Will Killers or Gang Bangers follow gun control laws?

[DrLove]

Apparently today is Stupid Poll Day. Not a manner of whether they will follow gun control laws or they don't --- NRA Sucker.

But if they're guilty of a felony and can't go to Armslist or any of a dozen other sites or a gun show in around 22 states and buy from an unlicensed seller .. it will make it tougher on them to find their preferred implement of destruction.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members.
Part of the point of reducing the number of guns in this country is exactly this. The less guns legally owned, the less are available to beg, borrow or steal from others. The vast majority of guns used in crimes are not legally owned, but were legally purchased once in their histories. I believe if a gun is stolen from you and you don't report it, or if you transfer a gun illegally, you should be held equally responsible for any any crime committed with it. That would slow things down.

Apparently today is Stupid Poll Day. Not a manner of whether they will follow gun control laws or they don't --- NRA Sucker.

But if they're guilty of a felony and can't go to Armslist or any of a dozen other sites or a gun show in around 22 states and buy from an unlicensed seller .. it will make it tougher on them to find their preferred implement of destruction.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Because people in Chicago can drive about 45 minutes across the border into Indiana or Wisconsin and buy whatever they please.

Agree with you that most are borrowed or stolen. But that doesn't mean that universal BG checks won't save lives.

As for illicit drugs - the primary problem is big pharma who spent billions flooding the market and the physicians who prescribed them.

Bullshit. How are 16 year old kids going to Indiana and buying pistols legally? How is anyone going across a state line purchasing a firearm legally? You have to reside in the state in order to purchase a gun.

The Journal of Preventive Medicine did a study of inmates in prison. The study showed that only 3 percent of them purchased their firearm from a gun store. You might want to read it because you might actually learn something..

Study: Most Chicago Criminals Attain Guns Illegally

Of course they're not buying from gun stores. Gun stores have to run BG checks. Duh?

As for the 16 year old kids? Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer to get theirs from an unlicensed dealer at a gun show with no BG check.

And it depends on the state as to whether one must be a resident of that state. Not at a gun show from an unlicensed dealer they don't. The only thing that seller needs to do is verify their age.

You guys are denying loopholes that ya gotta be wearing blinders not to see!

 

[Auld Phart]

One point that those who support additional background checks keep ignoring is the fact that many of these shootings have happened with guns obtained LEGALLY by law abiding citizens at the time of purchase. They didn't break any laws until after they got the guns.

IOW.....how would additional background checks have stopped LV shooter? Sandy Hook? Or any number of others? Even the FL shooter?

Because the background check would've revealed that Cruz had been expelled from school, posted violent threats on social media, etc.

The background checks ( as of now) dont include what needs to be put out there.
Oh I see you were expelled from school and posted violent threats on social media...here is your firearm. smh

Oh I see you were expelled from school and posted violent threats on social media...here is your firearm.

Whose fault is it that information isn't on the database?

 

[Auld Phart]

Apparently today is Stupid Poll Day. Not a manner of whether they will follow gun control laws or they don't --- NRA Sucker.

But if they're guilty of a felony and can't go to Armslist or any of a dozen other sites or a gun show in around 22 states and buy from an unlicensed seller .. it will make it tougher on them to find their preferred implement of destruction.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members.
Part of the point of reducing the number of guns in this country is exactly this. The less guns legally owned, the less are available to beg, borrow or steal from others. The vast majority of guns used in crimes are not legally owned, but were legally purchased once in their histories. I believe if a gun is stolen from you and you don't report it, or if you transfer a gun illegally, you should be held equally responsible for any any crime committed with it. That would slow things down.

Apparently today is Stupid Poll Day. Not a manner of whether they will follow gun control laws or they don't --- NRA Sucker.

But if they're guilty of a felony and can't go to Armslist or any of a dozen other sites or a gun show in around 22 states and buy from an unlicensed seller .. it will make it tougher on them to find their preferred implement of destruction.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Because people in Chicago can drive about 45 minutes across the border into Indiana or Wisconsin and buy whatever they please.

