What human cost is acceptable in controling illegal immigration?

[AZGAL]

Really, buddy you talk to the janitor? doesn't seem likely.

Wow JoeB, not only are you ignorant about geography, you are also ignorant about society as well. Many people are janitors, talk to janitors, and hire janitors. All the time buddy.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Since that isn't happening, I'm not that concerned with it. You guys have been looking for the elusive illegal alien voter since 2000 and haven't found him yet.

It's the right that opposes a national ID system, not the left.

So your answer is yes, you would oppose having an ID law requiring proof of citizenship ? To keep aliens from voting. Well sure, because that would keep your illegal alien friends from voting, and helping to get Democrats elected.

And deflecting to how many illegals are voting or not, is a DODGE. Simply enacting a citizenship requirement isn't a big deal. It's inexpensive both with time and money, it's easy, and should be done, regardless of anybody's estimate of the illegality taking place.

And for the illegal alien voter, there's nothing "elusive" about him to me. I've talked to them all across the country, in voting halls, on construction sites, in office buildings doing janitorial work, around my apartment complex doing landscaping, etc. And they're always willing to brag about how many laws they break (voting no exception)

Whatever gave you the idea we hadn't found them ? Let me guess >> CNN, MSNBC, look no further.

Illegals are not voting.

Why would a person hiding from the law walk into a government run facility where they may be asked to show ID?

Why would a person cross our borders illegally or overstay their Visa illegally?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Jeff Sessions and Donald Trump:

"If you are smuggling a child then we will prosecute you, and that child will be separated from you as required by law," Attorney General Jeff Sessions said Monday at a law enforcement conference in Scottsdale, Arizona. "If you don't like that, then don't smuggle children over our border."

Administration officials explained that the goal of the program is 100 percent prosecution of all who enter the U.S. illegally. When adults are prosecuted and jailed, their children will be separated from them, just as would happen for a U.S. citizen convicted and jailed.​

Anguish at Southwest border as more immigrant children are separated from parents

The Trump administration's willingness to take children from their parents has raised concerns about how far authorities should go to stem unauthorized border crossings and what human cost is acceptable in the name of border security and immigration control.

"There is something terrible happening here that Americans would not support if they understood it," said F. Scott McCown, director of the Children’s Rights Clinic at the University of Texas at Austin School of Law.​

I don't care how much you hate illegal immigrants this is EVIL. You are punishing the children. It's abhorrant and wrong and inexcusable. I hope they rot in hell for this. 700 children so far have been seperated from the only family they know and lost to our often incompetent and mismanaged child care system. I fail to see how any parent could support actions like these.

When parents are held for prosecution, their children are turned over to the Office of Refugee Resettlement, part of the Department of Health and Human Services. The children are then designated as "unaccompanied minors," and the government tries to connect them to family members who are already in the U.S. Until then, children wait in shelters or are sent to federally contracted foster homes, often without parents being told exactly where they are, immigration advocates said.

It may soon become even more difficult to place children with relatives. The Department of Homeland Security is proposing immigration checks be done on all people in a household who may take in these "unaccompanied" children, which means relatives who are undocumented may be less likely to come forward.

In the meantime, space in shelters and foster homes is limited; The Washington Post reported the administration plans to open facilities at military bases to house some of the separated children.​

Yes, this is terrible. I think I know of a solution though: If you have children, STF away from our borders.

Of course you. being a chickenshit, would punish the children.

Yes, it's always about the children with leftists; never to push their political agenda. All heart you people on the left are.

But I'll tell you, if these people south of our border were renown to vote Republican, the Democrat would have hogtied those people and their children and toss them back over to the Mexican side in two seconds; and a wall would have been built years ago.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I got screwed several times under DumBama; not once under Trump. You were saying????

The only screwing you got was the inadequacy you felt when a black man accomplished more than you ever will.... that's kind of on you.

And Trump accomplished ten times more than Ears. But that's kind of on you.

 

[danielpalos]

The Only acceptable Cost for Good capitalists is a profit on border policy!

