Women want to be treated equally.....

[WinterBorn]

Since the actual topic, before being derailled, was about equality and not the death penalty, here is a simple reply to using Susan Smith as a singular example. David Berkowitz murdered 6 people (more than Susan Smith) and was not given the death penalty. So equality does not seem to be the issue.

The OP seemed sure that the protests of the execution of the woman in GA was because she was a woman. But when it was pointed out that every execution in the US is protested, he tried to derail his own thread.

Do you know why David Berkowitz didn't get the death penalty? The reason has nothing to do with equality so a comparison with Susan Smith is a moot point. When you figure it out, you may understand why you can't compare the two.

Oh I know why. But it balances the gender claim. Any evidence that Susan Smith was not executed solely because she is a woman?

Wrong. Has nothing to do with gender.

Then it doesn't apply to this topic at all.

You brought up David Berkowitz and said he wasn't given the death penalty. The reason he wasn't has nothing to do with gender but everything to do with why you're a dumbass for even using him as an example. You're trying to compare something that can't be compared on any level.

Try researching why Berkowitz didn't get the death penalty or continue to look like a dumbass. Your choice.

As I said, I know why he wasn't given the death penalty. The death penalty was not reinstated until 1979. But since you have no evidence that the sole reason Susan Smith didn't get it was because of her gender (and you have even said that it has nothing to do with gender) it still works.

 

[WinterBorn]

Except the judge and jury were there every day.

How do them being there every day change the facts of what she admitted to doing. There is no question whether or not she did it. There is also no question that your opposition to the death penalty has nothing to do with whether or not we know without a doubt the person did it as you implied earlier. You simply don't like the death penalty and will come up with any excuse to not support it even in the clearest of cases.

I don't care if you have a different opinion just be honest enough to admit it.

How does not being there every day change the facts?? You made the claim "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Unless you were there every day, you obviously didn't hear everything the jury heard.

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

 

[Meathead]

How do them being there every day change the facts of what she admitted to doing. There is no question whether or not she did it. There is also no question that your opposition to the death penalty has nothing to do with whether or not we know without a doubt the person did it as you implied earlier. You simply don't like the death penalty and will come up with any excuse to not support it even in the clearest of cases.

I don't care if you have a different opinion just be honest enough to admit it.

How does not being there every day change the facts?? You made the claim "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Unless you were there every day, you obviously didn't hear everything the jury heard.

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

You've slithered all over the place, and yet you can't tell me why a death row prisoner was able to kill a prison guard, or why you were amused by it.
That is seriously sick stuff. The condemned should be spared for the chance to kill again?!

 

[WinterBorn]

How does not being there every day change the facts?? You made the claim "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Unless you were there every day, you obviously didn't hear everything the jury heard.

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

You've slithered all over the place, and yet you can't tell me why a death row prisoner was able to kill a prison guard, or why you were amused by it.
That is seriously sick stuff. The condemned should be spared for the chance to kill again?!

I never said I was amused by it.

And its funny that you make such a huge issue out of your lie about what I actually said, but when Anathema talks about it being ok to execute people for not having an alibi, you don't say a word.

Keep trying. Maybe someone with your reading skills will agree with you. But that doesn't change the facts of what I said.

As for why the death row inmate was able to kill a guard, that would be up to the prison to explain. Why was the inmate able to hide a weapon. Why was the guard so vulnerable?

 

[Conservative65]

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

You've slithered all over the place, and yet you can't tell me why a death row prisoner was able to kill a prison guard, or why you were amused by it.
That is seriously sick stuff. The condemned should be spared for the chance to kill again?!

I never said I was amused by it.

And its funny that you make such a huge issue out of your lie about what I actually said, but when Anathema talks about it being ok to execute people for not having an alibi, you don't say a word.

Keep trying. Maybe someone with your reading skills will agree with you. But that doesn't change the facts of what I said.

As for why the death row inmate was able to kill a guard, that would be up to the prison to explain. Why was the inmate able to hide a weapon. Why was the guard so vulnerable?

People like you say the death penalty isn't a deterrent. Apparently life in prison isn't any better.

 

[Conservative65]

How does not being there every day change the facts?? You made the claim "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Unless you were there every day, you obviously didn't hear everything the jury heard.

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

You've slithered all over the place, and yet you can't tell me why a death row prisoner was able to kill a prison guard, or why you were amused by it.
That is seriously sick stuff. The condemned should be spared for the chance to kill again?!

I read his response to your question and it was full of excuses that blamed anyone except the ones that did the killing.

 

[Conservative65]

How do them being there every day change the facts of what she admitted to doing. There is no question whether or not she did it. There is also no question that your opposition to the death penalty has nothing to do with whether or not we know without a doubt the person did it as you implied earlier. You simply don't like the death penalty and will come up with any excuse to not support it even in the clearest of cases.

