Abortion is murder

[hobelim]

1. Abortion end a human life.
2. It is wrong to end a human life.

Idolatry ends a human life.

It is wrong to end a human life.

But not always illegal.

When human life is taken in self-defense, or as authorized by an act of war, that taking is not illegal, and by most not considered immoral or wrong.

When those hostile to the privacy rights of others incorrectly refer to abortion as ‘murder,’ they’ve crossed the line from religious/philosophical debate as to the nature of life and when life begins into the legal realm where as a fact of law abortion is not ‘murder,’ it is not the unlawful taking of a human life, and in the context of the law not ‘wrong.’

I agree with you.

The so called religious take the position that abortion is murder. Of course this is false.

My point is that they are guilty of committing an act worse than murder by teaching their own children to commit idolatry as an expression of their religious devotion condemning them to a life of confusion and suffering caused by believing in lies, ignorance, and superstition and devotion to a degrading practice, the worship of a perverse and false triune image of Jesus, that the very Bible that they call the Word of God condemns as evil and promises results in death.


They are all murderers. Like serial killers, many even brag about how many followers they have accumulated like possessions and deceived into wasting their lives by praying to a figment of their imagination for guidance and help.... for a nominal service charge..

 

[ding]

The so called religious take the position that abortion is murder. Of course this is false.

What do you call it when someone intentionally ends the life of a fellow human being?

 

[hobelim]

The so called religious take the position that abortion is murder. Of course this is false.

What do you call it when someone intentionally ends the life of a fellow human being?

What do you call it when a person accuses the innocent of murder but whose house is filled with the corpses of his own children whose lives were snuffed out by his own hand?

Hypocrisy?


Ding! ding! ding!

 

[ding]

The so called religious take the position that abortion is murder. Of course this is false.

What do you call it when someone intentionally ends the life of a fellow human being?

What do you call it when a person accuses the innocent of murder but whose house is filled with the corpses of his own children whose lives were snuffed out by his own hand?

Hypocrisy?


Ding! ding! ding!

It's ok. I know you can't answer the question. No one who endorses ending the life of a human being can.

Man knows right from wrong but with confronted with violating it they rationalize that they didn't. The same thing happened at the garden of evil.

Adam, did you eat the apple? Eve gave it to me.

Eve, did you eat the apple. The serpent deceived me.

See? They couldn't admit to being wrong either.

 

[JakeStarkey]

So you have no such law.

This is over.

Would you have stood idly by? Your silence and everyone else's silence is deafening. Beliefs not worth stating are beliefs not worth having.

Yes, of course, state your belief.

I have. Would you have stood idly by while the holocaust was going on? Or would you have at least spoke out against it? Would you accept an evil because it is legal? Or would you follow the dictates of your conscience despite the letter of the law or the consequences to yourself?

I like your passion, but your equivalency is false, as is your understanding of what is human life.

 

[ding]

So you have no such law.

This is over.

Would you have stood idly by? Your silence and everyone else's silence is deafening. Beliefs not worth stating are beliefs not worth having.

Yes, of course, state your belief.

I have. Would you have stood idly by while the holocaust was going on? Or would you have at least spoke out against it? Would you accept an evil because it is legal? Or would you follow the dictates of your conscience despite the letter of the law or the consequences to yourself?

I like your passion, but your equivalency is false, as is your understanding of what is human life.

It isn't a false equivalency. The fact that you won't answer the question can only mean that you would have stood idly by.

When are you going to admit that I proved to you that at conception a new human being is created?

 

[hobelim]

The so called religious take the position that abortion is murder. Of course this is false.

What do you call it when someone intentionally ends the life of a fellow human being?

What do you call it when a person accuses the innocent of murder but whose house is filled with the corpses of his own children whose lives were snuffed out by his own hand?

Hypocrisy?


Ding! ding! ding!

It's ok. I know you can't answer the question. No one who endorses ending the life of a human being can.

You are confused my friend.

A person who takes the life of another human being is either a criminal or a hero depending on the circumstances.


As it stands, abortion is not murder.


Do you teach others to set aside the divine commands and worship a human being as if he was a god?

If so, you are a murderer according to the very book you profess to believe is the very Word of God.

