Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2

[Phoenall]

P F Tinmore,

You can't demand something that is not in the Public Domain.

(COMMENT)

The general criteria used in Central Europe is:

SUMMARY

The extraordinary European Council of 21 September 2001 defined terrorism as one of the main challenges facing the world and identified the fight against terrorism as one of the European Union’s (EU) priority objectives. The purpose of this common position is to apply further measures to combat terrorism, in addition to the United Nations Security Council Resolution 1373 (2001). Specifically, it establishes a list of individuals, groups and entities involved in terrorism whose funds and other financial assets are to be frozen as part of the fight against the financing of terrorism.

Definitions

"Persons, groups and entities involved in terrorist acts" means individuals, groups and entities on whom there is accurate information proving that they have committed, are attempting to commit or are facilitating the commission of terrorist acts.

"Terrorist acts" are defined as intentional acts that may seriously damage a country or an international organisation by intimidating a population, exerting undue compulsion of various types or by destabilising or destroying its fundamental political, constitutional, economic or social structures. The list of terrorist acts includes:

• attacks on a person’s life or physical integrity;
• kidnapping or hostage-taking;
• causing extensive destruction to a public or private facility, including information systems;
• seizure of means of public transport, such as aircrafts and ships;
• manufacture, possession, acquisition, transport or use of weapons, explosives, or nuclear, biological or chemical weapons;
• release of dangerous substances or causing fires, explosions or floods;
• interfering with or disrupting the supply of water, power or any other fundamental natural resource;
• directing or participating in the activities of a terrorist group, including by funding its activities or supplying material resources.

Merely threatening to commit any of these criminal acts is also to be treated as a terrorist offence.

The common position also defines "terrorist groups" as structured groups of persons, acting in concert to commit terrorist acts, regardless of their composition or the level of development of their structure.

List of individuals and entities concerned

The list annexed to the common position is drawn up on the basis of investigations carried out by the competent judicial and police authorities in EU countries. It must be revised at least every six months, so as to keep it up to date. The list comprises revolutionary activist groups, as well as the names of individuals belonging to such groups, including:

• CIRA (Continuity Irish Republican Army);
• E.T.A (Basque Fatherland and Liberty);
• G.R.A.P.O (the First of October Anti-Fascist Resistance Group);
• Hamas-Izz al-Din al-Qassem (terrorist wing of Hamas);

SPECIAL INSERT for P F TINMORE: HAMAS POLICY

With regards to the rise of Islamists to power and the significance and impact this has on the issue, it must be clear that this does not imply that Palestine needs only Islamists, or that Hamas and the Islamic Jihad – as national Islamic Palestinian powers – are only in need of Islamists due to their importance, distinction and firm position on the issue. On the contrary, we need all the nation’s trends and elements: Islamists, nationalists, liberals and leftists. This is our nation, we need everyone in it, and Palestine was and will remain an issue for the whole nation.

Senior Hamas Official: The Resistance Is Entitled To Attack Israel’s Embassies, Interests, And Officials Worldwide — And The Interests Of Its Allies, Headed By The U.S.
ByPAMELA GELLER on July 19, 2013

"The Palestinian resistance is entitled to expand and diversify its means and tools of resistance;
this is a legitimate resistance that defends a defenseless people that has fallen under an oppressive occupation which is supported by the global forces of evil. No one has the right to condemn the
resistance for any of the methods that it adopts, because it knows better than everyone else what is good for it and for its noble objectives.
​

PRESS RELEASE 3330th Council meeting Foreign Affairs Brussels, 22 July 2014

The EU strongly condemns the indiscriminate firing of rockets into Israel by Hamas and militant groups in the Gaza Strip, directly harming civilians. These are criminal and unjustifiable acts. The EU calls on Hamas to immediately put an end to these acts and to renounce violence. All terrorist groups in Gaza must disarm. The EU strongly condemns calls on the civilian population of Gaza to provide themselves as human shields.
​

Jihad and armed resistance is the correct and authentic means for the liberation of Palestine and the restoration of all rights. This battle must, of course, be accompanied by all forms of political, diplomatic, media, national and legal resistance, as well as the investment of the entire nation’s energies and the summoning of all the various strengths we possess.​

• LVF (Loyalist Volunteer Force)
• PIJ (Palestinian Islamic Jihad).

