Class War Illustrated

[Trajan]

Thank you.

Just to help Me ensure I understand your post-

say that 104-158k bracket, you note capital gains, does that mean that at 150K you cash in a 10K investment and pay 31% on the whole, or is it a marginal tax framework as added to income?

Trajan, I like you a lot, but you're starting to irritate me.

Capital gains will still be taxed on the high water mark under the Cuyo plan, same as they are now. The only difference is the table to which they're subject.

edit: Are you just trying to irritate me and laughing at me through that distant computer screen? You bastard!

gimme a hug buddy...

no not really.. just trying to be sure I understand before I respond. I think your rates are to high.

Mine-
0-25- 5%
26-50- 10%
51-100- 13%
101-200- 16%
201-350- 20%
351-5 million- 25%
5- ???- 33%


and I think your cap tax is , well to high as well, flat tax on cap gains of 10%, inheritance same and the payroll tax stays at it is.

 

[Toro]

The proper level of taxation is the level of spending.

All spending increases should be matched by an increase in taxes.

All tax cuts should be matched by a specified decrease in spending.

There should be no spending increases without tax increases and there should be no tax cuts without spending cuts.

This should be done over a cycle. Spending cuts and tax increases during a recession is insane. Likewise, there should be no spending increases or tax cuts without fiscal offsets during an expansion unless it is shown to be neutral to the fiscal balance over the cycle.

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

I agree in principal, however I would ask, who pays the 50% and how does it progress from the bottom up?

I don't know how it progresses up.

I'm not sure who pays 50%, but I have heard that in some states, the marginal rate is above 50%. If you include all taxes, not just income taxes, that pushes rates higher.

In some countries, some people pay more than half their incomes in taxes.

 

[Oddball]

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

There should be no taxes on incomes in any case....This is the cornerstone of class warfare.

 

[manifold]

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

There should be no taxes on incomes in any case....This is the cornerstone of class warfare.

I'd be ok with taxing wealth instead.

 

[The T]

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

There should be no taxes on incomes in any case....This is the cornerstone of class warfare.

I'd be ok with taxing wealth instead.

Tax wealth? Remember the domino theory...funny...ain't that what we're seeing NOW?

 

[The T]

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

There should be no taxes on incomes in any case....This is the cornerstone of class warfare.

Yep. originally? Commerce was taxed, and indirectly.

 

[manifold]

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

There should be no taxes on incomes in any case....This is the cornerstone of class warfare.

Yep. originally? Commerce was taxed, and indirectly.

Property (a form of wealth) taxes go back even further in history.

 

[Trajan]

The proper level of taxation is the level of spending.

All spending increases should be matched by an increase in taxes.

All tax cuts should be matched by a specified decrease in spending.

There should be no spending increases without tax increases and there should be no tax cuts without spending cuts.

This should be done over a cycle. Spending cuts and tax increases during a recession is insane. Likewise, there should be no spending increases or tax cuts without fiscal offsets during an expansion unless it is shown to be neutral to the fiscal balance over the cycle.

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

I agree in principal, however I would ask, who pays the 50% and how does it progress from the bottom up?

I don't know how it progresses up.

I'm not sure who pays 50%, but I have heard that in some states, the marginal rate is above 50%. If you include all taxes, not just income taxes, that pushes rates higher.

In some countries, some people pay more than half their incomes in taxes.

uhm yes like California.

my query as to how was really intended as a question as to your view of what would be a quick take on how as I and cuyo stipulated above as to tax burden by 'bracket'...

 

[Trajan]

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

There should be no taxes on incomes in any case....This is the cornerstone of class warfare.

well, I would have said so, but, in the end I have in this sense been beaten to my knees, there will never be a repeal of the 16th amend. etc. Its all a rearguard action now. But I believe your statement is truth.

 

[Foxfyre]

I agree in principal, however I would ask, who pays the 50% and how does it progress from the bottom up?

I don't know how it progresses up.

I'm not sure who pays 50%, but I have heard that in some states, the marginal rate is above 50%. If you include all taxes, not just income taxes, that pushes rates higher.

In some countries, some people pay more than half their incomes in taxes.

uhm yes like California.

my query as to how was really intended as a question as to your view of what would be a quick take on how as I and cuyo stipulated above as to tax burden by 'bracket'...

The thing is, by the time you add up local, state, and/or federal income taxes, sales taxes, license and permit fees, excise taxes, and all the other add ons built into various products and services, a great many of us are already paying close to 50% of our income in taxes.

But if we are making a good living, some seem to think we should be paying even more. But they won't ever say how much is enough for anybody to be able to earn and keep for himself or herself.

