Will Republicans ever admit the mess they left President Obama?

[Ray From Cleveland]

This all seems pretty silly. Hardcore partisans are predictable:

When my guy is in office and something good happens, it's because of my guy.

When my guy is in office and something bad happens, it's because of the other guy.

Bush left behind a disaster. Either a President is responsible for what happens during his term or he is not. Either the buck stops with him, or it does not.
.

When has the buck EVER stopped with Barack Obama, Mac? I don't know as I've ever seen a President who blames his own short comings on others more than this President! He's quick to take credit for things that happen that he's had very little to do with...like the price of gasoline going down...but even quicker to blame George W. Bush or the Republicans for the slow recovery by the economy and a dismal record of job creation.

It's really less of Obama than it is his supporters that do it. Some (life Franco) go all the way back to Reagan to shift the blame. That's a pretty far stretch, but they do it all the time.

On one hand they tell us of this miraculous recovery, and on the other they tell us why we need so many people on government programs. Republicans are the ones responsible for those on government programs, and Obama is responsible for this lower unemployment rate.

That's how it works with these guys.

 

[Oldstyle]

Bush is the one who pushed TARP through even though it wasn't popular and he took a lot of political heat for "bailing out" Banks. What did Barry ever come up with that is even remotely comparable to TARP? The majority of HIS economic strategies differ from Bush's because they were either remarkably ineffective...an eight hundred billion dollar stimulus that created so few jobs they had to hide how bad it was with "jobs created or saved"...or cost taxpayers millions that we still haven't seen repaid...as with the GM bailout and "green" initiatives like Solyndra!

 

[Oldstyle]

What's remarkable is how often Barack Obama's only successes seemed to pivot from something Bush did before leaving office...yet Bush is the person that Obama blames constantly. Obama probably doesn't get Bin Laden without intel gathered with the waterboarding that Bush allowed and he banned. The continuation of TARP is one of the few economic strategies of the Obama Administration that actually worked. A military "surge" in Afghanistan like the "surge" strategy employed by Bush earlier is one of the few moments of military success for this Administration.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

This all seems pretty silly. Hardcore partisans are predictable:

When my guy is in office and something good happens, it's because of my guy.

When my guy is in office and something bad happens, it's because of the other guy.

Bush left behind a disaster. Either a President is responsible for what happens during his term or he is not. Either the buck stops with him, or it does not.
.

That all depends on who else was involved during the time.

Some things take time to build up while others don't. If something started with the current administration, then yes, it is that administrations fault.

There is a difference between "My guy good--your guy bad" and saying "my guy isn't exclusively to blame."

Bush people have given GW more hell than anybody during his two terms. I never see Democrats do that with Obama.

 

[Oldstyle]

How bad would the Obama economic record be without the boost to the economy that was provided by fracking technologies that Barry actively fought? How bad would his job creation record be if not for jobs created in States run by GOP Governors or by someone like the Governor of New York who stimulated job growth with tax cuts to attract corporations to his State?

 

[Mac1958]

This all seems pretty silly. Hardcore partisans are predictable:

When my guy is in office and something good happens, it's because of my guy.

When my guy is in office and something bad happens, it's because of the other guy.

Bush left behind a disaster. Either a President is responsible for what happens during his term or he is not. Either the buck stops with him, or it does not.
.

That all depends on who else was involved during the time.

Some things take time to build up while others don't. If something started with the current administration, then yes, it is that administrations fault.

There is a difference between "My guy good--your guy bad" and saying "my guy isn't exclusively to blame."

Bush people have given GW more hell than anybody during his two terms. I never see Democrats do that with Obama.

You're exactly right, you can't put time limits on the effects of a Presidency, yet partisans do it all the time. Both parties.

So, if that's the game that is going to be played, then Republicans have to defend what Bush left behind, just as Democrats will have to do with Obama.

This particular thread is about what Bush left behind, and Republicans are not taking any responsibility for any of it.
.

 

[Oldstyle]

How bad would his job numbers be if the GOP hadn't won the House and Senate back in 2010 and he'd been able to push through Cap & Trade legislation? How bad would his deficit numbers be if the GOP hadn't resisted his calls for more spending and touched off a budget battle that mandated automatic cuts to multiple parts of government?

 

[eddiew]

no wasn't a history major

Yeah, kind of guessed that, Eddie!

yes old,,my expertise lies elsewhere

It's not economics and it's sure not history, Eddie! Where DOES your expertise lie?

I make money ,,,,the old fashioned way ,,,I earn it

Too bad you don't have a gig like the Clinton's, Eddie! They don't have to EARN money...fat cats just hand them millions!

how much did trump get from his daddy to start him on his highway of success {outside of 4 or 5 bankrupt companies where millions were lost and trump was untouched}

 

[rdean]

BBBUUUUTTT BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Of course they won't admit it. They will just make stupid posts like the one above.

They are however, tacitly admitting it by flocking to Trump.

Too bad NONE of you Bush bashing Idiots DEAL with history which will declare Bush a GREAT President when considering ALL these events
that in the history of the USA have NEVER NEVER occurred in one 8 year period!

Unlike you idiots that can't substantiate your stupid biased ignorant comments,
ALL of the below are LINKS if you aren't too f...king lazy to check out and see the Truth!

Recession
Are you aware that a recession started under Clinton and became official 3/01 ended 11/01?
Because idiots don't seem to comprehend... RECESSIONS are like large ships.. it takes miles to turn one...i.e. so does a "RECESSION"...
it doesn't just start the day NBER states... it is a slow degradation and it started under CLINTON!!!
Source: USATODAY.com - It's official: 2001 recession only lasted eight months

A Major $8 trillion market loss
Are you aware that the dot.com bust occurred and cost $8 trillion in losses?
Again Clinton laid claim BUT someone had to pay and it occurred during Bush's first year!
$8 trillion in market losses MEAN lost tax revenue.
PLUS JOBS!!!!
According to the Los Angeles Times, when the dot-com bubble burst, it wiped out $8 trillion dollars in market value for tech companies.
More than half of the Internet companies created since 1995 were gone by 2004 -
and hundreds of thousands of skilled technology workers were out of jobs.
Source: The dot-com bubble: How to lose $5 trillion

