Cigarette Tax’s Unintended Consequences That EVERYBODY Saw Coming – Except Libs

[Cecilie1200]

Who cares?
Smokers are being driven from society. They can't smoke at work. Can't smoke in public areas. Many can't even smoke in their homes are cars
So now they are driven to the black market to buy their precious smokes. Means I don't have to stand behind them in line at the convenience store

Means even communist and dictatorship countries have more freedom of smoking than Americans have.
America the 1st country ever to have freedom from government is now less free because the left think that they should tell the people what they can and can't do.

that really says something

Yes...because telling people they can't blow their filth in other peoples faces is a commie plot

That's not a Commie plot, but government telling private business owners what they are allowed to permit their customers to do sure is.

It was not customer comfort or concern that brought about smoking bans at business establishments. It was about employee health and safety. Employees, including those in a bar, were being required to inhale second-hand smoke and suffer from it's harmful health effects.

Unless they were in chains, they weren't being forced to work there. And don't, DO NOT, whine to me about how "unfair" it is for someone to have to choose between putting up with an unpleasant aspect of a job or finding another job. Work environment has always been a significant factor one considers when looking for a job or deciding to stay with one.

And don't snivel at me about the apocryphal leftist go-to of "What if it's the only job they can get?" One, I really, really doubt that. Two, making laws based on MAYBE one or two aberrant hard cases is always a bad idea. And three, if you really, really screwed up your life that badly that you literally cannot get but one job in your entire town/city, then you need to start accepting now that you're going to have to be miserable for a while to get it back on track. Life sucks, wear a helmet.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Means even communist and dictatorship countries have more freedom of smoking than Americans have.
America the 1st country ever to have freedom from government is now less free because the left think that they should tell the people what they can and can't do.

that really says something

Yes...because telling people they can't blow their filth in other peoples faces is a commie plot

That's not a Commie plot, but government telling private business owners what they are allowed to permit their customers to do sure is.

It was not customer comfort or concern that brought about smoking bans at business establishments. It was about employee health and safety. Employees, including those in a bar, were being required to inhale second-hand smoke and suffer from it's harmful health effects.

Which was a lie.

Hey, I'm willing to accept that being a cocktail waitress in a bar full of smokers sucks . . . for a lot more reasons than just the cigarette smoke. This is why I do not work as a cocktail waitress.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Yes...because telling people they can't blow their filth in other peoples faces is a commie plot

That's not a Commie plot, but government telling private business owners what they are allowed to permit their customers to do sure is.

Like telling 17 year old customers that they cannot drink. Like telling customers they cannot patronize a business that is not up to fire or health codes.

Damned nanny state

No, it's not the same thing.

Drinking underage is against the law no matter where it takes place. Fire and health violations are not obvious to anybody therefore somebody needs to control those hidden dangers.

If you go into a bar, nobody is surprised when they see people smoking. It's not a hidden danger. Cigarette smoke can be detected instantly. Then unlike hidden dangers such as food poisoning and fire hazards, a customer has the choice of whether they wish to stay in the establishment or not.

Lots of businesses don't WANT to allow smoking on their premises. That's up to them, since it's their business, and it's up to me to decide if I want to frequent them.

Likewise, it should be up to the business if they want to allow smoking, and up to the patrons whether or not they want to be around it. It's not like it's not obvious the instant you walk in the door. Just freaking go somewhere else.

I personally choose not to eat at restaurants that will not allow smoking and vaping even on their patios. Be serious. Your patio is four feet from a parking lot, sometimes four feet from a roadway, and you're worried about air quality? Really? I don't do business with idiots.

This being Tucson, many businesses allow vaping indoors, although smoking is still out because of the law. Those businesses are my preferred choices.

Howdy fellow Arizonan!
I am from Benson.
I totally agree with you.

We need to get together and have coffee sometime.

 

[Cecilie1200]

that really says something

Yes...because telling people they can't blow their filth in other peoples faces is a commie plot

That's not a Commie plot, but government telling private business owners what they are allowed to permit their customers to do sure is.

It was not customer comfort or concern that brought about smoking bans at business establishments. It was about employee health and safety. Employees, including those in a bar, were being required to inhale second-hand smoke and suffer from it's harmful health effects.

Then you should take it into consideration when you accept the job or not.

It doesn't work that way. Employers don't get to pick and choose which safety regulations they will adhere to.

Straw man. The point is that this is not appropriately something the government needs to decide for and impose upon business owners.

 

[peach174]

That's not a Commie plot, but government telling private business owners what they are allowed to permit their customers to do sure is.