Agree with you that most are borrowed or stolen. But that doesn't mean that universal BG checks won't save lives.

As for illicit drugs - the primary problem is big pharma who spent billions flooding the market and the physicians who prescribed them.

Bullshit. How are 16 year old kids going to Indiana and buying pistols legally? How is anyone going across a state line purchasing a firearm legally? You have to reside in the state in order to purchase a gun.

The Journal of Preventive Medicine did a study of inmates in prison. The study showed that only 3 percent of them purchased their firearm from a gun store. You might want to read it because you might actually learn something..

Study: Most Chicago Criminals Attain Guns Illegally

Of course they're not buying from gun stores. Gun stores have to run BG checks. Duh?

As for the 16 year old kids? Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer to get theirs from an unlicensed dealer at a gun show with no BG check.

And it depends on the state as to whether one must be a resident of that state. Not at a gun show from an unlicensed dealer they don't. The only thing that seller needs to do is verify their age.

You guys are denying loopholes that ya gotta be wearing blinders not to see!

Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer

used a straw buyer?


Then, even if the seller did a background check, they'd have ended up with the gun,

Right?

 

[DrLove]

One point that those who support additional background checks keep ignoring is the fact that many of these shootings have happened with guns obtained LEGALLY by law abiding citizens at the time of purchase. They didn't break any laws until after they got the guns.

IOW.....how would additional background checks have stopped LV shooter? Sandy Hook? Or any number of others? Even the FL shooter?

Because the background check would've revealed that Cruz had been expelled from school, posted violent threats on social media, etc.

The background checks ( as of now) dont include what needs to be put out there.
Oh I see you were expelled from school and posted violent threats on social media...here is your firearm. smh

Oh I see you were expelled from school and posted violent threats on social media...here is your firearm.

Whose fault is it that information isn't on the database?

It's the fault of crappy databases that gun strokers are opposed to enhancing - with shared information between states. Or, in this example it might also be the fault of the military for not reporting a dishonorable discharge to the national database.

Military added 4,000 veterans to gun ban list after Texas church shooting

 

[DrLove]

Apparently today is Stupid Poll Day. Not a manner of whether they will follow gun control laws or they don't --- NRA Sucker.

But if they're guilty of a felony and can't go to Armslist or any of a dozen other sites or a gun show in around 22 states and buy from an unlicensed seller .. it will make it tougher on them to find their preferred implement of destruction.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members.
Part of the point of reducing the number of guns in this country is exactly this. The less guns legally owned, the less are available to beg, borrow or steal from others. The vast majority of guns used in crimes are not legally owned, but were legally purchased once in their histories. I believe if a gun is stolen from you and you don't report it, or if you transfer a gun illegally, you should be held equally responsible for any any crime committed with it. That would slow things down.

Apparently today is Stupid Poll Day. Not a manner of whether they will follow gun control laws or they don't --- NRA Sucker.

But if they're guilty of a felony and can't go to Armslist or any of a dozen other sites or a gun show in around 22 states and buy from an unlicensed seller .. it will make it tougher on them to find their preferred implement of destruction.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Because people in Chicago can drive about 45 minutes across the border into Indiana or Wisconsin and buy whatever they please.

Agree with you that most are borrowed or stolen. But that doesn't mean that universal BG checks won't save lives.

As for illicit drugs - the primary problem is big pharma who spent billions flooding the market and the physicians who prescribed them.

Bullshit. How are 16 year old kids going to Indiana and buying pistols legally? How is anyone going across a state line purchasing a firearm legally? You have to reside in the state in order to purchase a gun.

The Journal of Preventive Medicine did a study of inmates in prison. The study showed that only 3 percent of them purchased their firearm from a gun store. You might want to read it because you might actually learn something..

Study: Most Chicago Criminals Attain Guns Illegally

Of course they're not buying from gun stores. Gun stores have to run BG checks. Duh?

As for the 16 year old kids? Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer to get theirs from an unlicensed dealer at a gun show with no BG check.

And it depends on the state as to whether one must be a resident of that state. Not at a gun show from an unlicensed dealer they don't. The only thing that seller needs to do is verify their age.

