Adam Lanza's Attack Took Less Than 5 Minutes

[M14 Shooter]

I just want to be sure about this.
A Bushmaster is an assault weapon - right?

They say it is.

Federal law that bans the owning or creation of bombs, landmines, grenades or any rocket-propelled weapon should be amended to include ANY configuration of a gun that can kill people en masse. It's just that simple.

It's also impossibly stupid.
ANY modern firearn can kill people en masse.

Stupid gun nuts on this board want to bury the argument in semantics. I hope you don't have to bury your children because of the ignorance you demonstrate here.

Let us know when you have something to offer other than an appeal to emotion.

Right now gun laws are riddled (no pun intended) with "with the exception of" in almost every line of their statutes, so there may be many gun control laws on the books, but they are ineffectual in application much less enforcement.

That's what happens when people who know nothing about guns write laws to 'regulate' them.

 

[Pogo]

You've got exactly the right idea at the end; it starts with "me". But the "legislate culture" concern is misplaced. You can't legislate culture and I never suggested that approach (actually if I thought we could legislate culture I wouldn't be wasting the energy on message board; I'd be pitching it to legislators).

I never said that you did but apparently you would be willing if possible. The point I was truying to make is that most of these threads, and the general discourse in the country, is of finding solutions and we are faced with a problem that essentially does not have any. At least not any that can be realized in a short length of time.

It really was not a concern – it was a point that we are not going to be able to change it. People HAVE advocated for it though. It is one of the reasons that I think LaPierre should be fired. It is what he advocated for – censorship. Asinine if you ask me and it was all in a vain attempt to steer the discourse away from guns onto another right, something that no rights advocate should ever do.

Clearly not every problem is solved by throwing legislation at the problem, least of all culture. Teach your children well. It takes time. But the longest journey begins with a single step.

This is true, if only others would accept that. Instead, they all want to make changes so they feel better even if it is not actually doing anything.

Agreed -- "not actually doing anything" is my biggest concern about the idea of throwing legislation at the problem; that we'll channel all our energies into "let's pass this legislation-- no, that's got problems, let's pass that legislation" --- as if the answer is legislation and it's just a matter of tweaking it. Meanwhile we've left the root problem completely alone and all we come up with is a new law that will be some criminal's challenge to find a way around.

We've even got some of the shallower minds on the gun side musing about whether Lanza's guns were legal and what he was wearing to carry stuff and what color his vest might have been. It's like, "let's talk about anything except where all this is coming from". Misdirection is an escapism that keeps us mired.

No, I don't believe we can legislate culture. Quaint Windbag tried to pin that on me too with no basis. It's just another misdirection. It would be akin to trying to legislate morality, and we know that doesn't work. IMO culture leads legislation, not the other way around, which is why I focus on culture. Once culture is established, all legislation can do is affirm it. It's clear to me which is the more powerful and effective influence.

We gain little from changing laws and much more from changing consciousness. I'd say Bob Costas in a 90-second TV commentary did more to help that cause than Barack Obama has done in 90 days.

 

[Brain357]

It's also impossibly stupid.
ANY modern firearn can kill people en masse.

Yes, but it's much slower with say a 6 shot revolver, than a 20 shot rifle. Yet the revolver is very effective for defending yourself.

 

[M14 Shooter]

It's also impossibly stupid.
ANY modern firearn can kill people en masse.

Yes, but it's much slower with say a 6 shot revolver, than a 20 shot rifle.

Irrelevant.
He said:

...ANY configuration of a gun...

This includes the 6-shot revolver.

 

[idb]

Here's another inconsistent flaw in what the media is reporting

Connecticut has had an assault weapons ban since 1993 how could she purchase a bushmaster between 2010 and 2012 and it be legal?

I just want to be sure about this.
A Bushmaster is an assault weapon - right?

Not if it was sold 1994-2004.

Oh, that's interesting.
Did they change the design of them in those years or something?

 

[JimH52]

Investigators: Adam Lanza surrounded by weapons at home; attack took less than 5 minutes

Adam Lanza left a home stuffed with weaponry and carried out the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in a 154-bullet barrage that took less than five minutes, investigators said Thursday in the first detailed account of his surroundings and troubled state of mind.

Authorities also recovered a certificate in Lanza’s name from the National Rifle Association, seven of his journals, drawings that he made and books from the house, including books on living with mental illness.

