Why do the God-haters persist?

[sealybobo]

Hi [MENTION=11281]sealybobo[/MENTION]
I thought of two good examples, where God's truth "doesn't have to hide"
but can be hiding "in plain sight" and we just can't see it yet

A. I can't find the post where [MENTION=48205]thebrucebeat[/MENTION] first said it
but when I posted that "Jesus means Justice" he automatically
retorted NO those two things have nothing in common, or something like that

When I share this same concept (that Jesus means Justice)
with Christian friends at different times and places, they responded differently, too:
a1. one of the friends took several minutes to realize this made sense to her.
that Jesus WAS Justice, but didn't get it at first. It took thinking about before she agreed.
a2. another friend at work IMMEDIATELY agreed of course, Jesus means Justice.
he did not have to think about it because he already understood this
a3. another friend was criticizing Christian fundamentalists for being unforgiving and hateful. once I explained the difference between Retributive Justice and Restorative Justice, he understood the division between the Christians who judge vs ones who forgive.
EVEN among believing Christians, this understanding of Jesus as Justice is HIDDEN or obscured.
It isn't obvious to all people, even though the concept is what it is; it is out there, not hidden, yet
we don't all see it, at first, or at all.

With Bruce who is secular and does not believe in using Biblical language or symbols
to ENFORCE positive things about justice, but only to ATTACK negative injustice,
I don't think he SEES that Jesus aligns with Justice.

So he is "blind" to this, it is HIDDEN from him.
He outright REJECTED any connection between Jesus with Justice.
He aligns Christian dogma with injustice, so this is FOREIGN that it is SUPPOSED
to mean Justice with Mercy, establishing Truth through Justice, etc.

B. the other example of hiding knowledge in plain public sight:
the science and studies on spiritual healing, and the effect of forgiveness and
deliverance on healing deep rooted sickness, addiction and abuse,
have already been established FOR THOSE WHO LOOK INTO THIS RESEARCH.

For those who want to keep reinforcing REJECTION of the natural science of healing,
this knowledge is OFF LIMITS, inaccessible, or Nonexistence.

it might as well be FRAUD with the malpractice and abuse of religion that is heard in the news.

The SUCCESSFUL testimonies, case studies and research is also out there.
But it is "hidden in plain sight"

People are too busy fighting over religious division between faith and science.
Not all people are ready to see that science can prove these methods of healing work naturally.

So that is a prime example, which I find fascinating,
but TRAGIC that lives could be saved by these methods that are censored due to
religious rejection of anything to do with Christian prayer, practice and healing process.

All accessible to the public, yet not accessible and cut off by division and rejection.
Like having "water everywhere" and "not a drop to drink."

Bruce is right. To say God is the universe/love/laws of physics/patience/kindness/justice.

We already have names for these things. Redefining something as ‘god’ tells us nothing. To use the word ‘god’ implies a host of other attributes and if you don’t intend to apply those attributes, using the word is intentionally misleading.

“To call the world God is not to explain it; it is only to enrich our language with a superfluous synonym for the word ‘world’.” – Arthur Schopenhauer

“If Jesus is the son of god, but also god himself, then he supposedly sacrificed himself to himself to save what he created from himself. He also, therefore, prayed to himself and begged himself not to require himself be crucified in order to appease himself and save the world from the wrath of himself.” – Anonymous

There’s no hell mentioned in the Old Testament. The punishment of the dead is not specified there. It’s only with gentle Jesus, meek and mild, that the idea of eternal torture for minor transgressions is introduced.” – Christopher Hitchens

“Now, if the book of Genesis is an allegory, then sin is an allegory, the Fall is an allegory and the need for a Savior is an allegory – but if we are all descendants of an allegory, where does that leave us? It destroys the foundation of all Christian doctrine—it destroys the foundation of the gospel.” - Ken Ham

YOUR IGNORANCE KNOWS NO BOUNDS!! BEFORE YOU TRY TO DEBATE WHAT GOD'S WORD SAYS YOU NEED TO READ IT!!!duh!!

I read it and all the other religious books of the world and I found that the Bible is not self-authenticating; it is simply one of many religious texts. The Bible is historically inaccurate, factually incorrect, inconsistent and contradictory. It was artificially constructed by a group of men in antiquity and is poorly translated, heavily altered and selectively interpreted. Entire sections of the text have been redacted over time.

