What do YOU believe? Russian hacking or leaked documents?

[oreo]

If it was "hacking" and not "leaks" why only Russia? Obama and Hillary pissed off a lot of countries with their foreign policy. Obama interfered in Israel's election directly. His man Messina worked for David Cameron and ran the campaign against Brexit and failed. Could be a Brit.

How about pissed off Egyptians who wanted payback for Obama's administration backing the terror group the Muslim Brotherhood?

Hey why not really really pissed off Syrians or Libyans? And don't forget the NSA was busted spying on 123 foreign leaders and corporations.

It's truly pathetic watching all these libs try to run with "we lost because of the eeeeeeeeeevil Russians".

What about the Chinese hacking. And obama didn't do one dang thing.
I guess private citizens have less value than government uppities.

China is responsible for a lot of hacking, but they've never hacked into a National election to sway an election to their preferred candidate.

This is what the UP ROAR is all about. We can't have foreign adversary's picking & choosing our Presidents for us. The United States is looked upon highly in the way we elect people to government seats, and this is a major black eye to that record, that both Republicans & Democrats are on board with.

PUTIN IS GOING TO BE PUNISHED for this action, because if he's not it's going to continue to happen in every election cycle. Next time it may be your candidate that Putin or some other foreign adversary doesn't care for.

So the next time you're cheering on a Wikileak--you might want to consider where it's really coming from, and WHY? There will always be a REWARD for committing a FELONY known as hacking into private or public computers.

 

[tinydancer]

I've just been reading that most of the so called evidence against Russia that has been cited has come from CrowdStrike a private security firm. The DNC paid them.

 

[tinydancer]

If it was "hacking" and not "leaks" why only Russia? Obama and Hillary pissed off a lot of countries with their foreign policy. Obama interfered in Israel's election directly. His man Messina worked for David Cameron and ran the campaign against Brexit and failed. Could be a Brit.

How about pissed off Egyptians who wanted payback for Obama's administration backing the terror group the Muslim Brotherhood?

Hey why not really really pissed off Syrians or Libyans? And don't forget the NSA was busted spying on 123 foreign leaders and corporations.

It's truly pathetic watching all these libs try to run with "we lost because of the eeeeeeeeeevil Russians".

What about the Chinese hacking. And obama didn't do one dang thing.
I guess private citizens have less value than government uppities.

China is responsible for a lot of hacking, but they've never hacked into a National election to sway an election to their preferred candidate.

This is what the UP ROAR is all about. We can't have foreign adversary's picking & choosing our Presidents for us. The United States is looked upon highly in the way we elect people to government seats, and this is a major black eye to that record, that both Republicans & Democrats are on board with.

PUTIN IS GOING TO BE PUNISHED for this action, because if he's not it's going to continue to happen in every election cycle. Next time it may be your candidate that Putin or some other foreign adversary doesn't care for.

So the next time you're cheering on a Wikileak--you might want to consider where it's really coming from, and WHY? There will always be a REWARD for committing a FELONY known as hacking into private or public computers.

Where is the proof? The tech experts say there is no hard evidence being presented.

As to the released emails themselves, what was in them that swayed the election? Trump voters came out in droves.

They already hated Hillary. The emails didn't change anyone's minds on who to vote for. All they did was confirm what everyone already knew.

That the press was colluding with the Clinton campaign. That the press, the Clinton campaign and the DNC were all in it together to fuck over Bernie.

No surprises. You are just desperately trying to blame the loss of the election on a foreign entity when in reality Clinton ran a shitty campaign despite the $$$$$$$$$$$ she threw at it.

 

[Crixus]

Lots of arguments from both sides. Let's get everyone on the record and see where this wormhole ends up.

I think it was a guy from an alphabet agency who has an axe to grind with the Clintons. I also think whomever it was may be a regular leaker to.

 

[Claudette]

Hillary lost the election all on her own. Trump used Twitter by passing the LSM who were all in the tank for Hillary. He got that message out and he won.

So far from what I've read they have no actual evidence that Russia hacked anything. Assange says the DNC emails weren't sent by the Russians. Assange isn't the most believable guy and he has loads of his own baggage.

On the news last night the FBI has a thirteen page report which states they have no proof.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Lots of arguments from both sides. Let's get everyone on the record and see where this wormhole ends up.

