Why Do "Desperate Democrats" Strongly Appose Voter Photo I.D. Requirement For 2012 ?

[Navy1960]

15th Amendment
“

Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.
Section 2. The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

19th Amendment

The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of sex.
Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

Taken in conjunction with the 10th;

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

It would seem that the "right to vote" is a power delegated to the United States and therefor any matter dealing with those rights such as requiring an ID at the polling place would be subject to Federal review, especially in Federal elections.

All elections are state elections. Federal elections do not exist.
Requiring -all- people to present a photo ID when voting does not violate the 15/19th.

12th Amendment

The person having the greatest Number of votes for President, shall be the President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of Electors appointed; and if no person have such majority, then from the persons having the highest numbers not exceeding three on the list of those voted for as President, the House of Representatives shall choose immediately, by ballot, the President. But in choosing the President, the votes shall be taken by states, the representation from each state having one vote; a quorum for this purpose shall consist of a member or members from two-thirds of the states, and a majority of all the states shall be necessary to a choice. And if the House of Representatives shall not choose a President whenever the right of choice shall devolve upon them, before the fourth day of March next following, then the Vice-President shall act as President, as in the case of the death or other constitutional disability of the President.

While I understand your point, Federal Elections are for offices of Senate, President, and Congress.

United States v. Mississippi 50

Held:

1. Section 1971(a) of Title 42 U.S.C. guarantees the right of citizens "who are otherwise qualified by law" to vote at any election without racial distinction, and subsection (c) authorizes the Attorney General to sue for preventive relief to protect that right regardless of whether it is threatened by invalid laws or valid laws discriminatorily applied. Pp. 380 U. S. 136-138.
UNITED STATES V. MISSISSIPPI, 380 U. S. 128 :: Volume 380 :: 1965 :: US Supreme Court Cases from Justia & Oyez

LESSER V. GARNETT
MR. JUSTICE BRANDEIS delivered the opinion of the Court.

On October 12, 1920, Cecilia Streett Waters and Mary D. Randolph, citizens of Maryland, applied for and were granted registration as qualified voters in Baltimore City. To have their names stricken from the list, Oscar Leser and others brought this suit in the court of common pleas. The only ground of disqualification alleged was that the applicants for registration were women, whereas the Constitution of Maryland limits the suffrage to men. Ratification of the proposed amendment to the federal
LESER V. GARNETT, 258 U. S. 130 :: Volume 258 :: 1922 :: Full Text :: US Supreme Court Cases from Justia & Oyez

It's pretty clear that when a state sets conditions upon which a voter , be it male, female, or whatever color they may be, those conditions when it comes to "rights not granted to the states" are a matter for congress to decide and NOT for the states to decide. Clearly while the "right to vote" was not the original intent of the 15th rather it was allowing African American men to vote. It's very clear since that time that "right" has been clearly established in several cases. While its' true that at the forming of this nation only white land owners could vote and that was generally established in the legislatures of the each of the 13 colonies, since that time, our nation has given ALL of it's citizens the "right" to vote. This talk of a voter I.D. is a political one and has little of anything to do with curbing voter fraud, if that were the case, again I submit it would be easy enough to place one's picture on a voter registration card and this issue would go away. Once more, I will repeat, while many may want these law's to become a reality they face a long uphill battle and over 130 years of established case law to overcome. On a personal level I have no issue with showing an ID at the polling place, however, I would ask this, if I am required to do so, and someone who vote's absentee is not, then how does that help in establishing who the voter is. Further, if the goal is to require everyone to show an ID, then what do you say to the sailor who is deployed on a cruise in the middle of the Pacific who wants to vote, please mail your Military ID , we will send it back?

 

[NoNukes]

Let us see some proof of voter fraud.

 

[Uncensored2008]

In Wisconsin, the law would would require a photo ID for the first time in Wisconsin history and only a very narrow range of ID's would qualify. Voters would have to show a Wisconsin driver's licenses, state-issued ID cards, military IDs, passports, naturalization certificates, IDs issued by a Native American tribe based in Wisconsin or certain student IDs. Students not living in dorms would have to show fee payment receipts. Common Cause Wisconsin characterizes the Wisconsin measure as "the most restrictive, blatantly partisan and ill-conceived voter identification legislation in the nation."