 

[GISMYS]

Bruce is right. To say God is the universe/love/laws of physics/patience/kindness/justice.

We already have names for these things. Redefining something as ‘god’ tells us nothing. To use the word ‘god’ implies a host of other attributes and if you don’t intend to apply those attributes, using the word is intentionally misleading.

“To call the world God is not to explain it; it is only to enrich our language with a superfluous synonym for the word ‘world’.” – Arthur Schopenhauer

“If Jesus is the son of god, but also god himself, then he supposedly sacrificed himself to himself to save what he created from himself. He also, therefore, prayed to himself and begged himself not to require himself be crucified in order to appease himself and save the world from the wrath of himself.” – Anonymous

There’s no hell mentioned in the Old Testament. The punishment of the dead is not specified there. It’s only with gentle Jesus, meek and mild, that the idea of eternal torture for minor transgressions is introduced.” – Christopher Hitchens

“Now, if the book of Genesis is an allegory, then sin is an allegory, the Fall is an allegory and the need for a Savior is an allegory – but if we are all descendants of an allegory, where does that leave us? It destroys the foundation of all Christian doctrine—it destroys the foundation of the gospel.” - Ken Ham

YOUR IGNORANCE KNOWS NO BOUNDS!! BEFORE YOU TRY TO DEBATE WHAT GOD'S WORD SAYS YOU NEED TO READ IT!!!duh!!

I already did. Now what?

The Biblical account of Jesus has striking similarities with other mythologies and texts and many of his supposed teachings existed prior to his time. It is likely the character was either partly or entirely invented [2] by competing first century messianic cults from an amalgamation of Greco-Roman, Egyptian and Judeo-Apocalyptic myths and prophecies.

The Gospels themselves contradict one-another [2] on many key events and were constructed by unknown authors up to a century after the events they describe are said to have occurred. They are not eyewitness accounts. The New Testament, as a whole, contains many internal inconsistencies as a result of its piecemeal construction and is factually incorrect on several historical claims, such as the early existence of Nazareth, the reign of Herod and the Roman census. Like the Old Testament, it too has had entire books and sections redacted.

YOU HAVE NO UNDERSTANDING ABOUT GOD'S ETERNAL LIVING WORD!!! GOD IS OUTSIDE TIME, GOD'S WORD WAS BEFORE CREATION. AND ALL YOUR DOUBTS ABOUT THE BIBLE ARE DEMON INSPIRED AND THE RESULTS YOUR IGNORANCE!!! =====HEY!!! almost my tennis time!!!

 

[sealybobo]

Hi [MENTION=11281]sealybobo[/MENTION]
I thought of two good examples, where God's truth "doesn't have to hide"
but can be hiding "in plain sight" and we just can't see it yet

A. I can't find the post where [MENTION=48205]thebrucebeat[/MENTION] first said it
but when I posted that "Jesus means Justice" he automatically
retorted NO those two things have nothing in common, or something like that

When I share this same concept (that Jesus means Justice)
with Christian friends at different times and places, they responded differently, too:
a1. one of the friends took several minutes to realize this made sense to her.
that Jesus WAS Justice, but didn't get it at first. It took thinking about before she agreed.
a2. another friend at work IMMEDIATELY agreed of course, Jesus means Justice.
he did not have to think about it because he already understood this
a3. another friend was criticizing Christian fundamentalists for being unforgiving and hateful. once I explained the difference between Retributive Justice and Restorative Justice, he understood the division between the Christians who judge vs ones who forgive.
EVEN among believing Christians, this understanding of Jesus as Justice is HIDDEN or obscured.
It isn't obvious to all people, even though the concept is what it is; it is out there, not hidden, yet
we don't all see it, at first, or at all.

With Bruce who is secular and does not believe in using Biblical language or symbols
to ENFORCE positive things about justice, but only to ATTACK negative injustice,
I don't think he SEES that Jesus aligns with Justice.

So he is "blind" to this, it is HIDDEN from him.
He outright REJECTED any connection between Jesus with Justice.
He aligns Christian dogma with injustice, so this is FOREIGN that it is SUPPOSED
to mean Justice with Mercy, establishing Truth through Justice, etc.

