Why is nobody talking about the illegal imprisonment of Kaci Hickox?

[TooTall]

It was common practice in the 40's and 50's to quarantine entire families for measles and chicken pox. I am not a lawyer, but there certainly were legal grounds for a mandatory quarantine back then.

Arrest is legal. That does not mean that all arrests are legal.

I will repeat, If someone comes down with the symptoms and becomes contagious, (and I don't wish that on anyone) I would much rather it happen while quarantined in their home rather than in the subway or bowling alley.

Sure....who needs those pesky constitutional rights. TooTall would feel much better if people get sick while in a quarantine, so we'll just go with that plan. Matter of fact, we'll expand the quarantine to include flu and colds as well. TooTall, you're quarantine bed is right over this way....

I suppose those pesky constitutional rights don't exist for those that were quarantined for non-fatal childhood diseases such as measles and chicken pox, but are going to be observed for life threatening Ebola. You won't mind if I call you a fool will you?

 

[martybegan]

And you are 100% sure of all this? The reason you have to be symptomatic is that the symptoms are what lead to diarrhea, vomiting, and all the other stuff that flings out the viral particles.

And where did you come up with this nonsense?

basic biology.

Well, you are wrong. Just FYI. You're attempting to guess, most assuredly with your guesses being highly biased by the conclusion you're trying to defend, against all truth and logic. For example, Ebola can be spread through semen during sex. Obviously, being symptomatic is not required for ejaculation. The thing is......Ebola can only be transmitted by a person who is symptomatic. Having sex with a non symptomatic person will not transmit Ebola.

They are saying it remains active in the semen for months after a person recovers. a person recovering is NOT symptomatic.

A person can shed viruses when non symptomatic, they just are not giving off enough particles to be infectious, however even that is guesswork, espeically when it comes to people being close/intimate with each other.

Do you really think the virus works as follows "98.6, no viral shedding, 100.3, VIRAL SHEDDING!!!!"

 

[SwimExpert]

They are saying it remains active in the semen for months after a person recovers. a person recovering is NOT symptomatic.

*shakes head*

Let me spell it out a little more clearly. RECOVERING is different than a person who has never been sick. Yes, it can be found in semen several weeks after recovery, but that is not the point. Not even close to the point. Your argument is that the reason a person has to become symptomatic in order to be contagious because the symptoms are the mechanism by which transmission occurs, as if a person were contagious prior to symptoms but merely lacked a vehicle by which to transmit. However, that is patently false.

A person can shed viruses when non symptomatic, they just are not giving off enough particles to be infectious, however even that is guesswork, espeically when it comes to people being close/intimate with each other.

Again, where are you getting this? Because you clearly are not getting it from medical professionals. You're making it up as you go along.

Do you really think the virus works as follows "98.6, no viral shedding, 100.3, VIRAL SHEDDING!!!!"

Have you ever had the chickenpox? Ever wonder why you haven't spent your entire life since shedding virus?

 

[martybegan]

They are saying it remains active in the semen for months after a person recovers. a person recovering is NOT symptomatic.

*shakes head*

Let me spell it out a little more clearly. RECOVERING is different than a person who has never been sick. Yes, it can be found in semen several weeks after recovery, but that is not the point. Not even close to the point. Your argument is that the reason a person has to become symptomatic in order to be contagious because the symptoms are the mechanism by which transmission occurs, as if a person were contagious prior to symptoms but merely lacked a vehicle by which to transmit. However, that is patently false.

A person can shed viruses when non symptomatic, they just are not giving off enough particles to be infectious, however even that is guesswork, espeically when it comes to people being close/intimate with each other.

Again, where are you getting this? Because you clearly are not getting it from medical professionals. You're making it up as you go along.

Do you really think the virus works as follows "98.6, no viral shedding, 100.3, VIRAL SHEDDING!!!!"

Have you ever had the chickenpox? Ever wonder why you haven't spent your entire life since shedding virus?

AGAIN, basic biology.

yes, a person done with chickenpox is not infectious, but a person before they become symptomatic is infectious, albeit more so than Ebola.

Your scientific knowledge is lacking.

 

[TooTall]

They are saying it remains active in the semen for months after a person recovers. a person recovering is NOT symptomatic.

*shakes head*

Let me spell it out a little more clearly. RECOVERING is different than a person who has never been sick. Yes, it can be found in semen several weeks after recovery, but that is not the point. Not even close to the point. Your argument is that the reason a person has to become symptomatic in order to be contagious because the symptoms are the mechanism by which transmission occurs, as if a person were contagious prior to symptoms but merely lacked a vehicle by which to transmit. However, that is patently false.

