BREAKING: E-mails Show Lois Lerner Intentionally Sought to Hide Information from Cong

[Oldstyle]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

 

[Skylar]

Allen West? Damn, it must be true...

Clearly. And the best part? This is their smoking gun:

‘I was cautioning folks about email and how we have several occasions where Congress has asked for emails … we need to be cautious about what we say in emails’
Read more at BREAKING: E-mails Show Lois Lerner Intentionally Sought to Hide Information from Congress (VIDEO) - Allen West Republic

Be careful what you say in Emails........oh, the humanities? Its time for Civil war! Someone was careful in an *E-Mail*!

If you got nothing to hide why would you have to be careful in an email?

If after a 3 year investigation, a veritable graveyard of failed conspiracy batshyte, threats, dozens of congressional hearings, hundreds of witnesses, hundreds of thousands of emails, tantrums and millions of dollars spent, that is the best argument you can make for the 'IRS scandal'....

.......then you just wasted an enormous amount of time.

And to answer your question, Republican leaders had already said that someone WOULD be going to jail for this. Before the investigation, they'd already determined the punishment.

Even McCarthy waited for his hearings before threatening people. But it must be a conspiracy when Lerner tells her people to be 'careful' in the face of that hysteric and extra-legal witch hunt?

 

[ogibillm]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

i'll wager that it will come out that these groups were not primarily engaged social welfare and were not eligible for 501c4 status before any wrong doing in the 'irs scandal' is proven.

 

[asaratis]

How does saying to use caution when putting information in emails means she purposely targeted conservatives? How does that prove it?

It doesnt. No one claimed it did. Another straw man.
What it does mean is that she intentionally tried to hide activity from Congress. Now, what was it she was trying to hide? Think hard here.

Again what activity? To be obstructing justice, you have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that she interfered and prevented the natural progression of an investigation. Saying a general statement like use caution when sending emails isn't obstructing justice because she is not obligated to put everything she does in the email. That's way too broad.

Hiding two years worth of emails via a faked "hard drive crash" IS obstruction of justice.

 

[Skylar]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

Lets be honest: If you had the evidence to back your narrative, you'd be showing it to us. Not telling us what we 'all know'. You're insinuating an argument you can't factually support.

The republican narrative didn't pan out. They accused Obama. They accused his cabinet. They accused the IRS commisioner. They accused the IRS Labor rep. They accused Lerner. They accused Holder.

And at the end of a 3 year investigation, they can't back any of it. They can't establish any crime was committed by anyone. They can't even factually establish a political motivation.

But they can insinuate the shyte out of an argument they can't factually support. Just like you're doing now.

 

[CrazedScotsman]

It truly is funny how people attack who is telling the story. They kill the messenger in the hope that the message just goes away.

It's like if Fox News were to report that 2+2=4, many will say "It can't be true, look who's saying it".

It doesn't matter who's telling the story. Debunk the story not who's telling it.

What's crazy is that everyone does it. It don't matter what the source is, there will always be those who will say "It can't be true, look who's saying it".

 

[LoneLaugher]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

If you were concerned with being honest, you'd admit that what happened here was a procedural matter. The IRS needed to handle an influx of 501c applications following the 2101 election. They made some decisions to flag some terms that might be political in nature. For both ends of the spectrum.

This gives the appearance of impropriety......and that is all dickheads like Issa need.

The rest is bullshit. And it will end in no arrests. It has, however, done what Issa intended it to do.

Congrats.

 

[Skylar]

It doesnt. No one claimed it did. Another straw man.
What it does mean is that she intentionally tried to hide activity from Congress. Now, what was it she was trying to hide? Think hard here.

Again what activity? To be obstructing justice, you have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that she interfered and prevented the natural progression of an investigation. Saying a general statement like use caution when sending emails isn't obstructing justice because she is not obligated to put everything she does in the email. That's way too broad.

Hiding two years worth of emails via a faked "hard drive crash" IS obstruction of justice.

But who said the hard drive crash was 'fake'. When the Bush Justice Department was being investigated by Congress for its firing of US government attorneys....and they were reviewing emails, guess what?

Many where lost because of crashed hard drives. Republicans didn't say shyte about it, and certainly didn't insinuate that the Bush white house was 'hiding' emails with 'fake' hard drive crashes.

But this time its different huh? Sorry, but you'll need to present evidence to support that narrative. Because conservative have cried wolf *far* too often on this issue to be given the benefit of the doubt for their latest round of baseless accusations.

 

[Skylar]

The rest is bullshit. And it will end in no arrests. It has, however, done what Issa intended it to do.

Yup. It provided republicans with a 'fire and forget' platform for any baseless accusation they wanted to lob. Remember when they told us that Obama had orchestrated the entire thing in order to disenfranchise Tea Party republicans to 'steal' the 2012 election.

Yeah, conservatives don't mention that one anymore, do they? There's zero evidence of it.

Remember when they told us that th IRS commissioner visiting the White House was proof of their plot to deny Tea Party groups approval for their tax exempt status?