You guys are denying loopholes that ya gotta be wearing blinders not to see!

Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer

used a straw buyer?

Then, even if the seller did a background check, they'd have ended up with the gun,

Right?

They brought Klebold's girlfriend along because she just turned 18. They knew what they were gonna do and didn't want to create a paper trail for anyone to discover and stop them.

 

[Auld Phart]

computers: Garbage in, garbage out.


Cant access info that has never been input.

What 'gun strokers' are against inputting info into a database?

 

[JGalt]

Apparently today is Stupid Poll Day. Not a manner of whether they will follow gun control laws or they don't --- NRA Sucker.

But if they're guilty of a felony and can't go to Armslist or any of a dozen other sites or a gun show in around 22 states and buy from an unlicensed seller .. it will make it tougher on them to find their preferred implement of destruction.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members.
Part of the point of reducing the number of guns in this country is exactly this. The less guns legally owned, the less are available to beg, borrow or steal from others. The vast majority of guns used in crimes are not legally owned, but were legally purchased once in their histories. I believe if a gun is stolen from you and you don't report it, or if you transfer a gun illegally, you should be held equally responsible for any any crime committed with it. That would slow things down.

Apparently today is Stupid Poll Day. Not a manner of whether they will follow gun control laws or they don't --- NRA Sucker.

But if they're guilty of a felony and can't go to Armslist or any of a dozen other sites or a gun show in around 22 states and buy from an unlicensed seller .. it will make it tougher on them to find their preferred implement of destruction.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Because people in Chicago can drive about 45 minutes across the border into Indiana or Wisconsin and buy whatever they please.

Agree with you that most are borrowed or stolen. But that doesn't mean that universal BG checks won't save lives.

As for illicit drugs - the primary problem is big pharma who spent billions flooding the market and the physicians who prescribed them.

Bullshit. How are 16 year old kids going to Indiana and buying pistols legally? How is anyone going across a state line purchasing a firearm legally? You have to reside in the state in order to purchase a gun.

The Journal of Preventive Medicine did a study of inmates in prison. The study showed that only 3 percent of them purchased their firearm from a gun store. You might want to read it because you might actually learn something..

Study: Most Chicago Criminals Attain Guns Illegally

Of course they're not buying from gun stores. Gun stores have to run BG checks. Duh?

As for the 16 year old kids? Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer to get theirs from an unlicensed dealer at a gun show with no BG check.

And it depends on the state as to whether one must be a resident of that state. Not at a gun show from an unlicensed dealer they don't. The only thing that seller needs to do is verify their age.

You guys are denying loopholes that ya gotta be wearing blinders not to see!

Have there been any mass shooting from people who bought their firearms at gun shows? Not a one, unless you consider the ones that Obama's DOJ sold to Mexican drug cartels.

Straw purchases perhaps, but those are illegal to start with, right?

 

[Auld Phart]

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members.
Part of the point of reducing the number of guns in this country is exactly this. The less guns legally owned, the less are available to beg, borrow or steal from others. The vast majority of guns used in crimes are not legally owned, but were legally purchased once in their histories. I believe if a gun is stolen from you and you don't report it, or if you transfer a gun illegally, you should be held equally responsible for any any crime committed with it. That would slow things down.

If it's already so hard for them to obtain firearms in Chicago for example, why are there so many shootings there? You do know that the majority of firearms that criminals commit an offense with, are not purchased legally, right?

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members. They seldom even practice with them or purchase ammunition, just using whatever shit ammo came with the gun.

Let me use another example: Illicit drugs are illegal, right? Yet there are more drug overdoses in this country, than ever before. Isn't it primarily the left who says that decriminalizing drugs will solve the problem?

Because people in Chicago can drive about 45 minutes across the border into Indiana or Wisconsin and buy whatever they please.

Agree with you that most are borrowed or stolen. But that doesn't mean that universal BG checks won't save lives.

As for illicit drugs - the primary problem is big pharma who spent billions flooding the market and the physicians who prescribed them.

Bullshit. How are 16 year old kids going to Indiana and buying pistols legally? How is anyone going across a state line purchasing a firearm legally? You have to reside in the state in order to purchase a gun.

