Zone1 Which came first, Christianity or Judaism?

[irosie91]

It's not contradicted by text. Yehoshua is the incarnation of the Sar Gadol. He is Mashiach and through Him, we are redeemed.

mr. man-----why do you persist in repeating meaningless statements?

 

[irosie91]

It's pretty clear what the RAMCHAL says, anyone can read it. The High Tzadick's suffering initiates or is the catalyst for redemption. He facilitates Tikkun Olam. Jesus/Yehoshua is the highest of Tzadickim because He is the incarnation of the High Prince of Heaven or Sar Gadol. The Archangel Michael is the Prince of Heaven, the Son of YHWH. The house of David will become like God, and it is through the Messiah. The incarnation of the Sar Gadol.

Mr man----you are, simply, throwing memes together roflmao @ "archangel"-----you
are slipping back into Mithraism

 

[TruthNotBS]

mr. man-----why do you persist in repeating meaningless statements?

Yehoshua redeems the world. He is the Jew who split time. The one the nations seek.

 

[irosie91]

This is closely tied to how a truth shall convey among humans. The US government can choose CNN as its dedicated media for government annonouncments to be released to the public. CNN has the obligation to idenify their sources of news which are subsequently from the claims of eyewitnesses. When such a media chose to lie about the election, then the US government may swtich its media from CNN to, say Fox News.

Similarly, the Jews as God's chosen media has the responsibility to identify the prophets from God. If they failed the role, God can switch His media from Judaism to Christianity.

One more characteristic is that when the US government tries to make an annonuncement to the public, it demands its media to broadcast towards all the states of America, not just Indiana or Texas. Similarly, when God has a message to annonounce, explicitly the gospel shall be preached to all nations. Christianity thus is the only true religion as other religions never had such a demand on who the message shall convey.

what does "who the message shall convey..." mean?

 

[irosie91]

Yehoshua redeems the world. He is the Jew who split time. The one the nations seek.

"split time..." what does that mean? "jesus" was a "jew" ----by what criterion?

 

[rosends]

The RAMCHAL, didn't say that the high tzadick, simply inspires others to repent, but rather that his suffering has a direct cosmic effect, cleansing creation of its corruption.

Ezekiel 4:4-6. The passage reads (New International Version):

"4 Then lie on your left side and put the sin of the house of Israel upon yourself. You are to bear their sin for the number of days you lie on your side. 5 I have assigned you the same number of days as the years of their sin. So for 390 days you will bear the sin of the house of Israel. 6 After you have finished this, lie down again, this time on your right side, and bear the sin of the people of Judah. I have assigned you 40 days, a day for each year."

The concept of "bearing the sin" of another is in the Hebrew Bible. When the Bible states otherwise, it's referring to a parent being condemned for the sins of their wicked children or children being condemned before the court, for the sins of their parents. That doesn't imply that a person can't bear the sin of another if that person is divinely appointed and empowered to do that.

You keep quoting the Ramchal as if he is the only voice and the absolute authority and you look at his deeper discussions as if they are the superficial meaning and not part of a larger tapestry of rabbinic explication. You should really read the medrash shmot rabbah 35:4 first, and the Zohar, itself, 356b (look here -- it supports precisely what I said Zohar, Achrei Mot 3:29 )

As for the Ezekiel quote, you really should have read Rashi on the verses
הקילותי עליך לקבל את צער שסבלתי אני למנין שנים שחטאו לפני הפכתים לך למנין ימים

If you learn more than such a narrow selection and read things in a larger context, you will see that things don't mean what you want them to.

 

[rosends]

It's pretty clear what the RAMCHAL says, anyone can read it. The High Tzadick's suffering initiates or is the catalyst for redemption. He facilitates Tikkun Olam. Jesus/Yehoshua is the highest of Tzadickim because He is the incarnation of the High Prince of Heaven or Sar Gadol. The Archangel Michael is the Prince of Heaven, the Son of YHWH. The house of David will become like God, and it is through the Messiah. The incarnation of the Sar Gadol.

Interesting that you doubled down on your claim but didn't deal with the exact quotes I presented.

