What's An Acceptable Number Of Innocent People Being Executed?

[Quantum Windbag]

No one has been executed by mistake. Ever. Every single one of them was guilty of something and it was their time to die.

That's an interesting phrase, guilty of something. So is it ok to convict a person of a crime they didn't do because they committed other crimes and got away with it?

Can there be ANY doubt that ALL forms of totalitarianism and oppressive government comes from the right?

Yes.

 

[9thIDdoc]

If they have been properly tried and sentenced they are by definiton not innocent.

 

[pgm]

You re-examine the evidence and ABSOLUTELY prove executed guy #456 didn't do the crime.

The libs have been looking for this guy for decades. they haven't found him yet.

They've gotten a few obviously guilty guys off on technicalities, so I guess that's something to be proud of.

I don't see why the standard for avoiding the death penalty should be "absolutely didn't do it," but I'll bite.

Here's just one example. It's from the UK, but I think it's poignant because it helped turn public opinion against the death penalty over there.

Remember, you said I only needed one.


"Timothy Evans in the United Kingdom, was tried and executed in 1950 for the murder of his baby daughter Geraldine. An official inquiry conducted 16 years later determined that it was Evans's fellow tenant, serial killer John Reginald Halliday Christie, who was responsible for the murder. Christie also admitted to the murder of Evans's wife as well as five other women and his own wife. Christie may have murderded other women, judging by evidence found in his possession at the time of his arrest, but it was never pursued by the police. Evans was pardoned posthumously following this, in 1966. The case prompted the abolition of capital punishment in the UK in 1965."

 

[idb]

You re-examine the evidence and ABSOLUTELY prove executed guy #456 didn't do the crime.

The libs have been looking for this guy for decades. they haven't found him yet.

They've gotten a few obviously guilty guys off on technicalities, so I guess that's something to be proud of.

I don't see why the standard for avoiding the death penalty should be "absolutely didn't do it," but I'll bite.

Here's just one example. It's from the UK, but I think it's poignant because it helped turn public opinion against the death penalty over there.

Remember, you said I only needed one.


"Timothy Evans in the United Kingdom, was tried and executed in 1950 for the murder of his baby daughter Geraldine. An official inquiry conducted 16 years later determined that it was Evans's fellow tenant, serial killer John Reginald Halliday Christie, who was responsible for the murder. Christie also admitted to the murder of Evans's wife as well as five other women and his own wife. Christie may have murderded other women, judging by evidence found in his possession at the time of his arrest, but it was never pursued by the police. Evans was pardoned posthumously following this, in 1966. The case prompted the abolition of capital punishment in the UK in 1965."

Ummm...why didn't the police suspect the serial killer living next door in the first place.

"Well, I think it's an open and shut case guv. It was clearly someone local and no one else except the husband had motive. Across the road lives a little old lady, there's a greengrocer living next door and a serial killer on the other side. This is almost too easy."

 

[candycorn]

If they have been properly tried and sentenced they are by definiton not innocent.

Juries don't make mistakes?

 

[candycorn]

Let's just put all the BS to rest, shall we?


Rick Perry had an innocent man executed, and should be made to answer

"...Not only did Governor Perry deny Willingham’s appeal for clemency even though an expert arson investigator had rebutted all the solid evidence in the case, Perry fired investigators who were about to provide Willingham’s innocence."
Perry: Willingham


Daily Kos: Rick Perry had an innocent man executed, and should be made to answer


Bottom line: Essentially we've got a re-tread of the Shrub with an ability to actually give a coherent speech...Jeezus, do we have to go through this again?

Perry did not have an innocent man executed. The state of Texas tried the man, and proved he was guilty, After that all of his appeals failed, including his appeal to the Supreme Court of the United States. That made his execution inevitable under Texas law unless the board of Pardons and Paroles recommended clemency. Since they never did Perry could not have prevented it if he wanted to.

If you want to go after him at least go after him for what he did, which was work to hide the facts that would have proven the state was wrong. I really hate it when idiots force me to defend politicians.

Are you saying the Governor cannot stay an execution in Texas? I think you're incorrect about that.

