What "rights" does nature give us?

Rights are recognized by people. You can say you have a fright, but unless others agree try exercising it.

Governments like Italy under Mussolini do not resemble representative republics like the USA.

Why do you hate the USA?

Damn, you are incredibly dense.

The only rights we have to exercise are our legal rights, natural rights exist even if we ignore them.

you say evolution and the big bang are only scientific theories and therefore not true, but something as abstract as natural rights is true?

how so? :eusa_shifty:

I never said that, what I said is that we are not positive they are right. Unless you understand the difference you will remain a troll.
 
Nature does not guarantee rights. How can it? What are we back to sacrificing neighbors to the Volcano god?

Rights are human constructs. Human constructs come from the mind. What was natural ages ago may not be natural now.

Nature & natural...two terms people are confusing/conflating/hiding behind?

That is strange, I don't recall saying that nature guarantees rights. Care to point out where I did, or am I just supposed to fall apart because you put up a scarecrow?

you say natural rights exist? how can something exist outside of guaranteeing it does? maybe it doesn't truly exist until it's pulled out of your ass like a rabbit out of a hat?

Better question, how does our inability to guarantee the existence of the universe negate the existence of the universe?
 
Evolution and the Big Bang have nothing to do with each other.

I think they do, as do scientists. It's kinda where the sub atomic particles came from which after roughly 1/2 million years began coalescing into hydrogen atoms.

Damn, I am not sure where to begin other than pointing out that you are going from quantum physics to evolution and thinking you are smart enough to link them together.

Quantum mechanics, actually. When shit gets really really small, it does not follow the same rules of physics. In fact, we're clueless as to what's happening, but can with remarkable accuracy, predict what percentage of particles will end up being where they're aimed.

Evolution is merely the progression (life, universe, planets, bumble bees ...). Life is an organism that can replicate itself and mutate (the evolutionary aspect).

And indeed, the Big Bang is where it began, perhaps from another dimension or in endless cycle of expansions / collapses. But it sure as shit is a part of the evolution of our fucking universe, of which we and stars are a part -- and made of the same stuff.
 
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Damn, you are incredibly dense.

The only rights we have to exercise are our legal rights, natural rights exist even if we ignore them.

you say evolution and the big bang are only scientific theories and therefore not true, but something as abstract as natural rights is true?

how so? :eusa_shifty:

I never said that, what I said is that we are not positive they are right. Unless you understand the difference you will remain a troll.

Evolution is a scientific theory to explain observed data and phenomena. The simple fact that evolution is an explanation of something does not make it true.

We are not positive? We are positive about evolution. The devil is in the details.

Either you agree with evolution or you don't. And if you say you do but think it might not be true...that would make you full of shit.
 
I think they do, as do scientists. It's kinda where the sub atomic particles came from which after roughly 1/2 million years began coalescing into hydrogen atoms.

Damn, I am not sure where to begin other than pointing out that you are going from quantum physics to evolution and thinking you are smart enough to link them together.

Quantum mechanics, actually. When shit gets really really small, it does follow the same rules of physics. In fact, we're clueless as to what's happening, but can with remarkable accuracy, predict what percentage of particles will end up being where they're aimed.

Evolution is merely the progression (life, universe, planets, bumble bees ...). Life is an organism that can replicate itself and mutate (the evolutionary aspect).

And indeed, the Big Bang is where it began, perhaps from another dimension or in endless cycle of expansions / collapses. But it sure as shit is a part of the evolution of our fucking universe, of which we and stars are a part -- and made of the same stuff.

Evolution is the change in inherited characteristics of biological populations over time. Unless the universe itself is biological it does not evolve.
 
you say evolution and the big bang are only scientific theories and therefore not true, but something as abstract as natural rights is true?

how so? :eusa_shifty:

I never said that, what I said is that we are not positive they are right. Unless you understand the difference you will remain a troll.

Evolution is a scientific theory to explain observed data and phenomena. The simple fact that evolution is an explanation of something does not make it true.

We are not positive? We are positive about evolution. The devil is in the details.

Either you agree with evolution or you don't. And if you do but think it might not be true...that would make you full of shit.

We are not positive about evolution, that is why we call it a theory. If something came along that proved it was wrong science would accept the new data and move on to another theory that explained it. Some people want science to be dogma, if we do that we will end up with more trials like what happened to Galileo.
 
