Can you be religious and pro science and technology?

[ding]

Your ability to misapply context is epic. The irony of your choice of using 1984 as your example was ironic.

.

Your ability to misapply context is epic. The irony of your choice of using 1984 as your example was ironic.

epic as well for the manuscripts that were discarded in the 4th century to write the NT, were those included in your 24000 copies.

No. They weren't. So what?

.

No. They weren't. So what?

View attachment 111443

So what ...

the historical record from that time to the present for the deception of the 4th century to disguise their agenda as a religion speaks for itself and those who continue to deny its legacy rather than righting their wrong.

You are like a broken record.

.

You are like a broken record.

that's called the legacy of christianity ... not everyone is so enamored as you.

MLK was.

 

[ding]

Who are you to say His miracles were not possible? I accept the accounts without the need to rationalize my own explanation. Why? Because I have tested it and He has transformed me. According to you, I must not be intelligent. I know that is not true. And no, if it is as you say, then it does make it less miraculous.

Thats fine with me. If you can go through life having read a story thats proclaims to be about a matter of eternal life or death without thinking very deeply about it, goodie for you. You were never transformed, you were lobotomized.

And its not about me rationalizing and making something up out of nothing. I have taken from what is there and revealed new meaning, hidden teaching, that you did not know was there before without adding or subtracting a single word. Hidden truth that renders your entire belief system silly and obsolete. You can't say its not there, I have shown it to you. You can't say its irrelevant, it is teaching drawn from the very words of of the man you call God.

And if you really want to know, 'just believing' dogma established in 325 c.e. by superstitious gentiles completely ignorant about Jewish thought, belief, and literary expressions, without thinking very deeply about it, really it isn't very smart at all..

You have confused faith with obstinate stupidity.

Even so, whether you like it or not, munching on Godflesh every Sunday will never be the same.

It doesn't sound like it is fine with you.

 

[xband]

Who are you to say His miracles were not possible? I accept the accounts without the need to rationalize my own explanation. Why? Because I have tested it and He has transformed me. According to you, I must not be intelligent. I know that is not true. And no, if it is as you say, then it does make it less miraculous.

Thats fine with me. If you can go through life having read a story thats proclaims to be about a matter of eternal life or death without thinking very deeply about it, goodie for you. You were never transformed, you were lobotomized.

And its not about me rationalizing and making something up out of nothing. I have taken from what is there and revealed new meaning, hidden teaching, that you did not know was there before without adding or subtracting a single word. Hidden truth that renders your entire belief system silly and obsolete. You can't say its not there, I have shown it to you. You can't say its irrelevant, it is teaching drawn from the very words of of the man you call God.

And if you really want to know, 'just believing' dogma established in 325 c.e. by superstitious gentiles completely ignorant about Jewish thought, belief, and literary expressions, without thinking very deeply about it, really it isn't very smart at all..

You have confused faith with obstinate stupidity.

Even so, whether you like it or not, munching on Godflesh every Sunday will never be the same.

It doesn't sound like it is fine with you.

Which reminds me that I need another jar of Miracle Whip.

 

[BreezeWood]

.
epic as well for the manuscripts that were discarded in the 4th century to write the NT, were those included in your 24000 copies.

No. They weren't. So what?

.

No. They weren't. So what?

View attachment 111443

So what ...

the historical record from that time to the present for the deception of the 4th century to disguise their agenda as a religion speaks for itself and those who continue to deny its legacy rather than righting their wrong.

You are like a broken record.

.

You are like a broken record.

that's called the legacy of christianity ... not everyone is so enamored as you.

MLK was.

.

MLK was.

I've already stated MLK was a Southern Baptist and tangentially true to the original religion - not the 4th century RCC bible that is a contrived political agenda serendipitly disguised as a religion.

bing is the perfect example of either the carrier or the unlikely victim ... undoubtedly the former.

 

[ding]

No. They weren't. So what?

.

No. They weren't. So what?

View attachment 111443

So what ...

the historical record from that time to the present for the deception of the 4th century to disguise their agenda as a religion speaks for itself and those who continue to deny its legacy rather than righting their wrong.

You are like a broken record.

.

You are like a broken record.

that's called the legacy of christianity ... not everyone is so enamored as you.

MLK was.

.

MLK was.

I've already stated MLK was a Southern Baptist and tangentially true to the original religion - not the 4th century RCC bible that is a contrived political agenda serendipitly disguised as a religion.

bing is the perfect example of either the carrier or the unlikely victim ... undoubtedly the former.

The Baptist work from the same Bible, lol. There is no difference.

 

[Cecilie1200]

The Bible tells us that Creation was created in steps. Science tells us that the universe and everything in it was created in steps.