Like telling 17 year old customers that they cannot drink. Like telling customers they cannot patronize a business that is not up to fire or health codes.

Damned nanny state

No, it's not the same thing.

Drinking underage is against the law no matter where it takes place. Fire and health violations are not obvious to anybody therefore somebody needs to control those hidden dangers.

If you go into a bar, nobody is surprised when they see people smoking. It's not a hidden danger. Cigarette smoke can be detected instantly. Then unlike hidden dangers such as food poisoning and fire hazards, a customer has the choice of whether they wish to stay in the establishment or not.

Lots of businesses don't WANT to allow smoking on their premises. That's up to them, since it's their business, and it's up to me to decide if I want to frequent them.

Likewise, it should be up to the business if they want to allow smoking, and up to the patrons whether or not they want to be around it. It's not like it's not obvious the instant you walk in the door. Just freaking go somewhere else.

I personally choose not to eat at restaurants that will not allow smoking and vaping even on their patios. Be serious. Your patio is four feet from a parking lot, sometimes four feet from a roadway, and you're worried about air quality? Really? I don't do business with idiots.

This being Tucson, many businesses allow vaping indoors, although smoking is still out because of the law. Those businesses are my preferred choices.

Howdy fellow Arizonan!
I am from Benson.
I totally agree with you.

We need to get together and have coffee sometime.

Maybe
I rarely go to Tucson though. Maybe once a year, if even that.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Then you should take it into consideration when you accept the job or not.

It doesn't work that way. Employers don't get to pick and choose which safety regulations they will adhere to.

It has nothing to do with safety, it has to do with control freaks wanting life to be nosey around them all hours of the day and expect government to make that provision for them even if it means violating private property rights.

It has everything to do with health and safety. Courts hearing lawsuits and insurance companies simply refused to be bullied by stupid people who insisted on staying stupid about second-hand smoke.

Second hand smoke is made up BS. If second hand smoke were so toxic, a cigarette smoker would die after three puffs of a cigarette.

I have to take drug tests for work, so one time I asked the doctor about second hand marijuana smoke since some of my friends did smoke pot when I'm at their home. He told me there was no way to detect Marijuana in the system from second hand pot smoke. It's simply too weak and others have tried to use that excuse in the past, and it's been medically proven it can't happen.

Marijuana can stay in a pot smokers system for close to 30 days after their last puff. But even as strong as it is, second hand smoke can't be detected through any means of drug testing including hair samples.

Why do non-smokers cough when they inhale second-hand smoke. I have given plenty of drug test. Never had one administered by a doctor. Always a technician. Not even a doctor on the premises or in the facility. If that was a doctor giving you advice, it was bad advice.

I cough when someone gets on the elevator with me wearing cheap cologne. Pretty sure cologne isn't actually toxic or going to give me cancer or emphysema.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Like telling 17 year old customers that they cannot drink. Like telling customers they cannot patronize a business that is not up to fire or health codes.

Damned nanny state

No, it's not the same thing.

Drinking underage is against the law no matter where it takes place. Fire and health violations are not obvious to anybody therefore somebody needs to control those hidden dangers.

If you go into a bar, nobody is surprised when they see people smoking. It's not a hidden danger. Cigarette smoke can be detected instantly. Then unlike hidden dangers such as food poisoning and fire hazards, a customer has the choice of whether they wish to stay in the establishment or not.

Lots of businesses don't WANT to allow smoking on their premises. That's up to them, since it's their business, and it's up to me to decide if I want to frequent them.

Likewise, it should be up to the business if they want to allow smoking, and up to the patrons whether or not they want to be around it. It's not like it's not obvious the instant you walk in the door. Just freaking go somewhere else.

I personally choose not to eat at restaurants that will not allow smoking and vaping even on their patios. Be serious. Your patio is four feet from a parking lot, sometimes four feet from a roadway, and you're worried about air quality? Really? I don't do business with idiots.

This being Tucson, many businesses allow vaping indoors, although smoking is still out because of the law. Those businesses are my preferred choices.

Howdy fellow Arizonan!
I am from Benson.
I totally agree with you.

We need to get together and have coffee sometime.

Maybe
I rarely go to Tucson though. Maybe once a year, if even that.

I go to Benson and Sierra Vista occasionally, though.

 

[peach174]

No, it's not the same thing.

Drinking underage is against the law no matter where it takes place. Fire and health violations are not obvious to anybody therefore somebody needs to control those hidden dangers.