B. the other example of hiding knowledge in plain public sight:
the science and studies on spiritual healing, and the effect of forgiveness and
deliverance on healing deep rooted sickness, addiction and abuse,
have already been established FOR THOSE WHO LOOK INTO THIS RESEARCH.

For those who want to keep reinforcing REJECTION of the natural science of healing,
this knowledge is OFF LIMITS, inaccessible, or Nonexistence.

it might as well be FRAUD with the malpractice and abuse of religion that is heard in the news.

The SUCCESSFUL testimonies, case studies and research is also out there.
But it is "hidden in plain sight"

People are too busy fighting over religious division between faith and science.
Not all people are ready to see that science can prove these methods of healing work naturally.

So that is a prime example, which I find fascinating,
but TRAGIC that lives could be saved by these methods that are censored due to
religious rejection of anything to do with Christian prayer, practice and healing process.

All accessible to the public, yet not accessible and cut off by division and rejection.
Like having "water everywhere" and "not a drop to drink."

Bruce is right. To say God is the universe/love/laws of physics/patience/kindness/justice.

We already have names for these things. Redefining something as ‘god’ tells us nothing. To use the word ‘god’ implies a host of other attributes and if you don’t intend to apply those attributes, using the word is intentionally misleading.

“To call the world God is not to explain it; it is only to enrich our language with a superfluous synonym for the word ‘world’.” – Arthur Schopenhauer

“If Jesus is the son of god, but also god himself, then he supposedly sacrificed himself to himself to save what he created from himself. He also, therefore, prayed to himself and begged himself not to require himself be crucified in order to appease himself and save the world from the wrath of himself.” – Anonymous

There’s no hell mentioned in the Old Testament. The punishment of the dead is not specified there. It’s only with gentle Jesus, meek and mild, that the idea of eternal torture for minor transgressions is introduced.” – Christopher Hitchens

“Now, if the book of Genesis is an allegory, then sin is an allegory, the Fall is an allegory and the need for a Savior is an allegory – but if we are all descendants of an allegory, where does that leave us? It destroys the foundation of all Christian doctrine—it destroys the foundation of the gospel.” - Ken Ham

YOUR IGNORANCE KNOWS NO BOUNDS!! BEFORE YOU TRY TO DEBATE WHAT GOD'S WORD SAYS YOU NEED TO READ IT!!!duh!!

You aren't even capable of reading the bible. You had to rely on the Greeks who

a. Translated it from the old written language to Greek so ultimately red neck hillbilly Kintucke or Tenese cifering hicks like you could understand what it meant.

b. Greek priests are still to this day debating the meaning(s) throughout. So its funny your televangelist preacher/reverand/minister cult leader is so sure about the meanings.

c. Funny my priest never even mentioned gays. He's always reading the bible and he never once talks about gays. He has talked about the 7 deadly sins though, GISMYS! Quit fingering yourself why you post. THat's why she goes all caps. Easier with one hand occupied.

 

[sealybobo]

YOUR IGNORANCE KNOWS NO BOUNDS!! BEFORE YOU TRY TO DEBATE WHAT GOD'S WORD SAYS YOU NEED TO READ IT!!!duh!!

I already did. Now what?

The Biblical account of Jesus has striking similarities with other mythologies and texts and many of his supposed teachings existed prior to his time. It is likely the character was either partly or entirely invented [2] by competing first century messianic cults from an amalgamation of Greco-Roman, Egyptian and Judeo-Apocalyptic myths and prophecies.

The Gospels themselves contradict one-another [2] on many key events and were constructed by unknown authors up to a century after the events they describe are said to have occurred. They are not eyewitness accounts. The New Testament, as a whole, contains many internal inconsistencies as a result of its piecemeal construction and is factually incorrect on several historical claims, such as the early existence of Nazareth, the reign of Herod and the Roman census. Like the Old Testament, it too has had entire books and sections redacted.

YOU HAVE NO UNDERSTANDING ABOUT GOD'S ETERNAL LIVING WORD!!! GOD IS OUTSIDE TIME, GOD'S WORD WAS BEFORE CREATION. AND ALL YOUR DOUBTS ABOUT THE BIBLE ARE DEMON INSPIRED AND THE RESULTS YOUR IGNORANCE!!! =====HEY!!! almost my tennis time!!!