 

[TruthNotBS]

Mr man----you are, simply, throwing memes together roflmao @ "archangel"-----you
are slipping back into Mithraism

The Sar Gadol -

Dan 12:1-3 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince (SAR GADOL - HIGH PRINCE/ARCHANGEL), which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. (2) And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. (3) And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

The SAR GADOL = The one who raises the dead, empowered by HASHEM (YOD HEY WAW HEY).

Dan_10:21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.

The name Michael in Hebrew is מיכאל. It is pronounced as "Mee-kha-el". In terms of its meaning, "Michael" originates from the question "מי כאל‎" : "Who is like God?". The answer isn't "No One Is Like God", but rather " You Are Like God". The Sar Gadol.

Zechariah 12:8.:

"On that day the Lord will protect the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them on that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the angel of the LORD, going before them."

"בית דוד יהיה כאלוהים"

Phonetically, it would be pronounced as: "Beit David yihyeh k'Elohim". The house of David is like God, like the Angel of YHWH = Mika'El.

Look:

"Your throne, O God, is forever and ever. The scepter of your kingdom is a scepter of uprightness." Psalms 45:7
"כִּסְאֲךָ אֱלֹהִים, עוֹלָם וָעֶד; שֵׁבֶט מִישֹׁר, שֵׁבֶט מַלְכוּתֶךָ."

"Kis'akha Elohim", Your throne O Elohim. Rashi interprets the above as "Your throne Oh Judge", it's in the vocative. David or Solomon are being identified as "Elohim". The next verse states:

"You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, has anointed you with the oil of gladness above your fellows." Psalms 45:8

The one who is like Elohim, has an Elohim. The one who is like God, has a God. The earthly King of Israel is a reflection of the heavenly King of Israel. The earthly King of Israel, sits upon the throne of Hashem:

1Ch_29:23 Then Solomon sat on the throne of HASHEM as king instead of David his father, and prospered; and all Israel obeyed him.

The earthly King of Israel is Like God, sitting upon the throne of Hashem in Jerusalem.

1Ch 29:20 And David said to all the congregation, Now bless YHWH your Elohim. And all the congregation blessed YHWH Elohim of their fathers, and bowed down their heads, and worshipped YHWH, and the king.

The earthly King of Israel sits on the throne of Hashem, and the Israelites worshiped Hashem and the king, who is Like God. Mika'EL = Who is like God? Answer: The King of Israel Is Like God.

The House of David is Like God, like the Angel of Hashem. Why? Because the earthly nation of Israel is a reflection of heavenly Israel, a.k.a. Tsabaoth.

Hashem Tsabaoth. He is YHWH of armies/Tsabaoth. The Sar Gadol, Miikael/Michael whose name is the question "Who Is Like God?" - The answer is: You are like God. The heavenly King of Israel, The Son of God, METATRON = The Angel Of YHWH, who is SAR GADOL = Heavenly Prince of Israel.

Purpose of earthly Israel: To create a holy place, set apart, for the incarnation of Mika'EL, the SAR GADOL, King of Israel, in heaven and on earth. He is the Mashiach, the true Adam, who doesn't fail. Through the first Adam, we were consigned to corruption and death. Through the last Adam, the incarnation of the Sar Gadol, we are redeemed.

 

[irosie91]

The Sar Gadol -

Dan 12:1-3 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince (SAR GADOL - HIGH PRINCE/ARCHANGEL), which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. (2) And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. (3) And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

The SAR GADOL = The one who raises the dead, empowered by HASHEM (YOD HEY WAW HEY).

Dan_10:21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.

The name Michael in Hebrew is מיכאל. It is pronounced as "Mee-kha-el". In terms of its meaning, "Michael" originates from the question "מי כאל‎" : "Who is like God?". The answer isn't "No One Is Like God", but rather " You Are Like God". The Sar Gadol.

Zechariah 12:8.:

"On that day the Lord will protect the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them on that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the angel of the LORD, going before them."

"בית דוד יהיה כאלוהים"

Phonetically, it would be pronounced as: "Beit David yihyeh k'Elohim". The house of David is like God, like the Angel of YHWH = Mika'El.

Look:

"Your throne, O God, is forever and ever. The scepter of your kingdom is a scepter of uprightness." Psalms 45:7
"כִּסְאֲךָ אֱלֹהִים, עוֹלָם וָעֶד; שֵׁבֶט מִישֹׁר, שֵׁבֶט מַלְכוּתֶךָ."

