12 Dead in Mass Shooting at So.Cal Bar

[Asclepias]

California mass shooting gunman identified

"The suspect behind America’s latest mass shooting has been identified as Ian David Long, who law enforcement officials have accused of killing at least 12 people inside the Borderline Bar & Grill in California.

The gunman, identified by NBC News as a heavily-tattooed, 28-year-old white male, used a .45 caliber handgun and was found dead after storming the bar that’s commonly frequented by country music fans on Wednesday nights. Details surrounding the suspect began flooding in from neighbours who told ABC News he was a veteran who may have suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Police said he was an ex-Marine who had multiple run-ins with law enforcement in recent years and likely shot himself Wednesday night in the bar."

Now we have a little more information about the shooter, not much information about what lead him to do it -- seems at this point it is mental illness -- I have also seen others speculate that since he was wearing black and targeted country music fans -- he may be ANTIFA..

He could be part of any group; it won’t matter. There will be another slaughter in the next few weeks. Just move along.

Meanwhile.....we won't have to wait for the lives saved by Americans with guns..on average, Americans use their legal guns to stop rapes, robberies and murders 1.1 million times a year...according to the Centers for Disease Control resear4ch.....or, if you prefer, 1.5 million times a year according to the Department of Justice Research..


Lives saved...every single day.

Jesus Christ! Who told you about this thread?

 

[2aguy]

He could be part of any group; it won’t matter. There will be another slaughter in the next few weeks. Just move along.

Agreed. It's nobody's fault be his. No need for senseless partisan mud slinging.

No need for anything at all. Get more guns into circulation until massacres happen often enough that nobody even bothers reporting about them.

Moron.....gun murder goes down when more Americans own and carry guns....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 17.25 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2018...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

 

[buttercup]

Of course he shot himself. How convenient. And of course he was known to the authorities. They all are.

 

[MrShangles]

Doesn’t California have the best gun laws?

This couldn’t have happened in California because liberals have made California a perfect state.

It is Nevada and Arizona fault... Wait, it is Trump fault... Wait, it is Bush jr. fault... Wait, is Hitler allow?

You forgot the AR-15


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[Bruce_T_Laney]

11:15 p.m. last night. Twelve dead, and they are still counting. Dead include the gunman, who went into a local Country-Western bar & grill having it's weekly College Night and began by shooting the security guard and cashier, then entered and began spraying bullets at college students with his rapid fire gun. Twelve dead include one of the first deputies on the scene.

Thousand Oaks is considered one of the safest communities in the country. Just like Parkland was.

People, it is time we stopped talking and started doing something about this. It is beyond ridiculous that we are no longer safe to go grocery shopping, pray in our church, go to yoga class, or to a bar to dance. Or to work. Or to school.

Something has to be done to stop this. Not just talk this time. It is time to actually do something. January approaches. Make sure your legislators know what you think will help make this country SAFE AGAIN.

California has some of the strictest gun laws, so what do you propose that can fix the issue?

We could do it, but not overnight, if we focused on severely limiting the violence in our entertainment and teaching kids from the time they can hit that killing other humans is the lowest thing you can do, including screwing your sister (in other words, taboo).

I don't think somebody screwing their sister was the root cause the shooting last night.

Well, that's one thing off the list.

And yet that is your first damn thought!

 

[BlackFlag]

California mass shooting gunman identified

"The suspect behind America’s latest mass shooting has been identified as Ian David Long, who law enforcement officials have accused of killing at least 12 people inside the Borderline Bar & Grill in California.

The gunman, identified by NBC News as a heavily-tattooed, 28-year-old white male, used a .45 caliber handgun and was found dead after storming the bar that’s commonly frequented by country music fans on Wednesday nights. Details surrounding the suspect began flooding in from neighbours who told ABC News he was a veteran who may have suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Police said he was an ex-Marine who had multiple run-ins with law enforcement in recent years and likely shot himself Wednesday night in the bar."