If there is a god he don't care about me or you. Have fun at tennis stupid.

 

[sealybobo]

YOUR IGNORANCE KNOWS NO BOUNDS!! BEFORE YOU TRY TO DEBATE WHAT GOD'S WORD SAYS YOU NEED TO READ IT!!!duh!!

I already did. Now what?

The Biblical account of Jesus has striking similarities with other mythologies and texts and many of his supposed teachings existed prior to his time. It is likely the character was either partly or entirely invented [2] by competing first century messianic cults from an amalgamation of Greco-Roman, Egyptian and Judeo-Apocalyptic myths and prophecies.

The Gospels themselves contradict one-another [2] on many key events and were constructed by unknown authors up to a century after the events they describe are said to have occurred. They are not eyewitness accounts. The New Testament, as a whole, contains many internal inconsistencies as a result of its piecemeal construction and is factually incorrect on several historical claims, such as the early existence of Nazareth, the reign of Herod and the Roman census. Like the Old Testament, it too has had entire books and sections redacted.

YOU HAVE NO UNDERSTANDING ABOUT GOD'S ETERNAL LIVING WORD!!! GOD IS OUTSIDE TIME, GOD'S WORD WAS BEFORE CREATION. AND ALL YOUR DOUBTS ABOUT THE BIBLE ARE DEMON INSPIRED AND THE RESULTS YOUR IGNORANCE!!! =====HEY!!! almost my tennis time!!!

Do they have tennis courts in the prison yard? Seems like you are on USMB 24/7 this is the first time you've said you had somewhere to go. Do they let you out for 1 hour a day? 2-3pm? See you at 3:15 after you shower with Crazy Eyes.

 

[GISMYS]

Bruce is right. To say God is the universe/love/laws of physics/patience/kindness/justice.

We already have names for these things. Redefining something as ‘god’ tells us nothing. To use the word ‘god’ implies a host of other attributes and if you don’t intend to apply those attributes, using the word is intentionally misleading.

“To call the world God is not to explain it; it is only to enrich our language with a superfluous synonym for the word ‘world’.” – Arthur Schopenhauer

“If Jesus is the son of god, but also god himself, then he supposedly sacrificed himself to himself to save what he created from himself. He also, therefore, prayed to himself and begged himself not to require himself be crucified in order to appease himself and save the world from the wrath of himself.” – Anonymous

There’s no hell mentioned in the Old Testament. The punishment of the dead is not specified there. It’s only with gentle Jesus, meek and mild, that the idea of eternal torture for minor transgressions is introduced.” – Christopher Hitchens

“Now, if the book of Genesis is an allegory, then sin is an allegory, the Fall is an allegory and the need for a Savior is an allegory – but if we are all descendants of an allegory, where does that leave us? It destroys the foundation of all Christian doctrine—it destroys the foundation of the gospel.” - Ken Ham

YOUR IGNORANCE KNOWS NO BOUNDS!! BEFORE YOU TRY TO DEBATE WHAT GOD'S WORD SAYS YOU NEED TO READ IT!!!duh!!

You aren't even capable of reading the bible. You had to rely on the Greeks who

a. Translated it from the old written language to Greek so ultimately red neck hillbilly Kintucke or Tenese cifering hicks like you could understand what it meant.

b. Greek priests are still to this day debating the meaning(s) throughout. So its funny your televangelist preacher/reverand/minister cult leader is so sure about the meanings.

c. Funny my priest never even mentioned gays. He's always reading the bible and he never once talks about gays. He has talked about the 7 deadly sins though, GISMYS! Quit fingering yourself why you post. THat's why she goes all caps. Easier with one hand occupied.

John 1:1-5 Before anything else existed, there was "THE WORD" Christ,* with God. He has always been alive and is himself God. 3 He created everything there is—nothing exists that he didn’t make. 4 Eternal life is in him, and this life gives light to all mankind. 5 His life is the light that shines through the darkness—and the darkness can never extinguish it.
John 1:1-5

 

[Boss]

Bruce is right. To say God is the universe/love/laws of physics/patience/kindness/justice.

We already have names for these things. Redefining something as ‘god’ tells us nothing.

You act as if God is some new idea we just recently came up with. A word we invented to "redefine" things. Sorry, but God precedes all those things, including language and thought as well as humans.