I thought I would give you an assortment of bullets that you might find interesting. However, the vast majority of Multinational Counterterrorism materials, actions and assets directed against self-identified Jihadist and Islamist is not yet in Open Source Material.

Most Respectfully,
R

The list annexed to the common position is drawn up on the basis of investigations carried out by the competent judicial and police authorities in EU countries.​

The court in the EU took Hamas off the terrorist list because their "investigations carried out by the competent judicial and police authorities" were taken from news reports.

I can speculate that the investigation in the US was not that stringent.

World| Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:29am EST
Related: WORLD
EU to appeal ruling that Hamas should be off terror list
BRUSSELS | BY ADRIAN CROFT

EU to appeal ruling that Hamas should be off terror list

EU foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini noted in a statement that the General Court made its ruling on procedural grounds. As a result of the appeal, Hamas will remain on the EU's terrorism list and its assets will remain frozen pending a judgment by the Court of Justice, the highest legal authority.

What dumbshit wrote this report?

Hamas has fought several wars with Israel since seizing power from Fatah in Gaza in 2007.​

Fatah lost the elections. Hamas was the elected government in office.

So what does this clown mean by seizing power?

Exactly what the world saw when hamas ran amok in gaza and started killing anyone suspected of having ties to fatah. They mass murdered children by throwing them from buildings or spraying them with bullets. This caused a backlash in the west bank that resulted in another bloodbath which now has the Palestinians virtually stateless again and no proper government. And it is all the fault of the Palestinian terrorists.

How does this mindless rant relate to my post?

If you cant see why then it is time to get a new hobby, I hear shark baiting is all the rage amongst elderly American wasters who have nothing.

 

[Phoenall]

Oh FFS. You are comparing thousands of civilian deaths as a result of Israeli terrorism with dozens as a result of Palestinian "terrorism". Unbelievable.

You are comparing defensive actions to terrorism and using the criteria such as quantity of civilian deaths as the measuring stick while placing the entire blame of those civilian deaths on the particular attacker in each exchange with no regard to the need for and the desirablity of defense or securing safety for one's own civilian population.

Thus those who minimize their own civilian deaths are demonized while those encouraging or actively supporting their own civilian deaths are glorified. And those who attempt to minimize the civilian deaths of the opponent are given the impossible task of reducing that to zero (especially difficult considering the above) or else be labelled evil or excessive while those actively attempting to maximize the opponent's civilian deaths are granted leisure to pursue such a course.

You and many others that blindly support Israel seem to ignore the fact that Israel has been occupying the land and ruling over the Muslim and Christian people of Palestine for over half a century. Any other country that behaved as Israel behaves as an occupying power would have been under severe sanctions long ago. What would you have the Palestinians do, meekly submit to foreign rule? It has nothing to do with religion, it has to do with foreign conquest and colonization. Israel should be demonized as the Germans were demonized when they responded disproportionally to violence perpetrated by the people they ruled under occupation.

"Had all of us in France meekly, lawfully carried out the orders of the German master, no Frenchman could have ever looked another man in the face. Such submission would have saved the lives of many -- some very dear to me -- but France would have lost its soul."

-- Commandant le Baron de Vomécourt

COWFLOP you don't have a clue as to what occupation means, and why it is being employed by Israel. You forget that under international law gaza is not occupied and so Israel can respond with force when the Palestinians fire illegal weapons into Israel. Time they started operation rolling thunder and did a two pronged attack meeting in the middle using standard munitions to take out every military target after warning the UN they intend to start bombing the next time an illegal weapon is fired and will stop when hamas surrenders

 

[Phoenall]

Oh FFS. You are comparing thousands of civilian deaths as a result of Israeli terrorism with dozens as a result of Palestinian "terrorism". Unbelievable.

You are comparing defensive actions to terrorism and using the criteria such as quantity of civilian deaths as the measuring stick while placing the entire blame of those civilian deaths on the particular attacker in each exchange with no regard to the need for and the desirablity of defense or securing safety for one's own civilian population.

