92-2 SENATE votes for show of support for NATO before Trump touches down

[tinydancer]

Great article at this link.Pretty bloody sad and embarrasing that Greece, Poland and Estonia can meet their obligations but Germany and France can't.



"To make the principle work, all countries are expected to chip in. NATO's official guidelines say member states should spend at least 2% of their GDP on defense.

Of the 28 countries in the alliance, only five -- the U.S., Greece, Poland, Estonia and the U.K. -- meet the target.

The rest lag behind. Germany spent 1.19% of its GDP on defense last year, France forked out 1.78%.

Iceland, which doesn't have its own army, spends just 0.1% of its GDP on defense, according to the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development.

Five other countries spend less than 1%, according to NATO's estimates for this year: Canada, Slovenia, Belgium, Spain and Luxembourg."

These NATO countries are not spending their fair share on defense

 

[tinydancer]

Does anyone know what NATO means? North Atlantic Treaty Organization, did you note it has treaty in it's name? Trump is demanding member countries who are bound by the treaty, actually fulfill their obligations under the TREATY. Exactly what is controversial about that, several presidents have made the same demands, Trump is simply being more forceful, with an intention of actually getting results.

If that is what Trump was actually doing and his intent, there would be nothing wrong with it. NATO nations started paying more when Obama asked them to. But it looks like Trump is wildly lashing out with a childish temper Tantrum. For the good of the nation and the world, he needs to resign

Oh give it a break. It's not a temper tantrum at all. Trump needs to bitch slap the slackers into another galaxy.

 

[centerleftFL]

I heard it was 97 - 2. GOP Sens. Rand Paul (Ky.) and Mike Lee (Utah) voted against the measure.

Then there is one missing. We know how John would vote

Thanks!! That was actually a typo. I knew it was almost unanimous and I figured McCain didn't vote.

Shit, I don't think you could 97 of them to vote on ordering pizza for lunch these days!

Let Trump become vulnerable or a lame duck and you will see something similar

Elections have consequences, yade yada... The Nation voted Trump in as President and under the Constitution he has the authority to unilaterally (w/o Congress) leave NATO. That's good enough for me. Believe me, I lived through 8 years of far worse with Obama's pen and a phone / questionably constitutional EO's & kept myself in check. Try doing likewise!

Oh your poor child. Life was sooo bad under Obama. You have Obama PTSD? LOL

Abso - F'n - lutely I do... worse than just PTSD, I have to live with the real life consequences of his presidency as well!!!

Such a snowflake. We need less people like you in this country

Lol, I'm a passionate patriot and I would be offended if I ever got affirmation from you or your ilk, lol !

You appear more like a phony hyper patriot, than anything resembling a true patriot

Real patriots NEVER brag about it.

 

[centerleftFL]

Did y'all actually read what "support" meant? It's 'non binding' window dressing, like telling the frumpy toothless simpleton in new garb that they look very handsome or pretty today. I support NATO too... in their fulfilling their obligation to contribute their agreed upon annual GDP percentage. It hurts us NONE to walk away, it hurts them greatly not being able to take advantage of our generosity.

Non binding, yet they went PUBLIC. How many of them were REPUBLICANS again?

 

[Dale Smith]

NATO isn't shit without USA.INC's military might that was created by the fiat currency/ world's reserve currency that is the federal reserve note that was foisted on the nations that didn't want to exchange their goods and services. USA.INC's military has been the hammer and every country that has resources that they covet has been the nail. You are "small time"......

really? Kinda doubt that

I know more than you,"newbie".........

really? I'm sure you believe you do

Debate me and provide a counter point as to what I have ascertained......or STFU....it's really that fucking simple. Step up to the plate or avoid my postings and give me a wide berth. There isn't a single leftard or neocon that can go "toe to toe" with me in a debate without walking away with their cyber head on backwards because of the well deserved bitchslapping. You think that you have some "game"? Bring it on.....I am always looking for a challenge but have found that the leftists always talk big but perform small.

What say ye?????

 

[OKTexas]

Does anyone know what NATO means? North Atlantic Treaty Organization, did you note it has treaty in it's name? Trump is demanding member countries who are bound by the treaty, actually fulfill their obligations under the TREATY. Exactly what is controversial about that, several presidents have made the same demands, Trump is simply being more forceful, with an intention of actually getting results.

If that is what Trump was actually doing and his intent, there would be nothing wrong with it. NATO nations started paying more when Obama asked them to. But it looks like Trump is wildly lashing out with a childish temper Tantrum. For the good of the nation and the world, he needs to resign

Sticks and carrots, something you simple minded un-American tards don't seem to understand. Other feckless presidents have made the same demands and all they gave us was the finger. Trump doesn't play that shit. Sit back, shut up and reap the rewards.