A person can shed viruses when non symptomatic, they just are not giving off enough particles to be infectious, however even that is guesswork, espeically when it comes to people being close/intimate with each other.

Again, where are you getting this? Because you clearly are not getting it from medical professionals. You're making it up as you go along.

Do you really think the virus works as follows "98.6, no viral shedding, 100.3, VIRAL SHEDDING!!!!"

Have you ever had the chickenpox? Ever wonder why you haven't spent your entire life since shedding virus?

Some have and here is a clear violation of the Constitution and their civil rights. After all, chicken pox is a non-life threatening childhood disease.

SUBJ: New Isolation and Quarantine Regulations: Varicella

Varicella (chickenpox)

Until lesions have dried and crusted, or until no new lesions appear, usually by the fifth day.

Susceptible students or staff, who are not appropriately immunized or are without laboratory evidence of immunity or a reliable history of chickenpox, shall be excluded from school from the tenth through the 21st days after their last exposure. Neonates born to mothers with active varicella shall be isolated from susceptibles until 21 days of age. Health care workers shall be excluded from their occupations from the tenth through 21st days after their last exposure if they are susceptible. Anyone receiving varicella zoster immune globulin (VZIG) shall extend their exclusion to 28 days post exposure. Otherwise, no restrictions.

http://www.mass.gov/eohhs/docs/dph/com-health/school/disease-varicella.pdf

 

[SwimExpert]

I suppose those pesky constitutional rights don't exist for those that were quarantined for non-fatal childhood diseases such as measles and chicken pox, but are going to be observed for life threatening Ebola. You won't mind if I call you a fool will you?

Were any of them detained without probable cause?

 

[SwimExpert]

AGAIN, basic biology.

Translation: You are making ad hoc assumptions.

yes, a person done with chickenpox is not infectious, but a person before they become symptomatic is infectious, albeit more so than Ebola.

You don't actually know. You're talking out of your ass, making wild assumptions out of nothing.

Your scientific knowledge is lacking.

Er...no.

 

[SwimExpert]

Some have and here is a clear violation of the Constitution and their civil rights. After all, chicken pox is a non-life threatening childhood disease.

You do realize that you're referencing a school policy that just requires students to not attend school, teachers and health care workers to not attend work, and infants in hospital to be isolated from other neonates right? Nobody is locking them inside their houses.

You're comparing apples to small pox.

 

[TooTall]

I suppose those pesky constitutional rights don't exist for those that were quarantined for non-fatal childhood diseases such as measles and chicken pox, but are going to be observed for life threatening Ebola. You won't mind if I call you a fool will you?

Were any of them detained without probable cause?

Not that I know of, but neither was Kaci Hickox. She had a low grade fever before she was quarantined which is probable cause. The Doctor was moving around in NYC for 6 or 7 days before he showed the symptoms of Ebola. This is just the usual lawyers trying to cash in and I do not suffer fools very well.

 

[TooTall]

Some have and here is a clear violation of the Constitution and their civil rights. After all, chicken pox is a non-life threatening childhood disease.

You do realize that you're referencing a school policy that just requires students to not attend school, teachers and health care workers to not attend work, and infants in hospital to be isolated from other neonates right? Nobody is locking them inside their houses.

You're comparing apples to small pox.

It is obvious that you are incapable of reading a link that I provided. The measles quarantine came from here.

San Francisco Department of Public Health
Communicable Disease Control and Prevention
Communicable Disease Control Unit
San Francisco, CA 94102

That is not a school policy, and I suggest there are very similar quarantines in every city and/or county in the US.

 

[SwimExpert]

Not that I know of, but neither was Kaci Hickox. She had a low grade fever before she was quarantined which is probable cause.

1) She had no fever. Anyone who thinks that a forehead surface reading is anywhere close to a legitimate method of taking a temperature is an idiot.

2) Even if she did, that is not probable cause. Fever can be caused from a wide variety of things.

3) After testing negative twice for the virus further eliminates any probable cause. Even if she had been severely sick, the negative tests for the virus would definitively show any illness being due to some other cause. Thus, no probable cause to continue holding her.

The Doctor was moving around in NYC for 6 or 7 days before he showed the symptoms of Ebola.

And??? Are you trying to say that you being scared shitless over something you're completely ignorant about is probable cause?

This is just the usual lawyers trying to cash in and I do not suffer fools very well.

A fool is someone who speaks as if they are knowledgeable, but are in fact not. That makes you prime suspect number one.