That is strange, I don't recall saying that nature guarantees rights. Care to point out where I did, or am I just supposed to fall apart because you put up a scarecrow?

you say natural rights exist? how can something exist outside of guaranteeing it does? maybe it doesn't truly exist until it's pulled out of your ass like a rabbit out of a hat?

Better question, how does our inability to guarantee the existence of the universe negate the existence of the universe?

Please, you claim there are natural rights. Where are they and where do they come form? When did man discover these rights? Do animals have rights or only humans? If only humans then it has to do with what separates us from our cousins (damn evolution again)...our brains.

Our brains, our minds, thoughts and ideas...human constructs
 
I never said that, what I said is that we are not positive they are right. Unless you understand the difference you will remain a troll.

Evolution is a scientific theory to explain observed data and phenomena. The simple fact that evolution is an explanation of something does not make it true.

We are not positive? We are positive about evolution. The devil is in the details.

Either you agree with evolution or you don't. And if you do but think it might not be true...that would make you full of shit.

We are not positive about evolution, that is why we call it a theory. If something came along that proved it was wrong science would accept the new data and move on to another theory that explained it. Some people want science to be dogma, if we do that we will end up with more trials like what happened to Galileo.

We are as positive about the theory of evolution as it is possible to be. What would change is the details (as somebody else said -- the mechanisms), not the theory itself.

Believing the theory of evolution as truth is not dogma. :lol: Dogma goes with faith. Evolution has scientific facts to back it up.
 
Damn, I am not sure where to begin other than pointing out that you are going from quantum physics to evolution and thinking you are smart enough to link them together.

Quantum mechanics, actually. When shit gets really really small, it does follow the same rules of physics. In fact, we're clueless as to what's happening, but can with remarkable accuracy, predict what percentage of particles will end up being where they're aimed.

Evolution is merely the progression (life, universe, planets, bumble bees ...). Life is an organism that can replicate itself and mutate (the evolutionary aspect).

And indeed, the Big Bang is where it began, perhaps from another dimension or in endless cycle of expansions / collapses. But it sure as shit is a part of the evolution of our fucking universe, of which we and stars are a part -- and made of the same stuff.

Evolution is the change in inherited characteristics of biological populations over time. Unless the universe itself is biological it does not evolve.

Merely one kind of evolution (species; note that Chuck's book is "On origin of species.")

We also have planetary evolution, etc. And the very same processes that create stars led to the organic molecules we needed to start our little quest to becoming what we are today.

Or personal evolution, as in you attending many classes, reading heavily and raising your IQ from around 15 up to 20 or so. Then many would exclaim, "My how QW has evolved!!!"
 
Some people want science to be dogma, if we do that we will end up with more trials like what happened to Galileo.

Idiot. It was the Church, faith, the dogma of truth that put Galileo on trial, not science. :eusa_clap:

Galileo had a theory, a scientific theory that people like you back in those days, had a difficult time grasping for fear it would change things...
 
I never said that, what I said is that we are not positive they are right. Unless you understand the difference you will remain a troll.

Evolution is a scientific theory to explain observed data and phenomena. The simple fact that evolution is an explanation of something does not make it true.

We are not positive? We are positive about evolution. The devil is in the details.

Either you agree with evolution or you don't. And if you do but think it might not be true...that would make you full of shit.

We are not positive about evolution, that is why we call it a theory. If something came along that proved it was wrong science would accept the new data and move on to another theory that explained it. Some people want science to be dogma, if we do that we will end up with more trials like what happened to Galileo.

No. It's a "theory" because it's comprised of all the facts we have on it. And NO! No doubt evolution is a fucking fact, even if we still can better understand its mechanisms.
 
Damn, I am not sure where to begin other than pointing out that you are going from quantum physics to evolution and thinking you are smart enough to link them together.

Quantum mechanics, actually. When shit gets really really small, it does follow the same rules of physics. In fact, we're clueless as to what's happening, but can with remarkable accuracy, predict what percentage of particles will end up being where they're aimed.

Evolution is merely the progression (life, universe, planets, bumble bees ...). Life is an organism that can replicate itself and mutate (the evolutionary aspect).

And indeed, the Big Bang is where it began, perhaps from another dimension or in endless cycle of expansions / collapses. But it sure as shit is a part of the evolution of our fucking universe, of which we and stars are a part -- and made of the same stuff.

