College Should Be Free! (For Americans)

[krypto]

I would hope it would make our society better. But giving it a shot would be better than not giving it a shot at all. I would also hope that it improved our economy. But let's say everybody on the planet was Stephen Hawkings good at mathematics. How much demand would there be for mathematicians. Also, according to a news program I was watching once, China is awash with unemployed engineers. Obviously simply having the training isn't enough. And from what I hear, having a college education here in the U.S. is no guarantee of finding employment.

Why would you need to hear that college was no guarantee of a job? It's common sense. College can't teach you how to think. It's like going to the gym. A degree in muscles won't do anything for your muscles. You have to use them and then they get stronger.

Europeans don't spend much on a military so they do have more for social programs. But if you join the military they can help you with an education, it worked for me.

From what I hear, China is awash with unemployed engineers. I doubt if it is because as engineers, they can't think. Next, before Hitler came to power, Germany was in an economic ruin. Hitler turned that ruin into an economic miracle. Which probably was made more difficult by the allies having stolen about 65 billion in gold, in back then money. That was for reparations for WW I. Which Germany got sucked into like everybody else. Hitler put a stop to that too. But he was defeated. I hear Germany made its last WW I reparation payment in about 2010. As for what Germany and Japan spend on the military, though I don't know, I would doubt if it was much different as a percentage of their GDP as it is for the U.S.

WTF? You are trying to make publicly funded higher ed more palatable by using Hitler?

Why bring Hitler into it? Because Hitler was a GOD! Almost everything you have ever been taught or heard about him are damnable LIES! If Hitler was running this country, there probably would be free college education. (As well as free health coverage) Though that would probably mean that negroes would have part of the U.S. as their own homeland and the same having been done for latinos. But that would be an incredibly small price to pay. Because Whites just don't need non-whites around.

 

[krypto]

Some articles on College and the high cost/low benefit of higher education:

Will tuition ever stop increasing?
These unprecedented levels of student loan debt have only been worsened by a lackluster economy. Around 50% of graduates with bachelor's degrees under 25 are either unemployed or underemployed, according to the Associated Press. It doesn't help that over the same period that saw rapid rises in tuition rates and tuition paid, incomes have stagnated. That means that a college education is increasingly unaffordable for most students and necessitates a continued increase in student loan debt.

Making college more expensive: Our view
Making college more expensive: Our view

Democrats' proposals do little to rein in costs.
The United States prides itself on being innovative and creative. Yet it is struggling to train its next generation of achievers. Despite rapidly rising sums that the federal government has devoted to loans and grants, American college students and recent graduates are wallowing in debt. At last count, they owed $1.2 trillion.

Not surprisingly, the leading Democratic presidential candidates — Hillary Clinton,Bernie Sanders and Martin O'Malley — have come up with plans they say will make colleges more affordable and provide debt relief for millennials. Though well-intentioned, their plans threaten to drive up costs rather than rein them in. They would all throw more federal money at colleges while offering little but hope that these institutions would hold expenses down.
If history is any guide, colleges and universities will channel much of the additional money into areas that don't directly benefit students. They might also hike tuition, telling students not to worry because taxpayers will pick up much of the additional burden. A Federal Reserve Bank of New York report found that colleges increased tuition 40 cents for every dollar received in Pell Grants, and 65 cents for every dollar in subsidized loans.
Clinton's plan is the least ambitious and the most practical. Yet it still amounts to taxpayers spending a lot more money without concrete efforts to make colleges control costs. Its centerpiece is a 10-year, $175 billion program of matching grants to states that would require states to reverse recent budget cuts. It would also allow students and graduates to refinance their debts at lower interest rates, expand programs that let people repay their loans as a percentage of their incomes, and enhance existing education tax credits.

She would pay for all this with higher taxes on wealthy Americans. While the affluent can and should pay more, this is a well that lawmakers can go to only so often. New revenue that goes to tuition assistance is money that can't be used to shore up Social Security or Medicare, expand the nation's infrastructure, or reduce the budget deficit.