The Journal of Preventive Medicine did a study of inmates in prison. The study showed that only 3 percent of them purchased their firearm from a gun store. You might want to read it because you might actually learn something..

Study: Most Chicago Criminals Attain Guns Illegally

Of course they're not buying from gun stores. Gun stores have to run BG checks. Duh?

As for the 16 year old kids? Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer to get theirs from an unlicensed dealer at a gun show with no BG check.

And it depends on the state as to whether one must be a resident of that state. Not at a gun show from an unlicensed dealer they don't. The only thing that seller needs to do is verify their age.

You guys are denying loopholes that ya gotta be wearing blinders not to see!

Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer

used a straw buyer?

Then, even if the seller did a background check, they'd have ended up with the gun,

Right?

They brought Klebold's girlfriend along because she just turned 18. They knew what they were gonna do and didn't want to create a paper trail for anyone to discover and stop them.

They brought a legal buyer to buy a gun for them.

even a seller that did a background check on her would be unlikely to have caught that.



your 'arguments', one after the other...

 

[Leo123]

You are right!

Looks like we need to ban semi-autos because there is no way to restrict their rate of fire

Yeah only criminals should have the right to own them.

 

[Leo123]

You are right!

Looks like we need to ban semi-autos because there is no way to restrict their rate of fire

You missed the point which is, banning anything (such as bump stocks) will not prevent humans from finding workarounds.

 

[DrLove]

Most of them are either stolen, bought from someone else who stole them or bought them, or are borrowed or taken from family members.
Part of the point of reducing the number of guns in this country is exactly this. The less guns legally owned, the less are available to beg, borrow or steal from others. The vast majority of guns used in crimes are not legally owned, but were legally purchased once in their histories. I believe if a gun is stolen from you and you don't report it, or if you transfer a gun illegally, you should be held equally responsible for any any crime committed with it. That would slow things down.

Because people in Chicago can drive about 45 minutes across the border into Indiana or Wisconsin and buy whatever they please.

Agree with you that most are borrowed or stolen. But that doesn't mean that universal BG checks won't save lives.

As for illicit drugs - the primary problem is big pharma who spent billions flooding the market and the physicians who prescribed them.

Bullshit. How are 16 year old kids going to Indiana and buying pistols legally? How is anyone going across a state line purchasing a firearm legally? You have to reside in the state in order to purchase a gun.

The Journal of Preventive Medicine did a study of inmates in prison. The study showed that only 3 percent of them purchased their firearm from a gun store. You might want to read it because you might actually learn something..

Study: Most Chicago Criminals Attain Guns Illegally

Of course they're not buying from gun stores. Gun stores have to run BG checks. Duh?

As for the 16 year old kids? Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer to get theirs from an unlicensed dealer at a gun show with no BG check.

And it depends on the state as to whether one must be a resident of that state. Not at a gun show from an unlicensed dealer they don't. The only thing that seller needs to do is verify their age.

You guys are denying loopholes that ya gotta be wearing blinders not to see!

Columbine killers Klebold and Harris used a straw buyer

used a straw buyer?

Then, even if the seller did a background check, they'd have ended up with the gun,

Right?

They brought Klebold's girlfriend along because she just turned 18. They knew what they were gonna do and didn't want to create a paper trail for anyone to discover and stop them.

They brought a legal buyer to buy a gun for them.

even a seller that did a background check on her would be unlikely to have caught that.

your 'arguments', one after the other...

You're correct Zippy - but AGAIN you miss the point.

They wanted to avoid a paper trail not ONLY because they didn't want anyone to stop them, but because they didn't want HER to get in trouble after their dastardly deed.

It took the Feds quite some time to get to find Robyn Anderson and sadly, she only got a slap on the wrist after having turned witness.

The OTHER Gun - Guilty plea

CNN - Gun provider pleads guilty in Columbine case - August 18, 1999

Be smart - Pinheads are dumb

 

[Cellblock2429]

I don't want you to think you can get away with restricting my rights because you are afraid or because you want to feel like you've done something when you've actually done nothing but to hinder law abiding people.