IT'S CONFIRMED. 17 intelligence agencies, the FBI, the CIA and the Department of Homeland security, and 99 Senators out of 100 have confirmed that Russia hacked into DNC databases to leak their emails, along with Hillary Clinton's emails. They are also responsible for most of the FAKE news on social media outlets, that was negative toward Hillary Clinton.
Graham: 99 percent of senators believe Russia interfered in election
FBI, CIA agree on Russia's role in election hacks

They have discovered a Russian digital fingerprint on it, and have found the same malware in a power plant in Vermont. The Russian malware is called Grissley Steepe.
https://www.us-cert.gov/sites/default/files/publications/JAR_16-20296A_GRIZZLY STEPPE-2016-1229.pdf

An official told CNN the administration has traced the hack to the specific keyboards -- which featured Cyrillic characters -- that were used to construct the malware code, adding that the equipment leaves "digital fingerprints" and, in the case of the recent hacks, those prints point to the Russian government.

Adviser contradicts Trump: Russians hacked the US - CNNPolitics.com

The FBI & Department of Homeland Security have already issued a 15 page report on this, and have put it on the internet so counties, especially power plants can check to see if they're infected with this malware.

Anyone denying it now, is looking like a total idiot. If Trump tries to deny it, you can be assured that he won't be getting along to well with the Republican Senate or the Joint Chiefs of staff that depend on this intelligence to advise the President. You don't call 17 intelligence agencies, the FBI, the CIA and the Department of Homeland Security inept, without expecting some political payback for doing so.

All of these agencies, including Senate Republicans and Barack Obama (together) are not going to kick Putin in the teeth for no reason.

If Trump continues to deny it, they will run him into the ground over it.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/11/world/europe/trump-campaign-russia.html?_r=1
Donald Trump's Many, Many, Many, Many Ties to Russia

I just don't understand why there is so much denial about this? Trump praised Putin through-out the campaign. Putin is former KGB--a spy--this is what he is good at, and he decided to lend a hand on getting his favorite elected. When Trump won, the Kremlin broke out the champagne bottles. What's there to deny?
US election 2016: Why Russia is celebrating Trump win - BBC News

Hackers routinely use other hackers methods to deflect blame from themselves.
Get a clue.

Look I know it's embarrassing to know that you supported a candidate that Putin did. This isn't Iraq--4000 miles away, these are in state, in our possession hacks that come from Russia. They know they're from Russia, because a Russian digital fingerprint is on them. This one is called Grissley Steepe. The FBI & Department of Homeland Security has issued a 15 page report on it, and have put it out on the internet with information on how to detect it.

This isn't some 400 lb fat guy sitting on his bed doing this because he has a grudge against Hillary Clinton. NO ONE in this country is going to do that knowing that he/she is also going to be doing a lot of PRISON time without expecting a big pay day for doing it.

I have a brother in law that works a big power plant in Colorado Springs. We have a lot of military bases here, including NORAD--and their biggest worry is the Russian hacks that they are constantly searching for. He says they're constantly finding crap from Russia, and they have to search for it everyday.

Russia is much worse than China today. They would love nothing more than getting into our electric grids to disrupt power, and get everything they can get their hands on. This is the new age of spying--only this time they hacked into our National election.

Be assured that Putin DID NOT expect this kind of response. This is the most severe action taken against them since the Cuban Missile crisis, and Senate Republicans are promising even more sanctions.

Trump should just admit it, because if he doesn't he is insulting all of these intelligence agencies and Senate Republicans and they'll just run over him with it. They won't let it go. If Trump was smart he should join the call for more sanctions instead of putting out a statement on how smart Putin is.

Lots of arguments from both sides. Let's get everyone on the record and see where this wormhole ends up.

IT'S CONFIRMED. 17 intelligence agencies, the FBI, the CIA and the Department of Homeland security, and 99 Senators out of 100 have confirmed that Russia hacked into DNC databases to leak their emails, along with Hillary Clinton's emails. They are also responsible for most of the FAKE news on social media outlets, that was negative toward Hillary Clinton.
Graham: 99 percent of senators believe Russia interfered in election
FBI, CIA agree on Russia's role in election hacks

They have discovered a Russian digital fingerprint on it, and have found the same malware in a power plant in Vermont. The Russian malware is called Grissley Steepe.
https://www.us-cert.gov/sites/default/files/publications/JAR_16-20296A_GRIZZLY STEPPE-2016-1229.pdf

An official told CNN the administration has traced the hack to the specific keyboards -- which featured Cyrillic characters -- that were used to construct the malware code, adding that the equipment leaves "digital fingerprints" and, in the case of the recent hacks, those prints point to the Russian government.

