Why didn't Obama and the Democrats Just Go for Single Payor

[Procrustes Stretched]

if single payer is so "common sense" as you say.....why don't more countries have it....?

...

jesus christ! If common sense were common...


oh never mind. my common sense says "why bother?" with you

typical lib retort....

so please inform us all those many countries which have exclusively a successful single payer system.....you can say Canada has single payer but it is not all that successful....

lots of countries didn't have democracies at one point either. So what is your point?

The USA needs to design a system fit for itself. You're reactionary argument "no one else has something" so "danger WIll Robinson" is silly and weak

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

dictating 'guarantees' from the top does not guarantee service....if there are no doctors to take care of things there simply is no care...

no doctors? "The End is Near!"???

come on, be serious

so who informed you of the big SURGE of young people planning to become doctors now that Obamacare is in effect....? /sarcasm...

drawing correlations on things that have yet to occur?

 

[JoeB131]

I mean this is what they desire! This is what Obaminationcare's end game is. Obaminationcare was designed to fail and fail miserably tearing the enter system down with in, while at the same time upping the number of people in medicaid.

Eventually they will float the only solution is single payor!

However, in the meantime Obaminationcare will decimate the economy and gripple the job market.

I am not arguing whether or not single payor is the solution, but if that is what they so strongly desire, then why didn't they just push that plan when they had the house and senate? I mean not a single republican voted for Obamacare anyways, so why didn't they just go for what they wanted?

Probably because for all their whining, guys who make 9 figure paychecks aren't going to give those up without a fight.

The ironic thing is, the Insurance Industry KNOWS their model is dying, but they aren't going to go quietly into the night. THey are going to get the government to prop them up for as long as they can.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

No. They know that a well funded minority of Americans reject the idea. Huge difference.

It is a common sense policy. It saves money and improves outcomes.

The lobby against it is strong......but to claim that Americans reject it is bullshit.

if single payer is so "common sense" as you say.....why don't more countries have it....?

because it is a stellar failure......the ones who have tried it are all going toward private payer or have adapted into a mix of two sytems.....both public and private....

Nearly every first world country other than the US has some form of single-payer healthcare.

Your post is nonsense.

yes...."some form of single payer".......it sure doesn't stand alone....if you can afford it you will go elsewhere for your healthcare....single payer is for the poor suckers...

take Great Britain for example....their NHS is now 65 years old and the healthcare system is atrocious....if single payer is so great why are so many Brits shunning it....?

Reality also prevents accepting the fantasy that the NHS-style socialized medicine as initiated in 1948 has actually lived up to the so-called “core value” of British society. For if true, it must seem odd that people of means in Britain consistently look elsewhere for medical care. About six million Brits now buy private health insurance, including almost two-thirds of Brits earning more than $78,700. According to The Telegraph, the number of people paying for their own private care is up 20 percent year-to-year, with about 250,000 now choosing to pay for private treatment out-of-pocket each year. And does anyone wonder why Prince Philip recently chose to receive his medical care in the private London Clinic? Is it a mystery why Prince William and Kate Middleton have chosen to deliver their royal baby and receive birth care at the private St. Mary’s Hospital? Isn’t it notable that more than 50,000 Britons travel out of the country per year and spend £161 million to receive medical care due to lack of access, even though they are hemorrhaging money for their national pride? When given the choice, Brits shun the NHS, and rightfully so.

Happy Birthday To Great Britain's Increasingly Scandalous National Health Service - Forbes

 

[ScreamingEagle]

no doctors? "The End is Near!"???

come on, be serious

so who informed you of the big SURGE of young people planning to become doctors now that Obamacare is in effect....? /sarcasm...

drawing correlations on things that have yet to occur?

not a thinking man are you...? which explains why you are so easily led by the Left....

 

[ScreamingEagle]

jesus christ! If common sense were common...


oh never mind. my common sense says "why bother?" with you

typical lib retort....

so please inform us all those many countries which have exclusively a successful single payer system.....you can say Canada has single payer but it is not all that successful....

lots of countries didn't have democracies at one point either. So what is your point?

The USA needs to design a system fit for itself. You're reactionary argument "no one else has something" so "danger WIll Robinson" is silly and weak

if the USA is to design its own system it needs to have input from both sides of the aisle....your Far Left Party didn't allow for that.....which is why we have the fucking FAIL we are now dealing with...

who exactly wrote those 2,000 pages of shit anyway.....?