 

[JohnA]

Just wondered what an acceptable number would be for "executing innocent people by mistake" before reviewing the death penalty? What brings this up is the proud record of Texas.

From what I've seen there have been 12 people released from Death Row in Texas. There has also been 755 executed. Now ASSUMING that EVERY ONE of the executed were, in fact, guilty as charged (highly unlikely) that would bring the average to about 1.6% faulty conviction rate.

So what say you? Is more than 1 out of 100 "mistakes" an acceptable number? Would that be considered "collateral damage"?

State by State Database | Death Penalty Information Center

DA who convicted man freed from death row:

NCADP Affiliate: Texas Coalition to Abolish the Death Penalty

.

well as has been discussed on another thread recently we are dealing with a lot of assumptions here .
of course the acceptable # is 0
there are a lot of sites mostly run by (anti DP advocats )) promoting the innocence of some who have been convicted and executed but IN NOT ONE case has the been irrifutable evidence that the person was innocent of the crime he/she was executed for .

but i agree we are human mistakes* could* have been made
when mistakes are discovered (like in the 12 released ) corrective action is taken

 

[bripat9643]

Your belief that the people released were "innocent" is your first wrong assumption.

What is your belief??? That none of them are innocent???

Given all the appeals and the fact that it can take 15 years to execute someone, the chances that any of them are innocent is statistically zero.

 

[9thIDdoc]

If they have been properly tried and sentenced they are by definiton not innocent.

Juries don't make mistakes?

Sure they do. They free killers to kill again every day.

 

[Charles_Main]

Let's just put all the BS to rest, shall we?


Rick Perry had an innocent man executed, and should be made to answer

"...Not only did Governor Perry deny Willingham’s appeal for clemency even though an expert arson investigator had rebutted all the solid evidence in the case, Perry fired investigators who were about to provide Willingham’s innocence."
Perry: Willingham


Daily Kos: Rick Perry had an innocent man executed, and should be made to answer


Bottom line: Essentially we've got a re-tread of the Shrub with an ability to actually give a coherent speech...Jeezus, do we have to go through this again?

Perry did not have an innocent man executed. The state of Texas tried the man, and proved he was guilty, After that all of his appeals failed, including his appeal to the Supreme Court of the United States. That made his execution inevitable under Texas law unless the board of Pardons and Paroles recommended clemency. Since they never did Perry could not have prevented it if he wanted to.

If you want to go after him at least go after him for what he did, which was work to hide the facts that would have proven the state was wrong. I really hate it when idiots force me to defend politicians.

LOL now that is funny, If the evidence was hidden how do you know for sure it "would have proven the state was wrong"

Seems you like to make assumptions with out any real evidence to back them up.

 

[DaGoose]

There are 4 reasons to imprison people:
1. To rehabilitate
2. To deter others
3. To seek retribution
4. To separate the person from society so they can't commit more crimes while in prison.

Forget the rehabilitation. We gave up on that long ago. Prisons teach the importance of not getting caught.

Prisons are really not much of a deterrent? 70% of the released prisoners are convicted of a crime in less than two years. It's not much of a deterrent for those considering committing a crime because they don't believe they will ever get caught or the crime is committed in a fit of passion or they're under the influence or just plain nuts.

Retribution does nothing for society and is questionable if it does anything for the injured parties.

Separation from society, either temporary or permanently is always a valid reason. Longer sentences will mean less crime.

I think we often forget, that prison is where we put the failures. Successful criminals don't get caught.

When Gov. Ryan commuted the sentences of 168 dirtbags on IL's death row, 7 of them were convicted of killing people IN PRISON! Without the threat of death, there's really nothing keeping a "lifer" from killing his fellow inmates or even a prison employee.

Wrong, DaGoofe told me all murderers would rather die than have to serve a long prison sentence.....

Ok....now you're just lying. Never did I ever say that ALL prisoners would rather die than serve life in prison. But I have offered support of my position that many consider a life sentence worse than the death penalty.