At the school, Lanza fired the 154 rounds from a Bushmaster .223-model rifle and the final bullet from a Glock 10mm handgun to take his own life, said Stephen Sedensky, the chief prosecutor investigating the shooting. Police recovered 10 30-round magazines for the Bushmaster that Lanza took to the school. Three of the magazines had a full 30 rounds still in them.

Among school shootings in the United States, the death toll from Newtown is second only to the 32 people killed at Virginia Tech in 2007.

Do any of you gun supporters see anything upsetting about this??? People like this Adam Lanza have to be stopped.

Investigators: Adam Lanza surrounded by weapons at home; attack took less than 5 minutes - Open Channel

Didn't one of the RW liars on this board say that the bushmaster was left in the car? It is amazing how low these idiots will stoop...

 

[CMike]

That's because the news reported conflicting information.

 

[Pogo]

Investigators: Adam Lanza surrounded by weapons at home; attack took less than 5 minutes

Adam Lanza left a home stuffed with weaponry and carried out the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in a 154-bullet barrage that took less than five minutes, investigators said Thursday in the first detailed account of his surroundings and troubled state of mind.

Authorities also recovered a certificate in Lanza’s name from the National Rifle Association, seven of his journals, drawings that he made and books from the house, including books on living with mental illness.

At the school, Lanza fired the 154 rounds from a Bushmaster .223-model rifle and the final bullet from a Glock 10mm handgun to take his own life, said Stephen Sedensky, the chief prosecutor investigating the shooting. Police recovered 10 30-round magazines for the Bushmaster that Lanza took to the school. Three of the magazines had a full 30 rounds still in them.

Among school shootings in the United States, the death toll from Newtown is second only to the 32 people killed at Virginia Tech in 2007.

Do any of you gun supporters see anything upsetting about this??? People like this Adam Lanza have to be stopped.

Investigators: Adam Lanza surrounded by weapons at home; attack took less than 5 minutes - Open Channel

Didn't one of the RW liars on this board say that the bushmaster was left in the car? It is amazing how low these idiots will stoop...

I remember that, and it was way more than one as I recall. I still think this is an obfuscation tactic. We should be asking ourselves "why do we have all these mass shootings?", and instead there's a gaggle of wags asking "which weapon did he use? What color was it? Did he have a backpack or a vest? How could he get that if it's illegal? What's the action like on that one?" ... ad nauseum.

It's a way of denying that the elephant in the room is in the room; when the elephant walks in the room, talk about the wallpaper and the ceiling and what's going on outside the window. Anything but the e-word.

 

[idb]

To be fair Pogo, we aren't even sure if it was an assault weapon or not because we don't know when it was originally sold.

Too many important questions remain unanswered.

 

[Pogo]

To be fair Pogo, we aren't even sure if it was an assault weapon or not because we don't know when it was originally sold.

To many important questions remain unanswered.

What I'm saying is, that ^^ is not an important question. It can hardly be less important. Because regardless which way it's resolved, the victims are exactly the same amount of dead.

 

[idb]

To be fair Pogo, we aren't even sure if it was an assault weapon or not because we don't know when it was originally sold.

To many important questions remain unanswered.

What I'm saying is, that ^^ is not an important question. It can hardly be less important. Because regardless which way it's resolved, the victims are exactly the same amount of dead.

Sorry, I should have put the \sarcasm switch at the end of my post.

 

[Pogo]

To be fair Pogo, we aren't even sure if it was an assault weapon or not because we don't know when it was originally sold.

To many important questions remain unanswered.

What I'm saying is, that ^^ is not an important question. It can hardly be less important. Because regardless which way it's resolved, the victims are exactly the same amount of dead.

Sorry, I should have put the \sarcasm switch at the end of my post.

whoooosh - went right over my head. Guess I've seen that same thing posted too many times with a straight face.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Investigators: Adam Lanza surrounded by weapons at home; attack took less than 5 minutes

Adam Lanza left a home stuffed with weaponry and carried out the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in a 154-bullet barrage that took less than five minutes, investigators said Thursday in the first detailed account of his surroundings and troubled state of mind.

Authorities also recovered a certificate in Lanza’s name from the National Rifle Association, seven of his journals, drawings that he made and books from the house, including books on living with mental illness.