The Bible is mythological folklore.
How can anyone take that crap seriously in modern times?

Wow, thanks for sharing your personal opinion, masquerading as a statement of fact. I'll get right on not giving a crap about it.

My statement about the Bible folklore is fact. How is the Bible relevant in modern times other than group rituals?
Is there any knowledge there about how physical reality works ... other than cultural anthropology patterns?

Please explain to me how your assertion relates to the thread topic.

 

[Cecilie1200]

No, I say that like I'm speaking for NO denominations, but rather like I'm speaking for the overarching tenets of Christianity, irregardless of the individual quibblings of humans (which quibblings, by the way, would probably mean nothing to anyone outside the denominations involved, despite the secular world's insistence on trying to pretend they are huge, doctrinal schisms).

I just had this discussion with my husband the other night, as a matter of fact. As a significantly newer Christian than myself, he wanted to know why we - Christians - didn't simply focus on the teachings and ministry of Christ while he was on Earth, but instead also included studies of the many centuries before Christ - the Old Testament - and the writings of the Apostles who lived after Christ had already died, been resurrected, and returned to Heaven.

I told him there were two reasons. The first is context. The ministry of Christ means nothing whatsoever if you don't know the history of why He came to Earth to be born, crucified, and resurrected, and what the old Covenant was which His sacrifice replaced. (By the way, if you're asking yourself right now, "Covenant? What the heck is she talking about?" then you don't know enough about Christianity to be questioning it or criticizing it, and need to take yourself off to a really good church to be educated before propounding any further on the topic.)

The second is that Christianity is a fairly complex endeavor, a deeply textured and nuanced system of beliefs intended to be applied to every moment of one's day. (Yes, I'm quite aware that the secular world insists on telling us that it's something one does merely in a church building on Sundays that should be separated from everyday life, but no true Christian should be asking or caring what the world thinks on the subject.) Christ's ministry on Earth only lasted about three years, and was never intended to encompass everything God had to say to us on the subject of how to be a Christian. Therefore, we also include other divinely inspired writings and prophecies that He provided for us. (Please don't even bother trying to haggle with me over who was and wasn't divinely inspired, and who should and shouldn't be included in the Bible. I didn't ask for your opinion on what and who to believe, and won't listen to it even if you insist on giving it to me, anyway.)

And finally, in response to your second "question", I have little to no interest in your snarky little "Aha!" cherrypickings, as they only show the truth of the saying that "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing." If you truly wish to pick apart the beliefs of Christianity based on your vast knowledge of it, may I suggest that you first acquire that vast knowledge and then come back and see me?

Translation: Yes, I'm holier than thou because I say so, heathen. Yes, I eat pork and shrimp Po'boys like donuts at a Cop convention so quit acting so smart simply because you've read the Bible and have questions.

Sweetie, I have no desire to "pick apart the beliefs of Christianity", but I do question those believers who cherry-pick their beliefs. The message of Christ is "good news" and I agree using the OT as context is excellent, but when you cherry-pick out of the OT to support your own prejudices but disregard things like adultery and eating pork without justifying it, I question your honesty.

I'll certainly keep all this in mind if I ever feel compelled to justify my religious beliefs to you and request your approval. I doubt it will happen, but I suppose it's technically possible I could sustain a severe head injury of some sort.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Were the ancient Egyptians anti-science or anti-tech? I mean, they made some spectacular advancements in mathematics, writing, machinery and architecture. And they were as religious as it gets

.

Were the ancient Egyptians anti-science or anti-tech? I mean, they made some spectacular advancements in mathematics, writing, machinery and architecture. And they were as religious as it gets

the hierarchy's of all organized religions throughout history have opposed fields of study other than their particular religion as threats to their authority and have worked to minimize their influence. incorporating the sciences as they have is their way of keeping them under control.

Religion was the basis of social hierarchy in ancient Egypt, which in turn led to specialization, which in turn led to scientific advancement.
That was one step in a long process. Doesn't mean we should adopt the Egyptian social order of slavery and privilege. Today we have media to pacify and distract the masses, and organized police forces, and free education for all. But it took a lot of steps to get here.

.

Religion was the basis of social hierarchy in ancient Egypt, which in turn led to specialization, which in turn led to scientific advancement.
That was one step in a long process. Doesn't mean we should adopt the Egyptian social order of slavery and privilege. Today we have media to pacify and distract the masses, and organized police forces, and free education for all. But it took a lot of steps to get here.

even today in the USA organized religion's are fighting against public education because of their lack of control. it is disingenuous to represent religion as a precursor for science when in most cases they are adversaries.

So you're saying the pro-science position is to send your children to public schools that routinely turn out adults who can't even read and write effectively?