Now we have a little more information about the shooter, not much information about what lead him to do it -- seems at this point it is mental illness -- I have also seen others speculate that since he was wearing black and targeted country music fans -- he may be ANTIFA..

He could be part of any group; it won’t matter. There will be another slaughter in the next few weeks. Just move along.

Meanwhile.....we won't have to wait for the lives saved by Americans with guns..on average, Americans use their legal guns to stop rapes, robberies and murders 1.1 million times a year...according to the Centers for Disease Control resear4ch.....or, if you prefer, 1.5 million times a year according to the Department of Justice Research..


Lives saved...every single day.

You should just go hand out guns to criminals and aspiring murderers. It’s more efficient for your goals than just working to flood the streets with them.

 

[bodecea]

So youd rather have fun instead of stopping white men from killing crowds of innocent people. Figures.

Why is it a big deal? Every weekend in Chicago black dudes shoot more then 11 black dudes every weekend.

2nd Amendment solutions....but why focus only on Chicago?

Lots of scary Black people live there of course.

Oh....is that why they are fixated on Chicago?

Look at you saying black on black violence is no big deal. Typical honky.

Oh...I said that? Where? Or are you just lying like most deplorable trumpanzees do so glibly?

 

[JimH52]

PTSD is real and sad. Our vets need help. Those poor victims. Should never have happened.

The frustrating thing is -- how do we improve it?

Vets that come back from overseas need to have consistent medical tests and their guns must be taken away until they are given a 100% bill of health. If they show ANY signs of PTSD they should immediately be placed under medical care, medications monitored and GUNS TAKEN AWAY!!!

How very liberal gun-grabber of you!

I am neither a liberal nor a gun grabber. Those who have a mental illness should not own guns. PTSD is a mental illness.

Well, when the president himself shows signs of mental illness....good luck...

Trump Undid Obama Rule That Added Mentally Ill People to Gun Check Register

 

[bodecea]

He could be part of any group; it won’t matter. There will be another slaughter in the next few weeks. Just move along.

Agreed. It's nobody's fault be his. No need for senseless partisan mud slinging.

No need for anything at all. Get more guns into circulation until massacres happen often enough that nobody even bothers reporting about them.

That's where we are heading, you know.

 

[BlackFlag]

He could be part of any group; it won’t matter. There will be another slaughter in the next few weeks. Just move along.

Agreed. It's nobody's fault be his. No need for senseless partisan mud slinging.

No need for anything at all. Get more guns into circulation until massacres happen often enough that nobody even bothers reporting about them.

Moron.....gun murder goes down when more Americans own and carry guns....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 17.25 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2018...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

Guns in fewer households since then

Of course, with over 400 million guns in the country, it is easier for a criminal to get a gun here than anywhere in the world.

 

[2aguy]

California mass shooting gunman identified

"The suspect behind America’s latest mass shooting has been identified as Ian David Long, who law enforcement officials have accused of killing at least 12 people inside the Borderline Bar & Grill in California.

The gunman, identified by NBC News as a heavily-tattooed, 28-year-old white male, used a .45 caliber handgun and was found dead after storming the bar that’s commonly frequented by country music fans on Wednesday nights. Details surrounding the suspect began flooding in from neighbours who told ABC News he was a veteran who may have suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Police said he was an ex-Marine who had multiple run-ins with law enforcement in recent years and likely shot himself Wednesday night in the bar."

Now we have a little more information about the shooter, not much information about what lead him to do it -- seems at this point it is mental illness -- I have also seen others speculate that since he was wearing black and targeted country music fans -- he may be ANTIFA..

Or he may be a republican thinking the club was filled with Jews.
You know how violent Republicans are. Just listen to what Trump says.

Interesting that the synagogue shooter only shared the viewpoints of democrats...since they too hate Trump, which he did, and the democrat party hates Isreal, which he did....the other shooters...the bernie sanders supporter who shot up the republican baseball team, and the black lives matter shooters who have murdered at least 9 police officers...not one Republican in the mix.....

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

I was talking about a metal detector being a solution at bars.