 

[SwimExpert]

It is obvious that you are incapable of reading a link that I provided. The measles quarantine came from here.

San Francisco Department of Public Health
Communicable Disease Control and Prevention
Communicable Disease Control Unit
San Francisco, CA 94102

That is not a school policy, and I suggest there are very similar quarantines in every city and/or county in the US.

The irony

TO: School Nurses
FROM: Anne Sheetz

 

[OriginalShroom]

Come to find out she's a left wing hack who is using this as a political ploy.

Damn Liberals..

 

[TooTall]

Not that I know of, but neither was Kaci Hickox. She had a low grade fever before she was quarantined which is probable cause.

1) She had no fever. Anyone who thinks that a forehead surface reading is anywhere close to a legitimate method of taking a temperature is an idiot.

2) Even if she did, that is not probable cause. Fever can be caused from a wide variety of things.

3) After testing negative twice for the virus further eliminates any probable cause. Even if she had been severely sick, the negative tests for the virus would definitively show any illness being due to some other cause. Thus, no probable cause to continue holding her.

The Doctor was moving around in NYC for 6 or 7 days before he showed the symptoms of Ebola.

And??? Are you trying to say that you being scared shitless over something you're completely ignorant about is probable cause?

This is just the usual lawyers trying to cash in and I do not suffer fools very well.

A fool is someone who speaks as if they are knowledgeable, but are in fact not. That makes you prime suspect number one.

So far I have seen nothing that indicates you are knowledgeable on much of anything.

1. If a forehead surface reading is not a legitimate method of taking a temperature is not legitimate, tell me why health care professionals do it. Are they all idiots, or could it be that you are the idiot?

2. A fever is absolutely probable cause since it is the very first symptom of Ebola. If a person had not just returned from West Africa where they served helping infected Ebola patients, a fever could very well be indicative of the flu or some other illness.

3. How many times was the Doctor tested for Ebola before he developed a fever? Do you even know?

Where is she getting her advice on planning to avoid the Maine quarantine now that she is there? Hint, it ain't a Doctor and starts with the letter L.

 

[peach174]

I am not a Liberal
I'm a Conservative
You need to learn some history bub.

Bullshit. You're a good for nothing CINO. Anyone who wants to wipe their ass with the constitution the way you are is not conservative.

Nice to know that you want healthy people infected.
You are the one making it into a right or left thing. It is about common sense.
Throughout history mankind has isolated and contained infectious disease's in order to protect the healthy. In no way does it violate the Constitution.
Learn about our history.
History of Quarantine Quarantine CDC

State and local governments made sporadic attempts to impose quarantine requirements. Continued outbreaks of yellow fever finally prompted Congress to pass federal quarantine legislation in 1878. This legislation, while not conflicting with states' rights, paved the way for federal involvement in quarantine activities.
Outbreaks of cholera from passenger ships arriving from Europe prompted a reinterpretation of the law in 1892 to provide the federal government more authority in imposing quarantine requirements. The following year, Congress passed legislation that further clarified the federal role in quarantine activities. As local authorities came to realize the benefits of federal involvement, local quarantine stations were gradually turned over to the U.S. government. Additional federal facilities were built and the number of staff was increased to provide better coverage. The quarantine system was fully nationalized by 1921 when administration of the last quarantine station was transferred to the U.S. government.

The Public Health Service Act of 1944 clearly established the federal government's quarantine authority for the first time. The act gave the U.S. Public Health Service (PHS) responsibility for preventing the introduction, transmission, and spread of communicable diseases from foreign countries into the United States.

 

[SwimExpert]

1. If a forehead surface reading is not a legitimate method of taking a temperature is not legitimate, tell me why health care professionals do it. Are they all idiots, or could it be that you are the idiot?

Actually, any respectable health care professionals will tell you that doing so is highly inaccurate. More inaccurate than an axillary reading. So yes, those who rely on them are idiots. At most, a forehead temperature reading can be used as an easy first step. Any concern raised by a forehead reading should be first confirmed with an oral (preferable) or tympanic reading.

Forehead readings are surface readings, and as such are highly susceptible to a variety of factors that can lead to false readings. Exercise and flushing of the skin are two of the most common causes for inaccurate surface readings. These can cause the appearance of an elevated body temperature, though the elevation is literally only skin deep.

A fever is absolutely probable cause since it is the very first symptom of Ebola. If a person had not just returned from West Africa where they served helping infected Ebola patients, a fever could very well be indicative of the flu or some other illness.

So traveling to West Africa eliminates all causes of fever other than Ebola? That's ridiculous.