 

[Dr Grump]

[
I'll certainly keep all this in mind if I ever feel compelled to justify my religious beliefs to you and request your approval. I doubt it will happen, but I suppose it's technically possible I could sustain a severe head injury of some sort.

Oh the irony after your ranting drivel to him....
I already thought you had a head injury. You mean, you're like you are through choice? hhhhmmm..

No wonder you're a religious nutter...

 

[Andylusion]

Well if you want to call all the other ancient texts to be all "shady". That's fine. Your choice. But there are literally thousands of people who study ancient texts that would laugh you off the planet. You would be considered the nut case, that you claim I am.

If that's the reputation you want, by all means go to all the universities, and promote your view. See how long that lasts. Take videos by the way. It will make a great youtube clip.

It's completely absurd to claim the bible is true because other books may or may not be true. Each books must be taken on its own worth. You therefore have no proof, just alternate facts.

By all means, promote your claim to any major university you want. Take video. Let's see how that plan of your works. We'll see what all the experts of the world have to say is absurd. By all means. I will enjoy the show.

You're a fucking doofus if you think you can prove the veracity of the bible by pointing to another book and saying "Look! That book is true, so the bible is true as well!" Go ahead, take that (non-)logic to a university and see what they say.

I don't think that was the original claim. At least not the claim I was arguing against.

The claim was that we can't trust that the Bible we have, is the Bible that was written.

If you want to argue that what was originally written is wrong... then that's a different argument.

But as far as suggesting that the Bible we have, is somehow drastically modified from what was the foundational basis of the early Christian church, and early Christian beliefs, that argument is false.

Take Homer’s Iliad for example. Is any part, or all of Homer's Iliad true? We could debate that. But is Homer's Iliad the real deal? Is it, what was originally written?

Well, people who study these ancient texts, have standards and requirements, by which they determine authenticity.

The standards by which they have proven the authenticity of Homer's Iliad, and numerous other ancient texts, the Bible not only meets all of them, but exceeds them many times over.

There is no question, no doubt, no debate by anyone of any authority, that the Bible we have today, is in fact the exact same text that was written 2,000 years ago.

You think what was written was wrong. And you have the right to be wrong about that. But short of blatant intellectual dishonesty, you can not argue the Bible has in any significant or meaningful way, changed from that which was written by the Authors.

In order for you to say that the Bible we have, isn't the same as the Bible that was written nearly 2,000 years ago, you would have to say that all ancient texts of the world, are frauds, and all the scholars, and Ph.d of academic study of these ancient texts, are also all frauds.

And that would make you a larger fool than you have claimed I am, by many times over... but it would still make a great youtube video to see you try and make that claim at a university.

Ok, time for you to move the goalposts, no problem.
It doesn't really matter to me if the bible has stayed the same or not (the King James version sure didn't), but if you agree that it's a book of fiction, then we're on the same page.

If anyone changed the goal post, that would be you. The comment I responded to, was that the 4th Century Bible is not the same as the versions before it.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true. I'm a Christian. You're a pagan. We're not ever going to be on the same page. I'm ok with that. Unless you become a Christian... but clearly that isn't happening any time soon.

 

[Andylusion]

Andy, here's a small test to see if the bible is true: how did Noah get kangaroos from Australia and then back again after the flood?

Don't know. Is anything impossible for an all powerful G-d? He created the entire universe. Getting a couple of animals from A to B, to him, is much easier than Amtrak getting people from LA to Seattle.

So you have no plausible theory, so you simply attribute all the nonsense in the bible to magic? Brah, you need to up your critical thinking game.
So if there's an all-powerful god looking out for us, why doesn't he cure cancer? Deformed babies? ...

There was no cancer to cure prior to us screwing up his design. Read the Bible dude. IT explains it pretty clearly. Creation was perfect and sinless. When we screwed up the world by rebelling against G-d, we tainted creation.

Believe it or not, G-d is not obligated to fix what you break.

And neither is he obligated to meet your demands to know how he did everything.

When I was growing up in my parents home, I had no idea how that home was built, or how they paid for it. It never occurred to me that until they explained it, I would refuse to accept my parents existence or authority.

And by the way... G-d will explain everything, and fix everything in the end. Read Revelations.

Of course that doesn't apply to you... Only the people who accept the Lord, will be in the recreated paradise. Where you'll be, I don't know. Depends on your choices before you die.

 

[BreezeWood]

It's completely absurd to claim the bible is true because other books may or may not be true. Each books must be taken on its own worth. You therefore have no proof, just alternate facts.

By all means, promote your claim to any major university you want. Take video. Let's see how that plan of your works. We'll see what all the experts of the world have to say is absurd. By all means. I will enjoy the show.