Plans offered by Sanders and O'Malley would go even further, setting a goal of debt-free education for all students at all public universities.

A better idea would be to take a magnifying glass to exactly why college costs have skyrocketed at three times the overall inflation rate since 1980. As with health care, the answer involves what happens when bills are paid with other people's money.

Too many universities have become bloated and inefficient, using their revenue in ways that don’t benefit the students’ education: Million dollar salaries awarded to top-paid college presidents. Professors who barely teach. Sparkling recreation centers, such as the one at Louisiana State University complete with a lazy river. Bloated bureaucracies with endless vice presidents. Money-losing sports programs.

It doesn’t take a Ph.D. to figure out where money could be saved, but persuading colleges to part with these extras won’t be easy. This is where the federal government and states can harness the leverage that accompanies their dollars to demand accountability, perhaps by awarding grants only to institutions that hold the line on tuition and fees.

Contrary to what many schools would tell you, such cost cutting isn't impossible. Purdue University in Indiana has frozen its tuition for two straight years and will continue to do so for at least two more. To be sure, some of this has been done with the budgetary gimmick of taking more out-of-state students, who pay much higher rates. Even so, Purdue's focus on cost containment should be followed by other schools.

Only by attacking rising tuition at its root cause will the problem of college affordability be addressed. The Democratic candidates need a little more educating on this.

There is no "root cause." But there are many causes. Most of which can be found in what we are. That effects how we behave. Just as what chimpanzees are effects how they behave and what bonobos are effects how they behave. After that is our diseased capitalist, expansionist and consumerism driven economy. But probably the biggest problem is living in a multiethnic society. Different creatures just don't like being around each other. It doesn't happen in the wild, and it shouldn't happen among parasitic humans.

That is why I think both Germany and Japan kick America's ass when it comes to the value of their yearly exports. Because in Germany, they have mostly Germans. And in Japan, they have mostly Japanese. This makes them more patriotic and gives them a heightened sense of community. Which in turm makes them happier. And happier people are more productive. If college professors lived in a society that they were happier to live in, they would be willing to take less to do what they do.

 

[Lewdog]

Some articles on College and the high cost/low benefit of higher education:

Will tuition ever stop increasing?
These unprecedented levels of student loan debt have only been worsened by a lackluster economy. Around 50% of graduates with bachelor's degrees under 25 are either unemployed or underemployed, according to the Associated Press. It doesn't help that over the same period that saw rapid rises in tuition rates and tuition paid, incomes have stagnated. That means that a college education is increasingly unaffordable for most students and necessitates a continued increase in student loan debt.

Making college more expensive: Our view
Making college more expensive: Our view

Democrats' proposals do little to rein in costs.
The United States prides itself on being innovative and creative. Yet it is struggling to train its next generation of achievers. Despite rapidly rising sums that the federal government has devoted to loans and grants, American college students and recent graduates are wallowing in debt. At last count, they owed $1.2 trillion.

Not surprisingly, the leading Democratic presidential candidates — Hillary Clinton,Bernie Sanders and Martin O'Malley — have come up with plans they say will make colleges more affordable and provide debt relief for millennials. Though well-intentioned, their plans threaten to drive up costs rather than rein them in. They would all throw more federal money at colleges while offering little but hope that these institutions would hold expenses down.
If history is any guide, colleges and universities will channel much of the additional money into areas that don't directly benefit students. They might also hike tuition, telling students not to worry because taxpayers will pick up much of the additional burden. A Federal Reserve Bank of New York report found that colleges increased tuition 40 cents for every dollar received in Pell Grants, and 65 cents for every dollar in subsidized loans.
Clinton's plan is the least ambitious and the most practical. Yet it still amounts to taxpayers spending a lot more money without concrete efforts to make colleges control costs. Its centerpiece is a 10-year, $175 billion program of matching grants to states that would require states to reverse recent budget cuts. It would also allow students and graduates to refinance their debts at lower interest rates, expand programs that let people repay their loans as a percentage of their incomes, and enhance existing education tax credits.