.

 

[cnm]

It hurts us NONE to walk away, it hurts them greatly not being able to take advantage of our generosity.

What generosity? You allowing their troops to die assisting you in Afghanistan, that generosity? After all, there has been no other NATO conflict.

 

[cnm]

Trump is demanding member countries who are bound by the treaty, actually fulfill their obligations under the TREATY.

Care to point out members' treaty obligations that are not being fulfilled?

The Parties to this Treaty reaffirm their faith in the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations and their desire to live in peace with all peoples and all governments.
They are determined to safeguard the freedom, common heritage and civilisation of their peoples, founded on the principles of democracy, individual liberty and the rule of law. They seek to promote stability and well-being in the North Atlantic area.
They are resolved to unite their efforts for collective defence and for the preservation of peace and security. They therefore agree to this North Atlantic Treaty :
https://www.nato.int
Article 1
The Parties undertake, as set forth in the Charter of the United Nations, to settle any international dispute in which they may be involved by peaceful means in such a manner that international peace and security and justice are not endangered, and to refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force in any manner inconsistent with the purposes of the United Nations.

Article 2
The Parties will contribute toward the further development of peaceful and friendly international relations by strengthening their free institutions, by bringing about a better understanding of the principles upon which these institutions are founded, and by promoting conditions of stability and well-being. They will seek to eliminate conflict in their international economic policies and will encourage economic collaboration between any or all of them.

Article 3
In order more effectively to achieve the objectives of this Treaty, the Parties, separately and jointly, by means of continuous and effective self-help and mutual aid, will maintain and develop their individual and collective capacity to resist armed attack.

Article 4
The Parties will consult together whenever, in the opinion of any of them, the territorial integrity, political independence or security of any of the Parties is threatened.

Article 5
The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.

Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security .

Article 6 1
For the purpose of Article 5, an armed attack on one or more of the Parties is deemed to include an armed attack:

• on the territory of any of the Parties in Europe or North America, on the Algerian Departments of France 2, on the territory of Turkey or on the Islands under the jurisdiction of any of the Parties in the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer;
• on the forces, vessels, or aircraft of any of the Parties, when in or over these territories or any other area in Europe in which occupation forces of any of the Parties were stationed on the date when the Treaty entered into force or the Mediterranean Sea or the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer.

Article 7
This Treaty does not affect, and shall not be interpreted as affecting in any way the rights and obligations under the Charter of the Parties which are members of the United Nations, or the primary responsibility of the Security Council for the maintenance of international peace and security.

Article 8
Each Party declares that none of the international engagements now in force between it and any other of the Parties or any third State is in conflict with the provisions of this Treaty, and undertakes not to enter into any international engagement in conflict with this Treaty.

Article 9
The Parties hereby establish a Council, on which each of them shall be represented, to consider matters concerning the implementation of this Treaty. The Council shall be so organised as to be able to meet promptly at any time. The Council shall set up such subsidiary bodies as may be necessary; in particular it shall establish immediately a defence committee which shall recommend measures for the implementation of Articles 3 and 5.

Article 10
The Parties may, by unanimous agreement, invite any other European State in a position to further the principles of this Treaty and to contribute to the security of the North Atlantic area to accede to this Treaty. Any State so invited may become a Party to the Treaty by depositing its instrument of accession with the Government of the United States of America. The Government of the United States of America will inform each of the Parties of the deposit of each such instrument of accession.

Article 11
This Treaty shall be ratified and its provisions carried out by the Parties in accordance with their respective constitutional processes. The instruments of ratification shall be deposited as soon as possible with the Government of the United States of America, which will notify all the other signatories of each deposit. The Treaty shall enter into force between the States which have ratified it as soon as the ratifications of the majority of the signatories, including the ratifications of Belgium, Canada, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States, have been deposited and shall come into effect with respect to other States on the date of the deposit of their ratifications. (3)

Article 12
After the Treaty has been in force for ten years, or at any time thereafter, the Parties shall, if any of them so requests, consult together for the purpose of reviewing the Treaty, having regard for the factors then affecting peace and security in the North Atlantic area, including the development of universal as well as regional arrangements under the Charter of the United Nations for the maintenance of international peace and security.

Article 13
After the Treaty has been in force for twenty years, any Party may cease to be a Party one year after its notice of denunciation has been given to the Government of the United States of America, which will inform the Governments of the other Parties of the deposit of each notice of denunciation.