The fact that you do not think its wrong and do not even have an inkling that the belief that idolatry leads to eternal life contradicts the entire Bible shows that you have your reward already.

Thats the way the cookie crumbles.

 

[JakeStarkey]

So you have no such law.

This is over.

Would you have stood idly by? Your silence and everyone else's silence is deafening. Beliefs not worth stating are beliefs not worth having.

Yes, of course, state your belief.

I have. Would you have stood idly by while the holocaust was going on? Or would you have at least spoke out against it? Would you accept an evil because it is legal? Or would you follow the dictates of your conscience despite the letter of the law or the consequences to yourself?

I like your passion, but your equivalency is false, as is your understanding of what is human life.

It isn't a false equivalency. The fact that you won't answer the question can only mean that you would have stood idly by. When are you going to admit that I proved to you that at conception a new human being is created?

Yes, it is a false equivalency, and questions underlining a FE are never answered because there is no legitimacy to that equation. You have proved nothing, ding, except in your own head. You don't understand the science is the problem. You are leading with your heart, which can get you in all sorts of quandries, like this one for instance.

For a lack of internal consistency, consider Hobelim's post above.

 

[ding]

Would you have stood idly by? Your silence and everyone else's silence is deafening. Beliefs not worth stating are beliefs not worth having.

Yes, of course, state your belief.

I have. Would you have stood idly by while the holocaust was going on? Or would you have at least spoke out against it? Would you accept an evil because it is legal? Or would you follow the dictates of your conscience despite the letter of the law or the consequences to yourself?

I like your passion, but your equivalency is false, as is your understanding of what is human life.

It isn't a false equivalency. The fact that you won't answer the question can only mean that you would have stood idly by. When are you going to admit that I proved to you that at conception a new human being is created?

Yes, it is a false equivalency, and questions underlining a FE are never answered because there is no legitimacy to that equation. You have proved nothing, ding, except in your own head. You don't understand the science is the problem. You are leading with your heart, which can get you in all sorts of quandries, like this one for instance.

I disagree. I think I have. I couldn't care less if you agree with me or not.

What about my proving to you that science defines the beginning of a new human life at conception? You keep dodging that. How come?

 

[ding]

They are not human lives. Or you can show me that abortion is taking a "human life." Show us.

Ok, I'm showing you AGAIN that they are humans. What do you have to say now? Are you just going to run away again?

"An individual human life begins at conception when a sperm cell from the father fuses with an egg cell from the mother, to form a new cell, the zygote, the first embryonic stage. The zygote grows and divides into two daughter cells, each of which grows and divides into two grand-daughter cells, and this cell growth/division process continues on, over and over again. The zygote is the start of a biological continuum that automatically grows and develops, passing gradually and sequentially through the stages we call foetus, baby, child, adult, old person and ending eventually in death. The full genetic instructions to guide the development of the continuum, in interaction with its environment, are present in the zygote. Every stage along the continuum is biologically human and each point along the continuum has the full human properties appropriate to that point."
Dr. William Reville, University College Cork, Ireland

"After fertilization has taken place a new human being has come into being...[this] is no longer a matter of taste or opinion, it is not a metaphysical contention, it is plain experimental evidence...." - Dr Jerome LeJeune, Professor of Genetics at the University of Descartes, Paris, discoverer of the chromosome pattern of Down's Syndrome, and Nobel Prize Winner, Report, Subcommittee on Separation of Powers to Senate Judiciary Committee S-158, 97th Congress, 1st Session 1981

 

[JakeStarkey]

Yes, of course, state your belief.

I have. Would you have stood idly by while the holocaust was going on? Or would you have at least spoke out against it? Would you accept an evil because it is legal? Or would you follow the dictates of your conscience despite the letter of the law or the consequences to yourself?

I like your passion, but your equivalency is false, as is your understanding of what is human life.

It isn't a false equivalency. The fact that you won't answer the question can only mean that you would have stood idly by. When are you going to admit that I proved to you that at conception a new human being is created?

Yes, it is a false equivalency, and questions underlining a FE are never answered because there is no legitimacy to that equation. You have proved nothing, ding, except in your own head. You don't understand the science is the problem. You are leading with your heart, which can get you in all sorts of quandries, like this one for instance.

