Will the free stuff pass muster?

[william the wie]

XXXXXXX the huge number of comp deals required of exchange network member MDs. Now what I am wondering is how many legal ways can a physician get himself out of this mess without violating the law assuming of course that these provisions are not found unconstitutional?

And how many of the possible solutions finding these provisions constitutional will effectively gut the bill such as making the insurance companies but not the patient pay for all of the free services or limiting the number of freebies to say no more than 5-10% of total patient workload?

Legislative solutions are out because of a divided congress and challenges cannot be filed until the bill takes effect, which is 1/1/14.

 

[OKTexas]

There are no services that doctors are required to provide for which they will not be paid. Don't know where you got that there were.

 

[Amelia]

Maybe it's late but that went over my head the first two times I read it. I think maybe I got some of it on the third, but I might be deluding myself.

Are you talking about the free preventative health stuff and the routine checkups?

Physicians will still get paid by the insurance company for those, right?

Maybe I need an example of the kinds of "comp deals" you're talking about.

 

[william the wie]

Maybe it's late but that went over my head the first two times I read it. I think maybe I got some of it on the third, but I might be deluding myself.

Are you talking about the free preventative health stuff and the routine checkups?

Physicians will still get paid by the insurance company for those, right?

Maybe I need an example of the kinds of "comp deals" you're talking about.

Not really to the first question. Not much and not fast is the answer to the second question. Less than $200 total compensation for a tonsillectomy, which is less than an average out of pocket cost to do the procedure. That is the CA price. Anything that a provider has to pay out of pocket to provide is a freebie in my book.

Also very large parts of the country are not covered by state or national exchanges because no one will accept the compensation on offer. Also ERs are closing because by law they must provide care, for free to all comers.

So, let me rephrase the questions if the doctors in network spend all their time on stuff free to the patient because compensation is too low to do anything else how soon will the insurance companies get sued out of the exchanges?

Counterwise how soon do all practioners that cannot make a decent salary doing procedures leave the network?

 

[rdean]

Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care".

Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind.

Why don't Republicans?

 

[jon_berzerk]

XXXXXXX the huge number of comp deals required of exchange network member MDs. Now what I am wondering is how many legal ways can a physician get himself out of this mess without violating the law assuming of course that these provisions are not found unconstitutional?

And how many of the possible solutions finding these provisions constitutional will effectively gut the bill such as making the insurance companies but not the patient pay for all of the free services or limiting the number of freebies to say no more than 5-10% of total patient workload?

Legislative solutions are out because of a divided congress and challenges cannot be filed until the bill takes effect, which is 1/1/14.

the newest mandate strongly urges insurers to provide insurance to those who applied

for insurance regardless if they have paid for the insurance or not

 

[Kosh]

Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care".

Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind.

Why don't Republicans?

So when is the far left going to get tough on sealing the border?

 

[The Professor]

Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care".

Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind.

Why don't Republicans?

There is no evidence that the ACA will result in less use of the emergency rooms. The best case study for health care reform is in Massachusetts, where universal health care was enacted in 2006. According to state data, emergency room visits increased 6 percent from 2006 to 2010. In recent years there has been a slight decline but the number of ER visits is still higher than it was in 2006.

Hospitals Brace for More ER Visits Due to Health Care Reform | KSTP TV - Minneapolis and St. Paul

Mass. Sees Increase in Emergency Room Visits, Nurses Assoc. Wants to Limit Patient Numbers | WAMC

The Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act or (EMTALA), requires hospitals that accept Medicare or Medicaid funding to treat patients for emergency medical conditions regardless of legal status or ability to pay. By law, the EMTALA applies only to medical emergencies like heart attacks or serious injury; however, in practice many people are treated in the emergency room for less serious medical conditions including minor cuts, scrapes, aches and pains.

The truth is that many people prefer the emergency room to a doctor's office. Years ago, a local TV station did an exposé on the high cost of emergency room treatments. One woman they interviewed described how she used the ER to treat her son's cold. She said she preferred to go to the ER because she didn't need to make an appointment and could go at her convenience. She also said she got better treatment at the ER.

With the ACA, it is possible that use of ERs will increase. People may find themselves unable to pay their copay because of higher insurance premiums. They may also lack confidence in the doctors in their new plan. Many experts predict a shortage in the number of doctors which would most likely increase use of the ERs. At this point, I think it is too early to assume that the ACA will result in less use of the ERs.

 

[Vox]

Maybe it's late but that went over my head the first two times I read it. I think maybe I got some of it on the third, but I might be deluding myself.

Are you talking about the free preventative health stuff and the routine checkups?