Evolution is the change in inherited characteristics of biological populations over time. Unless the universe itself is biological it does not evolve.

there she goes again...

reframing and redefining terms. Koios mentions the term 'evolution' to say things even the universe itself is evolving as well as saying most everything in the universe contains the stuff we also are made of...and QW inserts 'evolution' the theory as if to say Koios was calling the universe's progression itself a biological entity (the universe as a biological entity is an interesting theory)
 
you say natural rights exist? how can something exist outside of guaranteeing it does? maybe it doesn't truly exist until it's pulled out of your ass like a rabbit out of a hat?

Better question, how does our inability to guarantee the existence of the universe negate the existence of the universe?

Please, you claim there are natural rights. Where are they and where do they come form? When did man discover these rights? Do animals have rights or only humans? If only humans then it has to do with what separates us from our cousins (damn evolution again)...our brains.

Our brains, our minds, thoughts and ideas...human constructs

I claim the universe exists also, why don't you demand I prove that by showing how I can guarantee it?
 
We are not positive? We are positive about evolution. The devil is in the details.

Either you agree with evolution or you don't. And if you do but think it might not be true...that would make you full of shit.

We are not positive about evolution, that is why we call it a theory. If something came along that proved it was wrong science would accept the new data and move on to another theory that explained it. Some people want science to be dogma, if we do that we will end up with more trials like what happened to Galileo.

No. It's a "theory" because it's comprised of all the facts we have on it. And NO! No doubt evolution is a fucking fact, even if we still can better understand its mechanisms.

She's stuck. She will reframe things and mix it all up. She's a troll who has no idea she's trolling or worse...she's a lonely shut in who gets kicks out of making people explain themselves over and over again.

:clap2:
 
We are not positive? We are positive about evolution. The devil is in the details.

Either you agree with evolution or you don't. And if you do but think it might not be true...that would make you full of shit.

We are not positive about evolution, that is why we call it a theory. If something came along that proved it was wrong science would accept the new data and move on to another theory that explained it. Some people want science to be dogma, if we do that we will end up with more trials like what happened to Galileo.

We are as positive about the theory of evolution as it is possible to be. What would change is the details (as somebody else said -- the mechanisms), not the theory itself.

Believing the theory of evolution as truth is not dogma. :lol: Dogma goes with faith. Evolution has scientific facts to back it up.

If we were as positive about evolution as it is possible to be we would be able to describe it from beginning to end, develop mathematical models that duplicated the exact results we can see in nature, and even replicate the process in a lab.

We can't.
 
Quantum mechanics, actually. When shit gets really really small, it does follow the same rules of physics. In fact, we're clueless as to what's happening, but can with remarkable accuracy, predict what percentage of particles will end up being where they're aimed.

Evolution is merely the progression (life, universe, planets, bumble bees ...). Life is an organism that can replicate itself and mutate (the evolutionary aspect).

And indeed, the Big Bang is where it began, perhaps from another dimension or in endless cycle of expansions / collapses. But it sure as shit is a part of the evolution of our fucking universe, of which we and stars are a part -- and made of the same stuff.

Evolution is the change in inherited characteristics of biological populations over time. Unless the universe itself is biological it does not evolve.

Merely one kind of evolution (species; note that Chuck's book is "On origin of species.")

We also have planetary evolution, etc. And the very same processes that create stars led to the organic molecules we needed to start our little quest to becoming what we are today.

Or personal evolution, as in you attending many classes, reading heavily and raising your IQ from around 15 up to 20 or so. Then many would exclaim, "My how QW has evolved!!!"

We are talking about science, not semantics, evolutionary science is biological.
 
Some people want science to be dogma, if we do that we will end up with more trials like what happened to Galileo.

Idiot. It was the Church, faith, the dogma of truth that put Galileo on trial, not science. :eusa_clap:

Galileo had a theory, a scientific theory that people like you back in those days, had a difficult time grasping for fear it would change things...

It was all the scientists of his day that did not like the fact that he contradicted Aristotle.
 
We are not positive? We are positive about evolution. The devil is in the details.

Either you agree with evolution or you don't. And if you do but think it might not be true...that would make you full of shit.

We are not positive about evolution, that is why we call it a theory. If something came along that proved it was wrong science would accept the new data and move on to another theory that explained it. Some people want science to be dogma, if we do that we will end up with more trials like what happened to Galileo.

No. It's a "theory" because it's comprised of all the facts we have on it. And NO! No doubt evolution is a fucking fact, even if we still can better understand its mechanisms.

Says the guy that thinks planets evolve.
 

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