How much of a hinderance is it banning assault weapons, high capacity mags and bump stock? You still have thousands of options.

/——-/ Read about how all guns were banned in Australia and the UK. It’s called a first step

 

[Coyote]

I don't want you to think you can get away with restricting my rights because you are afraid or because you want to feel like you've done something when you've actually done nothing but to hinder law abiding people.

How much of a hinderance is it banning assault weapons, high capacity mags and bump stock? You still have thousands of options.

/——-/ Read about how all guns were banned in Australia and the UK. It’s called a first step

Neither the U.K. nor Australia have a 2nd Amendment. Big difference.

 

[Coyote]

You are right!

Looks like we need to ban semi-autos because there is no way to restrict their rate of fire

You missed the point which is, banning anything (such as bump stocks) will not prevent humans from finding workarounds.

It will make it a lot more difficult.

 

[del]

they don't pay any attention to drug laws or murder laws either, so fuck it, repeal those too

 

[Cellblock2429]

I don't want you to think you can get away with restricting my rights because you are afraid or because you want to feel like you've done something when you've actually done nothing but to hinder law abiding people.

How much of a hinderance is it banning assault weapons, high capacity mags and bump stock? You still have thousands of options.

/——-/ Read about how all guns were banned in Australia and the UK. It’s called a first step

Neither the U.K. nor Australia have a 2nd Amendment. Big difference.

/----/ I didn't say they did. I asked you read about the slow expansion of gun bans all in the name of public safety. Gee does everything have to be spelled out for you?

 

[Coyote]

I don't want you to think you can get away with restricting my rights because you are afraid or because you want to feel like you've done something when you've actually done nothing but to hinder law abiding people.

How much of a hinderance is it banning assault weapons, high capacity mags and bump stock? You still have thousands of options.

/——-/ Read about how all guns were banned in Australia and the UK. It’s called a first step

Neither the U.K. nor Australia have a 2nd Amendment. Big difference.

/----/ I didn't say they did. I asked you read about the slow expansion of gun bans all in the name of public safety. Gee does everything have to be spelled out for you?

You miss the point.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Please vote in the poll. Do you think that killers or gang members will follow ANY gun control laws? Do you think that gun control laws would make it more difficult for a criminal to obtain a weapon?

Many of the weapons used in mass murder have been legally purchased.

Anyone who wants to own, possess or have in his or her custody or control must first sign a universal Consent which legally releases every public and private agency to release their records before the applicant can be issued a license to own, possess or to have in his or her custody or control a firearm.

Every person who sells, gives or allows an unlicensed individual to obtain a firearm is guilty of a felony, and will lose their license and surrender all firearms immediately to the nearest law enforcement agency where every weapon - both involved in the transaction and not involved, will be destroyed.

 

[beagle9]

Please vote in the poll. Do you think that killers or gang members will follow ANY gun control laws? Do you think that gun control laws would make it more difficult for a criminal to obtain a weapon?

The thinking of the left is that if guns (specific assault weapons), are banned in every state, and the order is given to turn in the specific guns/weapons, then they will go off line at gun shows, armories, open trading, crossing state lines illegally etc... Therefore it would dry up the ability for anyone to purchase, steal or trade such weapons openly, privately or in a nefarious way. Of course millions will be stored away in private collections under lock and key if ever such an order is given.

Now whether the left could pull off their enforcement or ideas would be interesting to see, because as everyone knows the left has alternative motives when it does anything.

The argument of the masses is that the Genie is way to far out of the bottle to put him/her back into the bottle, so the thinking is that to disarm the innocent it would then leave the bad guy's only with the guns. I believe this, because the government can't ever get anything right, so to attempt to disarm the innocent without a garantee that the bad guy's would just comply or go along is a non-starter, and it will always be a non-starter.

At this point only security measures can be applied in a way that is significantly sufficient for the cases at hand, and we must never trust the government to disarm us PERIOD.

 

[harmonica]

obviously the gun control laws are not strict enough/sensible because like you say--the criminals can easily get guns