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Your inability to put anything in context is duly noted, as I explained. Your inability to grasp simple concepts is your problem, not mine. To call some historical figure a liberal (or conservative) makes no sense out of context the way you presented it.Nonsense. Liberals today believe in the opposite of what Jefferson stood for. It's dishonest to try to portray him as a modern day liberal, especially since freedom from big mother government is what the revolution was all about.Moreover, Jefferson and Madison were themselves Liberals. They would not have been angling for "freedom from" what they had just got done creating with the Constitution.
Your inability to navigate what the word "Liberal" means is your problem, not mine. And the OP's as well -- he's even more clueless, trying to connect his Republican Party to a man who was already 28 years dead when it started.
I made no mention of contemporary Liberalism, nor what ignorant wags pervert it into. I referred to Jefferson an Madison --- who, with their cohorts, founded this country on the principles of Liberalism. PERIOD.
ERGO --- they would not have been starting a political party to undermine what they had just built. DUH.
Your inability to put anything in context is duly noted, as I explained. Your inability to grasp simple concepts is your problem, not mine. To call some historical figure a liberal (or conservative) makes no sense out of context the way you presented it.Nonsense. Liberals today believe in the opposite of what Jefferson stood for. It's dishonest to try to portray him as a modern day liberal, especially since freedom from big mother government is what the revolution was all about.Moreover, Jefferson and Madison were themselves Liberals. They would not have been angling for "freedom from" what they had just got done creating with the Constitution.
Your inability to navigate what the word "Liberal" means is your problem, not mine. And the OP's as well -- he's even more clueless, trying to connect his Republican Party to a man who was already 28 years dead when it started.
I made no mention of contemporary Liberalism, nor what ignorant wags pervert it into. I referred to Jefferson an Madison --- who, with their cohorts, founded this country on the principles of Liberalism. PERIOD.
ERGO --- they would not have been starting a political party to undermine what they had just built. DUH.
Disagreed.I say Jefferson since he [and Madison] founded the Republican party in 1792 to stand for freedom from big liberal govt, exactly what modern Republicans stood for, while Lincoln founded another Republican that did not stand for freedom from big liberal govt, and so is more like the modern Democrat Party. This it seems to me makes Jefferson the first Republican.
...because, el tardo, YOU didn't.Your inability to put anything in context is duly noted, as I explained. Your inability to grasp simple concepts is your problem, not mine. To call some historical figure a liberal (or conservative) makes no sense out of context the way you presented it.Nonsense. Liberals today believe in the opposite of what Jefferson stood for. It's dishonest to try to portray him as a modern day liberal, especially since freedom from big mother government is what the revolution was all about.Moreover, Jefferson and Madison were themselves Liberals. They would not have been angling for "freedom from" what they had just got done creating with the Constitution.
Your inability to navigate what the word "Liberal" means is your problem, not mine. And the OP's as well -- he's even more clueless, trying to connect his Republican Party to a man who was already 28 years dead when it started.
I made no mention of contemporary Liberalism, nor what ignorant wags pervert it into. I referred to Jefferson an Madison --- who, with their cohorts, founded this country on the principles of Liberalism. PERIOD.
ERGO --- they would not have been starting a political party to undermine what they had just built. DUH.
Again for you Illiterati --- I made no mention of contemporary Liberals. ***YOU*** did that.
First, Jefferson was a renaissance man. A "liberal" in the best sense of the word as were several other Founders.
Second, "Republican" is a party. .
To call some historical figure a liberal (or conservative) makes no sense out of context the way you presented it.
So modern Republicans stand for leaving the Country with massive debt?why did you fail to tell us what Jefferson did stand for and what modern Republicans stand for?
He did?
So modern Republicans stand for leaving the Country with massive debt?
Never knew that how Progressive of you!
The GOP came from the WHIG Political Party and today GOP are from the Know Nothing Political movement and are nothing like Jefferson even though you have latched onto the idea that Republican must have came from the Jefferson Republican party which mean you are confessing that you are a Democrat that love wasteful spending and leaving national debt for the future to pay for like Jefferson did!
I would expect you to be more of a Jackson type of guy, but it seem you are a true blue dog after all, right?
Exactly the opposite as a matter of fact which is why Republicans have tried 30 times since Jeffersons first try to make debt illegall in America to too bad the liberals killed every amendment is that simple enough for you to understand?
And yet Jackson left the country debt free, and Jefferson did not!
So try again and Democrats back them were more conservative than the WHIGS of that day.
A debt-reduction policy that the Congress passed after the War of 1812 is what paid down the debt. Jackson the Populist just happened to be president when it was settled.
Jefferson actually reduced the size of the Executive Branch after the Federalists had taken liberties with it.
, trying to connect his Republican Party to a man who was already 28 years dead when it started.
Disagreed since you are arguing pure semantics. For example, the "Republican Party" I joined in 1974 is not the same "Republican Party" we see today. I fully supported the ideals of Senator Barry "Mr. Conservative" Goldwater. I like Ronald Reagan a lot, but both would be considered "RINOs" by the standards of the assholes in charge of the "Republican Party" today.First, Jefferson was a renaissance man. A "liberal" in the best sense of the word as were several other Founders.
issue is not whether he was renaissance man or liberal but rather whether he was first Republican given that he and Madison founded the Republican Party in 1792 to stand for freedom from big liberal govt, exactly what modern Republicans stand for.
I referred to Jefferson an Madison --- who, with their cohorts, founded this country on the principles of Liberalism. PERIOD.