 

[sealybobo]

Bruce is right. To say God is the universe/love/laws of physics/patience/kindness/justice.

We already have names for these things. Redefining something as ‘god’ tells us nothing.

You act as if God is some new idea we just recently came up with. A word we invented to "redefine" things. Sorry, but God precedes all those things, including language and thought as well as humans.

John 1:1-5 Before anything else existed, there was "THE WORD" Christ,* with God. He has always been alive and is himself God. 3 He created everything there is—nothing exists that he didn’t make. 4 Eternal life is in him, and this life gives light to all mankind. 5 His life is the light that shines through the darkness—and the darkness can never extinguish it.
John 1:1-5

 

[Boss]

Bruce is right. To say God is the universe/love/laws of physics/patience/kindness/justice.

We already have names for these things. Redefining something as ‘god’ tells us nothing.

You act as if God is some new idea we just recently came up with. A word we invented to "redefine" things. Sorry, but God precedes all those things, including language and thought as well as humans.

John 1:1-5 Before anything else existed, there was "THE WORD" Christ,* with God. He has always been alive and is himself God. 3 He created everything there is—nothing exists that he didn’t make. 4 Eternal life is in him, and this life gives light to all mankind. 5 His life is the light that shines through the darkness—and the darkness can never extinguish it.
John 1:1-5

Why are you quoting a religious text you don't believe in to make your point? Does that not strike you as just a little bit on the stupid side?

Let's go back to rudimentary science and what we know from observable evidence. The physical universe exists. It came to exist as the result of a cosmic "Big Bang" which created physical reality, time and space. God is the spiritual force which made that happen. It is impossible for the universe to have happened any other way. Physical nature cannot create itself because energy doesn't spontaneously create itself. E=mc2. Newton's Laws of Motion tells us things do not put themselves into motion. If the universe is in motion, it had to be put in motion by something, and if physical reality did not exist, it couldn't have been physical.

 

[sealybobo]

You act as if God is some new idea we just recently came up with. A word we invented to "redefine" things. Sorry, but God precedes all those things, including language and thought as well as humans.

John 1:1-5 Before anything else existed, there was "THE WORD" Christ,* with God. He has always been alive and is himself God. 3 He created everything there is—nothing exists that he didn’t make. 4 Eternal life is in him, and this life gives light to all mankind. 5 His life is the light that shines through the darkness—and the darkness can never extinguish it.
John 1:1-5

Why are you quoting a religious text you don't believe in to make your point? Does that not strike you as just a little bit on the stupid side?

Let's go back to rudimentary science and what we know from observable evidence. The physical universe exists. It came to exist as the result of a cosmic "Big Bang" which created physical reality, time and space. God is the spiritual force which made that happen. It is impossible for the universe to have happened any other way. Physical nature cannot create itself because energy doesn't spontaneously create itself. E=mc2. Newton's Laws of Motion tells us things do not put themselves into motion. If the universe is in motion, it had to be put in motion by something, and if physical reality did not exist, it couldn't have been physical.

That was Gismys' quote.

While non-human primates are not religious, they do exhibit some traits that would have been necessary for the evolution of religion. These traits include high intelligence, a capacity for symbolic communication, a sense of social norms, realization of "self" and a concept of continuity.

The use of burial rituals is evidence of religious activity, but there is no other evidence that religion existed in human culture before humans reached behavioral modernity.

Behavioral modernity refers to a set of traits that distinguish present day humans and their recent ancestors from both other living primates and other extinct hominid lineages. It is the point at which Homo sapiens began to demonstrate an ability to use complex symbolic thought and express cultural creativity. These developments are often thought to be associated with the origin of language. Elements of behavioral modernity include finely-made tools, fishing, long-distance exchange or barter among groups, self-ornamentation, figurative art, games, music, cooking and burial.

The religious mind is one consequence of a brain that is large enough to formulate religious and philosophical ideas. During human evolution, the hominid brain tripled in size, peaking 500,000 years ago. Much of the brain's expansion took place in the neocortex. This part of the brain is involved in processing higher order cognitive functions that are connected with human religiosity. The neocortex is associated with self-consciousness, language and emotion. The neocortex size of any species correlates with the level of social complexity of the particular species. The neocortex size correlates with a number of social variables that include social group size and complexity of mating behaviors. In chimpanzees the neocortex occupies 50% of the brain, whereas in modern humans it occupies 80% of the brain.