You're a fucking doofus if you think you can prove the veracity of the bible by pointing to another book and saying "Look! That book is true, so the bible is true as well!" Go ahead, take that (non-)logic to a university and see what they say.

I don't think that was the original claim. At least not the claim I was arguing against.

The claim was that we can't trust that the Bible we have, is the Bible that was written.

If you want to argue that what was originally written is wrong... then that's a different argument.

But as far as suggesting that the Bible we have, is somehow drastically modified from what was the foundational basis of the early Christian church, and early Christian beliefs, that argument is false.

Take Homer’s Iliad for example. Is any part, or all of Homer's Iliad true? We could debate that. But is Homer's Iliad the real deal? Is it, what was originally written?

Well, people who study these ancient texts, have standards and requirements, by which they determine authenticity.

The standards by which they have proven the authenticity of Homer's Iliad, and numerous other ancient texts, the Bible not only meets all of them, but exceeds them many times over.

There is no question, no doubt, no debate by anyone of any authority, that the Bible we have today, is in fact the exact same text that was written 2,000 years ago.

You think what was written was wrong. And you have the right to be wrong about that. But short of blatant intellectual dishonesty, you can not argue the Bible has in any significant or meaningful way, changed from that which was written by the Authors.

In order for you to say that the Bible we have, isn't the same as the Bible that was written nearly 2,000 years ago, you would have to say that all ancient texts of the world, are frauds, and all the scholars, and Ph.d of academic study of these ancient texts, are also all frauds.

And that would make you a larger fool than you have claimed I am, by many times over... but it would still make a great youtube video to see you try and make that claim at a university.

Ok, time for you to move the goalposts, no problem.
It doesn't really matter to me if the bible has stayed the same or not (the King James version sure didn't), but if you agree that it's a book of fiction, then we're on the same page.

If anyone changed the goal post, that would be you. The comment I responded to, was that the 4th Century Bible is not the same as the versions before it.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true. I'm a Christian. You're a pagan. We're not ever going to be on the same page. I'm ok with that. Unless you become a Christian... but clearly that isn't happening any time soon.

.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true.

christianity will only survive as long as there is their 4th century bible to maintain it without that book the deception will cease to exist.

 

[BreezeWood]

.
View attachment 111443

So what ...

the historical record from that time to the present for the deception of the 4th century to disguise their agenda as a religion speaks for itself and those who continue to deny its legacy rather than righting their wrong.

You are like a broken record.

.

You are like a broken record.

that's called the legacy of christianity ... not everyone is so enamored as you.

MLK was.

.

MLK was.

I've already stated MLK was a Southern Baptist and tangentially true to the original religion - not the 4th century RCC bible that is a contrived political agenda serendipitly disguised as a religion.

bing is the perfect example of either the carrier or the unlikely victim ... undoubtedly the former.

The Baptist work from the same Bible, lol. There is no difference.

.

The Baptist work from the same Bible, lol. There is no difference.

are they RCC, no - they are not the same they just do not realize the 4th century bible is the problem ... their problem for not solving the problem. and no, they are not necessarily any better than you.

 

[ding]

You are like a broken record.

.

You are like a broken record.

that's called the legacy of christianity ... not everyone is so enamored as you.

MLK was.

.

MLK was.

I've already stated MLK was a Southern Baptist and tangentially true to the original religion - not the 4th century RCC bible that is a contrived political agenda serendipitly disguised as a religion.

bing is the perfect example of either the carrier or the unlikely victim ... undoubtedly the former.

The Baptist work from the same Bible, lol. There is no difference.

.

The Baptist work from the same Bible, lol. There is no difference.

are they RCC, no - they are not the same they just do not realize the 4th century bible is the problem ... their problem for not solving the problem. and no, they are not necessarily any better than you.

But MLK gets a pass, right?

 

[Andylusion]

By all means, promote your claim to any major university you want. Take video. Let's see how that plan of your works. We'll see what all the experts of the world have to say is absurd. By all means. I will enjoy the show.

You're a fucking doofus if you think you can prove the veracity of the bible by pointing to another book and saying "Look! That book is true, so the bible is true as well!" Go ahead, take that (non-)logic to a university and see what they say.

I don't think that was the original claim. At least not the claim I was arguing against.

The claim was that we can't trust that the Bible we have, is the Bible that was written.

If you want to argue that what was originally written is wrong... then that's a different argument.

But as far as suggesting that the Bible we have, is somehow drastically modified from what was the foundational basis of the early Christian church, and early Christian beliefs, that argument is false.

Take Homer’s Iliad for example. Is any part, or all of Homer's Iliad true? We could debate that. But is Homer's Iliad the real deal? Is it, what was originally written?

Well, people who study these ancient texts, have standards and requirements, by which they determine authenticity.