At the school, Lanza fired the 154 rounds from a Bushmaster .223-model rifle and the final bullet from a Glock 10mm handgun to take his own life, said Stephen Sedensky, the chief prosecutor investigating the shooting. Police recovered 10 30-round magazines for the Bushmaster that Lanza took to the school. Three of the magazines had a full 30 rounds still in them.

Among school shootings in the United States, the death toll from Newtown is second only to the 32 people killed at Virginia Tech in 2007.

Do any of you gun supporters see anything upsetting about this??? People like this Adam Lanza have to be stopped.

Investigators: Adam Lanza surrounded by weapons at home; attack took less than 5 minutes - Open Channel

Didn't one of the RW liars on this board say that the bushmaster was left in the car? It is amazing how low these idiots will stoop...

Yes, in some lame, pathetic attempt to mitigate the tragedy.

It’s these rightwing extremists who pose the greatest threat to Second Amendment rights.

 

[FA_Q2]

Investigators: Adam Lanza surrounded by weapons at home; attack took less than 5 minutes

Adam Lanza left a home stuffed with weaponry and carried out the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in a 154-bullet barrage that took less than five minutes, investigators said Thursday in the first detailed account of his surroundings and troubled state of mind.

Authorities also recovered a certificate in Lanza’s name from the National Rifle Association, seven of his journals, drawings that he made and books from the house, including books on living with mental illness.

At the school, Lanza fired the 154 rounds from a Bushmaster .223-model rifle and the final bullet from a Glock 10mm handgun to take his own life, said Stephen Sedensky, the chief prosecutor investigating the shooting. Police recovered 10 30-round magazines for the Bushmaster that Lanza took to the school. Three of the magazines had a full 30 rounds still in them.

Among school shootings in the United States, the death toll from Newtown is second only to the 32 people killed at Virginia Tech in 2007.

Do any of you gun supporters see anything upsetting about this??? People like this Adam Lanza have to be stopped.

Investigators: Adam Lanza surrounded by weapons at home; attack took less than 5 minutes - Open Channel

Didn't one of the RW liars on this board say that the bushmaster was left in the car? It is amazing how low these idiots will stoop...

I remember that, and it was way more than one as I recall. I still think this is an obfuscation tactic. We should be asking ourselves "why do we have all these mass shootings?", and instead there's a gaggle of wags asking "which weapon did he use? What color was it? Did he have a backpack or a vest? How could he get that if it's illegal? What's the action like on that one?" ... ad nauseum.

It's a way of denying that the elephant in the room is in the room; when the elephant walks in the room, talk about the wallpaper and the ceiling and what's going on outside the window. Anything but the e-word.

You have to be fair about that though. That question was not asked when this occurred; it was asked when we were faced with legislators that were demanding ‘assault’ weapon bans because of this incident. In that context, the weapon used has some bearing.

If the weapon bans never arose, those questions would never have been asked. To frame the questions without the context is dishonest. It was the original intent of those that saw this as a chance to bend law to their agendas that have steered the national conversation on this. There has been little talk of real changes, of looking at things differently and the societal undertones that drive this behavior because that does not fit anyone’s agenda or allow anyone to grab more power.

TBH, I think that we could make a MASSIVE difference if these tragedies were not reported like they are. EVERYONE knows who the shooter is. That is a big draw for these people. It is a type of immortality. Almost no one can name a single victim though. It is not the Media’s fault though – they report what WE demand they report and that is communicated to them through ratings. As you pointed out earlier – WE need to make changes. It is sad though, I don’t think that they population at large is willing. They eat this shit up like candy all the while claiming that they don’t.

 

[eflatminor]

Didn't one of the RW liars on this board say that the bushmaster was left in the car? It is amazing how low these idiots will stoop...

Actually, ABC, NBC and CBS all initially reported that the AR was left in the car. They subsequently corrected themselves, but that's where the rumors started.

It is amazing how low idiots stoop. Thanks for making that clear.

CBS, NBC, ABC Admit No Assault Rifle Used at Sandy Hook | Alternative

 

[Pogo]

Didn't one of the RW liars on this board say that the bushmaster was left in the car? It is amazing how low these idiots will stoop...

I remember that, and it was way more than one as I recall. I still think this is an obfuscation tactic. We should be asking ourselves "why do we have all these mass shootings?", and instead there's a gaggle of wags asking "which weapon did he use? What color was it? Did he have a backpack or a vest? How could he get that if it's illegal? What's the action like on that one?" ... ad nauseum.