The critical event in the evolution of the neocortex took place at the speciation of archaic homo sapiens about 500,000 years ago. Only after the speciation event is the neocortex large enough to process complex social phenomena such as language and religion.

So when our brains got big enough to have an imagination, that's when we invented god. But you say this is proof of a god? No it is not. They were only 1 step out of the cave. Just look at how ignorant/back woods/uneducated our grandfathers were. Now go back 30 generations.

 

[Boss]

You're all over the board with your speculations and theories here. Brain size has little to do with anything at all. Dinosaurs had brains considerably larger than humans. Whales and great apes have a neocortex larger than humans. You've never shown a "speciation event" to have happened. This is a theory, a speculation. So are all the assorted assumptions you are making about how humans "invented" God.

Religions were invented. Spirituality was not. For whatever reason, humans have ALWAYS had the intrinsic ability to spiritually connect to something greater than self. Whether God designed us this way originally or God bestowed this upon us after we evolved into being, doesn't really matter. From the start, it distinguished humans from all other animals. This is very difficult to explain naturally, given the facts we know to be true. All behavioral attributes in nature are traceable to common ancestry. Spirituality is not. So we have this relatively new species arriving 500k years ago, achieving unprecedented levels of accomplishment, mind boggling achievement and knowledge, and we also just so happen to have this behavioral attribute found nowhere else in nature. We must consider these are connected fundamentally, and they are.

 

[PostmodernProph]

Just look at how ignorant/back woods/uneducated our grandfathers were.

reminds me of an interesting story.....I was baptized in a small Iowa country church.....I was the first child baptized by a young minister fresh out of the seminary....he went on to become the chairman of our entire denomination spanning all of North America.....5,000+ congregations....I heard him speak at his retirement celebration.....

he spoke about his first church.....he said he was getting ready for a consistory meeting....one of the matters up for discussion was about a controversial doctrinal matter....he was worried the elders were going to put him on the spot about the teachings of the church on the matter so he spent days preparing, researching, crafting arguments and counter arguments.....

he said when the meeting began the elders, all Iowa farmers, started discussing the teachings of Calvin regarding the issue and reached a conclusion without even asking him a question, covering everything he had diligently studied from their own memories of Calvin's writings.....

one of those elders was my "ignorant" grandfather......

 

[HUGGY]

John 1:1-5 Before anything else existed, there was "THE WORD" Christ,* with God. He has always been alive and is himself God. 3 He created everything there is—nothing exists that he didn’t make. 4 Eternal life is in him, and this life gives light to all mankind. 5 His life is the light that shines through the darkness—and the darkness can never extinguish it.
John 1:1-5

Why are you quoting a religious text you don't believe in to make your point? Does that not strike you as just a little bit on the stupid side?

Let's go back to rudimentary science and what we know from observable evidence. The physical universe exists. It came to exist as the result of a cosmic "Big Bang" which created physical reality, time and space. God is the spiritual force which made that happen. It is impossible for the universe to have happened any other way. Physical nature cannot create itself because energy doesn't spontaneously create itself. E=mc2. Newton's Laws of Motion tells us things do not put themselves into motion. If the universe is in motion, it had to be put in motion by something, and if physical reality did not exist, it couldn't have been physical.

That was Gismys' quote.

While non-human primates are not religious, they do exhibit some traits that would have been necessary for the evolution of religion. These traits include high intelligence, a capacity for symbolic communication, a sense of social norms, realization of "self" and a concept of continuity.

The use of burial rituals is evidence of religious activity, but there is no other evidence that religion existed in human culture before humans reached behavioral modernity.

Behavioral modernity refers to a set of traits that distinguish present day humans and their recent ancestors from both other living primates and other extinct hominid lineages. It is the point at which Homo sapiens began to demonstrate an ability to use complex symbolic thought and express cultural creativity. These developments are often thought to be associated with the origin of language. Elements of behavioral modernity include finely-made tools, fishing, long-distance exchange or barter among groups, self-ornamentation, figurative art, games, music, cooking and burial.

