hjmick
Platinum Member
I do not know of anyone who "celebrates" Columbus Day.
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I do not know of anyone who "celebrates" Columbus Day.
In 1492, Europe was lagging behind the Middle East and China and India is the civilized arts.
In 1492, West African cultures had a better grasp of proto-capitalism than any society in the world.
In 1600, at least 90% of Native Americans had perished, more than fifteen million individuals.
The Spanish empire assimilated the indios into a stratified culture that recognized their souls as God given and codified their legal status in society.
The French in North America generally respected Native American cultures, although the 'beaver wars' (down, Samson, down) disrupted entire regions and led to the extinction of several tribes.
The English would not accommodate and would not assimilate the Native American in general. The only possible reprisal by the Native Americans was battle, which inevitably they lost.
Having said all the above, I still believe if the colors of the Africans, Europeans, and Native Americans had been exchanged but not the cultures, then the outcome would have been the same.
Well well well...
Debunking Lies About Columbus: The Story Of Francisco de Bobadilla - Ricochet.com
Let me introduce you to Francisco de Bobadilla liar and Columbus usurper. The criticism of Columbus today comes from de Bobadilla. Who was he? The man who wanted Columbus job as Governor of Hispaniola.
In 1500 the King and Queen sent him here to investigate claims that Columbus wasnt being fair to the European settlers (which means Columbus was protecting the Indians). So de Bobedilla came here, and in just a few short days investigated (with no telephones or motorized vehicles to help him), then arrested Columbus and his brothers for Indian mistreatment and sent them back to Spain, sans a trial. Oh yeah, he appointed himself Governor. Coup de Coeur for power lead to Coup d etat, as usual.
The King and Queen called shenanigans and sent for be Bobadilla two years later, but he drowned on the trip home. Columbus was reinstated as Admiral. So what we know of Columbian malfeasance comes from a defrocked liar, de Bobadilla.
Nor was Columbus involved in the slave trade, as America haters like Howard Zinn and Noam Chomsky have asserted. One of his boats crashed in Haiti. He had no room for 39 men, so he started a colony there. Columbus came back a year later to find the Taino Indians killed all of them and left them where they fell. Columbus went to war with the Tainos and took 500 POWs, not slaves. They were released after the war. Big difference.
Also wrong is blaming Columbus for bringing genocidal microbes to kill the Indians. His detractors make fun of him for thinking he was in the East. So was his evil plan then to bring disease to wipe out the East?
Europeans didnt know of germs until Italian physicist Girolamo Fracastoro proposed the theory 40 years after Columbus died. Also, had an Indian built a boat and traveled to Europe and back, he would have contaminated the Indians too. Trans-continental contamination was going to happen at some point, making the first carriers irrelevant.
And the hits just keep in coming.
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Does anyone besides govt employees and Banks celebrate coloumbus day?
Columbus Day parade in New YorkDoes anyone besides govt employees and Banks celebrate coloumbus day?
Meh. Holidays are political creations, not historical ones. Congress wanted a day off in October and decided they liked a holiday called Columbus Day. Who knows, maybe they'll change it to Lindsay Lohan Day or something else equally meaningless.
Columbus Day parade in New YorkDoes anyone besides govt employees and Banks celebrate coloumbus day?
"barbarism, warfare and general misery"
Boo-hoo
We know very little about the state of the native's civilization because they had so little of it. They had barbarism, warfare and misery long before Western Europe showed up.
Columbus Day the holiday (likely of the Italian American lobby, lol, look at multi-culti me) in the United States of America is about the opening of the New World to a new way to live in it for all mankind. It's a celebration of Western philosophy that followed quickly upon discovery. Discovery, the Age of Reason and the Age of Enlightenment all made the USA possible in their path.
Since most everything was destroyed the claim that they has so little civilization simple cannot be backed up with fact can it?
Hahahaha, a new way to live. More like a new way to kill, and exploitation for the Spanish. And then after the Spanish decline came the other europeans to exploit the pristine forrests.
Have you not understood anything said on this topic to this point? Columbus Day is about the big picture and opening the New World to a better way of life. Yeah, 500+ years later the historical details show one primitive culture being cornholed buy a slightly less primitive culture but that's hardly shameful, Hell that's the story of mankind since day uno.
"Pristine forest"? Unless your some kind of cartoon fairy my guess is you would be dead in three days if lost in a pristine wood. How does one "exploit" a forest anyway. Build a house in it? (a school? a factory? a hospital? a museum?) Newsflash Sparky, that's the stuff of civilization. Really man, grow up.
In 1492, Europe was lagging behind the Middle East and China and India is the civilized arts.
In 1492, West African cultures had a better grasp of proto-capitalism than any society in the world.
In 1600, at least 90% of Native Americans had perished, more than fifteen million individuals.
The Spanish empire assimilated the indios into a stratified culture that recognized their souls as God given and codified their legal status in society.