Thus those who minimize their own civilian deaths are demonized while those encouraging or actively supporting their own civilian deaths are glorified. And those who attempt to minimize the civilian deaths of the opponent are given the impossible task of reducing that to zero (especially difficult considering the above) or else be labelled evil or excessive while those actively attempting to maximize the opponent's civilian deaths are granted leisure to pursue such a course.

You and many others that blindly support Israel seem to ignore the fact that Israel has been occupying the land and ruling over the Muslim and Christian people of Palestine for over half a century. Any other country that behaved as Israel behaves as an occupying power would have been under severe sanctions long ago. What would you have the Palestinians do, meekly submit to foreign rule? It has nothing to do with religion, it has to do with foreign conquest and colonization. Israel should be demonized as the Germans were demonized when they responded disproportionally to violence perpetrated by the people they ruled under occupation.

"Had all of us in France meekly, lawfully carried out the orders of the German master, no Frenchman could have ever looked another man in the face. Such submission would have saved the lives of many -- some very dear to me -- but France would have lost its soul."

-- Commandant le Baron de Vomécourt

As usual, you're clueless. The Arabs -Moslems occupying the disputed territories are unwilling to adhere to some pretty basic standards of law and order that the relevant first world holds to.

Retrogrades that hold to a standard of behavior delineated in a 1,400 year old hate and war manual represent a global plague on humanity.

And once again a member of team islamomoron shows that they are immature and childish when they need to get the last word but cant find anything adult or intelligent to post. The evidence of the islamonazi violence and mass murder is on nearly every page of the M.E. history books

 

[Phoenall]

Thank you for completely ignoring my actual post about the difference between terror and defensive actions which are currently legal. But ... addressing your comments...

What would you have the Palestinians do, meekly submit to foreign rule?

What would I have Palestinians do? First, I would have them recognize that ALL peoples (yes, including the Jewish people) have a right to live free from foreign rule and to have national self-determination. Then I would suggest that all terrorism cease -- no more rockets, no more stabbing people in the streets, no more running over moms and babies at bus stops, no more suicide/homicide bombs, no more kidnapping, no more tunnels. It all stops. Then I would suggest the Palestinians invest their time, money, energy, resources and intelligence into creating a viable infrastructure for their nation. Then they should negotiate a mutually beneficial peace and resource management and trade agreement with Israel, Jordan and Egypt. After that, they should apply for full membership into the UN. That would be the practical and civilized thing to do.

What do YOU think the Palestinians should do? Continue to commit small, ultimately useless terror attacks on the State of Israel in the hopes that one day this will lead to Israel giving Palestinians some sort of magical Judenrein kingdom from the river to the sea that the Palestinians still don't have to be actually responsible for?

You really want to know what I think. I think the Jews will never allow the creation of a sovereign state ruled by non-Jews in Eretz Israel, as stated by the Likud Charter. So, the Palestinians have two peaceful, relatively good options that would result in not being ruled by the Israeli Jews or living in a Jewish state indefinitely.

1. Negotiate reparations for each Palestinian (man, woman and child), those in the occupied territories, those in refugee camps and for Israeli Arabs combined with firm offers from countries around the world that include immediate citizenship and a suitable residence in those countries. I am talking about a monthly stipend of 500 USD monthly for each man, woman and child for say 10 years. That should result in an acceptable lifestyle in most countries, particularly for families, and provide time for integration into the economy of the new country. There is a huge Palestinian diaspora that could facilitate the operation.

Assuming 10 million Palestinians take the deal, it would cost donors 60 billion USD per year. The U.S. could stop paying Israel, Egypt and Jordan the 10 billion or so yearly in military aid and contribute it to the fund plus what it pays to the Palestinians already and bump it to 15 billion. The EU can afford to cover the same amount at least. The wealthy Gulf States and Saudi Arabia can afford at least as much. The other 15 billion could easily be covered by Japan, China and the rest of the world.