The worst attacks on the USA in History.. 3,000 deaths!!!
Obviously most of you are UNAWARE 9/11 cost 3,000 lives, $2 trillion in lost businesses,market values assets.
Jobs lost in New York owing to the attacks: 146,100 JUST in New York.
Are you aware this happened???
Now before you idiots say "well Bush should have known"! DUMMIES... ever hear of the Gorelick Memo signed under CLINTON??
Gorelick Memo that created the wall between FBI & CIA thus no knowledge of the 9/11 bombers shared with the FBI!!!
Looks especially imprudent 10 years later.
Because the memo created a barrier for U.S. intelligence agencies to share information with the FBI, one of its unintended consequences may have been to prevent the FBI from receiving the necessary intelligence to stop the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, the worst in American history.
Gorelick Memo Allegedly Impeded Probe of Clinton Fundraising Scandal
1995 memo [Clinton presidency-concerned about Chinese election sales] Gorelick wrote, stated explicitly that they would “go beyond what is legally required, [to] prevent any risk of creating an unwarranted appearance that FISA is being used to avoid procedural safeguards which would apply in a criminal investigation.” GORELICK Memo!
Here read what NOT my words but other sources:
Jamie Gorelick’s wall barred anti-terror investigators from accessing the computer of Zacarias Moussaoui, the 20th hijacker, already in custody on an immigration violation shortly before 9/11.
At the time, an enraged FBI investigator wrote a prophetic memo to headquarters about the wall.
Whatever has happened to this — someday someone will die — and wall or not — the public will not understand why we were not more effective in throwing every resource we had at certain problems…..especially since the biggest threat to us UBL [Usama bin Laden], is getting the most protection.
So, a year before the 9/11 attacks, a special unit in the U.S. military was aware of the presence of an al-Queda cell in Brooklyn, New York, and sought to share its information with the FBI but was stopped cold.Why?Because (as described in the April 16, 2004 Washington Times piece) “on March 4, 1995, [Jamie Gorelick, the then number 2 official in the Clinton Justice Department, sent a 4-page directive] to FBI Director Louis Freeh and Mary Jo White, the New York-based U.S. attorney investigating the 1993 World Trade Center bombing.
In the memo, Ms. Gorelick ordered Mr. Freeh and Ms. White to follow information-sharing procedures that ‘go beyond what is legally required,’ in order to avoid ‘any risk of creating an unwarranted appearance’ that the Justice Department was using Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) warrants, instead of ordinary criminal investigative procedures, in an effort to undermine the civil liberties of terrorism suspects.”
Could 9/11 Have Been Prevented? The Gorelick Memo and What We Knew

Year 2001: September 11 Terrorist Attacks
The 9/11 terrorist attacks were the events that helped shape other financial events of the decade. After that terrible day in September 2001, our economic climate was never to be the same again. It was only the third time in history that the New York Stock Exchange was shut down for a period of time. In this case, it was closed from September 10 - 17. Besides the tragic human loss of that day, the economic loss cannot even be estimated. Some estimate that there was over $60 billion in insurance losses alone. Airlines didn't fly for 3 days!
Approximately 18,000 small businesses were either displaced or destroyed in Lower Manhattan after the Twin Towers fell. There was a buildup in homeland security on all levels. 9/11 caused a catastrophic financial loss for the U.S.
Source: 10 Events That Rocked the Financial World
Anthrax Attacks...
The 2001 anthrax attacks in the United States, also known as Amerithrax from its Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) case name, occurred over the course of several weeks beginning on Tuesday, September 18, 2001, one week after the September 11 attacks. Letters containing anthrax spores were mailed to several news media offices and two DemocraticU.S. Senators, killing five people and infecting 17 others.

$1 trillion in losses due to the WORST Hurricane SEASONS in history.
The worst, Katrina made landfall in Louisiana as a Category 3 in 2005. It took 1,836 lives and caused $81.2 billion in damages. It quickly became the biggest natural disaster in U.S. history, almost destroying New Orleans due to severe flooding.
Rank Disaster Year Deaths Damage* $250 Billion in damages in the 8 disasters of the top 15 disasters in history!
1. Hurricane Katrina (LA/MS/AL/FL) 2005 1833 $133,800,000,000
6. Hurricane Ike (TX/LA/MS) 2008 112 $27,000,000,000
7. Hurricane Wilma (FL) 2005 35 $17,100,000,000
8. Hurricane Rita (TX/LA) 2005 119 $17,100,000,000
9. Hurricane Charley (FL) 2004 35 $16,500,000,000
12. Midwest Floods 2008 24 $15,000,000,000
13. Hurricane Ivan (FL/AL) 2004 57 $13,000,000,000
14. 30-State Drought 2002 0 $11,400,000,000
Costliest U.S. Weather Disasters | Weather Underground

THESE events OCCURRED!
YET in SPITE of:
a) 400,000 jobs lost due to Hurricanes Katrina/Rita ,
b) 2,800,000 jobs lost in alone due to 9/11,
c) 300,000 jobs lost due to dot.com busts... In spite of nearly $8 trillion in lost businesses, market values, destroyed property..
IN SPITE of that:
2002 $157.8 billion deficit.. also 9/11 occurred and tax revenues lowered for years later due to dot.com/9-11 losses against revenue.
2003 $377.6 billion deficit.. BRAND new cabinet Homeland Security, plus loans made to businesses.. again tax revenues down..affect of 9/11
2004 $412.7 billion deficit.. Revenues up by 5.5% spending increased and economy getting back.
2005 $318.3 billion deficit.. revenues up by 14.5% deficit decreasing at rate of 22%
2006 $248.2 billion deficit.. revenues up by 11.7% deficit decrease 22%
2007 $160.7 billion deficit.. revenues up by 6.7% deficit decrease 35%
2008 $458.6 billion deficit.. revenues down and deficit INCREASED TARP loan mostly...
http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=20

AFTER the tax cuts Federal Tax REVENUES Increased an average of 9.78% per year!!!
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/Historical

OH and yea how about THESE EVENTS that no other President ever experienced: 1) Dot.com bust-- 2) 9/11 3) Worst hurricane SEASONS...All of which made these numbers worse BUT still there was growth!!!
BEA National Economic Accounts
Average annual growth over 8 years 2.9% IN Spite of all the events AND if the housing bubble caused by the below people hadn't occurred it would have
been: 4.4% compared to what now???
2001 2.3% increase
2002 2.4%
2003 6.8%
2004 6.4%
2005 5.4%
2006 4.6%
2007 3.2%
2008 -7.7%

Failure to heed GWB warnings about the potential housing bust!
GWB's administration was LAUGHED AT BY Democrats Frank and Dodd after 17 times trying to get Fannie/Freddie fixed!
"Over the past six years, the President and his Administration have not only warned of the systemic consequences of failure to reform GSEs but also put forward thoughtful plans to reduce the risk that either Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac would encounter such difficulties.
President Bush publicly called for GSE reform at least 17 times in 2008 alone before Congress acted.