Another 'fire and forget' claim that went off into the aether like a fart in the wind.

Remember when they accused IRS labor rep Colleen Kelly of being the conduit between the white house and the IRS, shuttling their plans back and forth?

You don't hear that one much anymore either.

Remember when they said that Lerner was plotting to stop Tea Party groups and ordered it to further her own political agenda?

There's exactly dick back up that narrative. But who cares? The accusation was still made. And that's all many republicans are going to remember.

Not that the accusation turned out to be steaming pile of horseshyte. Not that the emails actually prove the exact opposite. Not that the accusation was debunked so thoroughly, it was embarrassing to watch.

Many conservatives just remember the accusation. Its the beauty of pitching political ideas to low information voters.

 

[Oldstyle]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

Lets be honest: If you had the evidence to back your narrative, you'd be showing it to us. Not telling us what we 'all know'. You're insinuating an argument you can't factually support.

The republican narrative didn't pan out. They accused Obama. They accused his cabinet. They accused the IRS commisioner. They accused the IRS Labor rep. They accused Lerner. They accused Holder.

And at the end of a 3 year investigation, they can't back any of it. They can't establish any crime was committed by anyone. They can't even factually establish a political motivation.

But they can insinuate the shyte out of an argument they can't factually support. Just like you're doing now.

So your point is that because the Obama Administration successfully stonewalled an investigation for years, what happened in the IRS...didn't happen? LOL Sorry, Skylar but that's laughable. This isn't a "narrative"...this is people in power using the IRS to target their political opponents. You SHOULD be concerned about that NO MATTER WHAT YOUR POLITICAL AFFILIATION IS!

 

[Skylar]

It truly is funny how people attack who is telling the story. They kill the messenger in the hope that the message just goes away.

It's like if Fox News were to report that 2+2=4, many will say "It can't be true, look who's saying it".

It doesn't matter who's telling the story. Debunk the story not who's telling it.

What's crazy is that everyone does it. It don't matter what the source is, there will always be those who will say "It can't be true, look who's saying it".

The obvious problem with that narrative is that Fox isn't saying '2 plus 2 is 4'. They're offering commentators who lob up some of the most baseless, batshyte conspiracy theories imaginable regarding the 'IRS scandal'. Claims that are not only unsubstantiated, but explicitly contradicted by overwhelming evidence.

And after 3 years, dozens of hearings, hundreds of witnesses, millions of emails, and an endless litanny of baseless accusations....

......the conservative narrative didn't pan out. The evidence simply didn't support it.

 

[ogibillm]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

If you were concerned with being honest, you'd admit that what happened here was a procedural matter. The IRS needed to handle an influx of 501c applications following the 2101 election. They made some decisions to flag some terms that might be political in nature. For both ends of the spectrum.

This gives the appearance of impropriety......and that is all dickheads like Issa need.

The rest is bullshit. And it will end in no arrests. It has, however, done what Issa intended it to do.

Congrats.

that's the bitch of it. i'm more inclined to believe the 501c4 tea party organizations are not engaged primarily in social welfare and were looking to skirt the law to throw the most money behind their candidates than i am to believe there was a mass conspiracy to target conservative groups.

 

[BlindBoo]

It doesnt. No one claimed it did. Another straw man.
What it does mean is that she intentionally tried to hide activity from Congress. Now, what was it she was trying to hide? Think hard here.

Again what activity? To be obstructing justice, you have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that she interfered and prevented the natural progression of an investigation. Saying a general statement like use caution when sending emails isn't obstructing justice because she is not obligated to put everything she does in the email. That's way too broad.

Hiding two years worth of emails via a faked "hard drive crash" IS obstruction of justice.

An the email in question proves that accusation how?

 

[Skylar]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

Lets be honest: If you had the evidence to back your narrative, you'd be showing it to us. Not telling us what we 'all know'. You're insinuating an argument you can't factually support.

The republican narrative didn't pan out. They accused Obama. They accused his cabinet. They accused the IRS commisioner. They accused the IRS Labor rep. They accused Lerner. They accused Holder.

And at the end of a 3 year investigation, they can't back any of it. They can't establish any crime was committed by anyone. They can't even factually establish a political motivation.

But they can insinuate the shyte out of an argument they can't factually support. Just like you're doing now.

So your point is that because the Obama Administration successfully stonewalled an investigation for years, what happened in the IRS...didn't happen? LOL Sorry, Skylar but that's laughable. This isn't a "narrative"...this is people in power using the IRS to target their political opponents. You SHOULD be concerned about that NO MATTER WHAT YOUR POLITICAL AFFILIATION IS!

My point is, republicans have been crying wolf on this issue for literally years. They have offered a verifable army of baseless, fact free accusations that when investigated, didn't pan out. They've found no crimes. They've found no political motivations. They've found only their own accusations which they use as the basis to *insinuate* an argument they know they cant factually support.

If you or they had the evidence to back your 'what every knows' narrative, you'd present it. But you don't. Because that evidence doesn't exist. Which is why you've slipped into insinuation, innuendo and baseless speculation.