Or how about we actually treat mental illness

You obviously haven't read the thread. That's okay. It was someone else's idea. I am 100% behind the obvious solution of treating mental illness and making it harder for a mentally ill person with homicidal ideation to keep wandering the community unsupervised and untreated, as is his "right."
I feel for veterans who come home torn up psychologically. A lot of people go into the service for the career and educational opportunities they offer, and some just to get a JOB.

No "right" exists without responsibility on the part of the holder. The irresponsible do not have rights. The responsible have the obligation of aiding the irresponsible, as well as the 'right' to protect themselves form irresponsible acts.

Show me the actual legislation and the votes for it. I can show you where Dem judges prefer to release the mentally ill, rather than get them in hospital help.

Don’t go there, Old Lady. It is a problem, both left and right. Trying to blame one side is ridiculous. I could just as easily state that the lefts policies are responsible, but won’t, because it is a problem with all govt.

Our Sheriff calls our local jail the detox center. And it is. When I was in social work, the waiting list for a substance abuse counselor was months long. The wait to become a suboxone patient was months long, as well. I hope that has gotten better, but it isn't likely with all the cuts to mental health funding that have been enacted by the Republicans over the past eight years here. Fortunately, we just did a clean sweep and got them outta here.

Sadly, it was our Republican governor and legislature (in OUR state) that made sure health benefits were cut.

The problem is not just funding, I know. Back to the specific case, as a vet he hopefully had help available if he chose to use it. If less than a year ago he was in a crisis and his guns were not temporarily taken, there is something wrong. Guns and mental health crises do not go together.

Stupid Liberals don't think that guns and Liberty do not go together, do they? Our Founding Fathers did but modern day idiot Liberals don't think so.

I am Liberal and she is Progressive.

I for one do not believe more gun laws will prevent retards from killing people, but progressives like Old Lady believe that one more law will stop the criminal and yet it never does.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

PTSD is real and sad. Our vets need help. Those poor victims. Should never have happened.

The frustrating thing is -- how do we improve it?

Vets that come back from overseas need to have consistent medical tests and their guns must be taken away until they are given a 100% bill of health. If they show ANY signs of PTSD they should immediately be placed under medical care, medications monitored and GUNS TAKEN AWAY!!!

How very liberal gun-grabber of you!

I am neither a liberal nor a gun grabber. Those who have a mental illness should not own guns. PTSD is a mental illness.

Well, when the president himself shows signs of mental illness....good luck...

Trump Undid Obama Rule That Added Mentally Ill People to Gun Check Register

Is he walking around with guns? What are you talking about? He is actually always surrounded by those who are well trained in using guns. Are you mentally ill too?

 

[BlackFlag]

He could be part of any group; it won’t matter. There will be another slaughter in the next few weeks. Just move along.

Agreed. It's nobody's fault be his. No need for senseless partisan mud slinging.

No need for anything at all. Get more guns into circulation until massacres happen often enough that nobody even bothers reporting about them.

That's where we are heading, you know.

Yes. At least it will stop conservatives from villifying and going after the families of gun slaughter victims.

 

[2aguy]

He could be part of any group; it won’t matter. There will be another slaughter in the next few weeks. Just move along.

Agreed. It's nobody's fault be his. No need for senseless partisan mud slinging.

No need for anything at all. Get more guns into circulation until massacres happen often enough that nobody even bothers reporting about them.

Moron.....gun murder goes down when more Americans own and carry guns....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 17.25 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2018...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

Guns in fewer households since then

Of course, with over 400 million guns in the country, it is easier for a criminal to get a gun here than anywhere in the world.

Not true.....

NBC Poll: Does Gun Ownership Increase Or Decrease Safety? Anti-Gun Activists Won't Like The Results.

nearly 6 in 10 Americans believe that getting guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens increases safety.

"In the poll, 58 percent agree with the statement that gun ownership does more to increase safety by allowing law-abiding citizens to protect themselves," NBC News reports. "By contrast, 38 percent say that gun ownership reduces safety by giving too many people access to firearms, increasing the chances for accidental misuse."