Unfortunately, these warnings went unheeded, as the President's repeated attempts to reform the supervision of these entities were thwarted by the legislative maneuvering of those who emphatically denied there were problems.
Setting the Record Straight: The Three Most Egregious Claims In The New York Times Article On The Housing Crisis

Many prominent Democrats, including House Finance Chairman Barney Frank, opposed any legislation correcting the risks posed by GSEs.
* House Financial Services Committee Chairman Barney Frank (D-MA) criticized
the President's warning saying:
"these two entities - Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac - are not facing any kind of financial crisis .
The more people exaggerate these problems,
the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing."...
(Stephen Labaton, "New Agency Proposed To Oversee Freddie Mac And Fannie Mae," New York Times, 9/11/03)

* Senate Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs Chairman Christopher Dodd also ignored the President's warnings and
called on him to "immediately reconsider his ill-advised" position. Eric Dash, "Fannie Mae's Offer To Help Ease Credit Squeeze
Is Rejected, As Critics Complain Of Opportunism," New York Times, 8/11/07)

Barney Frank's Fannie and Freddie Muddle


ONCE again I'm asking you idiot Bush bashers to prove the above statements WRONG! REFUTE the FACTS that
1) a recession started under Clinton.
2) dot.com bust started under Clinton cost $8 trillion market losses, lost jobs!
3) Clinton's Gorelick Memo prevented the CIA from Warning the FBI about 9/11.
4) 9/11 occurred
5) Anthrax attacks happened right after 9/11
6) Worst hurricane SEASONS in history occurred

Please refute these events occurred and in doing so prove these cataclysmic events didn't occur and didn't affect the country. Prove me wrong!

And say that they have because NOT ONE person to this date has even attempted to disprove the above events didn't happen much less have
ANY affect on our country! PROVE ME WRONG!

If Bush was so great, then why did he hand Obama such a mess. And how many years did Bush have such large majorities in congress he was able to use reconciliation again and again? Take Katrina for instance. Of course the hurricane occurred, but it's what happened AFTER by which Bush is judged. How can you not know that? Revenues are down due to the Bush tax cuts for the rich and because Republicans helped move millions of jobs overseas and close over 40,000 factories.

In fact, the more you defend Bush, the worse he looks. You might consider stopping or Republicans will NEVER let him anywhere near their convention.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Does anyone realize that the Nobel Peace Prize winner...obama...is now sending more troops over to Iraq....anyone hear about that in the news........? I thought not......

yeah neat huh

he is sending back over there to fight them

but this time the enemy has much better equipment

the equipment that obama left behind for them

 

[Dragonlady]

Obama will be seen as the worst President in history...his mistakes will follow us into the future and will cause great suffering for the people of the planet......but it I'll be a long time before the truth will be recorded...too many morons are going to write his history right now....

I know this is the conservative wet dream, but it won't happen. Obama will be hailed as a hero for beginning health care reform in America. It isn't just union demands that sent all of those jobs overseas, it's also the cost of employee health care insurance. I'd wager that rapidly health care insurance costs are part of what keeps wages flatlining year in and year out, too.

Your health care industry remains bloated with administration costs three times higher than most industrialized countries. So much for private industry being more cost efficient.

Once Republicans lose Congress and the Senate on Trumps coattails, perhaps the US can join the 21st Century on wage reforms.

It isn't private industry that is messing up our healthcare....it is government intervention in it that is causing the problems....

It's not government that insists on pre-approving treatment, it's the private insurance companies. Many doctors keep extra nurses on staff to deal with insurance company pre-approvals. They also farm out billing to third party companies because it's too time consuming and too complex. Many doctors refuse to deal with insurance companies at all because they are too intrusive in patient/doctor care. Patients pay out of pocket and then fight it out for their insurance companies for reimbursement. Billing and Administration is the largest department in American hospitals.

I live in a country with government funded health care. I have no paper work to complete, no forms to file for my care. I have a health card I present at the doctor's office and at the pharmacy for prescriptions. My only role is to hand my card to the doctor's receptionist or the pharmacist so they can verify that I have coverage. That's it. There are no pre-approvals. Billing is done once a month (single payer so it's only once invoice), by the doctor's receptionist. So while Canadian doctors don't make as much money up front, they don't need additional staff to deal with insurance companies, nor do they need third party billing and collections, and they get to spend more time with patients.

Our health care costs are almost half of what the US spends, and out administration costs are below 10%, while yours are over 30%, based entirely on levels of scrutiny and complex billing practices put in place by private insurance companies.

 

[Dragonlady]

Hope you enjoy your United States of Cuba.

I live in Canada. A country with a healthier, happier and more compassionate people. A country which is a lot like what the US likes to think it is, and like it was before conservatives began glorifying greed and hating on non-whites.

 

[Iceweasel]

Obama will be seen as the worst President in history...his mistakes will follow us into the future and will cause great suffering for the people of the planet......but it I'll be a long time before the truth will be recorded...too many morons are going to write his history right now....

I know this is the conservative wet dream, but it won't happen. Obama will be hailed as a hero for beginning health care reform in America. It isn't just union demands that sent all of those jobs overseas, it's also the cost of employee health care insurance. I'd wager that rapidly health care insurance costs are part of what keeps wages flatlining year in and year out, too.

Your health care industry remains bloated with administration costs three times higher than most industrialized countries. So much for private industry being more cost efficient.