If you go into a bar, nobody is surprised when they see people smoking. It's not a hidden danger. Cigarette smoke can be detected instantly. Then unlike hidden dangers such as food poisoning and fire hazards, a customer has the choice of whether they wish to stay in the establishment or not.

Lots of businesses don't WANT to allow smoking on their premises. That's up to them, since it's their business, and it's up to me to decide if I want to frequent them.

Likewise, it should be up to the business if they want to allow smoking, and up to the patrons whether or not they want to be around it. It's not like it's not obvious the instant you walk in the door. Just freaking go somewhere else.

I personally choose not to eat at restaurants that will not allow smoking and vaping even on their patios. Be serious. Your patio is four feet from a parking lot, sometimes four feet from a roadway, and you're worried about air quality? Really? I don't do business with idiots.

This being Tucson, many businesses allow vaping indoors, although smoking is still out because of the law. Those businesses are my preferred choices.

Howdy fellow Arizonan!
I am from Benson.
I totally agree with you.

We need to get together and have coffee sometime.

Maybe
I rarely go to Tucson though. Maybe once a year, if even that.

I go to Benson and Sierra Vista occasionally, though.

Hey let me know when you are planning to be in Benson and we can meet at one of the restaurants for coffee.
Anywhere but Denney's their coffee is really bad.

 

[rightwinger]

Lots of businesses don't WANT to allow smoking on their premises. That's up to them, since it's their business, and it's up to me to decide if I want to frequent them.

Likewise, it should be up to the business if they want to allow smoking, and up to the patrons whether or not they want to be around it. It's not like it's not obvious the instant you walk in the door. Just freaking go somewhere else.

I personally choose not to eat at restaurants that will not allow smoking and vaping even on their patios. Be serious. Your patio is four feet from a parking lot, sometimes four feet from a roadway, and you're worried about air quality? Really? I don't do business with idiots.

This being Tucson, many businesses allow vaping indoors, although smoking is still out because of the law. Those businesses are my preferred choices.

Howdy fellow Arizonan!
I am from Benson.
I totally agree with you.

We need to get together and have coffee sometime.

Maybe
I rarely go to Tucson though. Maybe once a year, if even that.

I go to Benson and Sierra Vista occasionally, though.

Hey let me know when you are planning to be in Benson and we can meet at one of the restaurants for coffee.
Anywhere but Denney's their coffee is really bad.

I spend a lot of time in Ft Huachuca...can I come?

 

[peach174]

Howdy fellow Arizonan!
I am from Benson.
I totally agree with you.

We need to get together and have coffee sometime.

Maybe
I rarely go to Tucson though. Maybe once a year, if even that.

I go to Benson and Sierra Vista occasionally, though.

Hey let me know when you are planning to be in Benson and we can meet at one of the restaurants for coffee.
Anywhere but Denney's their coffee is really bad.

I spend a lot of time in Ft Huachuca...can I come?

It would be OK with me.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Meanwhile cigarette smoking has dramatically declined

Cigarette use has dramatically declined? prove it.

Wow. Is your idiocy so powerful that you actually are allowing your biases to overcome a reality that EVERYONE knows?

Jesus!


Allow me:

CDC - Trends in Current Cigarette Smoking - Smoking & Tobacco Use

Cigarettes,

So this is your proof? The CDC? There is more smoking today by teenagers than ever before, folks like me have quit as we've aged, but your failure here is the teen count. oops!!!!! you lose.

And jesus most probably didn't pay any tax on a cigarette.

Where's the data?

what data?

Here ya go:

 

[rightwinger]

Hawaii is first state to raise smoking age to 21

 

[Wyatt earp]

that really says something

Yes...because telling people they can't blow their filth in other peoples faces is a commie plot

That's not a Commie plot, but government telling private business owners what they are allowed to permit their customers to do sure is.

It was not customer comfort or concern that brought about smoking bans at business establishments. It was about employee health and safety. Employees, including those in a bar, were being required to inhale second-hand smoke and suffer from it's harmful health effects.

Which was a lie.

How is that a lie? Are you suggesting that second hand smoke is not harmful?

I am, 2nd hand smoke was an out right lie by the 1993 EPA report and the public bought into it till this day.


The Second-Hand Smoke Charade

It now turns out that the influential 1993 EPA report “Respiratory Health Effects of Passive Smoking: Lung Cancer and Other Disorders” was as phony as a three-dollar bill. State officials and private businesses that believed that ETS was a public health danger (and not just a nuisance) were completely misled by the EPA. And, of course, so was main street American public opinion.