"Kis'akha Elohim", Your throne O Elohim. Rashi interprets the above as "Your throne Oh Judge", it's in the vocative. David or Solomon are being identified as "Elohim". The next verse states:

"You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, has anointed you with the oil of gladness above your fellows." Psalms 45:8

The one who is like Elohim, has an Elohim. The one who is like God, has a God. The earthly King of Israel is a reflection of the heavenly King of Israel. The earthly King of Israel, sits upon the throne of Hashem:

1Ch_29:23 Then Solomon sat on the throne of HASHEM as king instead of David his father, and prospered; and all Israel obeyed him.

The earthly King of Israel is Like God, sitting upon the throne of Hashem in Jerusalem.

1Ch 29:20 And David said to all the congregation, Now bless YHWH your Elohim. And all the congregation blessed YHWH Elohim of their fathers, and bowed down their heads, and worshipped YHWH, and the king.

The earthly King of Israel sits on the throne of Hashem, and the Israelites worshiped Hashem and the king, who is Like God. Mika'EL = Who is like God? Answer: The King of Israel Is Like God.

The House of David is Like God, like the Angel of Hashem. Why? Because the earthly nation of Israel is a reflection of heavenly Israel, a.k.a. Tsabaoth.

Hashem Tsabaoth. He is YHWH of armies/Tsabaoth. The Sar Gadol, Miikael/Michael whose name is the question "Who Is Like God?" - The answer is: You are like God. The heavenly King of Israel, The Son of God, METATRON = The Angel Of YHWH, who is SAR GADOL = Heavenly Prince of Israel.

Purpose of earthly Israel: To create a holy place, set apart, for the incarnation of Mika'EL, the SAR GADOL, King of Israel, in heaven and on earth. He is the Mashiach, the true Adam, who doesn't fail. Through the first Adam, we were consigned to corruption and death. Through the last Adam, the incarnation of the Sar Gadol, we are redeemed.

bad translation----the name MICHAEL is not "WHO IS LIKE GOD"??? it is more like
"HE WHO IS LIKE GOD" and I think that I shall never see, a poem lovely as a tree.
you are doing an idiot job on translating Hebrew----AND trying to base dogma on
aramaic poetry. and written or spoke poetry does not look like a tree

 

[irosie91]

It's not contradicted by text. Yehoshua is the incarnation of the Sar Gadol. He is Mashiach and through Him, we are redeemed.

ROFLMAO @ "incarnation" and "redeemed"

 

[hobelim]

slavery is enshrined in the c-bible among many other disparities, the desert religions - those people have never stood up for the prescribed religion from the heavens and murdered those who did in the 1st century ...

they have been crucifying ever since, you are wrong - injustice prevails and all is lost till those people are brought to justice for the path to the everlasting to again if it ever was be made available.

Slavery spoken of in the Bible, like indentured servitude, has never ended. People just call it employment. Slaves are now just called employees. Only difference, a big one, is that most people willingly give away their freedom for a price. The whippings are just more subtle and sophisticated. That being said if you tended to the ground of your own mind that has become filled with weeds that distort all of your thoughts perceptions and conclusions you would see that justice prevails and has always prevailed. Liberate yourself already from the slavery of perpetuating hatred.

In other words there is no escape either in this world or the next from the hand of the Almighty.

So there is no need for you to worry about injustice, it is never unanswered. Worry about yourself.

 

[rosends]

The SAR GADOL = The one who raises the dead, empowered by HASHEM (YOD HEY WAW HEY).

No, Michael did not raise the dead. He intended to speak against other nations but then asked for mercy on Israel's behalf.
Rashi -- ישתתק כאלם שיראה הקב"ה דן בעצמו ואומר היאך אאבד אומה גדולה כזו בשביל ישראל:
Metzudat David -- לבקש רחמים על ישראל

The name Michael in Hebrew is מיכאל. It is pronounced as "Mee-kha-el". In terms of its meaning, "Michael" originates from the question "מי כאל‎" : "Who is like God?". The answer isn't "No One Is Like God", but rather " You Are Like God". The Sar Gadol.