Once Republicans lose Congress and the Senate on Trumps coattails, perhaps the US can join the 21st Century on wage reforms.

It isn't private industry that is messing up our healthcare....it is government intervention in it that is causing the problems....

It's not government that insists on pre-approving treatment, it's the private insurance companies. Many doctors keep extra nurses on staff to deal with insurance company pre-approvals. They also farm out billing to third party companies because it's too time consuming and too complex. Many doctors refuse to deal with insurance companies at all because they are too intrusive in patient/doctor care. Patients pay out of pocket and then fight it out for their insurance companies for reimbursement. Billing and Administration is the largest department in American hospitals.

I live in a country with government funded health care. I have no paper work to complete, no forms to file for my care. I have a health card I present at the doctor's office and at the pharmacy for prescriptions. My only role is to hand my card to the doctor's receptionist or the pharmacist so they can verify that I have coverage. That's it. There are no pre-approvals. Billing is done once a month (single payer so it's only once invoice), by the doctor's receptionist. So while Canadian doctors don't make as much money up front, they don't need additional staff to deal with insurance companies, nor do they need third party billing and collections, and they get to spend more time with patients.

Our health care costs are almost half of what the US spends, and out administration costs are below 10%, while yours are over 30%, based entirely on levels of scrutiny and complex billing practices put in place by private insurance companies.

The problem is that they are HIGHLY regulated by government. You left that part out. We can't even shop across state lines for insurance. Plus Medicare, Medicaid, lots of red tape. Lawsuits up the ass due to our litigious society with lawyers more plentiful than rats.

You paint a rosy picture but I've heard some less than stellar things about your healthcare.

 

[healthmyths]

BBBUUUUTTT BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Of course they won't admit it. They will just make stupid posts like the one above.

They are however, tacitly admitting it by flocking to Trump.

Too bad NONE of you Bush bashing Idiots DEAL with history which will declare Bush a GREAT President when considering ALL these events
that in the history of the USA have NEVER NEVER occurred in one 8 year period!

Unlike you idiots that can't substantiate your stupid biased ignorant comments,
ALL of the below are LINKS if you aren't too f...king lazy to check out and see the Truth!

Recession
Are you aware that a recession started under Clinton and became official 3/01 ended 11/01?
Because idiots don't seem to comprehend... RECESSIONS are like large ships.. it takes miles to turn one...i.e. so does a "RECESSION"...
it doesn't just start the day NBER states... it is a slow degradation and it started under CLINTON!!!
Source: USATODAY.com - It's official: 2001 recession only lasted eight months

A Major $8 trillion market loss
Are you aware that the dot.com bust occurred and cost $8 trillion in losses?
Again Clinton laid claim BUT someone had to pay and it occurred during Bush's first year!
$8 trillion in market losses MEAN lost tax revenue.
PLUS JOBS!!!!
According to the Los Angeles Times, when the dot-com bubble burst, it wiped out $8 trillion dollars in market value for tech companies.
More than half of the Internet companies created since 1995 were gone by 2004 -
and hundreds of thousands of skilled technology workers were out of jobs.
Source: The dot-com bubble: How to lose $5 trillion

The worst attacks on the USA in History.. 3,000 deaths!!!
Obviously most of you are UNAWARE 9/11 cost 3,000 lives, $2 trillion in lost businesses,market values assets.
Jobs lost in New York owing to the attacks: 146,100 JUST in New York.
Are you aware this happened???
Now before you idiots say "well Bush should have known"! DUMMIES... ever hear of the Gorelick Memo signed under CLINTON??
Gorelick Memo that created the wall between FBI & CIA thus no knowledge of the 9/11 bombers shared with the FBI!!!
Looks especially imprudent 10 years later.
Because the memo created a barrier for U.S. intelligence agencies to share information with the FBI, one of its unintended consequences may have been to prevent the FBI from receiving the necessary intelligence to stop the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, the worst in American history.
Gorelick Memo Allegedly Impeded Probe of Clinton Fundraising Scandal
1995 memo [Clinton presidency-concerned about Chinese election sales] Gorelick wrote, stated explicitly that they would “go beyond what is legally required, [to] prevent any risk of creating an unwarranted appearance that FISA is being used to avoid procedural safeguards which would apply in a criminal investigation.” GORELICK Memo!
Here read what NOT my words but other sources:
Jamie Gorelick’s wall barred anti-terror investigators from accessing the computer of Zacarias Moussaoui, the 20th hijacker, already in custody on an immigration violation shortly before 9/11.
At the time, an enraged FBI investigator wrote a prophetic memo to headquarters about the wall.
Whatever has happened to this — someday someone will die — and wall or not — the public will not understand why we were not more effective in throwing every resource we had at certain problems…..especially since the biggest threat to us UBL [Usama bin Laden], is getting the most protection.
So, a year before the 9/11 attacks, a special unit in the U.S. military was aware of the presence of an al-Queda cell in Brooklyn, New York, and sought to share its information with the FBI but was stopped cold.Why?Because (as described in the April 16, 2004 Washington Times piece) “on March 4, 1995, [Jamie Gorelick, the then number 2 official in the Clinton Justice Department, sent a 4-page directive] to FBI Director Louis Freeh and Mary Jo White, the New York-based U.S. attorney investigating the 1993 World Trade Center bombing.
In the memo, Ms. Gorelick ordered Mr. Freeh and Ms. White to follow information-sharing procedures that ‘go beyond what is legally required,’ in order to avoid ‘any risk of creating an unwarranted appearance’ that the Justice Department was using Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) warrants, instead of ordinary criminal investigative procedures, in an effort to undermine the civil liberties of terrorism suspects.”
Could 9/11 Have Been Prevented? The Gorelick Memo and What We Knew

Year 2001: September 11 Terrorist Attacks
The 9/11 terrorist attacks were the events that helped shape other financial events of the decade. After that terrible day in September 2001, our economic climate was never to be the same again. It was only the third time in history that the New York Stock Exchange was shut down for a period of time. In this case, it was closed from September 10 - 17. Besides the tragic human loss of that day, the economic loss cannot even be estimated. Some estimate that there was over $60 billion in insurance losses alone. Airlines didn't fly for 3 days!
Approximately 18,000 small businesses were either displaced or destroyed in Lower Manhattan after the Twin Towers fell. There was a buildup in homeland security on all levels. 9/11 caused a catastrophic financial loss for the U.S.
Source: 10 Events That Rocked the Financial World
Anthrax Attacks...
The 2001 anthrax attacks in the United States, also known as Amerithrax from its Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) case name, occurred over the course of several weeks beginning on Tuesday, September 18, 2001, one week after the September 11 attacks. Letters containing anthrax spores were mailed to several news media offices and two DemocraticU.S. Senators, killing five people and infecting 17 others.