One source of evidence on the extent of pain associated with a life sentence
is provided by condemned prisoners who tell us point blank that a life
sentence is worse than a death sentence. These are not just empty words. A
remarkable 123 prisoners—11% of the 1,099 executions carried out at the
time of this writing—have dropped their appeals and allowed themselves to
be killed (Death Penalty Information Center, 2008).

http://www.realcostofprisons.org/materials/americas_other_death_penalty.pdf

And yet what have YOU offered? Your opinion? Well fuck you. Your opinion doesn't mean jack shit. I already attested to what life in prison is about via my BROTHER and good friend of which both have spent most of their adult lives in prison. You probably wouldn't know a prisoner if he come up and slapped your candy ass.

Now since you can't offer any kind of reasonable argument I will kindly ask you to fuck off and go post your childish and idiotic insults somewhere else.

But hey, I mean that in the nicest way.

.

 

[Charles_Main]

Your belief that the people released were "innocent" is your first wrong assumption.

What is your belief??? That none of them are innocent???

Given all the appeals and the fact that it can take 15 years to execute someone, the chances that any of them are innocent is statistically zero.

Actually it's more like 20 years, and since DNA evidence it is almost Impossible anyone convicted today, could be sentenced to death, if they were not actually guilty. Juries today tend to demand pretty Convincing Evidence before they will recommend the Death Penalty.

 

[pgm]

Ummm...why didn't the police suspect the serial killer living next door in the first place.

"Well, I think it's an open and shut case guv. It was clearly someone local and no one else except the husband had motive. Across the road lives a little old lady, there's a greengrocer living next door and a serial killer on the other side. This is almost too easy."

Christie was hanged in 1950. The serial killer was caught in 1953. He was only caught because he moved and had left three bodies under the floor boards.

 

[pgm]

Actually it's more like 20 years, and since DNA evidence it is almost Impossible anyone convicted today, could be sentenced to death, if they were not actually guilty. Juries today tend to demand pretty Convincing Evidence before they will recommend the Death Penalty.

I think the bold is bullshit so I would like to see evidence of that claim.

There's a man in Georgia who is literally down to his last chance at avoiding death. There was no physical evidence linking him to the crime. Moreover, 7 of the 9 witnesses recanted, many saying they were coerced by the police. Eye-witness testimonybis already notoriously unreliable. One of the two remaining was initially a suspect and allegedly confessed to shooting a cop to a third party. This does not sound like pretty convincing evidence to me.

 

[Dr Grump]

No one has been executed by mistake. Ever. Every single one of them was guilty of something and it was their time to die.

Congratulations! You get moronic post of the week..








...again!

 

[Dr Grump]

Your belief that the people released were "innocent" is your first wrong assumption.

What is your belief??? That none of them are innocent???

Given all the appeals and the fact that it can take 15 years to execute someone, the chances that any of them are innocent is statistically zero.

You are so full of shit, you must lead a double life as a latrine...

 

[bripat9643]

Given all the appeals and the fact that it can take 15 years to execute someone, the chances that any of them are innocent is statistically zero.

You are so full of shit, you must lead a double life as a latrine...

In other words, my statement is the obvious truth.,

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Your belief that the people released were "innocent" is your first wrong assumption.

What is your belief??? That none of them are innocent???

Given all the appeals and the fact that it can take 15 years to execute someone, the chances that any of them are innocent is statistically zero.

"statistically zero"

That's hilarious.

 

[Dr Grump]

Given all the appeals and the fact that it can take 15 years to execute someone, the chances that any of them are innocent is statistically zero.

You are so full of shit, you must lead a double life as a latrine...

In other words, my statement is the obvious truth.,

The West Memphis three were in prison for 18 years. They are innocent. Not even getting into the Innocence project and those on death row that have been exonerated.

As I said, full of shit....

Exhibit A as to why some people should not be allowed to vote...

 

[Poli_Sigh]

Those who support the DEATH PENALTY actually believe there is a margin for error. Of course, should they or someone in their family find themselves on death row and innocent, I'm sure they'd reconsider. In fact, I'm positive we'd hear them screaming about injustice from sea to shining sea.

That so many Americans continue to demand this remain on the law books as a form of punishment says much more about who we are as a people, as opposed to who we think we are.