The standards by which they have proven the authenticity of Homer's Iliad, and numerous other ancient texts, the Bible not only meets all of them, but exceeds them many times over.

There is no question, no doubt, no debate by anyone of any authority, that the Bible we have today, is in fact the exact same text that was written 2,000 years ago.

You think what was written was wrong. And you have the right to be wrong about that. But short of blatant intellectual dishonesty, you can not argue the Bible has in any significant or meaningful way, changed from that which was written by the Authors.

In order for you to say that the Bible we have, isn't the same as the Bible that was written nearly 2,000 years ago, you would have to say that all ancient texts of the world, are frauds, and all the scholars, and Ph.d of academic study of these ancient texts, are also all frauds.

And that would make you a larger fool than you have claimed I am, by many times over... but it would still make a great youtube video to see you try and make that claim at a university.

Ok, time for you to move the goalposts, no problem.
It doesn't really matter to me if the bible has stayed the same or not (the King James version sure didn't), but if you agree that it's a book of fiction, then we're on the same page.

If anyone changed the goal post, that would be you. The comment I responded to, was that the 4th Century Bible is not the same as the versions before it.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true. I'm a Christian. You're a pagan. We're not ever going to be on the same page. I'm ok with that. Unless you become a Christian... but clearly that isn't happening any time soon.

.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true.

christianity will only survive as long as there is their 4th century bible to maintain it without that book the deception will cease to exist.

First, I doubt you fully understand your own claims.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

Voltaire in 1750s said of Jesus "Curse the wretch. In 20 years, Christianity will be no more. My single hand will destroy the edifice it took 12 apostles to rear.”

After his death his residence in Geneva was used by the Bible society to distribute Bibles.

The difference between you, a random internet poster and Voltaire, is that you don't have the reputation, influence, and public credentials as Voltaire.

The one thing you have in common... both of you will fail equally in spectacular misery, while the Bible will continue: "until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." -Jesus in Matthew 5

You have a better chance of winning the super lotto 5 times over by tossing ping pong balls off the empire state building, and counting the shards left over to determine your numbers.... than ever getting rid of the Bible. You'll be dead so long, no one in your own family can remember your name, before the Bible ever passes away.

 

[BreezeWood]

You're a fucking doofus if you think you can prove the veracity of the bible by pointing to another book and saying "Look! That book is true, so the bible is true as well!" Go ahead, take that (non-)logic to a university and see what they say.

I don't think that was the original claim. At least not the claim I was arguing against.

The claim was that we can't trust that the Bible we have, is the Bible that was written.

If you want to argue that what was originally written is wrong... then that's a different argument.

But as far as suggesting that the Bible we have, is somehow drastically modified from what was the foundational basis of the early Christian church, and early Christian beliefs, that argument is false.

Take Homer’s Iliad for example. Is any part, or all of Homer's Iliad true? We could debate that. But is Homer's Iliad the real deal? Is it, what was originally written?

Well, people who study these ancient texts, have standards and requirements, by which they determine authenticity.

The standards by which they have proven the authenticity of Homer's Iliad, and numerous other ancient texts, the Bible not only meets all of them, but exceeds them many times over.

There is no question, no doubt, no debate by anyone of any authority, that the Bible we have today, is in fact the exact same text that was written 2,000 years ago.

You think what was written was wrong. And you have the right to be wrong about that. But short of blatant intellectual dishonesty, you can not argue the Bible has in any significant or meaningful way, changed from that which was written by the Authors.

In order for you to say that the Bible we have, isn't the same as the Bible that was written nearly 2,000 years ago, you would have to say that all ancient texts of the world, are frauds, and all the scholars, and Ph.d of academic study of these ancient texts, are also all frauds.

And that would make you a larger fool than you have claimed I am, by many times over... but it would still make a great youtube video to see you try and make that claim at a university.

Ok, time for you to move the goalposts, no problem.
It doesn't really matter to me if the bible has stayed the same or not (the King James version sure didn't), but if you agree that it's a book of fiction, then we're on the same page.

If anyone changed the goal post, that would be you. The comment I responded to, was that the 4th Century Bible is not the same as the versions before it.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true. I'm a Christian. You're a pagan. We're not ever going to be on the same page. I'm ok with that. Unless you become a Christian... but clearly that isn't happening any time soon.

.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true.

christianity will only survive as long as there is their 4th century bible to maintain it without that book the deception will cease to exist.

First, I doubt you fully understand your own claims.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

Voltaire in 1750s said of Jesus "Curse the wretch. In 20 years, Christianity will be no more. My single hand will destroy the edifice it took 12 apostles to rear.”

After his death his residence in Geneva was used by the Bible society to distribute Bibles.