She would pay for all this with higher taxes on wealthy Americans. While the affluent can and should pay more, this is a well that lawmakers can go to only so often. New revenue that goes to tuition assistance is money that can't be used to shore up Social Security or Medicare, expand the nation's infrastructure, or reduce the budget deficit.

Plans offered by Sanders and O'Malley would go even further, setting a goal of debt-free education for all students at all public universities.

A better idea would be to take a magnifying glass to exactly why college costs have skyrocketed at three times the overall inflation rate since 1980. As with health care, the answer involves what happens when bills are paid with other people's money.

Too many universities have become bloated and inefficient, using their revenue in ways that don’t benefit the students’ education: Million dollar salaries awarded to top-paid college presidents. Professors who barely teach. Sparkling recreation centers, such as the one at Louisiana State University complete with a lazy river. Bloated bureaucracies with endless vice presidents. Money-losing sports programs.

It doesn’t take a Ph.D. to figure out where money could be saved, but persuading colleges to part with these extras won’t be easy. This is where the federal government and states can harness the leverage that accompanies their dollars to demand accountability, perhaps by awarding grants only to institutions that hold the line on tuition and fees.

Contrary to what many schools would tell you, such cost cutting isn't impossible. Purdue University in Indiana has frozen its tuition for two straight years and will continue to do so for at least two more. To be sure, some of this has been done with the budgetary gimmick of taking more out-of-state students, who pay much higher rates. Even so, Purdue's focus on cost containment should be followed by other schools.

Only by attacking rising tuition at its root cause will the problem of college affordability be addressed. The Democratic candidates need a little more educating on this.

There is no "root cause." But there are many causes. Most of which can be found in what we are. That effects how we behave. Just as what chimpanzees are effects how they behave and what bonobos are effects how they behave. After that is our diseased capitalist, expansionist and consumerism driven economy. But probably the biggest problem is living in a multiethnic society. Different creatures just don't like being around each other. It doesn't happen in the wild, and it shouldn't happen among parasitic humans.

That is why I think both Germany and Japan kick America's ass when it comes to the value of their yearly exports. Because in Germany, they have mostly Germans. And in Japan, they have mostly Japanese. This makes them more patriotic and gives them a heightened sense of community. Which in turm makes them happier. And happier people are more productive. If college professors lived in a society that they were happier to live in, they would be willing to take less to do what they do.

Aww man did you have to go there?

 

[Unkotare]

Add that to being a slave of the jews. And I will PROVE it to you. Jews make up a little more than 2% of the U.S. population. If you are White and give half a cold turd about such an extreme minority, that PROVES you are enslaved by them. I could go on. But then again, you aren't worth it.

And he's an anti-Semite. Of course! Now we're getting down to the bottom of it.

Are you a jew? Or are you a slave. If you aren't jewish, it is interesting that you bring up "anti-semite." Because as I mentioned in the post you are probably commenting on, jews only mkake up a little over 2% of the U.S. population. Also, out of a world population of over 7 BILLION people, there are only about 14 million jews. So if you aren't jewish, that you would bring up "anti-semite" over such an extreme minority PROVES you are a slave of the jews. Now that we have gotten down to the bottom of that, I wish I could tell you more without getting banned.

Stop relying on your cowardice to shy away from speaking your mind, filthy bigot. Grow a backbone or shut up about it. Your idiotic Antisemitism has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

 

[Divine Wind]

Add that to being a slave of the jews. And I will PROVE it to you. Jews make up a little more than 2% of the U.S. population. If you are White and give half a cold turd about such an extreme minority, that PROVES you are enslaved by them. I could go on. But then again, you aren't worth it.

And he's an anti-Semite. Of course! Now we're getting down to the bottom of it.

Are you a jew? Or are you a slave. If you aren't jewish, it is interesting that you bring up "anti-semite." Because as I mentioned in the post you are probably commenting on, jews only mkake up a little over 2% of the U.S. population. Also, out of a world population of over 7 BILLION people, there are only about 14 million jews. So if you aren't jewish, that you would bring up "anti-semite" over such an extreme minority PROVES you are a slave of the jews. Now that we have gotten down to the bottom of that, I wish I could tell you more without getting banned.