$1 trillion in losses due to the WORST Hurricane SEASONS in history.
The worst, Katrina made landfall in Louisiana as a Category 3 in 2005. It took 1,836 lives and caused $81.2 billion in damages. It quickly became the biggest natural disaster in U.S. history, almost destroying New Orleans due to severe flooding.
Rank Disaster Year Deaths Damage* $250 Billion in damages in the 8 disasters of the top 15 disasters in history!
1. Hurricane Katrina (LA/MS/AL/FL) 2005 1833 $133,800,000,000
6. Hurricane Ike (TX/LA/MS) 2008 112 $27,000,000,000
7. Hurricane Wilma (FL) 2005 35 $17,100,000,000
8. Hurricane Rita (TX/LA) 2005 119 $17,100,000,000
9. Hurricane Charley (FL) 2004 35 $16,500,000,000
12. Midwest Floods 2008 24 $15,000,000,000
13. Hurricane Ivan (FL/AL) 2004 57 $13,000,000,000
14. 30-State Drought 2002 0 $11,400,000,000
Costliest U.S. Weather Disasters | Weather Underground

THESE events OCCURRED!
YET in SPITE of:
a) 400,000 jobs lost due to Hurricanes Katrina/Rita ,
b) 2,800,000 jobs lost in alone due to 9/11,
c) 300,000 jobs lost due to dot.com busts... In spite of nearly $8 trillion in lost businesses, market values, destroyed property..
IN SPITE of that:
2002 $157.8 billion deficit.. also 9/11 occurred and tax revenues lowered for years later due to dot.com/9-11 losses against revenue.
2003 $377.6 billion deficit.. BRAND new cabinet Homeland Security, plus loans made to businesses.. again tax revenues down..affect of 9/11
2004 $412.7 billion deficit.. Revenues up by 5.5% spending increased and economy getting back.
2005 $318.3 billion deficit.. revenues up by 14.5% deficit decreasing at rate of 22%
2006 $248.2 billion deficit.. revenues up by 11.7% deficit decrease 22%
2007 $160.7 billion deficit.. revenues up by 6.7% deficit decrease 35%
2008 $458.6 billion deficit.. revenues down and deficit INCREASED TARP loan mostly...
http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=20

AFTER the tax cuts Federal Tax REVENUES Increased an average of 9.78% per year!!!
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/Historical

OH and yea how about THESE EVENTS that no other President ever experienced: 1) Dot.com bust-- 2) 9/11 3) Worst hurricane SEASONS...All of which made these numbers worse BUT still there was growth!!!
BEA National Economic Accounts
Average annual growth over 8 years 2.9% IN Spite of all the events AND if the housing bubble caused by the below people hadn't occurred it would have
been: 4.4% compared to what now???
2001 2.3% increase
2002 2.4%
2003 6.8%
2004 6.4%
2005 5.4%
2006 4.6%
2007 3.2%
2008 -7.7%

Failure to heed GWB warnings about the potential housing bust!
GWB's administration was LAUGHED AT BY Democrats Frank and Dodd after 17 times trying to get Fannie/Freddie fixed!
"Over the past six years, the President and his Administration have not only warned of the systemic consequences of failure to reform GSEs but also put forward thoughtful plans to reduce the risk that either Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac would encounter such difficulties.
President Bush publicly called for GSE reform at least 17 times in 2008 alone before Congress acted.

Unfortunately, these warnings went unheeded, as the President's repeated attempts to reform the supervision of these entities were thwarted by the legislative maneuvering of those who emphatically denied there were problems.
Setting the Record Straight: The Three Most Egregious Claims In The New York Times Article On The Housing Crisis

Many prominent Democrats, including House Finance Chairman Barney Frank, opposed any legislation correcting the risks posed by GSEs.
* House Financial Services Committee Chairman Barney Frank (D-MA) criticized
the President's warning saying:
"these two entities - Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac - are not facing any kind of financial crisis .
The more people exaggerate these problems,
the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing."...
(Stephen Labaton, "New Agency Proposed To Oversee Freddie Mac And Fannie Mae," New York Times, 9/11/03)

* Senate Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs Chairman Christopher Dodd also ignored the President's warnings and
called on him to "immediately reconsider his ill-advised" position. Eric Dash, "Fannie Mae's Offer To Help Ease Credit Squeeze
Is Rejected, As Critics Complain Of Opportunism," New York Times, 8/11/07)

Barney Frank's Fannie and Freddie Muddle


ONCE again I'm asking you idiot Bush bashers to prove the above statements WRONG! REFUTE the FACTS that
1) a recession started under Clinton.
2) dot.com bust started under Clinton cost $8 trillion market losses, lost jobs!
3) Clinton's Gorelick Memo prevented the CIA from Warning the FBI about 9/11.
4) 9/11 occurred
5) Anthrax attacks happened right after 9/11
6) Worst hurricane SEASONS in history occurred

Please refute these events occurred and in doing so prove these cataclysmic events didn't occur and didn't affect the country. Prove me wrong!

And say that they have because NOT ONE person to this date has even attempted to disprove the above events didn't happen much less have
ANY affect on our country! PROVE ME WRONG!

If Bush was so great, then why did he hand Obama such a mess. And how many years did Bush have such large majorities in congress he was able to use reconciliation again and again? Take Katrina for instance. Of course the hurricane occurred, but it's what happened AFTER by which Bush is judged. How can you not know that? Revenues are down due to the Bush tax cuts for the rich and because Republicans helped move millions of jobs overseas and close over 40,000 factories.

In fact, the more you defend Bush, the worse he looks. You might consider stopping or Republicans will NEVER let him anywhere near their convention.

