Believe and be saved

[Vox]

If there was a moral bone in your body, you would know just how Satanic it is to punish an innocent for the evil deeds of the guilty. Did it ever occur to you that taking the easy way and agreeing to allow an innocent to be punished in your place for your transgressions, no matter how willing he might be, is the test of your suitability for salvation?? The Christian principle of allowing an innocent to be punished in place of the guilty is truly Satanic and not of God!!! You have been deceived in these end times.

what does this asinine rant have to do with a disagreement between branches of Christianity on what is necessary for salvation( and that is all Chuck was trying to prove by his quotes)?

Everything!

The Christians who say "faith without works is dead" [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]James 2:14-26 as well as the Christians who say [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]"For by grace are ye saved through faith: and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Ephesians 2:8, 9, both say they are "saved by the blood."
[

sweetheart, you would be much more coherent if you would learn the basics which you are trying to talk about.

you do not understand the difference between redemption, which is UNIVERSAL, and done by the blood and salvation, which is INDIVIDUAL and which is achieved by faith and works.

learn the basics of the issue you are trying to pose opinion of.

 

[edthecynic]

How is He blaming us by atoning for our sins?

He created sin! Quit blaming man for shit that God personally set up.

more boneheads on the board?

do you know what a free will means?

Obey or be punished has about as much to do with free will as "your money or your life."

 

[edthecynic]

what does this asinine rant have to do with a disagreement between branches of Christianity on what is necessary for salvation( and that is all Chuck was trying to prove by his quotes)?

Everything!

The Christians who say "faith without works is dead" [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]James 2:14-26 as well as the Christians who say [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]"For by grace are ye saved through faith: and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Ephesians 2:8, 9, both say they are "saved by the blood."
[

sweetheart, you would be much more coherent if you would learn the basics which you are trying to talk about.

you do not understand the difference between redemption, which is UNIVERSAL, and done by the blood and salvation, which is INDIVIDUAL and which is achieved by faith and works.

learn the basics of the issue you are trying to pose opinion of.

That is just doublespeak!

If they are separate, you are saying you can be redeemed without salvation and saved without redemption.

 

[GISMYS]

Everything!

The Christians who say "faith without works is dead" [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]James 2:14-26 as well as the Christians who say [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]"For by grace are ye saved through faith: and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Ephesians 2:8, 9, both say they are "saved by the blood."
[

sweetheart, you would be much more coherent if you would learn the basics which you are trying to talk about.

you do not understand the difference between redemption, which is UNIVERSAL, and done by the blood and salvation, which is INDIVIDUAL and which is achieved by faith and works.

learn the basics of the issue you are trying to pose opinion of.

That is just doublespeak!

If they are separate, you are saying you can be redeemed without salvation and saved without redemption.

Pray for a little wisdom and understanding!!!

 

[Vox]

Everything!

The Christians who say "faith without works is dead" [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]James 2:14-26 as well as the Christians who say [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]"For by grace are ye saved through faith: and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Ephesians 2:8, 9, both say they are "saved by the blood."
[

sweetheart, you would be much more coherent if you would learn the basics which you are trying to talk about.

you do not understand the difference between redemption, which is UNIVERSAL, and done by the blood and salvation, which is INDIVIDUAL and which is achieved by faith and works.

learn the basics of the issue you are trying to pose opinion of.

That is just doublespeak!

If they are separate, you are saying you can be redeemed without salvation and saved without redemption.

educate yourself, dear, so you do not prove the axiom that every bonehead has to be ignorant on the very issue he/she are fighting with.
I can extend it to your political affiliation as well, but you already know what I think about the general level of knowledge of your ilk
this particular subject just proves it again.

 

[kjw47]

God already knows that I plan to repent before I die. So it's an automatic repent, and god hasn't objected so far.

It doesn't work like that--everyone will be brought back to judgement for what they did in this lifetime.

You're not the fucking boss of what god allows or not.

You are right I am not the boss--Jesus is--And he says the only ones who will enter Gods kingdom are those who live this lifetime to do his Fathers will-Matt 7:21--- this is the bottom line of it all about being saved.

 

[GibsonSG]

It doesn't work like that--everyone will be brought back to judgement for what they did in this lifetime.