 

[AZGAL]

(eagle1462010 said: ↑
.California leads the nation in illegals..............have 25% of the illegal farmers there for the entire nation.............when the laws provide a legal path..............)
AZGAL says:
You can see me rant , raise hell, and post facts about the unacceptable situation that is ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION all over the board, yet I must DEFEND the FARM WORKERS! There is a slight nuance difference in the condition of the foreign farm workers. Hard working agricultural workers MUST BE RESPECTED! The farm workers SHOULD GET VISAS, legal worker visas QUICKLY as we need them and must appreciate them. GIVE assistance and RESPECT to the farm workers as they are hard working industrious people HERE for a good and honest activity. Please RIP AWAY DACA, take away overburdened "crime victim" U visas for the most part due to high levels of fraud, BOUNCE back the hordes of "asylum" seekers and have the USA help at the point of within their countries, YET HONOR the farm workers. These farm workers should be at the front of the line for the visas. VISAS#1 for FARM WORKERS. Perhaps some of the asylum seekers can option into farm workers. *** CANADA decides what specialty workers it needs from outside and so can the USA.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

That would require you to get off your ass and stop whining...

But I guess if having a white guy in the White HOuse makes you feel better for one year before the next recession hits, have at it.

Yes, that next recession that was supposed to start the day after Trump took office and the market crashed. That recession? Oh wait! Our economy is doing great! Our unemployment at the lowest levels since early 2000! More people leaving food stamps, more people back in the labor participation group.

State income tax in IL- 4.95%
State income tax in OH- 4.997%

That's just income taxes. There is property tax, sales tax, cost of living which is much higher, just a ton of things.

And yet you can't find a job that offers health insurance with all that.

No, I can't, not with the multiple government restrictions on me I can't.

Um, actually, you do. Because you write stuff down, you know exactly what you are talking about... but most other people won't. Most people suck at writing resumes because they can't be objective about their own jobs. Trust me, I've managed to make up a whole list of mistakes people commonly make writing resumes...

My personal favorite is people who take their job description from HR and plop it into their resume... usually complete with "Responsible for" and third person verb tenses like nobody is going to notice. I would say 40% of resumes I see, people try to get away with that.

And you can't learn that off of a video.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Yeah, those Darkies need to take starvation wages and be happy with it!

Says the guy who can't get health insurance and won't find a better job.

Says the guy who's obsession is so great it's ruining his life because he refuses to seek professional help.

Look, you stupid shit, the thing is, able bodies working adults aren't the ones on food stamps. The few who are already have jobs, working for companies that don't pay enough.

this has been explained to you a bunch of times.

Yes, in fact I have a bunch of those people right next door in the HUD house. But how can one get a job when they don't wake up until noon everyday and weigh about 200 lbs more than an average person of their height?

They are just the warmup act. The people at my grocery store are the ones that take the cake; and I mean literally take the cake.

 

[AZGAL]

from: Anguish at Southwest border as more immigrant children are separated from parents via @nbcnews"Hernandez, though, was lucky. She was caught before the new zero-tolerance policy fully went into effect, and so she was released May 10 with an electronic bracelet clamped to her ankle and her children at her side."
Time to buy stock in an ankle bracelet company. This is the way of the future to monitor illegals. I am sure the Democrats will be horrified and write crazy stories about these devices. US citizens on supervised incarceration and release are given these all the time. NO MORE family separations, just MONITORING!

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Since that isn't happening, I'm not that concerned with it. You guys have been looking for the elusive illegal alien voter since 2000 and haven't found him yet.

Maybe we did and you don't know about it because you refuse to read the news:

Lawsuit: 100,000 noncitizens registered to vote in Pennsylvania

Hundreds Vote Illegally in North Carolina after Court Bans Election Integrity Law - Judicial Watch

Non-American citizen arrested for voting in Texas -- FIVE times - faces up to 20 years

Massive Non-Citizen Voting Uncovered in Maryland

Need more stories, let me know. I have an entire folder of them.

 

[AZGAL]

Yes, in fact I have a bunch of those people right next door in the HUD house. But how can one get a job when they don't wake up until noon everyday and weigh about 200 lbs more than an average person of their height?

No, sorry, this is a narrow stereotype.

 

[danielpalos]

Why whine about Taxes, right wingers, when it is merely lousy capital management.