Physicians will still get paid by the insurance company for those, right?

Maybe I need an example of the kinds of "comp deals" you're talking about.

not sure what all of you guys are talking about here, but, all those pompously named by obamacare "new" "preventive measurements" for "free" as blood pressure "screening" ( meaning a staff member is checking your vital signs, including BP upon the office visit). "diabetes screening" ( which means checking your glucose level in a standard BMP test and if elevated - checking HgbA1C - done routinely for ages), "diet counseling", "smoking cancellation counseling" and all other lying crap - all of those have been a part of ROUTINE standard screening/counseling/checking for decades - and it is a part of the LIE all this law is that NOW it all will be done ( as if it was not) for "free" ( as if it already was not included in the visit.

the reimbursement rates fro many procedures have been declining steadily for years and that is why many specialists do not take either medicaid or some of the private insurances - nation wide.
and that is the reason the obamcare networks are going to be extremely restricted - because the majority of providers won't take them

 

[Vox]

Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care".

Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind.

Why don't Republicans?

which will be overwhelmingly common now with the unaffordable obamacare crap.
or people will simply die - because obamcare just cut off their insurance, their providers and their medications

 

[william the wie]

Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care".

Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind.

Why don't Republicans?

"an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure" was an ad slogan for Franklin's insurance company. preventative care has with rare exceptions, such as immunizations, has very little if any double blind study support. The preponderance of evidence is that the slogan sells at best unneeded care and at worst kills or injures more false positives and mistakenly reassures more false negatives than deaths or injuries that it helps prevent.

 

[Vox]

Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care".

Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind.

Why don't Republicans?

"an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure" was an ad slogan for Franklin's insurance company. preventative care has with rare exceptions, such as immunizations, has very little if any double blind study support. The preponderance of evidence is that the slogan sells at best unneeded care and at worst kills or injures more false positives and mistakenly reassures more false negatives than deaths or injuries that it helps prevent.

colonoscopies and pap smears do. and those were already included in any insurance policy to be "free".

so called preventive measures have three categories - the direct ones - immunizations and screening ( colonoscopy, mammography, pap smears and basic lab work), indirect ones - counseling on weight loss, exercise, smoking cessation ( all done already for ages) and imaginary ones - everything else, including the above two categories, depending on the patients compliance.

preventive measures mean nothing if the patients themselves are not interested.

 

[Amelia]

Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care".

Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind.

Why don't Republicans?

"Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills."

Appears not. From what I read the study which determined that actually said that the majority of bankruptcies were "medical bankruptcies" but that there didn't need to be any outstanding medical bills for the bankruptcy to be labelled a "medical bankruptcy". All they had to have done was to miss work for two weeks due to illness or injury. Could even have been a Medicare or Medicaid participant but if they missed work because they were ill, that was all it took for the people running the study to call it a medical bankruptcy.


"Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind."

It's pretty widely believed that preventative medicine doesn't lower costs. It surely saves some lives, but it does not lower costs. Widespread use of advanced medical tests when no symptoms are present and the person isn't in a high risk category is very expensive.


"The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care"."

See The Professor's response above.

 

[william the wie]

Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care".

Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind.

Why don't Republicans?

"Number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills."

Appears not. From what I read the study which determined that actually said that the majority of bankruptcies were "medical bankruptcies" but that there didn't need to be any outstanding medical bills for the bankruptcy to be labelled a "medical bankruptcy". All they had to have done was to miss work for two weeks due to illness or injury. Could even have been a Medicare or Medicaid participant but if they missed work because they were ill, that was all it took for the people running the study to call it a medical bankruptcy.


"Even the most stupid of the stupid understands that preventative medicine is the cheapest kind."

It's pretty widely believed that preventative medicine doesn't lower costs. It surely saves some lives, but it does not lower costs. Widespread use of advanced medical tests when no symptoms are present and the person isn't in a high risk category is very expensive.


"The country is going bankrupt because people use the emergency room as "primary health care"."

See The Professor's response above.

That runs up against ER closures due to the loss of hospital subsidies.

 

[Katzndogz]

Immigrants, primarily hispanic immigrants use hospital ER rooms as primary care providers. Americans pretty much make an appointment at the doctor or at least a clinic some of which are free clinics. Immigrants either do not understand the concept of appointment or just reject the whole idea.

 

[william the wie]

Immigrants, primarily hispanic immigrants use hospital ER rooms as primary care providers. Americans pretty much make an appointment at the doctor or at least a clinic some of which are free clinics. Immigrants either do not understand the concept of appointment or just reject the whole idea.

With no or limited ERs to go to and no Ocare self deportation will be fast.