 

[Contumacious]

Why didn't Obama and the Democrats Just Go for Single Payor

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQ_tAe87ELo#t=109"]One Single Payer System [/ame]

.

 

[Borillar]

I mean this is what they desire! This is what Obaminationcare's end game is. Obaminationcare was designed to fail and fail miserably tearing the enter system down with in, while at the same time upping the number of people in medicaid.

Eventually they will float the only solution is single payor!

However, in the meantime Obaminationcare will decimate the economy and gripple the job market.

I am not arguing whether or not single payor is the solution, but if that is what they so strongly desire, then why didn't they just push that plan when they had the house and senate? I mean not a single republican voted for Obamacare anyways, so why didn't they just go for what they wanted?

IIRC, single payer or even a public option was taken off the table very early. I would have preferred a public option - ability to opt in to medicare over the ACA as it exists now.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

typical lib retort....

so please inform us all those many countries which have exclusively a successful single payer system.....you can say Canada has single payer but it is not all that successful....

lots of countries didn't have democracies at one point either. So what is your point?

The USA needs to design a system fit for itself. You're reactionary argument "no one else has something" so "danger WIll Robinson" is silly and weak

if the USA is to design its own system it needs to have input from both sides of the aisle....your Far Left Party didn't allow for that.....which is why we have the fucking FAIL we are now dealing with...

who exactly wrote those 2,000 pages of shit anyway.....?

The Health Insurance lobby.

 

[Contumacious]

lots of countries didn't have democracies at one point either. So what is your point?

The USA needs to design a system fit for itself. You're reactionary argument "no one else has something" so "danger WIll Robinson" is silly and weak

if the USA is to design its own system it needs to have input from both sides of the aisle....your Far Left Party didn't allow for that.....which is why we have the fucking FAIL we are now dealing with...

who exactly wrote those 2,000 pages of shit anyway.....?

The Health Insurance lobby.

In that case they own Harry Reid (D-USSR)


The motherfucker introduced the billl IN SECRET, in a snowy Christmas eve , at 1;00 AM. 1400 Pages which no one read and which the Republicans were not allowed to object.

.

.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

so who informed you of the big SURGE of young people planning to become doctors now that Obamacare is in effect....? /sarcasm...

drawing correlations on things that have yet to occur?

not a thinking man are you...? which explains why you are so easily led by the Left....

you remind me of those who confuse having an empty mind with an open mind. Hmm...

A thinking man I am. A delusional twit like you, not

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

typical lib retort....

so please inform us all those many countries which have exclusively a successful single payer system.....you can say Canada has single payer but it is not all that successful....

lots of countries didn't have democracies at one point either. So what is your point?

The USA needs to design a system fit for itself. You're reactionary argument "no one else has something" so "danger WIll Robinson" is silly and weak

if the USA is to design its own system it needs to have input from both sides of the aisle....your Far Left Party didn't allow for that.....which is why we have the fucking FAIL we are now dealing with...

who exactly wrote those 2,000 pages of shit anyway.....?

Nope

We need a system designed with input from the people and all parties concerned.

We did not change the system, we reformed the old one.

btw, as far as laws go they get passed by majority, not bipartisan agreement. Many laws of the past were passed by conservatives or liberals in the congress, but that was when parties had bigger tents. Now the right has taken over the GOP and has been pushing the DNC to go -- left only. sadly they are getting close to having the left/right dichotomy they've so cherished

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

lots of countries didn't have democracies at one point either. So what is your point?

The USA needs to design a system fit for itself. You're reactionary argument "no one else has something" so "danger WIll Robinson" is silly and weak

if the USA is to design its own system it needs to have input from both sides of the aisle....your Far Left Party didn't allow for that.....which is why we have the fucking FAIL we are now dealing with...

who exactly wrote those 2,000 pages of shit anyway.....?

The Health Insurance lobby.

What is unusual with that? have other industries help write laws that regulate them?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

if the USA is to design its own system it needs to have input from both sides of the aisle....your Far Left Party didn't allow for that.....which is why we have the fucking FAIL we are now dealing with...

who exactly wrote those 2,000 pages of shit anyway.....?

The Health Insurance lobby.

In that case they own Harry Reid (D-USSR)


The motherfucker introduced the billl IN SECRET, in a snowy Christmas eve , at 1;00 AM. 1400 Pages which no one read and which the Republicans were not allowed to object.

.

.

The Health Insurance lobby owns most of the Senate, Reid included.

But nothing else you posted here is the slightest bit true.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

The Health Insurance lobby.