The difference between you, a random internet poster and Voltaire, is that you don't have the reputation, influence, and public credentials as Voltaire.

The one thing you have in common... both of you will fail equally in spectacular misery, while the Bible will continue: "until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." -Jesus in Matthew 5

You have a better chance of winning the super lotto 5 times over by tossing ping pong balls off the empire state building, and counting the shards left over to determine your numbers.... than ever getting rid of the Bible. You'll be dead so long, no one in your own family can remember your name, before the Bible ever passes away.

.

 

[BreezeWood]

You're a fucking doofus if you think you can prove the veracity of the bible by pointing to another book and saying "Look! That book is true, so the bible is true as well!" Go ahead, take that (non-)logic to a university and see what they say.

I don't think that was the original claim. At least not the claim I was arguing against.

The claim was that we can't trust that the Bible we have, is the Bible that was written.

If you want to argue that what was originally written is wrong... then that's a different argument.

But as far as suggesting that the Bible we have, is somehow drastically modified from what was the foundational basis of the early Christian church, and early Christian beliefs, that argument is false.

Take Homer’s Iliad for example. Is any part, or all of Homer's Iliad true? We could debate that. But is Homer's Iliad the real deal? Is it, what was originally written?

Well, people who study these ancient texts, have standards and requirements, by which they determine authenticity.

The standards by which they have proven the authenticity of Homer's Iliad, and numerous other ancient texts, the Bible not only meets all of them, but exceeds them many times over.

There is no question, no doubt, no debate by anyone of any authority, that the Bible we have today, is in fact the exact same text that was written 2,000 years ago.

You think what was written was wrong. And you have the right to be wrong about that. But short of blatant intellectual dishonesty, you can not argue the Bible has in any significant or meaningful way, changed from that which was written by the Authors.

In order for you to say that the Bible we have, isn't the same as the Bible that was written nearly 2,000 years ago, you would have to say that all ancient texts of the world, are frauds, and all the scholars, and Ph.d of academic study of these ancient texts, are also all frauds.

And that would make you a larger fool than you have claimed I am, by many times over... but it would still make a great youtube video to see you try and make that claim at a university.

Ok, time for you to move the goalposts, no problem.
It doesn't really matter to me if the bible has stayed the same or not (the King James version sure didn't), but if you agree that it's a book of fiction, then we're on the same page.

If anyone changed the goal post, that would be you. The comment I responded to, was that the 4th Century Bible is not the same as the versions before it.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true. I'm a Christian. You're a pagan. We're not ever going to be on the same page. I'm ok with that. Unless you become a Christian... but clearly that isn't happening any time soon.

.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true.

christianity will only survive as long as there is their 4th century bible to maintain it without that book the deception will cease to exist.

First, I doubt you fully understand your own claims.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

Voltaire in 1750s said of Jesus "Curse the wretch. In 20 years, Christianity will be no more. My single hand will destroy the edifice it took 12 apostles to rear.”

After his death his residence in Geneva was used by the Bible society to distribute Bibles.

The difference between you, a random internet poster and Voltaire, is that you don't have the reputation, influence, and public credentials as Voltaire.

The one thing you have in common... both of you will fail equally in spectacular misery, while the Bible will continue: "until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." -Jesus in Matthew 5

You have a better chance of winning the super lotto 5 times over by tossing ping pong balls off the empire state building, and counting the shards left over to determine your numbers.... than ever getting rid of the Bible. You'll be dead so long, no one in your own family can remember your name, before the Bible ever passes away.

.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

the history of the 4th century christian bible speaks for itself, the deception is the book itself not the religion of the Almighty that remains to this day unblemished - The Triumph of Good vs Evil, the choice is for each individual to decide for themselves, no book is required.

 

[ding]

I don't think that was the original claim. At least not the claim I was arguing against.

The claim was that we can't trust that the Bible we have, is the Bible that was written.

If you want to argue that what was originally written is wrong... then that's a different argument.

But as far as suggesting that the Bible we have, is somehow drastically modified from what was the foundational basis of the early Christian church, and early Christian beliefs, that argument is false.

Take Homer’s Iliad for example. Is any part, or all of Homer's Iliad true? We could debate that. But is Homer's Iliad the real deal? Is it, what was originally written?

Well, people who study these ancient texts, have standards and requirements, by which they determine authenticity.

The standards by which they have proven the authenticity of Homer's Iliad, and numerous other ancient texts, the Bible not only meets all of them, but exceeds them many times over.

There is no question, no doubt, no debate by anyone of any authority, that the Bible we have today, is in fact the exact same text that was written 2,000 years ago.