Are those the views of a vast right-wing conspiracy? Hardly. They are the sober conclusions of a gutsy federal district court judge in North Carolina named William Osteen, whose recent ruling invalidated the very foundation of the EPA report. Judge Osteen’s views coincide with a Congressional Research Service analysis released in late 1995 that had serious reservations about the EPA report.

 

[peach174]

Yes...because telling people they can't blow their filth in other peoples faces is a commie plot

That's not a Commie plot, but government telling private business owners what they are allowed to permit their customers to do sure is.

It was not customer comfort or concern that brought about smoking bans at business establishments. It was about employee health and safety. Employees, including those in a bar, were being required to inhale second-hand smoke and suffer from it's harmful health effects.

Which was a lie.

How is that a lie? Are you suggesting that second hand smoke is not harmful?

I am, 2nd hand smoke was an out right lie by the 1993 EPA report and the public bought into it till this day.


The Second-Hand Smoke Charade

It now turns out that the influential 1993 EPA report “Respiratory Health Effects of Passive Smoking: Lung Cancer and Other Disorders” was as phony as a three-dollar bill. State officials and private businesses that believed that ETS was a public health danger (and not just a nuisance) were completely misled by the EPA. And, of course, so was main street American public opinion.

Are those the views of a vast right-wing conspiracy? Hardly. They are the sober conclusions of a gutsy federal district court judge in North Carolina named William Osteen, whose recent ruling invalidated the very foundation of the EPA report. Judge Osteen’s views coincide with a Congressional Research Service analysis released in late 1995 that had serious reservations about the EPA report.

Me also.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Study Finds No Link Between Secondhand Smoke And Cancer


A large-scale study found no clear link between secondhand smoke and lung cancer, undercutting the premise of years of litigation including a Florida case that yielded a $350 million settlement.

The article in the Journal of the National Cancer Institutedetails a study of 76,000 women over more than a decade, which found the usual link between smoking and cancer. Lung cancer was 13 times more common in current smokers, and four times more common in former smokers, than in non-smokers

The study found no statistically significant relationship between lung cancer and exposure to passive smoke.



Study Finds No Link Between Secondhand Smoke And Cancer

 

[Ava]

Hawaii is first state to raise smoking age to 21

All states should raise voting rights to 21, as well.

 

[Ava]

Study Finds No Link Between Secondhand Smoke And Cancer


A large-scale study found no clear link between secondhand smoke and lung cancer, undercutting the premise of years of litigation including a Florida case that yielded a $350 million settlement.

The article in the Journal of the National Cancer Institutedetails a study of 76,000 women over more than a decade, which found the usual link between smoking and cancer. Lung cancer was 13 times more common in current smokers, and four times more common in former smokers, than in non-smokers

The study found no statistically significant relationship between lung cancer and exposure to passive smoke.



Study Finds No Link Between Secondhand Smoke And Cancer

It sure does activate asthmatic symptoms in those with asthma. Smoking is bad for everyone but none of the government's business. Let people choose their destiny.

The gov started the swell of a new business: Vaping.

SNIP:

"We're concerned about the potential for kids to start a lifetime of nicotine use by starting with e-cigarettes," she said.


5 Things to Know About E-Cigarettes

 

[pwjohn]

Were liberals the only ones who didn’t see this coming?

When New York raised their cigarette taxes to the highest in the nation – $4.35 per pack – not only did revenue decline by $1.3 billion, but organized crime and the smuggling of cigarettes across state lines is now rampant in the Empire State.

Over the last ten years, while state lawmakers raised the tobacco tax by190 percent, smokers switched to cheaper alternatives – like going to nearby Indian Reservations – quit smoking altogether or bought them on the rampant black market, The Daily Caller is reporting.

In fact, now 58 percent of all cigarettes are supplied from out-of-state and the number of packs bought at “full price” has dropped by 62 percent.


Snip

High cigarette taxes not only assist global crime networks but also have a disproportionate impact on the poor. According to the New York State Department of Health, low-income smokers, defined as individuals in households earning less than $30,000 a year, spent 23.6 percent of the annual household income on cigarettes in 2010-2011. That number is up from 11.6 percent in 2003-2004.


Read more: New York Loses $400 Million After Imposing The Nation’s Highest Cigarette Tax

Meanwhile cigarette smoking has dramatically declined

It would be a mistake for you to base your claim on a reduction in sales.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Hawaii is first state to raise smoking age to 21

All states should raise voting rights to 21, as well.

You know the Democrats would never go for that.

 

[initforme]

So we are supposed to feel bad for smokers? They can still smoke and they will. As long as I don't have to breathe in their smoke I could care less.