 

[Foxfyre]

I'm sure most of you have seen this e-mail that has been circulating for some years now. There is a lot of truth to it:

. . . .And don't forget on top of local, state, and federal income tax:

Accounts Receivable Tax
Building Permit Tax
Business License Tax
Cigarette Tax
Corporate Income Tax
Dog License Tax
Federal Income Tax
Federal Unemployment Tax (FUTA)
Fishing License Tax
Food License Tax
Fuel Permit Tax
Gasoline Tax (42 cents per gallon)
Hunting License Tax
Inheritance Tax
Inventory Tax
Interest Income Tax
IRS Interest Charges, IRS Penalties (tax on top of tax)
Liquor Tax
Luxury Tax
Marriage License Tax
Medicare Tax
Property Tax
Real Estate Tax
Service Charge Taxes
Social Security Tax
Road Usage Taxes
Sales Tax
Recreational Vehicle Tax
School Tax
State Income Tax
State Unemployment Tax (SUTA)
Telephone Federal Excise Tax
Telephone Federal Universal Service Fee Tax
Telephone Federal, State and Local Surcharge Tax
Telephone Minimum Usage Surcharge Tax
Telephone Recurring and Nonrecurring Charges Tax
Telephone State and Local Tax
Telephone Usage Charge Tax
Utility Taxes
Vehicle License Registration Tax
Vehicle Sales and License Tax
Watercraft Registration Tax
Well Permit Tax
Workers Compensation Tax

Not one of these taxes existed 100 years ago, and our nation was the most prosperous in the world. We had absolutely no national debt. We had an Army and Navy, the Marines and Coast Guard. We had the largest middle class population in the world. A man's salary brought in enough money to support his family. Mom could stay home and raise the kids.

 

[Trajan]

I don't know how it progresses up.

I'm not sure who pays 50%, but I have heard that in some states, the marginal rate is above 50%. If you include all taxes, not just income taxes, that pushes rates higher.

In some countries, some people pay more than half their incomes in taxes.

uhm yes like California.

my query as to how was really intended as a question as to your view of what would be a quick take on how as I and cuyo stipulated above as to tax burden by 'bracket'...

The thing is, by the time you add up local, state, and/or federal income taxes, sales taxes, license and permit fees, excise taxes, and all the other add ons built into various products and services, a great many of us are already paying close to 50% of our income in taxes.

EXACTLY.
you're such a peach AND a mind reader. this is pretty much where I was heading, its one of 2 stops on the way to beating back the 'tax the rich' hordes.

But if we are making a good living, some seem to think we should be paying even more. But they won't ever say how much is enough for anybody to be able to earn and keep for himself or herself.

you see it.....what one earns should really have ZERO to do with it. As Oddball said...its just a lever to foster division.

 

[JBeukema]

The will of the people is the only legitimate foundation of any government​

 

[The T]

The will of the people is the only legitimate foundation of any government​

Fine. Then why the usurpation by our electeds that continue to ignore the Constitution visa-vie Article One, Section 8?

 

[Trajan]

The will of the people is the only legitimate foundation of any government​

does that mean elections count?

 

[JBeukema]

The current tax rates are clearly not high enough, evidenced by the record deficits we're encountering.

You're only looking at half the equation. What about spending?

How do you propose we handle this issue? 84% +/- of the budget are Social Security, Medicare, and military

Then let us look at how we might trim them and make them more efficient and effective

Also, repeal NAFTA

 

[JBeukema]

No one should have to pay more than half their income in taxes under any circumstances perhaps with the exception of times of war.

There should be no taxes on incomes in any case....This is the cornerstone of class warfare.

It's also how they fund American colonialism and the bloated military, but I don't suppose you have a problem with that.

 

[JBeukema]

There should be no taxes on incomes in any case....This is the cornerstone of class warfare.

Yep. originally? Commerce was taxed, and indirectly.

Property (a form of wealth) taxes go back even further in history.

Are you appealing to tradition?

 

[The T]

I'm sure most of you have seen this e-mail that has been circulating for some years now. There is a lot of truth to it:

. . . .And don't forget on top of local, state, and federal income tax:

Accounts Receivable Tax
Building Permit Tax
Business License Tax
Cigarette Tax
Corporate Income Tax
Dog License Tax
Federal Income Tax
Federal Unemployment Tax (FUTA)
Fishing License Tax
Food License Tax
Fuel Permit Tax
Gasoline Tax (42 cents per gallon)
Hunting License Tax
Inheritance Tax
Inventory Tax
Interest Income Tax
IRS Interest Charges, IRS Penalties (tax on top of tax)
Liquor Tax
Luxury Tax
Marriage License Tax
Medicare Tax
Property Tax
Real Estate Tax
Service Charge Taxes
Social Security Tax
Road Usage Taxes
Sales Tax
Recreational Vehicle Tax
School Tax
State Income Tax
State Unemployment Tax (SUTA)
Telephone Federal Excise Tax
Telephone Federal Universal Service Fee Tax
Telephone Federal, State and Local Surcharge Tax
Telephone Minimum Usage Surcharge Tax
Telephone Recurring and Nonrecurring Charges Tax
Telephone State and Local Tax
Telephone Usage Charge Tax
Utility Taxes
Vehicle License Registration Tax
Vehicle Sales and License Tax
Watercraft Registration Tax
Well Permit Tax
Workers Compensation Tax

Not one of these taxes existed 100 years ago, and our nation was the most prosperous in the world. We had absolutely no national debt. We had an Army and Navy, the Marines and Coast Guard. We had the largest middle class population in the world. A man's salary brought in enough money to support his family. Mom could stay home and raise the kids.

Yeah I've seen it. What we are witnessing now is paying for people, and the acceptance of Societal changes that weren't taught any better...and that Government would bail them out of their poor life choices and they were entitled to it by BIRTHRIGHT.

The truth is father away than that and be described in one phrase...responsibility for one's self.

 

[manifold]

Yep. originally? Commerce was taxed, and indirectly.

Property (a form of wealth) taxes go back even further in history.

Are you appealing to tradition?

Actually, the exact opposite.

Thanks for noticing.