 

[AZGAL]

• 

Study supports Trump: 5.7 million noncitizens may have cast illegal votes
By Rowan Scarborough - The Washington Times - Monday, June 19, 2017
A research group in New Jersey has taken a fresh look at postelection polling data and concluded that the number of noncitizens voting illegally in U.S. elections is likely far greater than previous estimates.

As many as 5.7 million noncitizens may have voted in the 2008 election, which put Barack Obama in the White House.
The research organization Just Facts, a widely cited, independent think tank led by self-described conservatives and libertarians, revealed its number-crunching in a report on national immigration.
Just Facts President James D. Agresti and his team looked at data from an extensive Harvard/YouGov study that every two years questions a sample size of tens of thousands of voters. Some acknowledge they are noncitizens and are thus ineligible to vote.

 

[danielpalos]

• 

Study supports Trump: 5.7 million noncitizens may have cast illegal votes
By Rowan Scarborough - The Washington Times - Monday, June 19, 2017
A research group in New Jersey has taken a fresh look at postelection polling data and concluded that the number of noncitizens voting illegally in U.S. elections is likely far greater than previous estimates.

As many as 5.7 million noncitizens may have voted in the 2008 election, which put Barack Obama in the White House.
The research organization Just Facts, a widely cited, independent think tank led by self-described conservatives and libertarians, revealed its number-crunching in a report on national immigration.
Just Facts President James D. Agresti and his team looked at data from an extensive Harvard/YouGov study that every two years questions a sample size of tens of thousands of voters. Some acknowledge they are noncitizens and are thus ineligible to vote.

the right wing expects us to believe, they All voted Blue and not Red.

 

[AZGAL]

***********************************************************************************************

Texas judge hears arguments on DACA challenge

By Tal Kopan and Jason Morris, CNN

Updated 5:15 PM ET, Wed August 8, 2018

District Judge Andrew Hanen, a George W. Bush appointee, heard arguments from 10 states that say DACA, a program that protects from deportation young undocumented immigrants who came to the US as children, is unconstitutional. Their arguments rely heavily on a previous court ruling from Hanen that blocked an expansion of the program and the creation of a similar program for immigrant parents in 2014 from going into effect.
Hanen did not rule Wednesday and said he would hold off ruling on the constitutionality of DACA for now and consider only the request to immediately stop it.

DACA was created by executive action during the Obama administration, but opponents of President Donald Trump's decision to end it have convinced multiple federal judges this year that doing so violates the Administrative Procedure Act, a federal law that dictates how the government can create or change regulations. Hanen asked for responses from both sides by Monday on whether DACA itself also runs afoul of the act.

The Trump administration decided to end DACA last September, in part due to a threat from Texas and other states to sue if it didn't. But in the months since, three federal judges around the country have ruled that decision was not adequately justified, and have ordered the program to remain.
Texas sued, in the end, to argue that the original program was unconstitutional so it could be wiped off the books. The administration has decided to not defend DACA in Hanen's court, so pro-immigrant groups and New Jersey stepped in to defend the program instead.

The Trump administration has argued to Hanen that if he decides to issue an immediate stoppage of the program, he should limit any ruling to recipients in the states that have sued and should delay his order's effectiveness to give the administration time to appeal. A Justice Department attorney reiterated that position Wednesday in court.

Attorneys for the immigration advocacy group MALDEF argued that a key issue facing Hanen is whether Texas and other states can legally bring the case to begin with and are suffering irreparable harm from DACA, which has existed for five years.
"In addition to the legality of DACA, one of the more important topics of today's hearing was whether Texas was suffering any kind of injury whatsoever from having DACA recipients living and working in the state," said MALDEF attorney Nina Perales. "Texas was not able to point to evidence that DACA recipients are costing the state anything."

Multiple cases
The Trump administration is already preparing to appeal a different order from a Washington, DC, district judge, which would require it to reopen the program to new applications and restore it in full. Previous courts had merely ordered the government to continue renewing permits. That judge postponed the implementation of his decision 20 days to allow for the appeal. Other cases are pending before appellate courts in California and New York.

Hanen is widely seen as unfriendly to DACA, given his previous ruling on its sister program, Deferred Action for Parents of Americans and Lawful Permanent Residents.
"Issues in front of the court are issues that have already been decided," the lead attorney for the states challenging DACA, Todd Disher, said in court Wednesday. "This is not a close case."
Obama's move was a "direct defiance" of the law, Disher added.