So what ID's are acceptable for exercising the constitutional right to purchase a firearm? Is it the same ID?

While Governor Scott Walker has pushed forward an anti-union agenda with gusto and justified the push by repeating that "Wisconsin is broke," money is apparently not a concern when it comes to voter suppression. AB-7 is expected to cost the state some $5.7 million. That includes $2.2 million for the Government Accountability Board, almost $2 million for the Transportation Department (to cover employee expenses and the cost of free IDs) and more than $1.6 million if universities chose to remake student IDs.

Wisconsin's Voter ID bill is up for debate in the state Assembly this week and is expected to pass. The Isthmus reports that there were some modest changes to the bill in committee: "Most significantly, the Assembly version would include university-issued student identification cards as an acceptable form of ID. But there's a catch: the student IDs must include a current address, birth date, signature and expiration date -- requirements no college or university in Wisconsin currently meets."

Voter Suppression Bills Sweep the Country | Center for Media and Democracy

 

[Jarhead]

Just to be clear...

The left supports a law that mandates that an individual purchase health insurace at a cost of 3-5K per year

But the cost of an ID is too expensive to mandate having to use one to vote.

AM I correct?

 

[Chris]

Wisconsin's Voter ID bill is up for debate in the state Assembly this week and is expected to pass. The Isthmus reports that there were some modest changes to the bill in committee: "Most significantly, the Assembly version would include university-issued student identification cards as an acceptable form of ID. But there's a catch: the student IDs must include a current address, birth date, signature and expiration date -- requirements no college or university in Wisconsin currently meets."

Voter Suppression Bills Sweep the Country | Center for Media and Democracy

 

[Care4all]

In Wisconsin, the law would would require a photo ID for the first time in Wisconsin history and only a very narrow range of ID's would qualify. Voters would have to show a Wisconsin driver's licenses, state-issued ID cards, military IDs, passports, naturalization certificates, IDs issued by a Native American tribe based in Wisconsin or certain student IDs. Students not living in dorms would have to show fee payment receipts. Common Cause Wisconsin characterizes the Wisconsin measure as "the most restrictive, blatantly partisan and ill-conceived voter identification legislation in the nation."

So what ID's are acceptable for exercising the constitutional right to purchase a firearm? Is it the same ID?

While Governor Scott Walker has pushed forward an anti-union agenda with gusto and justified the push by repeating that "Wisconsin is broke," money is apparently not a concern when it comes to voter suppression. AB-7 is expected to cost the state some $5.7 million. That includes $2.2 million for the Government Accountability Board, almost $2 million for the Transportation Department (to cover employee expenses and the cost of free IDs) and more than $1.6 million if universities chose to remake student IDs.

Wisconsin's Voter ID bill is up for debate in the state Assembly this week and is expected to pass. The Isthmus reports that there were some modest changes to the bill in committee: "Most significantly, the Assembly version would include university-issued student identification cards as an acceptable form of ID. But there's a catch: the student IDs must include a current address, birth date, signature and expiration date -- requirements no college or university in Wisconsin currently meets."

Voter Suppression Bills Sweep the Country | Center for Media and Democracy

so essentially, the student id's will NOT be valid gvt id's to use to vote based on what i bolded above.

gun laws are by state, along with voter id requirements.

 

[Uncensored2008]

And claims to be a lawyer, no less.
:roll:

Jillian for the Offense, esq. Followed closely by Ravi....

 

[Conservative]

IDs will keep legal American voters from voting and provide no protection against the very type of fraud tthe right pretends exsists.

LIAR.

How does possessing an ID PREVENT you from voting?

 

[Uncensored2008]

so essentially, the student id's will NOT be valid gvt id's to use to vote based on what i bolded above.

gun laws are by state, along with voter id requirements.

As long as they have the required information, they are.

Why should the ID requirements to buy a gun be more strict than to decide our leaders?