Insinuation, innuendo and speculation which among conservatives has a *spectacular* record of failure, inaccuracy, and plain old batshytery.

But this time its different, huh? Show me. Don't tell me.

 

[Oldstyle]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

If you were concerned with being honest, you'd admit that what happened here was a procedural matter. The IRS needed to handle an influx of 501c applications following the 2101 election. They made some decisions to flag some terms that might be political in nature. For both ends of the spectrum.

This gives the appearance of impropriety......and that is all dickheads like Issa need.

The rest is bullshit. And it will end in no arrests. It has, however, done what Issa intended it to do.

Congrats.

If that really WERE the case, Laugher? Why wouldn't the IRS, Lois Lerner and the Obama White House welcome an investigation? Why would Lerner be planting questions she wanted to be asked right before the IG's report came out? Why would 7 computer hard drives crash at the IRS right after Camp started asking questions about what happened? Why would Lois Lerner take the 5th? This isn't the "appearance of impropriety"...this is using the IRS to target people because of their political leanings.

 

[jillian]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

1. what so-called conservative group was denied its status?

(hint: the answer is none

2. the so-called conservative groups could have just filed their returns. they did not need IRS permission.

3. the law PROHIBITS 501(c)(4) corporations from engaging in political activity so the wingnut tea party groups should really be quiet since they were breaking the law anyway.

 

[ogibillm]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

1. what so-called conservative group was denied its status?

(hint: the answer is none

2. the so-called conservative groups could have just filed their returns. they did not need IRS permission.

3. the law PROHIBITS 501(c)(4) corporations from engaging in political activity so the wingnut tea party groups should really be quiet since they were breaking the law anyway.

the law doesn't prohibit them from engaging in political activity - it just can't be their primary activity. that has to be social welfare.

so what do these tea party groups do other than political activity? that's the real irs scandal. insufficient rules and testing to enforce the law.

 

[Oldstyle]

Lets be honest: If you had the evidence to back your narrative, you'd be showing it to us. Not telling us what we 'all know'. You're insinuating an argument you can't factually support.

The republican narrative didn't pan out. They accused Obama. They accused his cabinet. They accused the IRS commisioner. They accused the IRS Labor rep. They accused Lerner. They accused Holder.

And at the end of a 3 year investigation, they can't back any of it. They can't establish any crime was committed by anyone. They can't even factually establish a political motivation.

But they can insinuate the shyte out of an argument they can't factually support. Just like you're doing now.

So your point is that because the Obama Administration successfully stonewalled an investigation for years, what happened in the IRS...didn't happen? LOL Sorry, Skylar but that's laughable. This isn't a "narrative"...this is people in power using the IRS to target their political opponents. You SHOULD be concerned about that NO MATTER WHAT YOUR POLITICAL AFFILIATION IS!

My point is, republicans have been crying wolf on this issue for literally years. They have offered a verifable army of baseless, fact free accusations that when investigated, didn't pan out. They've found no crimes. They've found no political motivations. They've found only their own accusations which they use as the basis to *insinuate* an argument they know they cant factually support.

If you or they had the evidence to back your 'what every knows' narrative, you'd present it. But you don't. Because that evidence doesn't exist. Which is why you've slipped into insinuation, innuendo and baseless speculation.

Insinuation, innuendo and speculation which among conservatives has a *spectacular* record of failure, inaccuracy, and plain old batshytery.

But this time its different, huh? Show me. Don't tell me.

You do realize that sooner or later they will get to the bottom of this? I'm more than happy to be patient and let the investigation take place. I think we both know why you Obama supporters are so desperate to "move on" to something else.

The fact of the matter is that if this really WAS "batshytery" all those involved would have WELCOMED an investigation and would have cooperated fully.

 

[Oldstyle]

Let's be honest here...I think we all know that Lerner's group within the IRS targeted conservative groups. The investigating committees are having a hard time nailing this down only because Lerner won't talk, the IRS's new commissioner is being less than forthcoming and Eric Holder's Justice Department will never in a million years look into this. It will come out...it's going to take a long time because of the stonewalling of the investigations...but it will come out.

1. what so-called conservative group was denied its status?

(hint: the answer is none

2. the so-called conservative groups could have just filed their returns. they did not need IRS permission.

3. the law PROHIBITS 501(c)(4) corporations from engaging in political activity so the wingnut tea party groups should really be quiet since they were breaking the law anyway.

Come on, Jillian...that talking point was debunked years ago! Just because you don't deny status doesn't mean that you haven't delayed status for YEARS! That's what Lerner's group in the IRS did! They had those conservative groups jumping through hoop after hoop...forcing them to fill out paperwork that nobody else had to...to answer questions that nobody else had to.

 

[Oldstyle]

If the same type of behavior took place with a minority trying to vote...with elections staff not denying their right to vote...but making them answer questions that others were not asked...and demanding that they provide pages and pages of documents that others were not asked to provide...you liberals would be foaming at the mouth (and rightfully so!) over it. But because it was conservative groups that were treated this way...you're fine with it.