Abortion Trade Off/Compromise

[JoeB131]

How do you "care" for someone you kill?

Fetuses are globs of tissue, they aren't anyone.

 

[22lcidw]

Just imagine what you could do with the abortion rate if the United States had a reasonable minimum wage, mandatory paid maternity leave for women, child tax benefits, sudsidized day care, for every low income family, and universal healthcare.

Birth control is always going to fail and they’re always gonna be unwanted pregnancies. These things are always gonna hit poor people hardest.

And this is equality.

 

[JoeB131]

2/3 of all Americans oppose abortion beyond the first trimester. This means a lot of people who call themselves "pro-choice" have opinions in direct conflict with Roe v. Wade.

Only because they didn't understand what Roe v. Wade actually said. Roe actually DID allow states to make laws against abortion after "viability". What made "abortion on demand" a thing was Doe v. Bolton, which found that abortion was allowed at any time if there was a finding that any danger to a woman's health allowed abortion at any time.

Doe v. Bolton doesn't get the attention that Roe v. Wade got, because they were issued on the same day by the same 7-2 SCOTUS majority

Bullshit. Imagine a 1940 German saying, "You know, I hate the extermination of Jews, but I oppose anyone who tries to stop it."

But here was the thing. Most 1940's Germans were fine with throwing the Jews out of Germany... they just were horrified when they found out where they were being sent.

The GOP has been very vindictive about abortion, rather than compassionate. Even Trump said women who get abortions should go to jail.

Texas put a literal bounty on anyone who gets an abortion, or who even helps a woman get an abortion. That is just pure hate.

My wife is one of the most pro-life people I know, but when Virginia Republicans wanted women to be raped with a wand before being allowed to get an abortion, she became very, very cold in her fury toward Republicans.

And here's the thing. If a woman is bound and determined to have an abortion, she's going to find a way to have an abortion.

Just like if someone is bound and determined to do drugs, hire a prostitute, or have a drink, they are going to find a way to do that. Prohibition caused far more problems than it solved, the war on drugs has been a cultural disaster, and prostitution laws lead to all sorts of undesirable results, such as human trafficking. When something is legal, you can regulate it.

Which is why I support legal abortion, not because I think abortion is a good thing, but because I don't want people maimed in abortions that are going to happen no matter what we feel about it.

So you either accept that some women are going to have abortions, or you can try to regulate it punitively, but carping about the "Wand of Shame" isn't a solution, it's just your discomfort in what would be required for the kinds of laws you want.

 

[BoostedHayabusa]

If you stomp on a sea turtle egg, the Left starts foaming at the mouth and calling for your death.

If you kill a human fetus, the Left says, "It just a clump of cells!"

Sea turtles are an endangered species.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

If you stomp on a sea turtle egg,

your foot stomping on an egg is an action that involves two separate living species trying to coexist in a universal physical environment on a planet called earth

A woman deciding not to continue gestation of her fertilized egg is an action that take place inside her body having no impact on civilization or the physical world whatsoever.

Huge difference. Unless you bring religion into it.

 

[Unkotare]

Fetuses are globs of tissue, they aren't anyone.

You are a glob of tissue. You aren’t anyone.

 

[initforme]

Plan b should be in every bedroom
Unprotected? Well you have a backup then. No awful surprises. No abortions.

 

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

Here's a compromise I'm for.

If you don't like abortion, you don't have to have one.
If you need an abortion, you should be able to get one, no questions asked.

Here’s a compromise I’m for, then.

The moral people ban the human rights abuse of abortion.

And sick fucks like you stop wasting oxygen.

 

[initforme]

Here’s a compromise I’m for, then.

The moral people ban the human rights abuse of abortion.

And sick fucks like you stop wasting oxygen.

But you are silent on promoting contraception. That goes against anti abortionists.

 

[martybegan]

I could compromise on that.

The issue is going to be rectified by the side that has the more people willing to nudge out from the hard positions.

Right now the Pro-life side seems to be more realistic, at least some of their side does.

Pro-Choice right now seems to mean abortion for any reason to the moment of birth.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

You are a glob of tissue. You aren’t anyone.

And every human glob of tissue develops an organ known as a brain science tells me at about 23 weeks. Then the start of making neurological connections that’s will total in the trillions over the coming weeks when there will come a time when the glob of tissue will be capable of consciousness. And coincidentally, all those neurological connections are required for a fetus to be capable of surviving outside the womb, if the need arises to deliver prematurely. Roe versus Wade causes women who do not want to assume the risk or hardship of continued gestation and delivery of a live birth to make the decision prior to 28 weeks. Tomorrow’s Atlanta, for civilized society was therefore resolved 50 years ago in the supreme court, that is basically that we all should agree that the sanctity of life sanctity of life, being one of the mysteries of life should have a fundamental threshold that it begins at viability.

 

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

But you are silent on promoting contraception. That goes against anti abortionists.

Promote? People know sex accessories and products exist. Go buy them if you want them.

And if they fail or you don’t buy them, congrats mom and dad, now take care of your damn kid!

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Pro-Choice right now seems to mean abortion for any reason to the moment of birth.

All pro-choice people are pro life. There is disagreement among all us, pro life world citizens of every race, religion, or philosophy, being the disagreement of when, the sanctity of life begins during its existence in the womb.

I’m saying when you look at polling and actual voting records since the fall of Roe an overwhelming majority of civilized humanity, agree that the sanctity of life begin around the time of viability. That is the period in life when every single one of us having a say, on the matter, were able to experience consciousness, which to me is a perfect solution, when dealing with a mystery of life.

 

[Unkotare]

And every human glob of tissue develops an organ known as a brain science tells me at about 23 weeks. Then the start of making neurological connections that’s will total in the trillions over the coming weeks when there will come a time when the glob of tissue will be capable of consciousness. And coincidentally, all those neurological connections are required for a fetus to be capable of surviving outside the womb, if the need arises to deliver prematurely. Roe versus Wade causes women who do not want to assume the risk or hardship of continued gestation and delivery of a live birth to make the decision prior to 28 weeks. Tomorrow’s Atlanta, for civilized society was therefore resolved 50 years ago in the supreme court, that is basically that we all should agree that the sanctity of life sanctity of life, being one of the mysteries of life should have a fundamental threshold that it begins at viability.

In the natural course of events, will any such glob of tissue become a chicken? a tree? a bowling ball?

 

[martybegan]

All pro-choice people are pro life. There is disagreement among all us, pro life world citizens of every race, religion, or philosophy, being the disagreement of win, the sanctity of life begins during its existence in the womb

Some of you aren't. Take a look at those shout your abortion posts/sites.

Stop trying to take over the semantics and post an actual position on something for once.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Some of you aren't.

93% of abortions are performed in the first 12 weeks. For the remaining 7% very few pro-choice people are OK with using abortion as a contraceptive means when both the mother and the baby are healthy and fit enough to survive a live birth.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

semantics

You acknowledge that your arguments are weak when you go there

 

[martybegan]

93% of abortions are performed in the first 12 weeks. For the remaining 7% very few pro-choice people are OK with using abortion as a contraceptive means when both the mother and the baby are healthy and fit enough to survive a live birth.

Then why are blue States passing laws allowing abortion up to the second of birth, and with some of the wording, theoretically a few weeks after?

 

[martybegan]

You acknowledge that your arguments are weak when you go there

I point out you have to post word salad instead of making a succinct and concise argument.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

n the natural course of events, will any such glob of tissue become a chicken? a tree? a bowling ball?

There are no moral people seeking to demand their government take license to cause harm to women by forcing full term gestation on women against their will