What mess? Talking about Iraq for example. Iraq was peaceful when Bush left. And tell though why was the MSM so against Bush and for Obama
that 85% of MSM donated to Obama's 2008 election?
Tell me who forced the subprime loans that Bush was telling Congress over 17 times in six years to fix Fannie/Freddie yet the likes of Franks/Dodd
said NOTHING was wrong?
Revenues WERE NOT down but actually up after Bush tax cuts in spite of $8 trillion losses in market value, $2 trillion in destroyed businesses that paid
taxes and nearly 3 million out of work due to Recession/dot.com/hurricanes/9-11!
NONE of which you could refute had a deleterious affect on the economy.
Here facts again show how ignorant your statements are:

2002 $157.8 billion deficit.. also 9/11 occurred and tax revenues lowered for years later due to dot.com/9-11 losses against revenue.
2003 $377.6 billion deficit.. BRAND new cabinet Homeland Security, plus loans made to businesses.. again tax revenues down..affect of 9/11
2004 $412.7 billion deficit.. Revenues up by 5.5% spending increased and economy getting back.
2005 $318.3 billion deficit.. revenues up by 14.5% deficit decreasing at rate of 22%
2006 $248.2 billion deficit.. revenues up by 11.7% deficit decrease 22%
2007 $160.7 billion deficit.. revenues up by 6.7% deficit decrease 35%
2008 $458.6 billion deficit.. revenues down and deficit INCREASED TARP loan mostly...
http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=20
AFTER Bush tax cuts revenues increased at higher rates for 4 years (2004 to 2007) at higher average 8.7% for Bush.
then Clinton's average of 7.9%
Source: Office of Management and Budget, Historical Tables,
Table 1.3; Historical Tables (last accessed Feb 2, 2015).

 

[Dragonlady]

Remember Obama told us he favored a system that would:
1) Bankrupt 1,400 companies
2) That pay each year over $100 billion in federal/state/local taxes --- some of you may see your property taxes increased because of those companies.
3) Put 450,000 people out of work.

Remember Obama told foreign countries he wanted to make the USA dependent on their oil.

No I don't remember any of this because it never happened. It's what the conservative media told you happened, but as usual, it's a false narrative.

Here's a link to a 2008 article on Obama's plan to REDUCE dependence on foreign oil, not increase it as you suggested.

Obama's Plan to Reduce Foreign Oil Dependence

Remember Obama told Americans he favored higher gas prices, skyrocketing utilities and bankrupting coal companies and utilities.

Bullshit. Obama said he wanted to end the use of coal to generate electricity because of the harm to the environment, and that coal fired plants would be going bankrupt. Coal is not an efficient or clean method of producing electricity. Not to mention that coal mining is dangerous and shortens the lives of miners. The bald fact is that demand for coal has been on the decline and not just in the US but worldwide. There are better and cheaper means of production which don't pollute the air.

China has ended it's use of coal to generate energy because its cities were becoming so polluted that people couldn't breathe due to air.

In Ontario, where I live, it's been years since we closed all of the coal fired plants, and our air is better for it.

Your resistance to change is noted. Had you lived during the time when Henry Ford invented the car, you'd be complaining about the President wanting to put horse breeders and buggy makers out of business.

 

[healthmyths]

Obama will be seen as the worst President in history...his mistakes will follow us into the future and will cause great suffering for the people of the planet......but it I'll be a long time before the truth will be recorded...too many morons are going to write his history right now....

I know this is the conservative wet dream, but it won't happen. Obama will be hailed as a hero for beginning health care reform in America. It isn't just union demands that sent all of those jobs overseas, it's also the cost of employee health care insurance. I'd wager that rapidly health care insurance costs are part of what keeps wages flatlining year in and year out, too.

Your health care industry remains bloated with administration costs three times higher than most industrialized countries. So much for private industry being more cost efficient.

Once Republicans lose Congress and the Senate on Trumps coattails, perhaps the US can join the 21st Century on wage reforms.

It isn't private industry that is messing up our healthcare....it is government intervention in it that is causing the problems....

It's not government that insists on pre-approving treatment, it's the private insurance companies. Many doctors keep extra nurses on staff to deal with insurance company pre-approvals. They also farm out billing to third party companies because it's too time consuming and too complex. Many doctors refuse to deal with insurance companies at all because they are too intrusive in patient/doctor care. Patients pay out of pocket and then fight it out for their insurance companies for reimbursement. Billing and Administration is the largest department in American hospitals.

I live in a country with government funded health care. I have no paper work to complete, no forms to file for my care. I have a health card I present at the doctor's office and at the pharmacy for prescriptions. My only role is to hand my card to the doctor's receptionist or the pharmacist so they can verify that I have coverage. That's it. There are no pre-approvals. Billing is done once a month (single payer so it's only once invoice), by the doctor's receptionist. So while Canadian doctors don't make as much money up front, they don't need additional staff to deal with insurance companies, nor do they need third party billing and collections, and they get to spend more time with patients.

Our health care costs are almost half of what the US spends, and out administration costs are below 10%, while yours are over 30%, based entirely on levels of scrutiny and complex billing practices put in place by private insurance companies.

The problem is that they are HIGHLY regulated by government. You left that part out. We can't even shop across state lines for insurance. Plus Medicare, Medicaid, lots of red tape. Lawsuits up the ass due to our litigious society with lawyers more plentiful than rats.

You paint a rosy picture but I've heard some less than stellar things about your healthcare.

It's called "defensive medicine" and here are the facts about $850 billion in wasted payments made by insurance companies who simply raise premiums!

PLEASE read the study that proves that doctors think they send between $600 Billion to $850 Billion a year in wasted claims to insurance companies.

READ THIS STUDY!! http://www.jacksonhealthcare.com/media/8968/defensivemedicine_ebook_final.pdf

90% of physicians surveyed say they order $850 billion a year in wasted duplicate tests, referrals all out of FEAR of being SUED!
--- Emergency medicine, primary care, and OB/GYN physicians are most likely to practice defensive medicine.
--- 79 to 83% of surgeons and OB/GYNs have been named in lawsuits.
"Physicians contracted by the federal government practice significantly less defensive medicine as they are protected against lawsuits by the
1946 Federal Tort Claims Act. "
-- BUT........Only 48% practice defensive medicine compared to 92% of non-government physicians.
Consider that fact that of the physicians interviewed 52% DID NOT practice defensive medicine!
Who were they? Doctors contracted by federal government!
WHY did these doctors NOT practice "defensive medicine"??? 1946 Tort reform!