I don't care if you have a different opinion just be honest enough to admit it.

How does not being there every day change the facts?? You made the claim "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Unless you were there every day, you obviously didn't hear everything the jury heard.

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

Since you don't know what type of training I have, that statement holds as much water as any other you made.

You brought up her mental status. If you now say you don't know, bringing it up isn't worth the time it took you to mention it.

Still full of excuses for her. I don't give a shit about her two suicide attempts. I do care about the kids she killed and that people like you continue to make excuses for her as to why she did it.

 

[WinterBorn]

How does not being there every day change the facts?? You made the claim "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Unless you were there every day, you obviously didn't hear everything the jury heard.

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

Since you don't know what type of training I have, that statement holds as much water as any other you made.

You brought up her mental status. If you now say you don't know, bringing it up isn't worth the time it took you to mention it.

Still full of excuses for her. I don't give a shit about her two suicide attempts. I do care about the kids she killed and that people like you continue to make excuses for her as to why she did it.

I never made a single excuse for her. You claimed the only reason she didn't get the death penalty was because she is a woman. Of course, that was before you said gender had nothing to do with it. I brought up her mental illness because it was brought up at her trial. And that is more likely to be a reason she didn't get the death penalty than is her gender. And since you later said her gender had nothing to do with anything, you likely agree that her mental health was why the judge & jury did not send her to be executed.

 

[WinterBorn]

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

You've slithered all over the place, and yet you can't tell me why a death row prisoner was able to kill a prison guard, or why you were amused by it.
That is seriously sick stuff. The condemned should be spared for the chance to kill again?!

I read his response to your question and it was full of excuses that blamed anyone except the ones that did the killing.

Please show me one excuse I made for anyone killing anyone? I did bring up Susan Smith's mental health as a likely reason that the jury didn't give her the death penalty. But that is not making an excuse for anyone.

Please show me where I made any excuses for someone killing someone.

 

[Conservative65]

I didn't have to hear everything to know she was guilty of 1st degree murder and that warrants the death penalty. You heard none of it yet you made the determination that she had mental problems. On what do you base that claim?

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

Since you don't know what type of training I have, that statement holds as much water as any other you made.

You brought up her mental status. If you now say you don't know, bringing it up isn't worth the time it took you to mention it.

Still full of excuses for her. I don't give a shit about her two suicide attempts. I do care about the kids she killed and that people like you continue to make excuses for her as to why she did it.

I never made a single excuse for her. You claimed the only reason she didn't get the death penalty was because she is a woman. Of course, that was before you said gender had nothing to do with it. I brought up her mental illness because it was brought up at her trial. And that is more likely to be a reason she didn't get the death penalty than is her gender. And since you later said her gender had nothing to do with anything, you likely agree that her mental health was why the judge & jury did not send her to be executed.

I said gender had nothing to do with David Berkowitz didn't get it.

Do you have ANY knowledge of what happened during the trial other than what you read or saw on TV. Since you don't and I do, my perspective is on a much higher level than yours. While mine may not be all, it's still more than your NONE.

If you use mental illness as your reasoning, that's called an excuse.

 

[Conservative65]

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

You've slithered all over the place, and yet you can't tell me why a death row prisoner was able to kill a prison guard, or why you were amused by it.
That is seriously sick stuff. The condemned should be spared for the chance to kill again?!

I read his response to your question and it was full of excuses that blamed anyone except the ones that did the killing.

Please show me one excuse I made for anyone killing anyone? I did bring up Susan Smith's mental health as a likely reason that the jury didn't give her the death penalty. But that is not making an excuse for anyone.

Please show me where I made any excuses for someone killing someone.

You made excuses, specifically mental issues, as to why she shouldn't have been executed. When you say she did this, but . . (fill in the blank), it's called an excuse.

 

[WinterBorn]

First you said "Those of us who attended it heard what the jury heard". Now you say you didn't need to hear it all?

The jury and the judge did not give her the death penalty. You were not there every day and did not hear what they heard.

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

Since you don't know what type of training I have, that statement holds as much water as any other you made.

You brought up her mental status. If you now say you don't know, bringing it up isn't worth the time it took you to mention it.

Still full of excuses for her. I don't give a shit about her two suicide attempts. I do care about the kids she killed and that people like you continue to make excuses for her as to why she did it.

I never made a single excuse for her. You claimed the only reason she didn't get the death penalty was because she is a woman. Of course, that was before you said gender had nothing to do with it. I brought up her mental illness because it was brought up at her trial. And that is more likely to be a reason she didn't get the death penalty than is her gender. And since you later said her gender had nothing to do with anything, you likely agree that her mental health was why the judge & jury did not send her to be executed.

I said gender had nothing to do with David Berkowitz didn't get it.

Do you have ANY knowledge of what happened during the trial other than what you read or saw on TV. Since you don't and I do, my perspective is on a much higher level than yours. While mine may not be all, it's still more than your NONE.