You're not the fucking boss of what god allows or not.

You are right I am not the boss--Jesus is--And he says the only ones who will enter Gods kingdom are those who live this lifetime to do his Fathers will-Matt 7:21--- this is the bottom line of it all about being saved.

Jesus never said that, it's all hearsay, written several generations after the facts. Anyways, Jesus doesn't need me to be his slave, he has you.

 

[Chuckt]

what does this asinine rant have to do with a disagreement between branches of Christianity on what is necessary for salvation( and that is all Chuck was trying to prove by his quotes)?

Everything!

The Christians who say "faith without works is dead" [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]James 2:14-26 as well as the Christians who say [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]"For by grace are ye saved through faith: and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Ephesians 2:8, 9, both say they are "saved by the blood."
[

sweetheart, you would be much more coherent if you would learn the basics which you are trying to talk about.

you do not understand the difference between redemption, which is UNIVERSAL, and done by the blood and salvation, which is INDIVIDUAL and which is achieved by faith and works.

learn the basics of the issue you are trying to pose opinion of.

Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

 

[Chuckt]

It doesn't work like that--everyone will be brought back to judgement for what they did in this lifetime.

You're not the fucking boss of what god allows or not.

You are right I am not the boss--Jesus is--And he says the only ones who will enter Gods kingdom are those who live this lifetime to do his Fathers will-Matt 7:21--- this is the bottom line of it all about being saved.

Where were the Jehovah's Witnesses on the day of Pentecost?

Jehovah's Witnesses Main Page

 

[kjw47]

You're not the fucking boss of what god allows or not.

You are right I am not the boss--Jesus is--And he says the only ones who will enter Gods kingdom are those who live this lifetime to do his Fathers will-Matt 7:21--- this is the bottom line of it all about being saved.

Where were the Jehovah's Witnesses on the day of Pentecost?

Jehovah's Witnesses Main Page

Receiving holy spirit-- every servant whom ever served the true God was a Jehovah witness(Isaiah 43:10,, 44:8)(--Jesus is #1- Rev 1:5)

 

[kjw47]

You're not the fucking boss of what god allows or not.

You are right I am not the boss--Jesus is--And he says the only ones who will enter Gods kingdom are those who live this lifetime to do his Fathers will-Matt 7:21--- this is the bottom line of it all about being saved.

Jesus never said that, it's all hearsay, written several generations after the facts. Anyways, Jesus doesn't need me to be his slave, he has you.

Then you will miss out on everlasting life--so then I guess we will never get to jam.

 

[Vox]

Everything!

The Christians who say "faith without works is dead"James 2:14-26 as well as the Christians who say]"For by grace are ye saved through faith: and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." Ephesians 2:8, 9, both say they are "saved by the blood."
[

sweetheart, you would be much more coherent if you would learn the basics which you are trying to talk about.

you do not understand the difference between redemption, which is UNIVERSAL, and done by the blood and salvation, which is INDIVIDUAL and which is achieved by faith and works.

learn the basics of the issue you are trying to pose opinion of.

Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

And? what is your point?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Actually, Deuteronomy 18:18 is speaking about the Prophet Muhammad. ..

who told you that? The verse specifically states that The Prophet would be an Israelite.

No it doesn't.

It says, "brethren".

Isaac and Ishmael were brothers.

And the children of Isaac (jews) are the brethren of the children of Ishmael (arabs).

Read your Bible........

Actually that is a Muslim heresy.

Remember that Islam is the illegitimate step child of Christianity as was Ishmael the illegitimate son of Isaac.

Read your Bible.

 

[Chuckt]

sweetheart, you would be much more coherent if you would learn the basics which you are trying to talk about.

you do not understand the difference between redemption, which is UNIVERSAL, and done by the blood and salvation, which is INDIVIDUAL and which is achieved by faith and works.

learn the basics of the issue you are trying to pose opinion of.

Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

And? what is your point?

It means you believe in dead works (Hebrews 6:1, Hebrews 9:14).

 

[Vox]

It means you believe in dead works (Hebrews 6:1, Hebrews 9:14).

no, it means you missed the point - For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also - James 2:14-26.