You think what was written was wrong. And you have the right to be wrong about that. But short of blatant intellectual dishonesty, you can not argue the Bible has in any significant or meaningful way, changed from that which was written by the Authors.

In order for you to say that the Bible we have, isn't the same as the Bible that was written nearly 2,000 years ago, you would have to say that all ancient texts of the world, are frauds, and all the scholars, and Ph.d of academic study of these ancient texts, are also all frauds.

And that would make you a larger fool than you have claimed I am, by many times over... but it would still make a great youtube video to see you try and make that claim at a university.

Ok, time for you to move the goalposts, no problem.
It doesn't really matter to me if the bible has stayed the same or not (the King James version sure didn't), but if you agree that it's a book of fiction, then we're on the same page.

If anyone changed the goal post, that would be you. The comment I responded to, was that the 4th Century Bible is not the same as the versions before it.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true. I'm a Christian. You're a pagan. We're not ever going to be on the same page. I'm ok with that. Unless you become a Christian... but clearly that isn't happening any time soon.

.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true.

christianity will only survive as long as there is their 4th century bible to maintain it without that book the deception will cease to exist.

First, I doubt you fully understand your own claims.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

Voltaire in 1750s said of Jesus "Curse the wretch. In 20 years, Christianity will be no more. My single hand will destroy the edifice it took 12 apostles to rear.”

After his death his residence in Geneva was used by the Bible society to distribute Bibles.

The difference between you, a random internet poster and Voltaire, is that you don't have the reputation, influence, and public credentials as Voltaire.

The one thing you have in common... both of you will fail equally in spectacular misery, while the Bible will continue: "until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." -Jesus in Matthew 5

You have a better chance of winning the super lotto 5 times over by tossing ping pong balls off the empire state building, and counting the shards left over to determine your numbers.... than ever getting rid of the Bible. You'll be dead so long, no one in your own family can remember your name, before the Bible ever passes away.

.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

the history of the 4th century christian bible speaks for itself, the deception is the book itself not the religion of the Almighty that remains to this day unblemished - The Triumph of Good vs Evil, the choice is yours.

Martin Luther King Jr used that 4th century christian bible when he prayed, "Let us pray. Oh, God our gracious Heavenly Father, in the glory of this Palm Sunday, help us to realize the darkness of the week ahead, with its Gethsemane, yes, with its Calvary, with its dark cross. Oh, God, help us to realize though that in the midst of this, there is a way out as we face life’s central test, the test of making the transition from “Let this cup pass from me” to “nevertheless.” God grant that we will discover that it can only be faced by giving our ultimate allegiance to Thee and to a religious view of life. Help us to realize that God is the answer. In the midst of all of our trials and tribulations, God is the answer. In the midst of all of our disappointments, God is the answer. Help us to live with that philosophy. And by that we will be able to live until we meet Thee in all of Thy eternities. In the name and spirit of Jesus we pray. Amen."

He made that prayer after he delivered his sermon on the Garden of Gethsemane at Dexter Avenue Baptist Church in Montgomery, Ala.on April 14, 1957.

Garden of Gethsemane, Sermon Delivered at Dexter Avenue Baptist Church

Martin Luther King Jr believed what was written in that 4th century christian bible. The same as I do.

 

[BreezeWood]

Ok, time for you to move the goalposts, no problem.
It doesn't really matter to me if the bible has stayed the same or not (the King James version sure didn't), but if you agree that it's a book of fiction, then we're on the same page.

If anyone changed the goal post, that would be you. The comment I responded to, was that the 4th Century Bible is not the same as the versions before it.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true. I'm a Christian. You're a pagan. We're not ever going to be on the same page. I'm ok with that. Unless you become a Christian... but clearly that isn't happening any time soon.

.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true.

christianity will only survive as long as there is their 4th century bible to maintain it without that book the deception will cease to exist.

First, I doubt you fully understand your own claims.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

Voltaire in 1750s said of Jesus "Curse the wretch. In 20 years, Christianity will be no more. My single hand will destroy the edifice it took 12 apostles to rear.”

After his death his residence in Geneva was used by the Bible society to distribute Bibles.

The difference between you, a random internet poster and Voltaire, is that you don't have the reputation, influence, and public credentials as Voltaire.

The one thing you have in common... both of you will fail equally in spectacular misery, while the Bible will continue: "until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." -Jesus in Matthew 5

You have a better chance of winning the super lotto 5 times over by tossing ping pong balls off the empire state building, and counting the shards left over to determine your numbers.... than ever getting rid of the Bible. You'll be dead so long, no one in your own family can remember your name, before the Bible ever passes away.

.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

the history of the 4th century christian bible speaks for itself, the deception is the book itself not the religion of the Almighty that remains to this day unblemished - The Triumph of Good vs Evil, the choice is yours.

