Zionism and Nazism: is there a difference that makes a difference?

[Marc39]

Ah, the topic was the 1948 war.

The '48 war initiated by the Arabs.

Those countries went into Palestine to defend them from the foreigners.

Except, Palestine did not exist to Arabs. D'oh!

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...

For Arabs, the term Palestine was unacceptable. For Muslims it was alien and irrelevant. The main objection for them was that it seemed to assert a separate entity which politically conscious Arabs in Palestine and elsewhere denied. For them there was no such thing as a country called Palestine. The region which the British called Palestine was merely a separated part of a larger whole [Syria]. For a long time organized and articulate Arab political opinion was virtually unanimous on this point.

 

[Marc39]

Ah, the topic was the 1948 war.

The '48 war initiated by the Arabs.

Those countries went into Palestine to defend them from the foreigners.

Jews are the original Palestinians. The Romans renamed Judea, the correct historical name of the land, "Palaestina" 1500 years after Jews lived on the land and 500 years before Arabs lived there.

Ooops.

 

[daveman]

The Parties to the present Agreement, responding to the Security Council resolution of 16 November 1948 calling upon them, as a further provisional measure under Article 40 of the Charter of the United Nations and in order to facilitate the transition from the present truce to permanent peace in Palestine, to negotiate an Armistice; having decided to enter into negotiations under United Nations Chairmanship concerning the implementation of the Security Council resolutions of 4 and 16 November 1948; (2) and having appointed representatives empowered to negotiate and conclude an Armistice Agreement;

The Avalon Project : Egyptian-Israeli General Armistice Agreement, February 24, 1949

The Security Council,

Having decided on 15 July 1948 that, subject to further decision by the Security Council or the General Assembly, the truce shall remain in force is accordance with resolution 54 (1948) of that date and with resolution 50 (1948) of 29 May 1948 Unto a peaceful adjustment of the future situation of Palestine is reached,

The Avalon Project : United Nations Security Council Resolution 61; November 4, 1948

There was no surrender. None of those countries lost any land.

So they didn't lose?

I was at Cairo West AB in Egypt in 1995. I saw buildings that had been destroyed by the IAF in 1967 during the Six-Day War.


And what happened on the ground?


As a result of the war:

By June 10, Israel had completed its last offensive, the one in the Golan Heights. On the following day, a cease-fire was signed. Israel had seized the Gaza Strip, the Sinai Peninsula, the West Bank of the Jordan River(including East Jerusalem), and the Golan Heights. Overall, Israel's territory grew by a factor of 4, including about one million Arabs placed under Israel's direct control in the newly captured territories. Israel's strategic depth grew to at least 300 kilometers in the south, 60 kilometers in the east and 20 kilometers of extremely rugged terrain in the north, a security asset that would prove useful in the 1973 Arab-Israeli War six years later.

History itself proves you wrong.

Ah, the topic was the 1948 war.

And now it's the 1967 war, wherein Israel kicked the Arab world's ass and gained territory.

I know you really don't want to acknowledge this, but too damn bad.

 

[daveman]

You're confusing two different wars.
One in 1948 and the other in 1967.

You useful idiots never want to discuss the '67 war. Why is that?

I also couldn't help noticing you left out one event of 8 June 1967?

Your flailing, pathetic attempt at deflection is noted and dismissed.

Besides, you hate America. Why do you give a shit about the Liberty?

 

[P F Tinmore]

The '48 war initiated by the Arabs.

Those countries went into Palestine to defend them from the foreigners.

Except, Palestine did not exist to Arabs. D'oh!

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...

For Arabs, the term Palestine was unacceptable. For Muslims it was alien and irrelevant. The main objection for them was that it seemed to assert a separate entity which politically conscious Arabs in Palestine and elsewhere denied. For them there was no such thing as a country called Palestine. The region which the British called Palestine was merely a separated part of a larger whole [Syria]. For a long time organized and articulate Arab political opinion was virtually unanimous on this point.

It was still their country no matter what it was called.

 

[Marc39]

Those countries went into Palestine to defend them from the foreigners.

Except, Palestine did not exist to Arabs. D'oh!

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...

For Arabs, the term Palestine was unacceptable. For Muslims it was alien and irrelevant. The main objection for them was that it seemed to assert a separate entity which politically conscious Arabs in Palestine and elsewhere denied. For them there was no such thing as a country called Palestine. The region which the British called Palestine was merely a separated part of a larger whole [Syria]. For a long time organized and articulate Arab political opinion was virtually unanimous on this point.

It was still their country no matter what it was called.

Except, Jews lived in "Palestine" 2000 years before Muslims, who originated from Arabia.

Facts for you are inconveneint things, right?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Except, Palestine did not exist to Arabs. D'oh!

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...

It was still their country no matter what it was called.

Except, Jews lived in "Palestine" 2000 years before Muslims, who originated from Arabia.

Facts for you are inconveneint things, right?

Are all those blond, blue eyed Palestinians Arabs?

 

[Marc39]

It was still their country no matter what it was called.

Except, Jews lived in "Palestine" 2000 years before Muslims, who originated from Arabia.

Facts for you are inconveneint things, right?

Are all those blond, blue eyed Palestinians Arabs?

Are all those Arabs with surnames al-Masri (The Egyptian) and Maghrebi (Maghreb, Africa) Palestinians?

 

[Marc39]

It was still their country no matter what it was called.