LOL. Dude, you just proved Dont Taz Me Bro correct.

 

[Divine Wind]

When I went to highschool, I was never charged for it. That's all that matters. Next, if you make college free, reducing the price of college would be accomplished.

Your parents were charged along with all the other taxpaying adults so just because you got a free ride doesn't mean HS was free. Maybe if you took some of those Khan Academy math and economic lessons you'd understand why saying "if you make college free, reducing the price of college would be accomplished" is so woefully ignorant of reality....and you should have your HS diploma revoked.

 

[Divine Wind]

Why bring Hitler into it? Because Hitler was a GOD! Almost everything you have ever been taught or heard about him are damnable LIES! If Hitler was running this country, there probably would be free college education. (As well as free health coverage) Though that would probably mean that negroes would have part of the U.S. as their own homeland and the same having been done for latinos. But that would be an incredibly small price to pay. Because Whites just don't need non-whites around.

Dude, college can't save you from yourself.

 

[Treeshepherd]

Many free online courses are available thru top universities. Community college is nearly free for low income students, and dirt cheap for everyone else (in California).

The internet has opened up tons of opportunity for information sharing and self learning. Imagine using virtual reality to simulate a classroom experience with a 'room' full of avatar classmates.

Universities are centers of learning. But, learning has no center in the digital age. Information is everywhere. It's merely cultural lag and centralized accreditation authority that maintain the current model of higher education. Too many cheaper alternatives exist, so the model is ripe for disruption.

Politicians try to solve yesterday's problems. We don't need to save universities or make the current dinosaur 'affordable'. We need to create the education system of tomorrow

 

[Divine Wind]

Many free online courses are available thru top universities. Community college is nearly free for low income students, and dirt cheap for everyone else (in California).

The internet has opened up tons of opportunity for information sharing and self learning. Imagine using virtual reality to simulate a classroom experience with a 'room' full of avatar classmates.

Universities are centers of learning. But, learning has no center in the digital age. Information is everywhere. It's merely cultural lag and centralized accreditation authority that maintain the current model of higher education. Too many cheaper alternatives exist, so the model is ripe for disruption.

Politicians try to solve yesterday's problems. We don't need to save universities or make the current dinosaur 'affordable'. We need to create the education system of tomorrow

Agreed, but try telling that to racist, antisemitic slacker potheads.

 

[krypto]

Add that to being a slave of the jews. And I will PROVE it to you. Jews make up a little more than 2% of the U.S. population. If you are White and give half a cold turd about such an extreme minority, that PROVES you are enslaved by them. I could go on. But then again, you aren't worth it.

And he's an anti-Semite. Of course! Now we're getting down to the bottom of it.

Are you a jew? Or are you a slave. If you aren't jewish, it is interesting that you bring up "anti-semite." Because as I mentioned in the post you are probably commenting on, jews only mkake up a little over 2% of the U.S. population. Also, out of a world population of over 7 BILLION people, there are only about 14 million jews. So if you aren't jewish, that you would bring up "anti-semite" over such an extreme minority PROVES you are a slave of the jews. Now that we have gotten down to the bottom of that, I wish I could tell you more without getting banned.

LOL. Dude, you just proved Dont Taz Me Bro correct.

Do tell. How.

 

[Divine Wind]

Do tell. How.

With at least two of your racist, antisemitic rants on this thread. I'm sure there are more.

 

[krypto]

When I went to highschool, I was never charged for it. That's all that matters. Next, if you make college free, reducing the price of college would be accomplished.

Your parents were charged along with all the other taxpaying adults so just because you got a free ride doesn't mean HS was free. Maybe if you took some of those Khan Academy math and economic lessons you'd understand why saying "if you make college free, reducing the price of college would be accomplished" is so woefully ignorant of reality....and you should have your HS diploma revoked.