I disagree. I think I have. I couldn't care less if you agree with me or not.

What about my proving to you that science defines the beginning of a new human life at conception? You keep dodging that. How come?

You show you are leading by feez not reeliz, but that is OK because you don't have the votes and you don't have the courts. Your sources can easily be countered by scores of equally equalified bioethicists who disagree with you.

And if you don't care, why do you keep coming back? Move along, ding.

 

[ding]

They are not human lives. Or you can show me that abortion is taking a "human life." Show us.

Ok, I'm showing you AGAIN for the third time that they are humans. What do you have to say now? Are you just going to run away again?

"An individual human life begins at conception when a sperm cell from the father fuses with an egg cell from the mother, to form a new cell, the zygote, the first embryonic stage. The zygote grows and divides into two daughter cells, each of which grows and divides into two grand-daughter cells, and this cell growth/division process continues on, over and over again. The zygote is the start of a biological continuum that automatically grows and develops, passing gradually and sequentially through the stages we call foetus, baby, child, adult, old person and ending eventually in death. The full genetic instructions to guide the development of the continuum, in interaction with its environment, are present in the zygote. Every stage along the continuum is biologically human and each point along the continuum has the full human properties appropriate to that point."
Dr. William Reville, University College Cork, Ireland

"After fertilization has taken place a new human being has come into being...[this] is no longer a matter of taste or opinion, it is not a metaphysical contention, it is plain experimental evidence...." - Dr Jerome LeJeune, Professor of Genetics at the University of Descartes, Paris, discoverer of the chromosome pattern of Down's Syndrome, and Nobel Prize Winner, Report, Subcommittee on Separation of Powers to Senate Judiciary Committee S-158, 97th Congress, 1st Session 1981

 

[JakeStarkey]

Abortion is not murder.

But we should be talking about wrong. Would you have stood idly by during the holocaust? That was legal too?

One again a false equivalency.

but it shows where his heart is at, and where your's is at.

ty, your church allows abortion, as you well know

my standard is abortion in case of genetic malformation that results in death after birth, in case of rape, in case of incest, and in case of danger to mother's health.

Your church is fine with that.

You need to talk to your brethren in your ward and with your high councilor assigned to your ward.

You are in strange hiways and biways.

"your church is fine with that"
ah but you left out the qualifier jake. Like always.

Nope, there it is. You have no say in what they church says. I only spell out because you won't.

 

[JakeStarkey]

They are not human lives. Or you can show me that abortion is taking a "human life." Show us.

Ok, I'm showing you AGAIN for the third time that they are humans. What do you have to say now? Are you just going to run away again?

"An individual human life begins at conception when a sperm cell from the father fuses with an egg cell from the mother, to form a new cell, the zygote, the first embryonic stage. The zygote grows and divides into two daughter cells, each of which grows and divides into two grand-daughter cells, and this cell growth/division process continues on, over and over again. The zygote is the start of a biological continuum that automatically grows and develops, passing gradually and sequentially through the stages we call foetus, baby, child, adult, old person and ending eventually in death. The full genetic instructions to guide the development of the continuum, in interaction with its environment, are present in the zygote. Every stage along the continuum is biologically human and each point along the continuum has the full human properties appropriate to that point."
Dr. William Reville, University College Cork, Ireland

"After fertilization has taken place a new human being has come into being...[this] is no longer a matter of taste or opinion, it is not a metaphysical contention, it is plain experimental evidence...." - Dr Jerome LeJeune, Professor of Genetics at the University of Descartes, Paris, discoverer of the chromosome pattern of Down's Syndrome, and Nobel Prize Winner, Report, Subcommittee on Separation of Powers to Senate Judiciary Committee S-158, 97th Congress, 1st Session 1981

And for the second time those are opinions of folks who can be countered by scores of others.

Do you believe any abortion under any certain circumstance(s) is (are) acceptable to you? If so, list the exceptions, please.

 

[the_human_being]

being is like reagan, saying, "I don't understand this," when shortly he will understand none of it. Stop whining, and tell me what you believe should be the limits of abortion.

Since I believe abortion to be the premediated murder for hire of a defenseless human being, I see no instance where it should be permitted.