So does Canada allow lawsuits against doctors? NO.

ONLY idiots proclaim a Canada's health care program successful where the population is 1/10th the USA! GEEZ I can manage 35 million but
NOT 330 million!
Second only idiots proclaim Canadian successful!

1) Amongst industrialized countries — members of the OECD — with universal health care, Canada has the second most expensive health care system as a share of the economy after adjusting for age.
2) In 2013, Canadians, on average, faced a four and a half month wait for medically necessary treatment after referral by a general practitioner.
This wait time is almost twice as long as it was in 1993 when national wait times were first measured.
If Universal Health Care Is The Goal, Don't Copy Canada
But who can argue the FACTS with ignorant people that proclaim Canada as a role model!

 

[Iceweasel]

Obama will be seen as the worst President in history...his mistakes will follow us into the future and will cause great suffering for the people of the planet......but it I'll be a long time before the truth will be recorded...too many morons are going to write his history right now....

I know this is the conservative wet dream, but it won't happen. Obama will be hailed as a hero for beginning health care reform in America. It isn't just union demands that sent all of those jobs overseas, it's also the cost of employee health care insurance. I'd wager that rapidly health care insurance costs are part of what keeps wages flatlining year in and year out, too.

Your health care industry remains bloated with administration costs three times higher than most industrialized countries. So much for private industry being more cost efficient.

Once Republicans lose Congress and the Senate on Trumps coattails, perhaps the US can join the 21st Century on wage reforms.

It isn't private industry that is messing up our healthcare....it is government intervention in it that is causing the problems....

It's not government that insists on pre-approving treatment, it's the private insurance companies. Many doctors keep extra nurses on staff to deal with insurance company pre-approvals. They also farm out billing to third party companies because it's too time consuming and too complex. Many doctors refuse to deal with insurance companies at all because they are too intrusive in patient/doctor care. Patients pay out of pocket and then fight it out for their insurance companies for reimbursement. Billing and Administration is the largest department in American hospitals.

I live in a country with government funded health care. I have no paper work to complete, no forms to file for my care. I have a health card I present at the doctor's office and at the pharmacy for prescriptions. My only role is to hand my card to the doctor's receptionist or the pharmacist so they can verify that I have coverage. That's it. There are no pre-approvals. Billing is done once a month (single payer so it's only once invoice), by the doctor's receptionist. So while Canadian doctors don't make as much money up front, they don't need additional staff to deal with insurance companies, nor do they need third party billing and collections, and they get to spend more time with patients.

Our health care costs are almost half of what the US spends, and out administration costs are below 10%, while yours are over 30%, based entirely on levels of scrutiny and complex billing practices put in place by private insurance companies.

The problem is that they are HIGHLY regulated by government. You left that part out. We can't even shop across state lines for insurance. Plus Medicare, Medicaid, lots of red tape. Lawsuits up the ass due to our litigious society with lawyers more plentiful than rats.

You paint a rosy picture but I've heard some less than stellar things about your healthcare.

It's called "defensive medicine" and here are the facts about $850 billion in wasted payments made by insurance companies who simply raise premiums!

PLEASE read the study that proves that doctors think they send between $600 Billion to $850 Billion a year in wasted claims to insurance companies.

READ THIS STUDY!! http://www.jacksonhealthcare.com/media/8968/defensivemedicine_ebook_final.pdf

90% of physicians surveyed say they order $850 billion a year in wasted duplicate tests, referrals all out of FEAR of being SUED!
--- Emergency medicine, primary care, and OB/GYN physicians are most likely to practice defensive medicine.
--- 79 to 83% of surgeons and OB/GYNs have been named in lawsuits.
"Physicians contracted by the federal government practice significantly less defensive medicine as they are protected against lawsuits by the
1946 Federal Tort Claims Act. "
-- BUT........Only 48% practice defensive medicine compared to 92% of non-government physicians.
Consider that fact that of the physicians interviewed 52% DID NOT practice defensive medicine!
Who were they? Doctors contracted by federal government!
WHY did these doctors NOT practice "defensive medicine"??? 1946 Tort reform!

So does Canada allow lawsuits against doctors? NO.

ONLY idiots proclaim a Canada's health care program successful where the population is 1/10th the USA! GEEZ I can manage 35 million but
NOT 330 million!
Second only idiots proclaim Canadian successful!

1) Amongst industrialized countries — members of the OECD — with universal health care, Canada has the second most expensive health care system as a share of the economy after adjusting for age.
2) In 2013, Canadians, on average, faced a four and a half month wait for medically necessary treatment after referral by a general practitioner.
This wait time is almost twice as long as it was in 1993 when national wait times were first measured.
If Universal Health Care Is The Goal, Don't Copy Canada
But who can argue the FACTS with ignorant people that proclaim Canada as a role model!

I think you responded to the wrong person.

 

[healthmyths]

Remember Obama told us he favored a system that would:
1) Bankrupt 1,400 companies
2) That pay each year over $100 billion in federal/state/local taxes --- some of you may see your property taxes increased because of those companies.
3) Put 450,000 people out of work.

Remember Obama told foreign countries he wanted to make the USA dependent on their oil.

No I don't remember any of this because it never happened. It's what the conservative media told you happened, but as usual, it's a false narrative.

Here's a link to a 2008 article on Obama's plan to REDUCE dependence on foreign oil, not increase it as you suggested.

Obama's Plan to Reduce Foreign Oil Dependence

Remember Obama told Americans he favored higher gas prices, skyrocketing utilities and bankrupting coal companies and utilities.

Bullshit. Obama said he wanted to end the use of coal to generate electricity because of the harm to the environment, and that coal fired plants would be going bankrupt. Coal is not an efficient or clean method of producing electricity. Not to mention that coal mining is dangerous and shortens the lives of miners. The bald fact is that demand for coal has been on the decline and not just in the US but worldwide. There are better and cheaper means of production which don't pollute the air.