------

NBC notes that the overall result is a "reversal" of the findings of a 1999 survey that found that 52 percent of respondents believed gun ownership reduced safety. The more positive perspective on gun ownership is partly reflected in gun ownership trends: "47 percent of American adults say they have a firearm in the household, which is up from 44 percent in 1999."

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Don’t go there, Old Lady. It is a problem, both left and right. Trying to blame one side is ridiculous. I could just as easily state that the lefts policies are responsible, but won’t, because it is a problem with all govt.

Incarcerated? Getting a mental health hold on those that are known to be a danger is next to impossible in this country. In a hospital, not a jail cell, where so many end up.

Our Sheriff calls our local jail the detox center. And it is. When I was in social work, the waiting list for a substance abuse counselor was months long. The wait to become a suboxone patient was months long, as well. I hope that has gotten better, but it isn't likely with all the cuts to mental health funding that have been enacted by the Republicans over the past eight years here. Fortunately, we just did a clean sweep and got them outta here.

Sadly, it was our Republican governor and legislature (in OUR state) that made sure health benefits were cut.

------------------------------------------------- GOOD , last thing i'd want to do is pay money to head or mental health doktors , social workers and other silly experts that speculate and guess as they waste time to stay on the gravy train and act important OldLady .

Even coming from you, that is a really stupid thing to say. And your attitude is a great example of why so many mentally ill people are walking around untreated and unsupervised.

Your state can provide the treatment needed for the mentally ill, so why has your state failed you?

Why do you believe the Federal Government should force states to do what you want but the majority do not feel they need?

 

[2aguy]

PTSD is real and sad. Our vets need help. Those poor victims. Should never have happened.

The frustrating thing is -- how do we improve it?

Vets that come back from overseas need to have consistent medical tests and their guns must be taken away until they are given a 100% bill of health. If they show ANY signs of PTSD they should immediately be placed under medical care, medications monitored and GUNS TAKEN AWAY!!!

Really? How many Vets are there in this country....and as of this shooting, how many Veterans stage mass public shootings...? Please.....we will wait for your answer.....

Smearing Veterans is typical of left wing haters......

 

[BlackFlag]

He could be part of any group; it won’t matter. There will be another slaughter in the next few weeks. Just move along.

Agreed. It's nobody's fault be his. No need for senseless partisan mud slinging.

No need for anything at all. Get more guns into circulation until massacres happen often enough that nobody even bothers reporting about them.

Moron.....gun murder goes down when more Americans own and carry guns....

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400-600 million guns in private hands and over 17.25 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2018...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%

--gun crime down 75%

--violent crime down 72%

Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

Guns in fewer households since then

Of course, with over 400 million guns in the country, it is easier for a criminal to get a gun here than anywhere in the world.

Not true.....

NBC Poll: Does Gun Ownership Increase Or Decrease Safety? Anti-Gun Activists Won't Like The Results.

nearly 6 in 10 Americans believe that getting guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens increases safety.

"In the poll, 58 percent agree with the statement that gun ownership does more to increase safety by allowing law-abiding citizens to protect themselves," NBC News reports. "By contrast, 38 percent say that gun ownership reduces safety by giving too many people access to firearms, increasing the chances for accidental misuse."

------

NBC notes that the overall result is a "reversal" of the findings of a 1999 survey that found that 52 percent of respondents believed gun ownership reduced safety. The more positive perspective on gun ownership is partly reflected in gun ownership trends: "47 percent of American adults say they have a firearm in the household, which is up from 44 percent in 1999."

Dude just go give a murderer a gun. You know you want to. You can come on here when they’re finished and demand more guns become available to him.

 

[2aguy]

PTSD is real and sad. Our vets need help. Those poor victims. Should never have happened.

The frustrating thing is -- how do we improve it?

More money into healthcare. Regan is the cause of that money disappearing.

No...he wasn't....

 

[MrShangles]

We know he wasn’t a Trump supporter, because if he was it would be everywhere by now.


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