The religious mind is one consequence of a brain that is large enough to formulate religious and philosophical ideas. During human evolution, the hominid brain tripled in size, peaking 500,000 years ago. Much of the brain's expansion took place in the neocortex. This part of the brain is involved in processing higher order cognitive functions that are connected with human religiosity. The neocortex is associated with self-consciousness, language and emotion. The neocortex size of any species correlates with the level of social complexity of the particular species. The neocortex size correlates with a number of social variables that include social group size and complexity of mating behaviors. In chimpanzees the neocortex occupies 50% of the brain, whereas in modern humans it occupies 80% of the brain.

The critical event in the evolution of the neocortex took place at the speciation of archaic homo sapiens about 500,000 years ago. Only after the speciation event is the neocortex large enough to process complex social phenomena such as language and religion.

So when our brains got big enough to have an imagination, that's when we invented god. But you say this is proof of a god? No it is not. They were only 1 step out of the cave. Just look at how ignorant/back woods/uneducated our grandfathers were. Now go back 30 generations.

A human reproductive generation is around 20 years. A Israelite generation is said to be 40 years as that is the length of time they wandered through the desert. Some say 100 years..

Some claim a generation is as long as it takes a society to "get" a new way of being or understanding the latest circumstance and the lessons it forces us to go through.

Examples..the WWI generation..the WWII generation including the invention of the atomic bomb. The Viet Nam generation including the protests and divide created among us. There was a generation created that witnessed the Kennedy assacination and the lack of trust in the powers that be. There was a generation started with 9/11.

At best a generation is a vague measurement.

 

[Boss]

Here is a prolific thought to ponder. What really exists? People will say God doesn't exist because they see no evidence, but in actuality, what does exist? Can we say the past exists? It's in the past. The things that have been written here earlier this day, or yesterday, last week, a month ago... no longer exist in reality, they are past events. At one time, they were reality. Do the events of the future exist? Well, not yet. They will exist in reality the moment they happen, then they will become the past and no longer exist. However, we are not sure if they will ever actually exist, the universe could abruptly end before you finish reading this sentence. Whew... it didn't, but the point is, it could have. You are now experiencing a totally different reality than when you began reading this paragraph, and that moment when you began reading is now the past and no longer part of reality.

Our perception of reality is but a fleeting moment in time. It is constantly moving, every second, every nanosecond, what was real is gone forever, part of the past and what was real at one time. There is no way to stop this process or reverse it. At least, not as of now. The present is all that is real and all that exists. Reality is not the future or past, it is the present. It is in constant state of change.

Just something to think about when discussing what is real, what exists, and reality.

 

[sealybobo]

Here is a prolific thought to ponder. What really exists? People will say God doesn't exist because they see no evidence, but in actuality, what does exist? Can we say the past exists? It's in the past. The things that have been written here earlier this day, or yesterday, last week, a month ago... no longer exist in reality, they are past events. At one time, they were reality. Do the events of the future exist? Well, not yet. They will exist in reality the moment they happen, then they will become the past and no longer exist. However, we are not sure if they will ever actually exist, the universe could abruptly end before you finish reading this sentence. Whew... it didn't, but the point is, it could have. You are now experiencing a totally different reality than when you began reading this paragraph, and that moment when you began reading is now the past and no longer part of reality.

Our perception of reality is but a fleeting moment in time. It is constantly moving, every second, every nanosecond, what was real is gone forever, part of the past and what was real at one time. There is no way to stop this process or reverse it. At least, not as of now. The present is all that is real and all that exists. Reality is not the future or past, it is the present. It is in constant state of change.

Just something to think about when discussing what is real, what exists, and reality.

Yea yea the old if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it, does it make a noise routine. Who's on second? No, THIRD BASE.

You're assuming god talked to adam, noah & moses. He didn't. If he did in "the past" then I would say god exists or at least existed. But since that's all made up all you have is wishful thinking.

Because our barely smarter than ape ancestors invented god you believe. They also invented the idea that the earth was flat. They were wrong.