If you use mental illness as your reasoning, that's called an excuse.

I didn't use it as any sort of reasoning. But the judge and jury probably did. That was widely reported, and is still stated in articles about her.

The Wikipedia page on her includes: "The case gained worldwide attention shortly after it developed, due to her claim that a black man carjacked her and kidnapped them. Her defense attorneys, including Judy Clarke presented expert testimony that she suffered from mental health issues that impaired her judgment when she committed the crimes.".

The defense presented expert testimony that she was mentally ill. That did not exonerate her. But it is probably why she didn't get the death penalty.

I have made no judgements on it. I have argued, repeatedly, about what probably caused the jury to rule the way they did. And Susan Smith will spend the rest of her life in prison. Which works for me.

The fact that you have repeatedly tried to claim what I said or what I meant shows your own ignorance, not mine.

 

[WinterBorn]

You left out the part that I don't have to hear it all in order to know what the guilty person admitted to doing.

You weren't there at all and have determined she was mentally ill. Seems you claim to know more than I do and have less involvement in what happened. That's arrogant you bastard.

No, you claimed you heard what the jury heard. You obviously did not hear what the jury heard, if you were not there every day.

As for Susan Smith's mental state being an excuse, I am happy you have the necessary training to make that determination. Oh wait, you don't. But perhaps the expert testimony and the two suicide attempts prior to her getting married and having children might be a clue?

As for my arrogance, at least I am not claiming to have heard what the jury heard, despite not being there every day. And I am not claiming to know Susan Smith's mental state, as you have done.

You've slithered all over the place, and yet you can't tell me why a death row prisoner was able to kill a prison guard, or why you were amused by it.
That is seriously sick stuff. The condemned should be spared for the chance to kill again?!

I read his response to your question and it was full of excuses that blamed anyone except the ones that did the killing.

Please show me one excuse I made for anyone killing anyone? I did bring up Susan Smith's mental health as a likely reason that the jury didn't give her the death penalty. But that is not making an excuse for anyone.

Please show me where I made any excuses for someone killing someone.

You made excuses, specifically mental issues, as to why she shouldn't have been executed. When you say she did this, but . . (fill in the blank), it's called an excuse.

Did I say that? Or did I say that the judge and jury heard testimony about her mental illness, and that is likely the reason she was not executed?

 

[Anathema]

So go ahead and execute anyone without an alibi or who can't afford a good lawyer? lol That is one of the worst things I have seen posted here.

Execute ALL felons and violent criminals. They have no place in society or being a burden on society. The Guilty should have no Rights. Pure and simple.

 

[WinterBorn]

So go ahead and execute anyone without an alibi or who can't afford a good lawyer? lol That is one of the worst things I have seen posted here.

Execute ALL felons and violent criminals. They have no place in society or being a burden on society. The Guilty should have no Rights. Pure and simple.

And those wrongly convicted? Execute them too?

 

[Anathema]

]And those wrongly convicted? Execute them too?

They're acceptable collateral damage to make sure the guilty face proper punishment. Don't be in bad places and your chances of being wrongly charged with anything are very small.

 

[WinterBorn]

]And those wrongly convicted? Execute them too?

They're acceptable collateral damage to make sure the guilty face proper punishment. Don't be in bad places and your chances of being wrongly charged with anything are very small.

Your brand of justice went out with the Spanish Inquisition. Just because you are a miserable old bastard doesn't change the reality of our world.

And luckily, you don't have a say in it.

 

[Anathema]

Your brand of justice went out with the Spanish Inquisition. Just because you are a miserable old bastard doesn't change the reality of our world.

And luckily, you don't have a say in it.

....And see how far society has fallen since then.

I will say this.... Anyone who wronfs me better hope thr "Justice" (lol) system does its job because if not, I WILL get REAL Justice.

 

[WinterBorn]

Your brand of justice went out with the Spanish Inquisition. Just because you are a miserable old bastard doesn't change the reality of our world.

And luckily, you don't have a say in it.

....And see how far society has fallen since then.

I will say this.... Anyone who wronfs me better hope thr "Justice" (lol) system does its job because if not, I WILL get REAL Justice.

Society has not fallen far enough to justify executing people for being in the wrong place or for not having an alibi.

I am sure all your neighbors are scared. The rest of us, not so much.

 

[Anathema]

Society has not fallen far enough to justify executing people for being in the wrong place or for not having an alibi.

I am sure all your neighbors are scared. The rest of us, not so much.

Society has fallen far enough to justify far morethan just the execution of convicts; but that's a topic for another place and time.

My neighbors actually enjoy having me around most of the time. I'm the only guy in the eight condos in my building. I'm handy to have around most of the time and generally limit my outbursts of rage to short bursts of screaming and breaking stuff.