Except, Jews lived in "Palestine" 2000 years before Muslims, who originated from Arabia.

Facts for you are inconveneint things, right?

Are all those blond, blue eyed Palestinians Arabs?

Palestinians are Arabs. They even speak Arabic.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Except, Jews lived in "Palestine" 2000 years before Muslims, who originated from Arabia.

Facts for you are inconveneint things, right?

Are all those blond, blue eyed Palestinians Arabs?

Palestinians are Arabs. They even speak Arabic.

Are all Americans English? That is the language we speak.

 

[Marc39]

Are all those blond, blue eyed Palestinians Arabs?

Palestinians are Arabs. They even speak Arabic.

Are all Americans English? That is the language we speak.

All Pallies are Arab, though, Arabs didn't call themselves Pallies until 1967.

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...

The Palestinian Arabs' basic sense of corporate historic identity was, at different levels, Muslim or Arab or -- for some -- Syrian; it is significant that even by the end of the Mandate in 1948, after 30 years of separate Palestinian political existence, there were virtually no books in Arabic on the history of Palestine.

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Middle-East-Bernard-Lewis/dp/0684832801/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1288529772&sr=8-5]Amazon.com: The Middle East (9780684832807): Bernard Lewis: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]

 

[P F Tinmore]

Palestinians are Arabs. They even speak Arabic.

Are all Americans English? That is the language we speak.

All Pallies are Arab, though, Arabs didn't call themselves Pallies until 1967.

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...

The Palestinian Arabs' basic sense of corporate historic identity was, at different levels, Muslim or Arab or -- for some -- Syrian; it is significant that even by the end of the Mandate in 1948, after 30 years of separate Palestinian political existence, there were virtually no books in Arabic on the history of Palestine.

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Middle-East-Bernard-Lewis/dp/0684832801/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1288529772&sr=8-5]Amazon.com: The Middle East (9780684832807): Bernard Lewis: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]

So?

 

[Marc39]

Are all Americans English? That is the language we speak.

All Pallies are Arab, though, Arabs didn't call themselves Pallies until 1967.

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...

The Palestinian Arabs' basic sense of corporate historic identity was, at different levels, Muslim or Arab or -- for some -- Syrian; it is significant that even by the end of the Mandate in 1948, after 30 years of separate Palestinian political existence, there were virtually no books in Arabic on the history of Palestine.

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Middle-East-Bernard-Lewis/dp/0684832801/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1288529772&sr=8-5]Amazon.com: The Middle East (9780684832807): Bernard Lewis: Books: Reviews, Prices & more[/ame]

So?

So, you're clueless about the subject matter. For this reason, you have zero reputational points and described as a troll

 

[P F Tinmore]

All Pallies are Arab, though, Arabs didn't call themselves Pallies until 1967.

Middle East historian Bernard Lewis...

Amazon.com: The Middle East (9780684832807): Bernard Lewis: Books: Reviews, Prices & more

So?

So, you're clueless about the subject matter. For this reason, you have zero reputational points and described as a troll

You play the name game like it actually means something.

 

[Marc39]

So?

So, you're clueless about the subject matter. For this reason, you have zero reputational points and described as a troll

You play the name game like it actually means something.

Your own page here says you're a troll. That makes me guilty of feeding a troll. Guilty, as charged.

 

[MelissaD]

So palestine was deserted land before 1948?

 

[Marc39]

So palestine was deserted land before 1948?

The Palestine that doesn't exist, hun? You believe in Never Never Land, too, hun?

Former PLO Leader Zuheir Mohsen...

The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism.

Zuheir Mohsen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Arab American Journalist Joe Farah...

There is no language known as Palestinian. There is no distinct Palestinian culture. There has never been a land known as Palestine governed by Palestinians. Palestinians are Arabs, indistinguishable from Jordanians (another recent invention), Syrians, Lebanese, Iraqis, etc. Keep in mind that the Arabs control 99.9 percent of the Middle East lands. Israel represents one-tenth of 1 percent of the landmass.

Palestine has never existed -- before or since -- as an autonomous entity. It was ruled alternately by Rome, by Islamic and Christian crusaders, by the Ottoman Empire and, briefly, by the British after World War I. The British agreed to restore at least part of the land to the Jewish people as their homeland.

Myths of the Middle East


Arab Commentator Azmi Bishara...

Well, I dont think there is a Palestinian nation at all. I think there is an Arab nation. I always thought so and I did not change my mind. I do not think there is a Palestinian nation, I think its a colonialist invention - Palestinian nation. When were there any Palestinians? Where did it come from? I think there is an Arab nation. I never turned to be a Palestinian nationalist, despite of my decisive struggle against the occupation. I think that until the end of the 19th century, Palestine was the south of Greater Syria.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3n5-yG-6dU[/ame]

 

[MelissaD]

ok troll, then was the land that israel sits on deserted land before 1948?

 

[Marc39]

ok troll, then was the land that israel sits on deserted land before 1948?

That would be Israel, hun. Jews own Israel.

Get it, now, hun?

 

[MelissaD]

ok troll, then was the land that israel sits on deserted land before 1948?

That would be Israel, hun. Jews own Israel.

Get it, now, hun?

So you're too embarassed to admit that people lived there before 1948. Check.

You know, you're not a very positive voice for israel, so you're not helping things. Maybe you should consider shutting the fuck up?