Article 14
This Treaty, of which the English and French texts are equally authentic, shall be deposited in the archives of the Government of the United States of America. Duly certified copies will be transmitted by that Government to the Governments of other signatories.​

 

[cnm]

"To make the principle work, all countries are expected to chip in. NATO's official guidelines say member states should spend at least 2% of their GDP on defense.

By 2024, no? Care to link to these 'official guidelines'?

 

[Borillar]

Did y'all actually read what "support" meant? It's 'non binding' window dressing, like telling the frumpy toothless simpleton in new garb that they look very handsome or pretty today. I support NATO too... in their fulfilling their obligation to contribute their agreed upon annual GDP percentage. It hurts us NONE to walk away, it hurts them greatly not being able to take advantage of our generosity.

If we walk away, we won’t have a grand coalition for future wars. We won’t be able to count on them sending a Corporal and a couple Privates to help out.

 

[Borillar]

Great article at this link.Pretty bloody sad and embarrasing that Greece, Poland and Estonia can meet their obligations but Germany and France can't.



"To make the principle work, all countries are expected to chip in. NATO's official guidelines say member states should spend at least 2% of their GDP on defense.

Of the 28 countries in the alliance, only five -- the U.S., Greece, Poland, Estonia and the U.K. -- meet the target.

The rest lag behind. Germany spent 1.19% of its GDP on defense last year, France forked out 1.78%.

Iceland, which doesn't have its own army, spends just 0.1% of its GDP on defense, according to the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development.

Five other countries spend less than 1%, according to NATO's estimates for this year: Canada, Slovenia, Belgium, Spain and Luxembourg."

These NATO countries are not spending their fair share on defense

Defense against what?

 

[OKTexas]

Trump is demanding member countries who are bound by the treaty, actually fulfill their obligations under the TREATY.

Care to point out members' treaty obligations that are not being fulfilled?

The Parties to this Treaty reaffirm their faith in the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations and their desire to live in peace with all peoples and all governments.
They are determined to safeguard the freedom, common heritage and civilisation of their peoples, founded on the principles of democracy, individual liberty and the rule of law. They seek to promote stability and well-being in the North Atlantic area.
They are resolved to unite their efforts for collective defence and for the preservation of peace and security. They therefore agree to this North Atlantic Treaty :
https://www.nato.int
Article 1
The Parties undertake, as set forth in the Charter of the United Nations, to settle any international dispute in which they may be involved by peaceful means in such a manner that international peace and security and justice are not endangered, and to refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force in any manner inconsistent with the purposes of the United Nations.

Article 2
The Parties will contribute toward the further development of peaceful and friendly international relations by strengthening their free institutions, by bringing about a better understanding of the principles upon which these institutions are founded, and by promoting conditions of stability and well-being. They will seek to eliminate conflict in their international economic policies and will encourage economic collaboration between any or all of them.

Article 3
In order more effectively to achieve the objectives of this Treaty, the Parties, separately and jointly, by means of continuous and effective self-help and mutual aid, will maintain and develop their individual and collective capacity to resist armed attack.

Article 4
The Parties will consult together whenever, in the opinion of any of them, the territorial integrity, political independence or security of any of the Parties is threatened.

Article 5
The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.

Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security .

Article 6 1
For the purpose of Article 5, an armed attack on one or more of the Parties is deemed to include an armed attack:

• on the territory of any of the Parties in Europe or North America, on the Algerian Departments of France 2, on the territory of Turkey or on the Islands under the jurisdiction of any of the Parties in the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer;
• on the forces, vessels, or aircraft of any of the Parties, when in or over these territories or any other area in Europe in which occupation forces of any of the Parties were stationed on the date when the Treaty entered into force or the Mediterranean Sea or the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer.

Article 7
This Treaty does not affect, and shall not be interpreted as affecting in any way the rights and obligations under the Charter of the Parties which are members of the United Nations, or the primary responsibility of the Security Council for the maintenance of international peace and security.

Article 8
Each Party declares that none of the international engagements now in force between it and any other of the Parties or any third State is in conflict with the provisions of this Treaty, and undertakes not to enter into any international engagement in conflict with this Treaty.

Article 9
The Parties hereby establish a Council, on which each of them shall be represented, to consider matters concerning the implementation of this Treaty. The Council shall be so organised as to be able to meet promptly at any time. The Council shall set up such subsidiary bodies as may be necessary; in particular it shall establish immediately a defence committee which shall recommend measures for the implementation of Articles 3 and 5.