Adviser contradicts Trump: Russians hacked the US - CNNPolitics.com

The FBI & Department of Homeland Security have already issued a 15 page report on this, and have put it on the internet so counties, especially power plants can check to see if they're infected with this malware.

Anyone denying it now, is looking like a total idiot. If Trump tries to deny it, you can be assured that he won't be getting along to well with the Republican Senate or the Joint Chiefs of staff that depend on this intelligence to advise the President. You don't call 17 intelligence agencies, the FBI, the CIA and the Department of Homeland Security inept, without expecting some political payback for doing so.

All of these agencies, including Senate Republicans and Barack Obama (together) are not going to kick Putin in the teeth for no reason.

If Trump continues to deny it, they will run him into the ground over it.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/11/world/europe/trump-campaign-russia.html?_r=1
Donald Trump's Many, Many, Many, Many Ties to Russia

I just don't understand why there is so much denial about this? Trump praised Putin through-out the campaign. Putin is former KGB--a spy--this is what he is good at, and he decided to lend a hand on getting his favorite elected. When Trump won, the Kremlin broke out the champagne bottles. What's there to deny?
US election 2016: Why Russia is celebrating Trump win - BBC News

Hackers routinely use other hackers methods to deflect blame from themselves.
Get a clue.

Look I know it's embarrassing to know that you supported a candidate that Putin did. This isn't Iraq--4000 miles away, these are in state, in our possession hacks that come from Russia. They know they're from Russia, because a Russian digital fingerprint is on them. This one is called Grissley Steepe. The FBI & Department of Homeland Security has issued a 15 page report on it, and have put it out on the internet with information on how to detect it.

This isn't some 400 lb fat guy sitting on his bed doing this because he has a grudge against Hillary Clinton. NO ONE in this country is going to do that knowing that he/she is also going to be doing a lot of PRISON time without expecting a big pay day for doing it.

I have a brother in law that works a big power plant in Colorado Springs. We have a lot of military bases here, including NORAD--and their biggest worry is the Russian hacks that they are constantly searching for. He says they're constantly finding crap from Russia, and they have to search for it everyday.

Russia is much worse than China today. They would love nothing more than getting into our electric grids to disrupt power, and get everything they can get their hands on. This is the new age of spying--only this time they hacked into our National election.

Be assured that Putin DID NOT expect this kind of response. This is the most severe action taken against them since the Cuban Missile crisis, and Senate Republicans are promising even more sanctions.

Trump should just admit it, because if he doesn't he is insulting all of these intelligence agencies and Senate Republicans and they'll just run over him with it. They won't let it go. If Trump was smart he should join the call for more sanctions instead of putting out a statement on how smart Putin is.

Lots of arguments from both sides. Let's get everyone on the record and see where this wormhole ends up.

IT'S CONFIRMED. 17 intelligence agencies, the FBI, the CIA and the Department of Homeland security, and 99 Senators out of 100 have confirmed that Russia hacked into DNC databases to leak their emails, along with Hillary Clinton's emails. They are also responsible for most of the FAKE news on social media outlets, that was negative toward Hillary Clinton.
Graham: 99 percent of senators believe Russia interfered in election
FBI, CIA agree on Russia's role in election hacks

They have discovered a Russian digital fingerprint on it, and have found the same malware in a power plant in Vermont. The Russian malware is called Grissley Steepe.
https://www.us-cert.gov/sites/default/files/publications/JAR_16-20296A_GRIZZLY STEPPE-2016-1229.pdf

An official told CNN the administration has traced the hack to the specific keyboards -- which featured Cyrillic characters -- that were used to construct the malware code, adding that the equipment leaves "digital fingerprints" and, in the case of the recent hacks, those prints point to the Russian government.

Adviser contradicts Trump: Russians hacked the US - CNNPolitics.com

The FBI & Department of Homeland Security have already issued a 15 page report on this, and have put it on the internet so counties, especially power plants can check to see if they're infected with this malware.

Anyone denying it now, is looking like a total idiot. If Trump tries to deny it, you can be assured that he won't be getting along to well with the Republican Senate or the Joint Chiefs of staff that depend on this intelligence to advise the President. You don't call 17 intelligence agencies, the FBI, the CIA and the Department of Homeland Security inept, without expecting some political payback for doing so.