China has ended it's use of coal to generate energy because its cities were becoming so polluted that people couldn't breathe due to air.

In Ontario, where I live, it's been years since we closed all of the coal fired plants, and our air is better for it.

Your resistance to change is noted. Had you lived during the time when Henry Ford invented the car, you'd be complaining about the President wanting to put horse breeders and buggy makers out of business.

Obama and energy Dependence !
You read that headline correctly. Unfortunately, the Obama Administration is financing oil exploration off Brazil.

The U.S. is going to lend billions of dollars to Brazil's state-owned oil company, Petrobras, to finance exploration of the huge offshore discovery in Brazil's Tupi oil field in the Santos Basin near Rio de Janeiro. Brazil's planning minister confirmed that White House National Security Adviser James Jones met this month with Brazilian officials to talk about the loan.
President Barack Obama has pledged that the United States will be a "major customer" for Brazilian oil in the coming years amid continuing unrest in the Middle East.
Obama says US to be major purchaser of Brazilian oil
This is the ONLY real executive action any President can have on INCREASING production which would INCREASE supplies and Obama ....
a) In 6 years new leases under Obama..........9,922 new leases or 29% of total leases.
b) In 8 years new leases under Bush...........23,569 new leases or 71% of total leases
Between the two a total of 33,491 federal oil exploration leases.
Obama signed almost 50% fewer oil finding leases on Federal lands.
httThis is the ONLY real executive action any President can have on INCREASING production which would INCREASE supplies and Obama ....
a) In 6 years new leases under Obama..........9,922 new leases or 29% of total leases.
b) In 8 years new leases under Bush...........23,569 new leases or 71% of total leases
Between the two a total of 33,491 federal oil exploration leases.
Obama signed almost 50% fewer oil finding leases on Federal lands.
Oil and Gas Statistics
In the 2012 presidential debates Obama denied Romney's statement of FACTS...
p://www.blm.gov/wo/st/en/prog/energy/oil_and_gas/statistics.html
In the 2012 presidential debates Obama denied Romney's statement of FACTS...
Romney: And — and — and production on private — on government lands is down.
Obama: And the production is up. No it isn’t.
Romney: Production on government land of oil is down 14 percent.
Obama: Governor —
Romney: And production of gas is down 9 percent.
Obama: What you’re saying is just not true. It’s just not true.
What a bald faced LIAR! Are we to expect JUST because the Messiah said "it's not true" then that's that when the FACT clearly support
the premise Obama is not only a liar BUT incompetent.
Factcheck.org strongly says Obama was wrong!

Obama’s Drilling Denials

 

[Iceweasel]

Bullshit. Obama said he wanted to end the use of coal to generate electricity because of the harm to the environment, and that coal fired plants would be going bankrupt. Coal is not an efficient or clean method of producing electricity. Not to mention that coal mining is dangerous and shortens the lives of miners. The bald fact is that demand for coal has been on the decline and not just in the US but worldwide. There are better and cheaper means of production which don't pollute the air.

China has ended it's use of coal to generate energy because its cities were becoming so polluted that people couldn't breathe due to air.

Like all liberals you know so much that isn't true.

Coal mining can be made safe and with modern technology, clean.

China ban on new coal mines barely scratches the surface of tackling capacity
China ban on new coal mines barely scratches the surface of tackling capacity

Jan 18 China's decision to stop approving new coal mines for three years has been applauded by green groups, but the move is likely to make barely a dent on the world's biggest coal industry given its vast existing production capacity.

 

[Dragonlady]

Obama will be seen as the worst President in history...his mistakes will follow us into the future and will cause great suffering for the people of the planet......but it I'll be a long time before the truth will be recorded...too many morons are going to write his history right now....

I know this is the conservative wet dream, but it won't happen. Obama will be hailed as a hero for beginning health care reform in America. It isn't just union demands that sent all of those jobs overseas, it's also the cost of employee health care insurance. I'd wager that rapidly health care insurance costs are part of what keeps wages flatlining year in and year out, too.

Your health care industry remains bloated with administration costs three times higher than most industrialized countries. So much for private industry being more cost efficient.

Once Republicans lose Congress and the Senate on Trumps coattails, perhaps the US can join the 21st Century on wage reforms.

It isn't private industry that is messing up our healthcare....it is government intervention in it that is causing the problems....

It's not government that insists on pre-approving treatment, it's the private insurance companies. Many doctors keep extra nurses on staff to deal with insurance company pre-approvals. They also farm out billing to third party companies because it's too time consuming and too complex. Many doctors refuse to deal with insurance companies at all because they are too intrusive in patient/doctor care. Patients pay out of pocket and then fight it out for their insurance companies for reimbursement. Billing and Administration is the largest department in American hospitals.

I live in a country with government funded health care. I have no paper work to complete, no forms to file for my care. I have a health card I present at the doctor's office and at the pharmacy for prescriptions. My only role is to hand my card to the doctor's receptionist or the pharmacist so they can verify that I have coverage. That's it. There are no pre-approvals. Billing is done once a month (single payer so it's only once invoice), by the doctor's receptionist. So while Canadian doctors don't make as much money up front, they don't need additional staff to deal with insurance companies, nor do they need third party billing and collections, and they get to spend more time with patients.

Our health care costs are almost half of what the US spends, and out administration costs are below 10%, while yours are over 30%, based entirely on levels of scrutiny and complex billing practices put in place by private insurance companies.

The problem is that they are HIGHLY regulated by government. You left that part out. We can't even shop across state lines for insurance. Plus Medicare, Medicaid, lots of red tape. Lawsuits up the ass due to our litigious society with lawyers more plentiful than rats.

You paint a rosy picture but I've heard some less than stellar things about your healthcare.

No health care system is perfect but yours is a snake pit for all who use it. Here's a clue, all that paperwork that has to be submitted by claimants and their physicians is an expensive waste of time. More money is spent to prevent waste and fraud than the waste and fraud would cost. The paperwork surrounding your medical system keeps people from making claims, which is as was intended. Give users a photo ID swipe card and have them present it each time they access the system.

Everything about your private insurance plans is designed to make claims difficult to file and difficult to get approved. All that obstruction costs money - money for the physicians, and money for the hospitals, and aggravation for sick people who should be focused on getting well.