Article 10
The Parties may, by unanimous agreement, invite any other European State in a position to further the principles of this Treaty and to contribute to the security of the North Atlantic area to accede to this Treaty. Any State so invited may become a Party to the Treaty by depositing its instrument of accession with the Government of the United States of America. The Government of the United States of America will inform each of the Parties of the deposit of each such instrument of accession.

Article 11
This Treaty shall be ratified and its provisions carried out by the Parties in accordance with their respective constitutional processes. The instruments of ratification shall be deposited as soon as possible with the Government of the United States of America, which will notify all the other signatories of each deposit. The Treaty shall enter into force between the States which have ratified it as soon as the ratifications of the majority of the signatories, including the ratifications of Belgium, Canada, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States, have been deposited and shall come into effect with respect to other States on the date of the deposit of their ratifications. (3)

Article 12
After the Treaty has been in force for ten years, or at any time thereafter, the Parties shall, if any of them so requests, consult together for the purpose of reviewing the Treaty, having regard for the factors then affecting peace and security in the North Atlantic area, including the development of universal as well as regional arrangements under the Charter of the United Nations for the maintenance of international peace and security.

Article 13
After the Treaty has been in force for twenty years, any Party may cease to be a Party one year after its notice of denunciation has been given to the Government of the United States of America, which will inform the Governments of the other Parties of the deposit of each notice of denunciation.

Article 14
This Treaty, of which the English and French texts are equally authentic, shall be deposited in the archives of the Government of the United States of America. Duly certified copies will be transmitted by that Government to the Governments of other signatories.​

Article 3 and subsequent agreements pursuant to it.

Here's who is paying the agreed-upon share to NATO — and who isn't


.

 

[EverCurious]

Great article at this link.Pretty bloody sad and embarrasing that Greece, Poland and Estonia can meet their obligations but Germany and France can't.



"To make the principle work, all countries are expected to chip in. NATO's official guidelines say member states should spend at least 2% of their GDP on defense.

Of the 28 countries in the alliance, only five -- the U.S., Greece, Poland, Estonia and the U.K. -- meet the target.

The rest lag behind. Germany spent 1.19% of its GDP on defense last year, France forked out 1.78%.

Iceland, which doesn't have its own army, spends just 0.1% of its GDP on defense, according to the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development.

Five other countries spend less than 1%, according to NATO's estimates for this year: Canada, Slovenia, Belgium, Spain and Luxembourg."

These NATO countries are not spending their fair share on defense

Defense against what?

Why do we need NATO then?

 

[Care4all]

Why stay clueless of history, when it is at your fingertips?

 

[cnm]

If we walk away, we won’t have a grand coalition for future wars. We won’t be able to count on them sending a Corporal and a couple Privates to help out.

Around 800 dead corporals and privates from Afghanistan for NATO allies. Not counting the non NATO allies.

The gratitude of the yanks is legend.

 

[eagle1462010]

OMFG............they can finally agree on something.........I had thought they had forgotten how to pass anything........

 

[cnm]

Article 3 and subsequent agreements pursuant to it.

Show how it's being broken by NATO members.

 

[eagle1462010]

If we walk away, we won’t have a grand coalition for future wars. We won’t be able to count on them sending a Corporal and a couple Privates to help out.

Around 800 dead corporals and privates from Afghanistan for NATO allies. Not counting the non NATO allies.

The gratitude of the yanks is legend.

So that gives them the right to screw us on Trade.......using protective tariffs against us while we pay the Lion's share of NATO military expenditures.........and asking for them to spend 2% in their own defense...........Some have done so.........the POTUS has asked them to speed up cooperation on the rest..........2% isn't that dang big a deal to defend your own countries.

 

[Borillar]

Great article at this link.Pretty bloody sad and embarrasing that Greece, Poland and Estonia can meet their obligations but Germany and France can't.



"To make the principle work, all countries are expected to chip in. NATO's official guidelines say member states should spend at least 2% of their GDP on defense.

Of the 28 countries in the alliance, only five -- the U.S., Greece, Poland, Estonia and the U.K. -- meet the target.

The rest lag behind. Germany spent 1.19% of its GDP on defense last year, France forked out 1.78%.

Iceland, which doesn't have its own army, spends just 0.1% of its GDP on defense, according to the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development.

Five other countries spend less than 1%, according to NATO's estimates for this year: Canada, Slovenia, Belgium, Spain and Luxembourg."

These NATO countries are not spending their fair share on defense

Defense against what?

Why do we need NATO then?

NATO served its purpose, which was to deter the Soviet Union. That threat no longer exists. Europe can defend itself.

 

[Flash]

Trump also supports NATO but wants to see them get off American welfare.