...and fortunately for all of our country, your belief's are not worth a warm bucket of piss until you are appointed to the Supreme Court.

I can't argue with that because that is true. I am simply adult enough and possess enough common sense to know the difference between right and wrong.

 

[the_human_being]

Since the law is clear that abortion is not illegal, and the word, "murder" is the illegal taking of life, then we know that abortion isn't murder and is not illegal.

As to someone's moral objections to abortion, I simply couldn't care less. I can point to things that go on every day that I do not consider moral, including a lot of religious practices and beliefs, such as the Catholic ban on birth control in overpopulated, impoverished countries. But, that means nothing to anyone but myself.

Correct.

Murder is a legal concept, the unlawful taking of a person’s life.

This fact isn’t changed by demagogues hostile to the right privacy using the term in bad faith in an effort to propagate the lie that abortion is ‘murder.’

It is sad that one must rely on someone to instruct him in what is the difference between what is right and what is wrong.

 

[the_human_being]

being is like reagan, saying, "I don't understand this," when shortly he will understand none of it. Stop whining, and tell me what you believe should be the limits of abortion.

Since I believe abortion to be the premediated murder for hire of a defenseless human being, I see no instance where it should be permitted.

Thank you. Then, yes, your understanding is far narrower than mine, and I was wrong mine was narrower. I believe in cases of genetic malformations that will lead to quick death after birth, rape, family incest, and the life of the mother as reasons acceptable for abortion.

There you have it Jake. We see a lot of thing very differently. I don't hold the child to be guilty of anything at all in the cases of rape or incest. It has also been my experience with the women I have been exposed to that they would choose to give up their own lives to spare the lives of their children whether born or within the womb.

 

[the_human_being]

They are not human lives. Or you can show me that abortion is taking a "human life." Show us.

Ok, I'm showing you AGAIN for the third time that they are humans. What do you have to say now? Are you just going to run away again?

"An individual human life begins at conception when a sperm cell from the father fuses with an egg cell from the mother, to form a new cell, the zygote, the first embryonic stage. The zygote grows and divides into two daughter cells, each of which grows and divides into two grand-daughter cells, and this cell growth/division process continues on, over and over again. The zygote is the start of a biological continuum that automatically grows and develops, passing gradually and sequentially through the stages we call foetus, baby, child, adult, old person and ending eventually in death. The full genetic instructions to guide the development of the continuum, in interaction with its environment, are present in the zygote. Every stage along the continuum is biologically human and each point along the continuum has the full human properties appropriate to that point."
Dr. William Reville, University College Cork, Ireland

"After fertilization has taken place a new human being has come into being...[this] is no longer a matter of taste or opinion, it is not a metaphysical contention, it is plain experimental evidence...." - Dr Jerome LeJeune, Professor of Genetics at the University of Descartes, Paris, discoverer of the chromosome pattern of Down's Syndrome, and Nobel Prize Winner, Report, Subcommittee on Separation of Powers to Senate Judiciary Committee S-158, 97th Congress, 1st Session 1981

And for the second time those are opinions of folks who can be countered by scores of others.

Do you believe any abortion under any certain circumstance(s) is (are) acceptable to you? If so, list the exceptions, please.

Everything under the sun will be countered by someone, Jake. Surely you are adult enough to realize that.

 

[the_human_being]

It is pretty sad when people deny the overwhelming evidence of science.

It’s pretty sad when people deny the Constitution, its case law, facts of law, the rule of law, and willfully violate the rights and protected liberties of other.

Actually, it is very commendable. It shows the person has moral character.

 

[the_human_being]

Abortion is not the holocaust, or like it, except in your opinion. Your fallacy of false equivalency does not make it so.

It is worse. The holocaust claimed 7 million lives. In this country alone, abortion has claimed 50 million lives since Roe v Wade.

They are not human lives. Or you can show me that abortion is taking a "human life." Show us.

If they are not human lives then you tell us what they are, Jake. I have seen many via ultrasound and they all seem to have arms, legs, a human head, ten fingers and toes. Even the doctor addresses them as the expectant parents' child or if the sex has been discovered via ultrasound, as "your son" or "your daughter". The doctors must believe they are human beings.