 

[sealybobo]

Just look at how ignorant/back woods/uneducated our grandfathers were.

reminds me of an interesting story.....I was baptized in a small Iowa country church.....I was the first child baptized by a young minister fresh out of the seminary....he went on to become the chairman of our entire denomination spanning all of North America.....5,000+ congregations....I heard him speak at his retirement celebration.....

he spoke about his first church.....he said he was getting ready for a consistory meeting....one of the matters up for discussion was about a controversial doctrinal matter....he was worried the elders were going to put him on the spot about the teachings of the church on the matter so he spent days preparing, researching, crafting arguments and counter arguments.....

he said when the meeting began the elders, all Iowa farmers, started discussing the teachings of Calvin regarding the issue and reached a conclusion without even asking him a question, covering everything he had diligently studied from their own memories of Calvin's writings.....

one of those elders was my "ignorant" grandfather......

What's your point? As far as science goes your grandparents were probably just as ignorant as mine. AND, your grandfather, just like you and I, was brainwashed from birth to believe in god.

Don't take it personally. 80% of the world believes in god. That doesn't mean its right. Us humans are still pretty unevolved/primative. How much of our brains do we use? There is still a lot to learn. Yes, our ancestors were stupid and they passed on a lie to us. Not their fault. They were told the fables when they were children so of course they told them to you. We've been doing it since men wrote the bible around 1900 years ago. Its time we stop telling the lie. At least keep it to yourselves. Don't try to push that shit on us in school or in our government.

 

[Boss]

Yea yea the old if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it, does it make a noise routine.

Not at all. Regardless of who hears what, once the tree falls the event is part of the past and no longer reality. It may be the last time a tree ever falls, the universe can end at any time. Reality is only what is experienced for the instant it happens. You can't hold the past or experience the past again, it's gone forever. You may remember it, but the experience was only the instant it happened. It no longer exists in reality. It will never exist again in reality.

 

[GISMYS]

Yea yea the old if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it, does it make a noise routine.

Not at all. Regardless of who hears what, once the tree falls the event is part of the past and no longer reality. It may be the last time a tree ever falls, the universe can end at any time. Reality is only what is experienced for the instant it happens. You can't hold the past or experience the past again, it's gone forever. You may remember it, but the experience was only the instant it happened. It no longer exists in reality. It will never exist again in reality.

UNLESS YOU WERE GOD,GOD SEES THE BEGINNING TO THE END OF THE AGE NOW!!!=TODAY!!! GOD IS THE ALPHA AND OMEGA=GOD IS OUTSIDE TIME!!! Wow!!!

 

[PostmodernProph]

Just look at how ignorant/back woods/uneducated our grandfathers were.

reminds me of an interesting story.....I was baptized in a small Iowa country church.....I was the first child baptized by a young minister fresh out of the seminary....he went on to become the chairman of our entire denomination spanning all of North America.....5,000+ congregations....I heard him speak at his retirement celebration.....

he spoke about his first church.....he said he was getting ready for a consistory meeting....one of the matters up for discussion was about a controversial doctrinal matter....he was worried the elders were going to put him on the spot about the teachings of the church on the matter so he spent days preparing, researching, crafting arguments and counter arguments.....

he said when the meeting began the elders, all Iowa farmers, started discussing the teachings of Calvin regarding the issue and reached a conclusion without even asking him a question, covering everything he had diligently studied from their own memories of Calvin's writings.....

one of those elders was my "ignorant" grandfather......

What's your point?

/shrugs....my point is, my grandfather was less ignorant than you...../

 

[HUGGY]

reminds me of an interesting story.....I was baptized in a small Iowa country church.....I was the first child baptized by a young minister fresh out of the seminary....he went on to become the chairman of our entire denomination spanning all of North America.....5,000+ congregations....I heard him speak at his retirement celebration.....

he spoke about his first church.....he said he was getting ready for a consistory meeting....one of the matters up for discussion was about a controversial doctrinal matter....he was worried the elders were going to put him on the spot about the teachings of the church on the matter so he spent days preparing, researching, crafting arguments and counter arguments.....

he said when the meeting began the elders, all Iowa farmers, started discussing the teachings of Calvin regarding the issue and reached a conclusion without even asking him a question, covering everything he had diligently studied from their own memories of Calvin's writings.....

one of those elders was my "ignorant" grandfather......

What's your point?

/shrugs....my point is, my grandfather was less ignorant than you...../

"reminds me of an interesting story".....

This family reprise seems not as "interesting" as you might imagine...

In it's own small way another reason to hate god?