All of these agencies, including Senate Republicans and Barack Obama (together) are not going to kick Putin in the teeth for no reason.

If Trump continues to deny it, they will run him into the ground over it.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/11/world/europe/trump-campaign-russia.html?_r=1
Donald Trump's Many, Many, Many, Many Ties to Russia

I just don't understand why there is so much denial about this? Trump praised Putin through-out the campaign. Putin is former KGB--a spy--this is what he is good at, and he decided to lend a hand on getting his favorite elected. When Trump won, the Kremlin broke out the champagne bottles. What's there to deny?
US election 2016: Why Russia is celebrating Trump win - BBC News

Hackers routinely use other hackers methods to deflect blame from themselves.
Get a clue.

Look I know it's embarrassing to know that you supported a candidate that Putin did. This isn't Iraq--4000 miles away, these are in state, in our possession hacks that come from Russia. They know they're from Russia, because a Russian digital fingerprint is on them. This one is called Grissley Steepe. The FBI & Department of Homeland Security has issued a 15 page report on it, and have put it out on the internet with information on how to detect it.

This isn't some 400 lb fat guy sitting on his bed doing this because he has a grudge against Hillary Clinton. NO ONE in this country is going to do that knowing that he/she is also going to be doing a lot of PRISON time without expecting a big pay day for doing it.

I have a brother in law that works a big power plant in Colorado Springs. We have a lot of military bases here, including NORAD--and their biggest worry is the Russian hacks that they are constantly searching for. He says they're constantly finding crap from Russia, and they have to search for it everyday.

Russia is much worse than China today. They would love nothing more than getting into our electric grids to disrupt power, and get everything they can get their hands on. This is the new age of spying--only this time they hacked into our National election.

Be assured that Putin DID NOT expect this kind of response. This is the most severe action taken against them since the Cuban Missile crisis, and Senate Republicans are promising even more sanctions.

Trump should just admit it, because if he doesn't he is insulting all of these intelligence agencies and Senate Republicans and they'll just run over him with it. They won't let it go. If Trump was smart he should join the call for more sanctions instead of putting out a statement on how smart Putin is.

All I hear is a lot of lip flapping. Show me the proof.

 

[SavannahMann]

I voted that I just didn't know.

I read a lot. I read a little of many different types of books. History, Biographies, Fiction, Science Fiction. One of the little facts about History that always is interesting regarding this story line is this. It responsibility for protecting the secrets is never on the baddie not to do it, but on the person holding the secrets not to let them out of their sight.

Let's say you were a soldier. Just a regular Private in the Army serving under McArthur in World War II. You are serving as a courier. Your job is to take the Top Secret Message from the basement where it is decrypted, to the office of the Intelligence Boss. To do so you would certainly be armed with a pistol, and probably escorted by someone else who is armed. Your orders would be to shoot anyone who was not on your list of authorized people and who tried to get to the documents in the briefcase that was chained to your wrist.

The information was to be protected, at all costs.

The Walker Spy Ring provided the encryption device to the Soviets. Then they provided the encryption keys as well. So the Soviet's could then listen to our radio messages which were encrypted and we thought secure.

The British had good results breaking codes of the Germans in both World War One and Two. History seems to put the blame on the Germans for not coming up with a better system. The Americans are lauded for breaking Japanese Codes, but no one seems to blame the Americans for being all evil and such reading the Japanese messages like that.

The Venona project spent decades trying to read the Soviet messages with some success.

History is full of stories like that. The reality is that someone will always try to read your messages. So the pressure is on those who are handling the messages to make sure they are protected. There are probably ten thousand websites that tell you how to come up with hard to break passwords. Websites help you by requiring that you have at least one capital letter and one number in your password. If the password is too easy, or has been used too long, some websites insist you change it. Oh and when you do, you can't change it to something you've used before.

Now of course, we're blaming those who got the messages, because we can't blame those who lost them. They were the helpless victim. One of my often stated arguments against Hillary when I posted on Discussionist was that she was inept.

The picture summarizes what the Defense of Hillary was saying regarding the Email Server in her bathroom story.