The departure of all the Muslims and Christians now under Jewish Israeli rule would insure that Israel could remain a Jewish state indefinitely. Non-Jews don't want to live in a state that proclaims itself a state for Jews and Israeli Jews don't want to live in a secular state for all religions, that's why they went to Israel.

2. Stop resisting and accept occupation for 2-3 generations when demographics will make it impossible for Israeli Jews to continue to maintain absolute rule over what will become a heavily majority non-Jewish population in the lands now ruled/controlled by Israel.

Of course, this latter option is not a good option for the Jews. But, I can't think of another "god" option for the Palestinians given the fact that the Israelis will not permit the establishment of a sovereign non-Jewish state in Eretz Israel.

Conversely, the bad option for the non-Jews is a decision by the Jews to forcibly expel the non-Jews or otherwise eliminate them. As the Israeli Jews turn further and further to the right this option is no longer unthinkable.

As is delinetated by the UN in 242, that says it will be done by all parties. Then do the same for the over 1 million Jewish refugees and their families that were expelled from their lands by the Palestinians. I would say $20 million for each Jew should just about cover it.
By the way your 10 million Palestinians would be reduced to less than 5,000 if the letter of the law was strictly adhered to as the vast majority of Palestinians have never even seen Palestine.


The demographics will never get to that point as you lump in Palestine to muddle the figures, the simple answer is for Israel to keep on as they are and let the UN take care of any attempt at all out war by the arab terrorists. If they don't then just bomb the Palestinians into the stone age.

 

[Phoenall]

montelatici

Wow. I'm actually surprised. So your solution to the conflict is to give each Palestinian 60,000 USD and forcibly displace them to other countries? Or to feign submission to foreign rule until the Jewish people can be overtaken by demographics?

You have no interest in pursuing some sort of self-determination in a two (four) state solution?

A sovereign non-Jewish state in Eretz Israel is not acceptable to the Israelis. It would not be a forced displacement, it would be an offer that the Palestinians would probably accept. The yearly stipend I proposed is 6K not 60K per annum.

The second option is what the Palestinians are left with if the first is not viable financially.

Self determination for the Palestinians is, unfortunately, a non-starter. Some people get screwed, it's the way of the world. All you can do is soften the blow to avoid retaliatory violence from those screwed.

And who would stump up this sum, bearing in mind that the original offer along these lines was turned down by the arab's as they would pay the largest amount being the most culpable. Nothing has changed since then to apportion moreblame on the Jews.

The second option is a pipe dream of yours that would see your final solution restart and the mass murder of the Jews. A pity that the Jews are too strong for that to work anymore. And all you would see is the death of thousands of Palestinian militia needlessly

 

[Phoenall]

You are comparing defensive actions to terrorism and using the criteria such as quantity of civilian deaths as the measuring stick while placing the entire blame of those civilian deaths on the particular attacker in each exchange with no regard to the need for and the desirablity of defense or securing safety for one's own civilian population.

Thus those who minimize their own civilian deaths are demonized while those encouraging or actively supporting their own civilian deaths are glorified. And those who attempt to minimize the civilian deaths of the opponent are given the impossible task of reducing that to zero (especially difficult considering the above) or else be labelled evil or excessive while those actively attempting to maximize the opponent's civilian deaths are granted leisure to pursue such a course.

You and many others that blindly support Israel seem to ignore the fact that Israel has been occupying the land and ruling over the Muslim and Christian people of Palestine for over half a century. Any other country that behaved as Israel behaves as an occupying power would have been under severe sanctions long ago. What would you have the Palestinians do, meekly submit to foreign rule? It has nothing to do with religion, it has to do with foreign conquest and colonization. Israel should be demonized as the Germans were demonized when they responded disproportionally to violence perpetrated by the people they ruled under occupation.

"Had all of us in France meekly, lawfully carried out the orders of the German master, no Frenchman could have ever looked another man in the face. Such submission would have saved the lives of many -- some very dear to me -- but France would have lost its soul."

-- Commandant le Baron de Vomécourt

As usual, you're clueless. The Arabs -Moslems occupying the disputed territories are unwilling to adhere to some pretty basic standards of law and order that the relevant first world holds to.