Martin Luther King Jr used that 4th century christian bible when he prayed, "Let us pray. Oh, God our gracious Heavenly Father, in the glory of this Palm Sunday, help us to realize the darkness of the week ahead, with its Gethsemane, yes, with its Calvary, with its dark cross. Oh, God, help us to realize though that in the midst of this, there is a way out as we face life’s central test, the test of making the transition from “Let this cup pass from me” to “nevertheless.” God grant that we will discover that it can only be faced by giving our ultimate allegiance to Thee and to a religious view of life. Help us to realize that God is the answer. In the midst of all of our trials and tribulations, God is the answer. In the midst of all of our disappointments, God is the answer. Help us to live with that philosophy. And by that we will be able to live until we meet Thee in all of Thy eternities. In the name and spirit of Jesus we pray. Amen."

He made that prayer after he delivered his sermon on the Garden of Gethsemane at Dexter Avenue Baptist Church in Montgomery, Ala.on April 14, 1957.

Garden of Gethsemane, Sermon Delivered at Dexter Avenue Baptist Church

Martin Luther King Jr believed what was written in that 4th century christian bible. The same as I do.

.

Martin Luther King Jr believed what was written in that 4th century christian bible. The same as I do.

that is neither hear nor there for the countless victims of the same book yet to be reconciled and as pointed out MLK was southern baptist so you are not the same and the reason for the diversion is the duplicity for an agenda the book represents that is not a religion.

 

[ding]

If anyone changed the goal post, that would be you. The comment I responded to, was that the 4th Century Bible is not the same as the versions before it.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true. I'm a Christian. You're a pagan. We're not ever going to be on the same page. I'm ok with that. Unless you become a Christian... but clearly that isn't happening any time soon.

.

Of course it's not fiction. It is literal, and true.

christianity will only survive as long as there is their 4th century bible to maintain it without that book the deception will cease to exist.

First, I doubt you fully understand your own claims.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

Voltaire in 1750s said of Jesus "Curse the wretch. In 20 years, Christianity will be no more. My single hand will destroy the edifice it took 12 apostles to rear.”

After his death his residence in Geneva was used by the Bible society to distribute Bibles.

The difference between you, a random internet poster and Voltaire, is that you don't have the reputation, influence, and public credentials as Voltaire.

The one thing you have in common... both of you will fail equally in spectacular misery, while the Bible will continue: "until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." -Jesus in Matthew 5

You have a better chance of winning the super lotto 5 times over by tossing ping pong balls off the empire state building, and counting the shards left over to determine your numbers.... than ever getting rid of the Bible. You'll be dead so long, no one in your own family can remember your name, before the Bible ever passes away.

.

Regardless, based on your posts, I have to conclude that you are trying to fight against the Bible. That's very sad.... for you.

the history of the 4th century christian bible speaks for itself, the deception is the book itself not the religion of the Almighty that remains to this day unblemished - The Triumph of Good vs Evil, the choice is yours.

Martin Luther King Jr used that 4th century christian bible when he prayed, "Let us pray. Oh, God our gracious Heavenly Father, in the glory of this Palm Sunday, help us to realize the darkness of the week ahead, with its Gethsemane, yes, with its Calvary, with its dark cross. Oh, God, help us to realize though that in the midst of this, there is a way out as we face life’s central test, the test of making the transition from “Let this cup pass from me” to “nevertheless.” God grant that we will discover that it can only be faced by giving our ultimate allegiance to Thee and to a religious view of life. Help us to realize that God is the answer. In the midst of all of our trials and tribulations, God is the answer. In the midst of all of our disappointments, God is the answer. Help us to live with that philosophy. And by that we will be able to live until we meet Thee in all of Thy eternities. In the name and spirit of Jesus we pray. Amen."

He made that prayer after he delivered his sermon on the Garden of Gethsemane at Dexter Avenue Baptist Church in Montgomery, Ala.on April 14, 1957.

Garden of Gethsemane, Sermon Delivered at Dexter Avenue Baptist Church

Martin Luther King Jr believed what was written in that 4th century christian bible. The same as I do.

.

Martin Luther King Jr believed what was written in that 4th century christian bible. The same as I do.

that is neither hear nor there for the countless victims of the same book yet to be reconciled and as pointed out MLK was southern baptist so you are not the same and the reason for the diversion is the duplicity for an agenda the book represents that is not a religion.

Martin Luther King Jr believed that Jesus was fully human and fully divine... just as it is told in that 4th century bible.

"He is the word made flesh. He is the second person of the trinity. He is very God of very God, of one substance with the Father, who for our salvation came down from Heaven and was incarnate be the Holy Ghost of the Virgin Mary." MLK and the 4th century bible