 

[Vox]

It is as clear as it can be :

14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

18 But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your[a] works, and I will show you my faith by my works. 19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?[c] 21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect? 23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”[d] And he was called the friend of God. 24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

25 Likewise, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way?

26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
James 2:14-26 NKJV - Faith Without Works Is Dead - What does - Bible Gateway

 

[Chuckt]

It means you believe in dead works (Hebrews 6:1, Hebrews 9:14).

no, it means you missed the point - For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also - James 2:14-26.

James is talking about justification before man because James uses the word 'show' (our faith) in James 2:18. You can have faith without showing it and you will be justified before God just as Abraham was justified before God.

James acknowledges that "Abraham believed God and it was counted to him as righteousness." (James 2:23)

Jesus says that you can’t justify yourself before God like you do with men. Jesus said to them, “..Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.”-Luke 16:15

You are trying to justify yourself before men and it is an abomination in the sight of God.

 

[Vox]

It means you believe in dead works (Hebrews 6:1, Hebrews 9:14).

no, it means you missed the point - For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also - James 2:14-26.

James is talking about justification before man because James uses the word 'show' (our faith) in James 2:18. You can have faith without showing it and you will be justified before God just as Abraham was justified before God.

James acknowledges that "Abraham believed God and it was counted to him as righteousness." (James 2:23)

Jesus says that you can’t justify yourself before God like you do with men. Jesus said to them, “..Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.”-Luke 16:15

You are trying to justify yourself before men and it is an abomination in the sight of God.

stop twisting the clear cut text by James, it won't work.

He states several times - faith without works IS dead. and it is. It needs works to lead you to salvation.

James is talking exactly about the issue if faith alone is sufficient for salvation. and explaining that it is NOT. clear and simple.

even with sarcasm that demons are also believers I bet they are - are they being saved by their faith ?

And Jesus said that He is going to Judge us at the Last Judgement EXACTLY by works - so your idiocy about faith only sufficient for salvation is just that - idiocy.
But you have the right to remain ignorant and reject the words of Jesus Christ - he gave you free will.

There is NOTHING here about faith AT ALL - just about works.

And I trust HIS words, not your false interpretations, Chuck

The Final Judgment

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? 39 And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40 And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers,[a] you did it to me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44 Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

 

[Chuckt]

no, it means you missed the point - For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also - James 2:14-26.

James is talking about justification before man because James uses the word 'show' (our faith) in James 2:18. You can have faith without showing it and you will be justified before God just as Abraham was justified before God.

James acknowledges that "Abraham believed God and it was counted to him as righteousness." (James 2:23)

Jesus says that you can’t justify yourself before God like you do with men. Jesus said to them, “..Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.”-Luke 16:15

You are trying to justify yourself before men and it is an abomination in the sight of God.

stop twisting the clear cut text by James, it won't work.

He states several times - faith without works IS dead. and it is. It needs works to lead you to salvation.

James is talking exactly about the issue if faith alone is sufficient for salvation. and explaining that it is NOT. clear and simple.

even with sarcasm that demons are also believers I bet they are - are they being saved by their faith ?

[/QUOTE]

Jesus didn't die for demons. Jesus died for me.

 

[Vox]

James is talking about justification before man because James uses the word 'show' (our faith) in James 2:18. You can have faith without showing it and you will be justified before God just as Abraham was justified before God.

James acknowledges that "Abraham believed God and it was counted to him as righteousness." (James 2:23)

Jesus says that you can’t justify yourself before God like you do with men. Jesus said to them, “..Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.”-Luke 16:15

You are trying to justify yourself before men and it is an abomination in the sight of God.

stop twisting the clear cut text by James, it won't work.

He states several times - faith without works IS dead. and it is. It needs works to lead you to salvation.

James is talking exactly about the issue if faith alone is sufficient for salvation. and explaining that it is NOT. clear and simple.

even with sarcasm that demons are also believers I bet they are - are they being saved by their faith ?

Jesus didn't die for demons. Jesus died for me.

and He said that you MUST have good works to be judged righteous on the Last Judgement.

Faith alone is not sufficient for salvation.

as a matter of fact He never even mentioned faith - just WORKS ONLY when He describes how is He going to be judging us.

I trust HIM, not you.