If Hanen were to rule DACA should be ended, that would conflict with the court rulings that the program should be reopened -- likely setting the stage for a fast track to the Supreme Court by this fall.

 

[AZGAL]

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump Aug 6


Democrats want Open Borders and they want to abolish ICE, the brave men and women that are protecting our Country from some of the most vicious and dangerous people on earth! Sorry, we can’t let that happen! Also, change the rules in the Senate and approve STRONG Border Security!

 

[danielpalos]

Why are we Losing money on border policy and not Making money on border policy, like Good capitalists should?

 

[protectionist]

So your answer is yes, you would oppose having an ID law requiring proof of citizenship ? To keep aliens from voting. Well sure, because that would keep your illegal alien friends from voting, and helping to get Democrats elected.

You have yet to prove that they are voting, and these laws are being used to keep citizens of color from voting because they can't afford an ID.

And deflecting to how many illegals are voting or not, is a DODGE. Simply enacting a citizenship requirement isn't a big deal. It's inexpensive both with time and money, it's easy, and should be done, regardless of anybody's estimate of the illegality taking place.

Well, guy, I'm only for finding solutions to problems that ACTUALLY EXIST. If so few illegals are voting that it won't really effect the outcome of an election, then this really isn't a problem.

THere are good reasons to have a national ID Card. Employment verification being the obvious one. But the Right doesn't want to give that kind of power to the Federal Government.

And for the illegal alien voter, there's nothing "elusive" about him to me. I've talked to them all across the country, in voting halls, on construction sites, in office buildings doing janitorial work, around my apartment complex doing landscaping, etc. And they're always willing to brag about how many laws they break (voting no exception)

Really, buddy you talk to the janitor? doesn't seem likely.

And then they totally admit that they are breaking laws... that doesn't seem very smart.

1. You make a statement. you present no evidence.

2. They are NOT asked to show CITIZENSHIP ID. Showing ordinary personal ID is something anyone can do, and has nothing to do with citizenship, or being an illegal alien (or legal alien) People in voting places have no idea if anyone is a citizen or not.

NO, what happens is that when I go to vote, I am asked to sign my card, and it is compared to the signature they have on file for me.

You're just talking like an idiot saying "You have yet to prove that they are voting" Don't be an ass. It's that kind of dumbass talk that got Hillary Clinton thrown into the garbage. The "citizens of color" BS is just as dopey - more votes lost for Democrats. People don't appreciate being conned. And all the phony attacks on Trump RAISE his popularity. You still don't get it. Trump will win again.

Only citizenship ID is needed. The right wants that. You try to change reality. The folks aren't buying it.

I talked to janitors (in Spanish) for HOURS, when I used to work as a security guard at night in office buildings. One time 11 illegal aliens from Ecuador showed up, looking for a place to stay for the night. Mexican janitor invited them in. I got rid of them.

HA HA. Doesn't seem likely, huh? Sounds like you never talked to an illegal alien. I have HUNDREDS of times, for 40 years. You shouldn't even be in this discussion. You have no idea what you're talking about. Nobody is more talkative (in Spanish) than illegal aliens from Mexico, after they've had a couple of beers (which they drink even while working). You can trust me on that. This is what frequently happens when you talk to liberals. You say things you've known all your life, and they act like it's a question. Pheeeew! (high-pitched whistle) I feel like I'm talking to somebody who just arrived here from another planet, and doesn't know Anything.

Oh, so you are asked to sign a card, and it is compared to the signature they have on file for you, huh ? Well, that's nice. Problem is, at no point are you required to present CITIZENSHIP ID, thereby allowing non-citizens to vote. Get it ?

 

[AZGAL]

IDIOTIC:
https://www.maldef.org/assets/pdf/Census_Complaint.pdf

CORRECT:
Title 13 of the United States Code - Wikipedia

 

[protectionist]

IDIOTIC:
https://www.maldef.org/assets/pdf/Census_Complaint.pdf

CORRECT:
Title 13 of the United States Code - Wikipedia

MALDEF is just a legal version of La Raza. Pro- Mexican. Anti-American. You could expect to see their people on US streets waving Mexican flags.