No, the question "who is like God" is answered in the text. Are you not familiar with

אֵ֥ין כָּאֵ֖ל יְשֻׁר֑וּן​

or this phrase which appears 6 times?
אֵין כָּמוֹךָ וְאֵין אֱלֹהִים זוּלָתֶךָ

Zechariah 12:8.:

"On that day the Lord will protect the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them on that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the angel of the LORD, going before them."

"בית דוד יהיה כאלוהים"

Phonetically, it would be pronounced as: "Beit David yihyeh k'Elohim". The house of David is like God, like the Angel of YHWH = Mika'El.

actually, that's not what the phrase means, especially in light of the subsequest phrase -- to help you out, start with the T"Y on the verse

כְּרַבְרְבִין יִצְלְחוּן בְּמַלְאֲכָא דַייָ קָדָמֵיהוֹן
and check out the Ibn Ezra's summary
מלאכים וככה פירושו כמלאך ה' לפניהם במלחמה.

Look:

"Your throne, O God, is forever and ever. The scepter of your kingdom is a scepter of uprightness." Psalms 45:7
"כִּסְאֲךָ אֱלֹהִים, עוֹלָם וָעֶד; שֵׁבֶט מִישֹׁר, שֵׁבֶט מַלְכוּתֶךָ."

"Kis'akha Elohim", Your throne O Elohim. Rashi interprets the above as "Your throne Oh Judge", it's in the vocative. David or Solomon are being identified as "Elohim". The next verse states:

That's not what Rashi says -- כסאך שר ושופט לעולם ועד (your throne, minister and judge eternally). The commentator who identifies it as a reference to Solomon is quoted by the Radak "החכם ר׳ אברהם פירש: כסאך כסא אלהים, כמו וישב שלמה על כסא" but that is because he explains the verse as "your throne is of God". This is the same Radak who also wrote "התועים הנוצרים שמפרשים המזמור על ישו הנוצרי"

The earthly King of Israel sits on the throne of Hashem, and the Israelites worshiped Hashem and the king, who is Like God. Mika'EL = Who is like God? Answer: The King of Israel Is Like God.

No, as text indicates, no one is like God but God can prepare a throne for a king. No one worshipped the king.

 

[irosie91]

Slavery spoken of in the Bible, like indentured servitude, has never ended. People just call it employment. Slaves are now just called employees. Only difference, a big one, is that most people willingly give away their freedom for a price. The whippings are just more subtle and sophisticated. That being said if you tended to the ground of your own mind that has become filled with weeds that distort all of your thoughts perceptions and conclusions you would see that justice prevails and has always prevailed. Liberate yourself already from the slavery of perpetuating hatred.

In other words there is no escape either in this world or the next from the hand of the Almighty.

So there is no need for you to worry about injustice, it is never unanswered. Worry about yourself.

..............in other word .............. you is nuts

 

[hobelim]

..............in other word .............. you is nuts

Yeah yeah yeah, thats what they all say.

 

[irosie91]

Yeah yeah yeah, thats what they all say.

ALL?????

 

[hobelim]

He is Mashiach and through Him, we are redeemed.

How many of you are there?

 

[BreezeWood]

Jews did not murder Jesus.

- they were cowards ... the jews

Then answered all the people, and the jews said, His blood be on us, and on our children.

you must be fond of moses - the liar.

 

[hobelim]

ALL?????

Well no. Only the ones who are running around naked, unwashed and covered with filth, reeking of vomit, cutting themselves with rocks and shrieking GIBBERISH among the jelly bean tombstones.

 

[irosie91]

Well no. Only the ones who are running around naked, unwashed and covered with filth, reeking of vomit, cutting themselves with rocks and shrieking GIBBERISH among the jelly bean tombstones.

easter egg hunt?

 

[BreezeWood]

So there is no need for you to worry about injustice, it is never unanswered.

the religion of antiquity - the triumph of good vs evil - is not in conclusion as injustice, the crucifixion of those in the 1st century, the criminals have not been brought to reckoning and continue their crimes to this day and in final triumph will terminate humanity to extinction upon final judgement ...

that's you hobo whether yourself or not - the religion of antiquity is for all humanity - see noah.