Making that big leap from the 1780's to modern Parties and thinking they're the same thing and the language is the same is the first and only clue anyone needs to know about you and your grasp of any of the subjects here.
How is being a modern Republican being a no nothing if Modern Republicans stand for limited government exactly as Jefferson and Madison did when they formed the Republican Party.So then why not tell us the name of the party at Jefferson formed and what that party stood forwhen you know that he will know the purpose of the American revolution and the basic principle of your countryDifferent political party!
The GOP that Lincoln ran on is the same one that Progressive Donald John Trump ran on and not the one that Jefferson ran on!
I did and provided links. It is you playing as if the name of Jefferson political party is the same as today GOP!
The thing is today GOP has a lot of know nothing supporters which left the Democratic Party when Johnson chased you from the party!
It is you that can not understand the reality is the Democratic party came from Jefferson Republican Party and not today GOP!
You are a Know Nothing WHIG!
Know Nothing Political Movement!
Look them up and learn something new!
You even writing No Nothing show me you are just playing stupid and trying to twist history to support your opinion on something. Democrats like Andrew Jackson were Conservative in their day and Lincoln was Progressive. Times change and voters move from one political party to the next. The Jefferson Republican party are not today GOP but today GOP are more like the Know Nothing Political Movement that split from the Republican Party!
The Know Nothings came and went before the contemporary Republican Party but in their obstinate nativist xenophobia and thuggery yes they were very much a precursor of both Donald T. Rump and the Klan, who both exploit the same divisive paranoiae. Coincidentally they called themselves (at first) the American Republican Party, but that was 1843, nine years before the Republican Party (of today) was founded, some twenty -eight years after Thomas Jefferson was already dead. The Know Nothings collapsed about the same time.
And yet --- they are not unrelated in origins....:
>> By 1854, when the activists allied with a rump faction of the Whig Party to run a slate of candidates on an anti-immigration platform, they were labeled the “Know-Nothing Party.”
(get that? "A rump faction". I didn't even write that, although I wish I did....)
The following year, the Know-Nothings officially dubbed themselves the American Party. In 1856 they met in Philadelphia to pick a future president [candidate]. That process didn’t go well. Millard Fillmore was chosen as the party standard-bearer (he would carry just one state in November: Maryland), but the seeds for the Know-Nothing’s demise were planted at their own convention.
A wing of Southerners moved to pass a platform plank calling for the preservation of slavery. This alarmed many Northern and Midwestern Know-Nothings, who bolted to another newly formed political entity: The Republican Party. << --- Immigration and the Rise and Fall of the Know Nothing Party
Parallels between Rump and the Know-Nothings have been noted throughout the last campaign. In the 1850s for the Know Nothings.the xenophobia target was Irish and German immigrants geographically, and Catholics religiously. In 2016 for Rump it was Mexicans geographically and Muslims religiously. Same shit, different century. Con artists trying to exploit irrational public fears for their own self-serving gain. We saw this movie before and continue to not-learn from it.
Tell that to the farmers in western Pennsylvania in 1794.
I like Ronald Reagan a lot, but both would be considered "RINOs" by the standards of the assholes in charge of the "Republican Party" today.
Do you truly believe Thomas Jefferson would not be considered a fucking RINO by the standards of those who call themselves Republicans in 2017?
Jefferson was the first Republican
...because, el tardo, YOU didn't.Your inability to put anything in context is duly noted, as I explained. Your inability to grasp simple concepts is your problem, not mine. To call some historical figure a liberal (or conservative) makes no sense out of context the way you presented it.Nonsense. Liberals today believe in the opposite of what Jefferson stood for. It's dishonest to try to portray him as a modern day liberal, especially since freedom from big mother government is what the revolution was all about.Moreover, Jefferson and Madison were themselves Liberals. They would not have been angling for "freedom from" what they had just got done creating with the Constitution.
Your inability to navigate what the word "Liberal" means is your problem, not mine. And the OP's as well -- he's even more clueless, trying to connect his Republican Party to a man who was already 28 years dead when it started.
I made no mention of contemporary Liberalism, nor what ignorant wags pervert it into. I referred to Jefferson an Madison --- who, with their cohorts, founded this country on the principles of Liberalism. PERIOD.
ERGO --- they would not have been starting a political party to undermine what they had just built. DUH.
Again for you Illiterati --- I made no mention of contemporary Liberals. ***YOU*** did that.
How is it my problem? What did I just get? You're a dimwit....because, el tardo, YOU didn't.Your inability to put anything in context is duly noted, as I explained. Your inability to grasp simple concepts is your problem, not mine. To call some historical figure a liberal (or conservative) makes no sense out of context the way you presented it.Nonsense. Liberals today believe in the opposite of what Jefferson stood for. It's dishonest to try to portray him as a modern day liberal, especially since freedom from big mother government is what the revolution was all about.
Your inability to navigate what the word "Liberal" means is your problem, not mine. And the OP's as well -- he's even more clueless, trying to connect his Republican Party to a man who was already 28 years dead when it started.
I made no mention of contemporary Liberalism, nor what ignorant wags pervert it into. I referred to Jefferson an Madison --- who, with their cohorts, founded this country on the principles of Liberalism. PERIOD.
ERGO --- they would not have been starting a political party to undermine what they had just built. DUH.
Again for you Illiterati --- I made no mention of contemporary Liberals. ***YOU*** did that.
NOW you've got it.
And that makes it your problem ----- not mine. Which is what I already said umpteen posts ago.