In that case they own Harry Reid (D-USSR)


The motherfucker introduced the billl IN SECRET, in a snowy Christmas eve , at 1;00 AM. 1400 Pages which no one read and which the Republicans were not allowed to object.

.

.

The Health Insurance lobby owns most of the Senate, Reid included.

But nothing else you posted here is the slightest bit true.

Do they own Republicans and Democrats and if so why did and do they fight Obamacare in it's final draft form and parts of it's enactment?

 

[Contumacious]

The Health Insurance lobby.

In that case they own Harry Reid (D-USSR)


The motherfucker introduced the billl IN SECRET, in a snowy Christmas eve , at 1;00 AM. 1400 Pages which no one read and to which the Republicans were not allowed to object.

.

.

The Health Insurance lobby owns most of the Senate, Reid included.

But nothing else you posted here is the slightest bit true.

Really.

Grow a pair and provide a link to the pertinent Congressional Record.

Go for it.

.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

lots of countries didn't have democracies at one point either. So what is your point?

The USA needs to design a system fit for itself. You're reactionary argument "no one else has something" so "danger WIll Robinson" is silly and weak

if the USA is to design its own system it needs to have input from both sides of the aisle....your Far Left Party didn't allow for that.....which is why we have the fucking FAIL we are now dealing with...

who exactly wrote those 2,000 pages of shit anyway.....?

Nope

We need a system designed with input from the people and all parties concerned.

We did not change the system, we reformed the old one.

btw, as far as laws go they get passed by majority, not bipartisan agreement. Many laws of the past were passed by conservatives or liberals in the congress, but that was when parties had bigger tents. Now the right has taken over the GOP and has been pushing the DNC to go -- left only. sadly they are getting close to having the left/right dichotomy they've so cherished

your reply makes no sense...

change or reform....what kind of quibbling inane statement is that...?

and didn't i just say we need input from both sides of the aisle.....you know those representatives who represent the people....?

when the U.S. has major legislation it should be bipartisan after lots and lots of discussion and not be jammed through sneakily by one side in the 'dead of night'...as Contumacious noted....

 

[theDoctorisIn]

In that case they own Harry Reid (D-USSR)


The motherfucker introduced the billl IN SECRET, in a snowy Christmas eve , at 1;00 AM. 1400 Pages which no one read and which the Republicans were not allowed to object.

.

.

The Health Insurance lobby owns most of the Senate, Reid included.

But nothing else you posted here is the slightest bit true.

Really.

Grow a pair and provide a link to the pertinent Congressional Record.

Go for it.

.

Bill Summary & Status - 111th Congress (2009 - 2010) - H.R.3590 - All Information - THOMAS (Library of Congress)

There was 2 months of debate in the Senate, and countless amendments added throughout the month of December 2009. The vote was called at 7:05 AM on Christmas Eve, with all members of the Senate present and voting except for one.

There was nothing "secret" about it and every member of the Senate had ample opportunity to read it before the vote, and offer amendments - including the many amendments proposed by Republicans that ended up in the final bill.

 

[bripat9643]

Government provides currency, security, regulation and infrastructure.

Without those things, Capitalism isn't possible.

You can have trade..but it wouldn't be the same thing.

OK again. And, again, the implied 'so the fuck what'? I'm not advocating anarchy. I'm saying government shouldn't be interfering in our personal economic decisions. When you give government that power, those with the most to gain from controlling it (in this case, the insurance companies) will find a way to bend it to their ends. Blaming that on capitalism is perverse. It's like blaming freedom for tyranny.

Personal decisions in terms of what?

The government not only provides the things I listed but it also provides patents and copyrights.

Which is another way of "interfering" with "personal" decisions.

I never see any of you "free market" libertarians complaining about stuff like that.

And it really does create a HUGE disadvantage to people who want to start up a business.

Patent and copyright laws are a minor issue compared to dealing with the vast all-encompassing regulatory bureaucracy that we all suffer under now. Many libertarians oppose patent laws. However, abolishing the welfare state takes a much higher priority than fretting over trivial issues like that.

 

[bripat9643]

jesus christ! If common sense were common...


oh never mind. my common sense says "why bother?" with you

typical lib retort....

so please inform us all those many countries which have exclusively a successful single payer system.....you can say Canada has single payer but it is not all that successful....

lots of countries didn't have democracies at one point either. So what is your point?

The USA needs to design a system fit for itself. You're reactionary argument "no one else has something" so "danger WIll Robinson" is silly and weak

So an unbroken record of failure is your cue to do the same thing?