Was it the Russians? Possibly. Was it a hacker that was not affiliated with the Russian Government but was located in Russia? Again, possibly. Was it a disgruntled DNC staffer who was disgusted by the underhanded crap that Hillary and the DNC was doing to Bernie and the way they talked about the Voters? Possibly.

There are many possibilities, and because the CIA says Russia doesn't sell me on Russia. As I posted before, the motto of the Intelligence Agencies is "We bet your life" and I've never heard any of them willing to stake their careers on it. They usually do everything they can to avoid the price of screw ups.

I just do not know.

 

[TNHarley]

Hard to say. This is a big deal what they did to Russia. And it wouldn't surprise me barry did it for political reasons.
All these govt people say this while releasing ZERO evidence. Seems you would prove it before you expel foreign diplomats..
Assange is the source, however his credibility is now questionable, IMO. He talked a lot of shit about the leaks and they weren't what he said they would be. Remember the Oct surprise?
IDK just have to wait and see.

 

[EverCurious]

See my posts (I think I parsed down to my fact posts, if not I apologize - will check Now checked and explained for reference )

Vlad the Merciful flushed Joke Obama down the toilett - Breaking down reports "evidence" - re Phishing
US EXPELS 35 Russian diplomats, closes two compounds. - Related: Explaining Phishing (Addendum 1)
US EXPELS 35 Russian diplomats, closes two compounds. - Related: Explaining Phishing (Addendum 2)

US EXPELS 35 Russian diplomats, closes two compounds. - Destroying the reports "evidence" - re Malware
Wikileaks: Russia didn't hack shit. - Wikileaks has always claimed it was an insider, Crowdstrike connection, and further breaking down report's evidence
US EXPELS 35 Russian diplomats, closes two compounds. - Related: Wikileaks nailing Russia (and specifically Putin, aka they are no friends)
PROOF: FBI, DHS release joint report on Russia hacking - Related: Just how easy it is too get the malware proclaimed as Russia (malware claims to be Ukrainian - Guccifer 2.0 claims to be Ukrainian as well )
CIA Concludes Russia Interfered In Election To Help Trump Win - Related: explaining a bit on how hacking/coding/malware works, as well as trashing the proclaimed "keyboard" tracking the media is flapping about.

US EXPELS 35 Russian diplomats, closes two compounds. - Related: Our reactions to other countries hacking us in the very recent past (aka 2015)

This is not to say that I don't think Russian's hack American's, we know they do, regularly, but to blame this specific incident on a specific government requires proof they simply do not have.

I see no reason for Wikileaks to lie about it being a DNC insider, that was not only said long before the claims of Russian hacking, but also is the standard method by which Wikileaks gets 99% of their information. Could there be an exception here, perhaps, but just as the government is working on presumption, opinion, and circumstantial evidence, so too are the naysayers.

And no, it has nothing to do with loving Putin. Its about doing the right thing and being a role model of fair judgement and just punishment in the eyes of the rest of the world. We're running off wild speculation and that will negatively effect our relations with other countries - friend and foe alike, just like the whole thing about spying on friendly diplomats did. Speculation and circumstantial evidence is simply not good enough.

 

[blackhawk]

I believe Russia had a hand in the hacking of the DNC and Podesta e-mails but not that they cost Hillary the election.

 

[usmbguest5318]

What's stopping the truth from being a combination of the first two poll choices?

 

[candycorn]

Omg

We did indeed avoid a disaster in the making

The republicans were certainly hacked as well, might spare a few moments to ponder what the hackers are going to do with that information. Before long the emails of the few republicans who might oppose trump will be leaked as well if they don't tow the line. These leaks were too powerful a political weapon to stop now.

I thought Assange said they weren't hacked.

Assange has acted so suspiciously that no rational person would believe a damned thing he says. He has no way of knowing if someone was hacked or not, all he knows is what has been leaked to his organization. He says he has received nothing on the republicans, he may even be telling the truth there, but it is incomprehensible that a hacking operation would only concentrate on democrats. It would be much wiser to retain the Republican stuff since they are in power and use it for blackmail against individuals.

Most on the right on this forum don't even believe a hacking to place.

I would believe it if we were given proof. The left want us to condemn an entire nation on the words of the very people they claim got the wmd's proclamation wrong.

The would be much like saying that since we have one guy in the army kill some of his fellow soldiers, all soldiers are homicidal maniacs. There are different analysts for different areas of expertise.