It's a way of denying that the elephant in the room is in the room; when the elephant walks in the room, talk about the wallpaper and the ceiling and what's going on outside the window. Anything but the e-word.

You have to be fair about that though. That question was not asked when this occurred; it was asked when we were faced with legislators that were demanding ‘assault’ weapon bans because of this incident. In that context, the weapon used has some bearing.

If the weapon bans never arose, those questions would never have been asked. To frame the questions without the context is dishonest. It was the original intent of those that saw this as a chance to bend law to their agendas that have steered the national conversation on this. There has been little talk of real changes, of looking at things differently and the societal undertones that drive this behavior because that does not fit anyone’s agenda or allow anyone to grab more power.

TBH, I think that we could make a MASSIVE difference if these tragedies were not reported like they are. EVERYONE knows who the shooter is. That is a big draw for these people. It is a type of immortality. Almost no one can name a single victim though. It is not the Media’s fault though – they report what WE demand they report and that is communicated to them through ratings. As you pointed out earlier – WE need to make changes. It is sad though, I don’t think that they population at large is willing. They eat this shit up like candy all the while claiming that they don’t.

There are a lot of worthy thoughts in here.

The relationship to an assault weapons ban, OK I can see that, but it doesn't explain the tangents off to whether a shooter was wearing a vest or a backpack, or how this particular model compares to that one. It also raises a flag when we think back to all the vehement denials about Lanza using the Bushmaster, insisting that was not the case and he left it in the car. Red flags because it reveals that the paramount issue to those insisters is not the safety of schoolchildren, but how will this affect Numero Uno's toys. And that belies a value that's related to the underlying values of the death culture I brought up in the first place; it strongly implies that Numero Uno's Toys (NUT for short) are more important that twenty six-year-olds getting gunned down in cold blood.

I'll have to disagree with the implication (if I read it correctly) that Newtown served anyone as a catalyst to advance a pre-existing agenda; I'm far more sympathetic to the view that these wanker politicians are taking a reactive stance, posturing to appear to do something, and that absent a string of shooting events, the issue would simply not have come up at all.

Finally I'm skeptical of the 'immortality' concept, given that the shooters are guaranteed to end up either jailed in infamy for life, or resolved to take their own life, ensuring that they'll be gone before the first news story breaks, which means they'll never get to taste that perverse fame. It seems much more to me that the goal is "I'll take as many out as I can before I have to take myself out". Much like shooting as many of the last video game aliens as you can while time is running out and you know you don't have enough points to continue, so you go out with guns blazing. The price he pays for indulgence in carnage.

(and this is another point I keep harping on -- these shooters are not out for murder, they're out for carnage. That's why they do it with guns)

Besides, we must understand the shooter and what drove him (and we notice, it's always a him, and that's unquestionably a large part of it). We can't do that if he's anonymous. The innocent victims did nothing to stand out as abnormal; the shooter did. Therefore we must know his name and try to know what made him tick. That's not glorifying what he did; the glorification is something we made sure was in place before he ever picked up his weapon. Had we not done that, he wouldn't have either.

 

[M14 Shooter]

I just want to be sure about this.
A Bushmaster is an assault weapon - right?

Not if it was sold 1994-2004.

Oh, that's interesting.
Did they change the design of them in those years or something?

Yes - they remived the flash suppressor and the bayonet lug.
After that, they were just semi-automatic rifles.

 

[JimH52]

Didn't one of the RW liars on this board say that the bushmaster was left in the car? It is amazing how low these idiots will stoop...

Actually, ABC, NBC and CBS all initially reported that the AR was left in the car. They subsequently corrected themselves, but that's where the rumors started.

It is amazing how low idiots stoop. Thanks for making that clear.

CBS, NBC, ABC Admit No Assault Rifle Used at Sandy Hook | Alternative

Oh but the poster was drooling with a "politicizing" attack. They even questioned whether the coroner was a lying...sick bast....ds

 

[WUN]

For the record, they are called MAGAZINES, NOT CLIPS


Ahhhh...that felt better.

For the record, this is not on the record. I don't read Guns and Ammo magazine. The point is you got the point.

 

[M14 Shooter]

For the record, they are called MAGAZINES, NOT CLIPS
Ahhhh...that felt better.

For the record, this is not on the record.

If you choose to remian ignorant, there's not much anyone can do about it.