 

[Foxfyre]

In my opinion it should not be made 'easy' to vote. People should be responsible enough to go through the effort to go to an authorized place to show positive ID and register to vote. Registration should be closed far enough ahead of the election to verify all registrations before the vote is taken.

An absentee ballot system should require going to an authorized location, showing positive ID, and picking up a very-difficult-to-forge ballot that should be returned in time to be counted on election day along with everybody else.

If you move to a different precinct during that waiting period, you should make it your responsibility to get back to your old precinct to vote.

You should get yourself to a bonafide polling place, show your positive ID, and vote even if it means standing in line for awhile to do so as it used to do.

Such a system would go a long way to restoring the integrity of the process, and would ensure that it was informed, concerned citizens who actually cared about the process who would vote.

It would disenfranchise nobody. Those who don't care enough to inconvenience themselves a bit shouldn't be voting anyway.

Yeah, but if they make it too difficult, it will take more than $20 to get an illegal to vote for Obama. We must consider the ACORN budget in this....

LOL tada!!! The additional benefit of making people take initiative and effort to qualify to vote and then to vote makes it soooooooo much more dificult for groups like ACORN to try to rig the system. No more paying somebody on the street $1 or $5 to go in, register, and then vote for the name on the piece of paper they are given. No more bussing in folks from another state who are able to utilize lax rules and processes to affect the results in a particular precinct.

And our wonderful friends here who honestly believe that sort of thing doesn't go on still should not object to making the system as foolproof, honest, and fair as possible. Those who object to that simply must WANT there to be ways to rig a vote.

 

[M14 Shooter]

IDs will keep legal American voters from voting and provide no protection against the very type of fraud tthe right pretends exsists.

LIAR.
How does possessing an ID PREVENT you from voting?

It should be very clear that the truth does NOT really matter.

 

[Navy1960]

IDs will keep legal American voters from voting and provide no protection against the very type of fraud tthe right pretends exsists.

LIAR.

How does possessing an ID PREVENT you from voting?

ID's don't keep people from voting, just a thought here though Conservative, if the goal is to cut down on fraud what's to stop those people who wish to do so from making fake ID's if the goal here is to commit fraud in the first place? Again, I will say this, I honestly do not have an issue with an ID being shown in some form or the other, it would seem to me that making them obtainable for those who do not have them would be a more noble goal, so that two birds with one stone so to speak.

 

[Foxfyre]

On this same note, I think the voter registration should include an affidavit that the person intends to vote in that precinct only. If it turns out they lied about that, they should be subject to a stiff fine at the very least. Actually voting twice in the same election should include jail time.

 

[Care4all]

so essentially, the student id's will NOT be valid gvt id's to use to vote based on what i bolded above.

gun laws are by state, along with voter id requirements.

As long as they have the required information, they are.

Why should the ID requirements to buy a gun be more strict than to decide our leaders?

it depends on what state you are in....it's not harder to own a gun here, but then again, it is not hard for a citizen to vote here either, though the republican governor is trying to change that now.....

it's up to your own state....

but i would venture to guess that the reason could be, because guns can kill other people, a citizen's vote does not...???

 

[M14 Shooter]

so essentially, the student id's will NOT be valid gvt id's to use to vote based on what i bolded above.

gun laws are by state, along with voter id requirements.

As long as they have the required information, they are.

Why should the ID requirements to buy a gun be more strict than to decide our leaders?

it depends on what state you are in....it's not harder to own a gun here, but then again, it is not hard for a citizen to vote here either, though the republican governor is trying to change that now.....
it's up to your own state....
but i would venture to guess that the reason could be, because guns can kill other people, a citizen's vote does not...???

Allowing people to illegally cast ballots directly damages the rights of all voters, dilutes the effect of the exercise of that right and undermines the very nature of our version of democracy.

This is a FAR more sinister issue than the occasional gun death.

 

[Navy1960]

On this same note, I think the voter registration should include an affidavit that the person intends to vote in that precinct only. If it turns out they lied about that, they should be subject to a stiff fine at the very least. Actually voting twice in the same election should include jail time.