Retrogrades that hold to a standard of behavior delineated in a 1,400 year old hate and war manual represent a global plague on humanity.

Absent your typical cutting and pasting of spam that you litter thread after thread with, such are the musings of the vacant minded.

You are posting nonsense, don't interrupt the grownups.

You are the one doing that with your immature posts

 

[Phoenall]

A national liberation movement made up of Muslims and Christians contrasting a foreign occupation has little to do with Islamic terrorism. Grow up.

Listen to this Christian Palestinian.

Just more islamonazi pallywood propaganda. Why wont this group tell the world about the genocide of the Christians in Palestine by the muslims. The population has been reduced by 90% and leaves very few Christians left, just as Daesh is doing to the north.

 

[Phoenall]

No, the Christians have left as a result of being expelled by the Jews in 1947-1948 and as a result of the occupation. This Christian Palestinian tells it like it was.

And again just islamonazi pallywood propaganda to feed the gullible. The Bible is not a work of reference as this person claims, as it was written with the sole intention of disenfranchising the Jews of their heritage.

 

[Hollie]

You see, Holly, you just babble nonsense. I have the facts, and links to those facts. Give it up.

Actually, you do nothing but mindlessly cut and paste.

How silly that anyone would suggest that the Arabs-Moslems occupying the disputed territories should receive more welfare to continue their existing welfare fraud.

 

[Hollie]

No, the Christians have left as a result of being expelled by the Jews in 1947-1948 and as a result of the occupation. This Christian Palestinian tells it like it was.

Oh really.

 

[Phoenall]

No, the Christians have left as a result of being expelled by the Jews in 1947-1948 and as a result of the occupation. This Christian Palestinian tells it like it was.

Oh really.

The church has shown that since 2007 90% of the Christians from Palestine have been cleansed, forcibly converted or murdered by hamas and fatah because they are easier to deal with than the Jews.

 

[P F Tinmore]

A national liberation movement made up of Muslims and Christians contrasting a foreign occupation has little to do with Islamic terrorism. Grow up.

Listen to this Christian Palestinian.

Just more islamonazi pallywood propaganda. Why wont this group tell the world about the genocide of the Christians in Palestine by the muslims. The population has been reduced by 90% and leaves very few Christians left, just as Daesh is doing to the north.

You call a speech by a Christian to the Holy Land Christian Ecumenical Foundation islamonazi?

 

[montelatici]

Now a real Christian Palestinian priest, not Hasbarawood Productions:

 

[Hollie]

Who are the Pal'istanians?





Persecution of non-islamists is typical in Islamist colonial projects.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Now a real Christian Palestinian priest, not Hasbarawood Productions:

This Priest is in Gaza.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Who are the Pal'istanians?





Persecution of non-islamists is typical in Islamist colonial projects.

Why is it that every report of Muslims attacking Christians is from someone connected to Israel.

Coincident that!

 

[Hollie]

Who are the Pal'istanians?





Persecution of non-islamists is typical in Islamist colonial projects.

Why is it that every report of Muslims attacking Christians is from someone connected to Israel.

Coincident that!

What is a common theme among totalitarian Islamist fear societies? Suppression of free speech.

What do you think would happen if a kuffar was to openly criticize the Islamic terrorists in Gaza? In so many Islamist hell holes, an islamo- mob will form and any offence to Islamist ideology can result in death for the kuffar.

 

[P F Tinmore]

"Voices from Palestine", a day long festival of Palestinian films

 

[Hollie]

"Voices from Palestine", a day long festival of Palestinian films

In the meantime, the Islamic terrorists can eat a jdam.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Who are the Pal'istanians?





Persecution of non-islamists is typical in Islamist colonial projects.

Why is it that every report of Muslims attacking Christians is from someone connected to Israel.

Coincident that!

What is a common theme among totalitarian Islamist fear societies? Suppression of free speech.

What do you think would happen if a kuffar was to openly criticize the Islamic terrorists in Gaza? In so many Islamist hell holes, an islamo- mob will form and any offence to Islamist ideology can result in death for the kuffar.

Two women talk about Gaza.

Start @ 10:25