The French in North America generally respected Native American cultures, although the 'beaver wars' (down, Samson, down) disrupted entire regions and led to the extinction of several tribes.
The English would not accommodate and would not assimilate the Native American in general. The only possible reprisal by the Native Americans was battle, which inevitably they lost.
Having said all the above, I still believe if the colors of the Africans, Europeans, and Native Americans had been exchanged but not the cultures, then the outcome would have been the same.
In 1600, at least 90% of Native Americans had perished, more than fifteen million individuals.
In 1492, Europe was lagging behind the Middle East and China and India is the civilized arts.
The Europeans won, not because God was on their side (I am pretty sure by then He was hiding from their religious wars against each other), because they had superior technology, incredible numbers over the centuries, and European diseases. Good or bad? You decide. The fact is what it was: a superior technology and diseases that crippled Native American power.
Wow. What pieces of poorly-written, masturbatory garbage. I especially like how they say Columbus should be excused for not holding modern values, but then look down upon the Native Americans for having non-Western values.
I hope someone brought a tube-sock.
If it weren't for Columbus you would have never been born.
Because of Columbus, countless native Americans never were born.
In 1492, Europe was lagging behind the Middle East and China and India is the civilized arts.
In 1492, West African cultures had a better grasp of proto-capitalism than any society in the world.
In 1600, at least 90% of Native Americans had perished, more than fifteen million individuals.
The Spanish empire assimilated the indios into a stratified culture that recognized their souls as God given and codified their legal status in society.
The French in North America generally respected Native American cultures, although the 'beaver wars' (down, Samson, down) disrupted entire regions and led to the extinction of several tribes.
The English would not accommodate and would not assimilate the Native American in general. The only possible reprisal by the Native Americans was battle, which inevitably they lost.
Having said all the above, I still believe if the colors of the Africans, Europeans, and Native Americans had been exchanged but not the cultures, then the outcome would have been the same.
In 1600, at least 90% of Native Americans had perished, more than fifteen million individuals.
I am going to have to ask for some verification, that seems an awful lot t have happened by 1600.
In 1492, Europe was lagging behind the Middle East and China and India is the civilized arts.
thats a curious way of putting it......can you define what you mean by- civilized arts?
The Europeans won, not because God was on their side (I am pretty sure by then He was hiding from their religious wars against each other), because they had superior technology, incredible numbers over the centuries, and European diseases. Good or bad? You decide. The fact is what it was: a superior technology and diseases that crippled Native American power.
diseases? you are I guess referring to the Fort Pitt incident?
The Europeans won, not because God was on their side (I am pretty sure by then He was hiding from their religious wars against each other), because they had superior technology, incredible numbers over the centuries, and European diseases. Good or bad? You decide. The fact is what it was: a superior technology and diseases that crippled Native American power.
diseases? you are I guess referring to the Fort Pitt incident?
measles, mumps, small pox, chicken pox, so forth and so on. The Native American communities, having no immunity to any of these diseases, withered away.
If it weren't for Columbus you would have never been born.
Because of Columbus, countless native Americans never were born.
wow, sounds like a huge burden to put on a guy that never even step foot on the Continent...oh, I get it, guilt by association.
Its time again to honor the great man that discovered America. To me this has always seemed a bit strange since he did not discover America and his greatness is certainly debatable.
Leif Ericson landed on our shores 500 years before Columbus. There exists cartographic evidence, according to cartographic expert Armando Cortesao, that Portuguese explorers visited the Americas and mapped the area in 1424. There is also evidence of other early explorers reaching our shores. Of course we always discount the first real discovers of American, the native Americans.
Well, as far as a being a great man . He was a slave trader who heartlessly took men and women away form their families in order lessen his failure to find a new trade route. He oversaw and participated in the rape and murder of innocent villagers. His contemporaries despised him. As governor of Santo Domingo on Hispaniola, he was a despot who kept all profits for himself and his brothers, and was loathed by the colonists whose lives he controlled. Attempts were made on his life and he was actually sent back to Spain in chains at one point after his third voyage. During his fourth voyage, he and his men were stranded on Jamaica for a year where his ships rotted: no one wanted to travel there from Hispaniola to save him. He was also a cheapskate: after promising a reward to whomever spotted land first on his 1492 voyage, he refused to pay up when sailor Rodrigo de Triana did so, giving the reward to himself instead because he had seen a glow the night before. However, one of the greatest curses he brought to American was smallpox which killed as much as 400,000 native Americans. A great man, I don't think so.
Previously, elevation of Columbus to a hero caused people to name cities (and a country, Colombia) after him and many places still celebrate Columbus Day, but now days people tend to see Columbus for what he really was: a brave, but very flawed, human being. Frankly, I just can't figure why we set aside a special day in his honor.
Who Discovered America? Not Christopher Columbus, That's for Certain - Associated Content - associatedcontent.com
The Truth About Christopher Columbus
AmericanHeritage.com / Christopher Columbus, Hero and Villain