Fox, my daughter is in her Senior year in college and can tell you from experience helping her get into the place, this voter registration and ID issue is not has complicated as we make it out to be. Take for example a kid going into college, well they are issued a college ID with their picture on it, and as an example, let's say they decided to register to vote, well then it would be a matter of just placing a mark or color or whatever and you have an ID for them. Same goes for my earlier suggestion on the picture on the registration card. Personally, I believe that much to much time is spent on nonsense legislation like these voter ID laws, rather than solving issues like issuing the ID's themselves in order to make political hay be it Democrat or Republican take your pick.

 

[Uncensored2008]

it depends on what state you are in....

No, federal law requires that ID be presented to buy a firearm.

{Sale of a firearm by a federally licensed dealer must be documented by a federal form 4473, which identifies and includes other information about the purchaser, and records the make, model, and serial number of the firearm. Sales to an individual of multiple handguns within a five-day period require dealer notification to the ATF. Violations of dealer record keeping requirements are punishable by a penalty of up to $1000 and one year's imprisonment.}

it's not harder to own a gun here, but then again, it is not hard for a citizen to vote here either, though the republican governor is trying to change that now.....

It's harder to buy a gun than to vote.

it's up to your own state....

Here in the Peoples Republic, gun ownership is actively under assault.

but i would venture to guess that the reason could be, because guns can kill other people, a citizen's vote does not...???

Tell that to those dying in Afghanistan due to Bush/Obama...

 

[Chris]

Maine
Citing problems with voter fraud as a reason to end election day registration and require people to present a photo ID prior to voting, Maine legislators are trying to pass two bills that would disenfranchise 11 percent of the state. Maine has one of the highest voter turnout rates in the country. Apparently, Maine Republicans think this is bad for democracy.

The Sun Journal reported that in early March, "A legislative panel [Joint Finance Committee] voted 6-6 along party lines to recommend LD 199 to the Legislature ... Same-day registration could soon come to an end under a bill [LD 203] proposed by Rep. Gary Knight (R-Livermore Falls). His bill, which has yet to be heard by the committee, would halt voter registration seven days before an election."

Voter Suppression Bills Sweep the Country | Center for Media and Democracy

 

[M14 Shooter]

Maine
Citing problems with voter fraud as a reason to end election day registration and require people to present a photo ID prior to voting, Maine legislators are trying to pass two bills that would disenfranchise 11 percent of the state. Maine has one of the highest voter turnout rates in the country. Apparently, Maine Republicans think this is bad for democracy.

The Sun Journal reported that in early March, "A legislative panel [Joint Finance Committee] voted 6-6 along party lines to recommend LD 199 to the Legislature ... Same-day registration could soon come to an end under a bill [LD 203] proposed by Rep. Gary Knight (R-Livermore Falls). His bill, which has yet to be heard by the committee, would halt voter registration seven days before an election."

Excellent! This is great news!

 

[Foxfyre]

On this same note, I think the voter registration should include an affidavit that the person intends to vote in that precinct only. If it turns out they lied about that, they should be subject to a stiff fine at the very least. Actually voting twice in the same election should include jail time.

Fox, my daughter is in her Senior year in college and can tell you from experience helping her get into the place, this voter registration and ID issue is not has complicated as we make it out to be. Take for example a kid going into college, well they are issued a college ID with their picture on it, and as an example, let's say they decided to register to vote, well then it would be a matter of just placing a mark or color or whatever and you have an ID for them. Same goes for my earlier suggestion on the picture on the registration card. Personally, I believe that much to much time is spent on nonsense legislation like these voter ID laws, rather than solving issues like issuing the ID's themselves in order to make political hay be it Democrat or Republican take your pick.

To me the simplest solution is to simply issue a photo voter registration card when you register to vote along with the registrant signing an affidavit that they will vote only in their assigned precinct. And you show your voter ID when you go to vote. I think those three things would eliminate 99% of voter fraud and/or uncertainty without disenfranchising a single soul or compromising the system in any way.

Nobody but a few idiots will accept $1 or $5 or $20 to vote fraudulently and thereby risk a stiff fine or jail time.