How many times was the Doctor tested for Ebola before he developed a fever? Do you even know?

Do you? Or are you just tossing up red herrings?

Where is she getting her advice on planning to avoid the Maine quarantine now that she is there? Hint, it ain't a Doctor and starts with the letter L.

And what does it matter that she is talking with her lawyer? You're damned right she's talking to him. Her rights have been egregiously violated. A lawyer seems like a prudent measure.

 

[TooTall]

It is obvious that you are incapable of reading a link that I provided. The measles quarantine came from here.

San Francisco Department of Public Health
Communicable Disease Control and Prevention
Communicable Disease Control Unit
San Francisco, CA 94102

That is not a school policy, and I suggest there are very similar quarantines in every city and/or county in the US.

The irony

TO: School Nurses
FROM: Anne Sheetz

It is obvious that you are incapable of reading a link that I provided. The measles quarantine came from here.

San Francisco Department of Public Health
Communicable Disease Control and Prevention
Communicable Disease Control Unit
San Francisco, CA 94102

That is not a school policy, and I suggest there are very similar quarantines in every city and/or county in the US.

The irony

TO: School Nurses
FROM: Anne Sheetz

Since I was using the Measles quarantine, you went to the Chicken Pox link.
Yes, from my link the school nurse reported to the department of health as required by law. If you had any ability at all you would have clicked on this in that very link and possible learned something.

300.100: Diseases Reportable to Local Boards of Health

 

[TooTall]

I am not a Liberal
I'm a Conservative
You need to learn some history bub.

Bullshit. You're a good for nothing CINO. Anyone who wants to wipe their ass with the constitution the way you are is not conservative.

Nice to know that you want healthy people infected.
You are the one making it into a right or left thing. It is about common sense.
Throughout history mankind has isolated and contained infectious disease's in order to protect the healthy. In no way does it violate the Constitution.
Learn about our history.
History of Quarantine Quarantine CDC

State and local governments made sporadic attempts to impose quarantine requirements. Continued outbreaks of yellow fever finally prompted Congress to pass federal quarantine legislation in 1878. This legislation, while not conflicting with states' rights, paved the way for federal involvement in quarantine activities.
Outbreaks of cholera from passenger ships arriving from Europe prompted a reinterpretation of the law in 1892 to provide the federal government more authority in imposing quarantine requirements. The following year, Congress passed legislation that further clarified the federal role in quarantine activities. As local authorities came to realize the benefits of federal involvement, local quarantine stations were gradually turned over to the U.S. government. Additional federal facilities were built and the number of staff was increased to provide better coverage. The quarantine system was fully nationalized by 1921 when administration of the last quarantine station was transferred to the U.S. government.

The Public Health Service Act of 1944 clearly established the federal government's quarantine authority for the first time. The act gave the U.S. Public Health Service (PHS) responsibility for preventing the introduction, transmission, and spread of communicable diseases from foreign countries into the United States.

You are wasting your efforts on this fool. Anyone who thinks that it is a violation of civil rights for a person to be quarantined is, in his opinion 'scared shitless.'

 

[TooTall]

1. If a forehead surface reading is not a legitimate method of taking a temperature is not legitimate, tell me why health care professionals do it. Are they all idiots, or could it be that you are the idiot?

Actually, any respectable health care professionals will tell you that doing so is highly inaccurate. More inaccurate than an axillary reading. So yes, those who rely on them are idiots. At most, a forehead temperature reading can be used as an easy first step. Any concern raised by a forehead reading should be first confirmed with an oral (preferable) or tympanic reading.

Forehead readings are surface readings, and as such are highly susceptible to a variety of factors that can lead to false readings. Exercise and flushing of the skin are two of the most common causes for inaccurate surface readings. These can cause the appearance of an elevated body temperature, though the elevation is literally only skin deep.

A fever is absolutely probable cause since it is the very first symptom of Ebola. If a person had not just returned from West Africa where they served helping infected Ebola patients, a fever could very well be indicative of the flu or some other illness.

So traveling to West Africa eliminates all causes of fever other than Ebola? That's ridiculous.

How many times was the Doctor tested for Ebola before he developed a fever? Do you even know?

Do you? Or are you just tossing up red herrings?

Where is she getting her advice on planning to avoid the Maine quarantine now that she is there? Hint, it ain't a Doctor and starts with the letter L.

And what does it matter that she is talking with her lawyer? You're damned right she's talking to him. Her rights have been egregiously violated. A lawyer seems like a prudent measure.

Do you really think she has a case?

 

[Katzndogz]

She has no case.