 

[candycorn]

I’d be shocked if Russia didn’t try to hack as many top US officials as they can…every day. That we have people here who now believe Russia’s story that they didn’t is more disturbing than their attempts; successful or not. Russia is our enemy; they have proven that time and again. As for the Assange claim; it’s worthless. What better way to throw you off the trail as to claim it was those guys over here and not those guys over there; especially when inexplicably….you are actually believed by millions of Americans?

Which leads me to point number 2. I keep hearing the term, “hacked the election”. Russia or whomever else did no such thing. The DNC and some high level staffers were hacked (likely with a bunch of other agencies). Their e-mails were released without clarity or context and some proved embarrassing. The dems have no one to blame but themselves.

 

[Theowl32]

I believe (I know) the pathological liars on the left were caught doing a lot of shit (especially the witch and her fucking foundation) and the mass media has used the slight of hand to direct our attention over there, when the crimes were over here.

Most of the msm are too stupid to know they are nothing but propaganda robots and too inflated with themselves to care. They just do the bidding of their marxist masters, seduce the public, rinse and repeat.

Not only have they not learned anything, but they are more determined than ever to take Trump apart by the joints and put his head high on "London bridge" as a warning to all who ever have the audacity to cross them or the rest of the bought establishment.

Common tale that keeps repeating over and over again. Jesus was welcomed into Jerusalem, then he turned over the money changers. ....

 

[Rozman]

R U GUYS WATCHING HANNITY RIGHT NOW?

Russia did not hack voting machines (a false story to conflate the issues) and did not hack emails that Wikileaks published. That we are certain of. Russia dindu nuttin.

Well if Hannity from the Trump propaganda machine said so...
Hannity can try all he wants to suck up to Trump in order to get a position in administration....
But Sean should keep in mind Trump picked Omarosa over him....for a nice position that she can
use in the future to rise in power....

 

[hadit]

I'll go with the source.

Assange has said numerous times that no state actor was involved in the information that he released.

He's not going to admit where that shit came from, his organization would lose what little legitimacy it has left. Now all he has to do is wait for Putin to deliver whatever he was promised to stab the American left, his only American allies, in the back.

So you're saying he's lying, on what basis beyond sheer partisanship?

 

[hadit]

R U GUYS WATCHING HANNITY RIGHT NOW?

Russia did not hack voting machines (a false story to conflate the issues) and did not hack emails that Wikileaks published. That we are certain of. Russia dindu nuttin.

Well if Hannity from the Trump propaganda machine said so...
Hannity can try all he wants to suck up to Trump in order to get a position in administration....
But Sean should keep in mind Trump picked Omarosa over him....for a nice position that she can
use in the future to rise in power....

Hannity didn't say it, Assange did.

 

[hadit]

I don't know...and to paraphrase a famous dried-out cankled kunt, "what difference does it make?"

The content of the e-mails is what counts.

Nobody is disputing their validity.

Why won't the GOP release their internal emails and we'll see what content they have .

Because there's no reason to do so. Apparently, the DNC has some very disgruntled employees.

 

[hadit]

Perhaps hacking is a bit too strong of a word to use. Podesta's password was p@ssw0rd.

Are you sitting me?

Unfortunately, no:

2 things - WikiLeaks


And these people actually believe they are competent enough to run the whole country! None of them can even operate basic email without getting in scandalous trouble.

Omg

We did indeed avoid a disaster in the making

The republicans were certainly hacked as well, might spare a few moments to ponder what the hackers are going to do with that information. Before long the emails of the few republicans who might oppose trump will be leaked as well if they don't tow the line. These leaks were too powerful a political weapon to stop now.

Bring em on. Sunshine is a disinfectant in these things. The more corruption exposed the better.

 

[hadit]

I believe the Russians DID hack the DNC, Podesta and other accounts, they have the digital footprint that shows this....

this does not exclude that there could have been an inside plant of Roger Stone's, that stole and distributed the emails to wikileaks.... Roger Stone was fired from the Dole campaign because it was found out that he planted a mole inside the competitor's campaign to steal info.... dole would have no part of scum like that....

Just saying, it could be BOTH.

Stone tweeted about the Podesta emails two months before wiki finally released them, he said he had a friend who informed him on what was going to wikileaks to be released...just google it....please.

That is a good point. There is absolutely nothing that would prevent multiple actors from hacking something like the DNC. And that makes Hillary's cavalier approach to email security that much more egregious.