I am seeing the divine wind of ignorance with you. I never said that highschool or anything was free. But with high school, it wasn't the students who were charged for it. That is all that matters. The same would be true if college was free, for students. What we should do to "pay" for it is to stop all tax completely. Just do what the pharoahs did when they wanted a pyramid built. Just command the people to do it.

You know, if an ant or termite colony can make a society work without money, humans should be able to. But I am talking about doing so as humans. Not exactly how insects do it. If somebody has a difficult intellectual job, you just compensate them more by giving them a little better car or a little bigger house. With a little more land. After all, insulation from other people is what most people seem to prefer. And in our society, I can't blame them. I am reminded of the old saying, "Good fences make good neighbors." Also, I decided to not take part in the full high school brainwashing program. So I dropped out.

 

[krypto]

Why bring Hitler into it? Because Hitler was a GOD! Almost everything you have ever been taught or heard about him are damnable LIES! If Hitler was running this country, there probably would be free college education. (As well as free health coverage) Though that would probably mean that negroes would have part of the U.S. as their own homeland and the same having been done for latinos. But that would be an incredibly small price to pay. Because Whites just don't need non-whites around.

Dude, college can't save you from yourself.

What. Did I say something you disagree with?

 

[Divine Wind]

I am seeing the divine wind of ignorance with you..........Also, I decided to not take part in the full high school brainwashing program. So I dropped out.

No worries. I expect that from high school dropouts, idiots, racists and the like. Have a nice life.

 

[krypto]

Many free online courses are available thru top universities. Community college is nearly free for low income students, and dirt cheap for everyone else (in California).

The internet has opened up tons of opportunity for information sharing and self learning. Imagine using virtual reality to simulate a classroom experience with a 'room' full of avatar classmates.

Universities are centers of learning. But, learning has no center in the digital age. Information is everywhere. It's merely cultural lag and centralized accreditation authority that maintain the current model of higher education. Too many cheaper alternatives exist, so the model is ripe for disruption.

Politicians try to solve yesterday's problems. We don't need to save universities or make the current dinosaur 'affordable'. We need to create the education system of tomorrow

In the realm of classrooms with students in them, I think we should stick with what works. I have also seen that some classes are starting to use an interesting technology. Each student is basically given an electronic clicker. If a professor says something that a student didn't quite understand, he presses the clicker. There is no being singled out as a dummy by raising your hand to ask the teacher something. The teacher just explains what he just did again.

Also, if it changes very drastically, the "education system of tomorrow" is likely to be what it was in the past. What Benjamin Franklin had to endure. Indentured servitude. As an indentured apprentice. I hear that on the job training works pretty well. And from what I also hear, by the time students graduate, they forget 90% of what they learned. It's no wonder that tests are usually those multiple guess tests.

 

[krypto]

Do tell. How.

With at least two of your racist, antisemitic rants on this thread. I'm sure there are more.

That isn't telling me how. I said that whoever, probably like you, is a slave of the jews. The "proof" I gave didn't seem to be good enough for you. How few jews do you think there need to be in the U.S. to make anti-semitism a non-issue. 1/4 of 1%?

 

[Divine Wind]

In the realm of classrooms with students in them, I think we should stick with what works. I have also seen that some classes are starting to use an interesting technology. Each student is basically given an electronic clicker. If a professor says something that a student didn't quite understand, he presses the clicker. There is no being singled out as a dummy by raising your hand to ask the teacher something. The teacher just explains what he just did again.

Also, if it changes very drastically, the "education system of tomorrow" is likely to be what it was in the past. What Benjamin Franklin had to endure. Indentured servitude. As an indentured apprentice. I hear that on the job training works pretty well. And from what I also hear, by the time students graduate, they forget 90% of what they learned. It's no wonder that tests are usually those multiple guess tests.

Better to just kick out all the dumbasses and let the smart kids get back to learning. The dumbasses can start immediately training in the minimum wage, paper hat job they'll have for life.

 

[krypto]

I am seeing the divine wind of ignorance with you..........Also, I decided to not take part in the full high school brainwashing program. So I dropped out.

No worries. I expect that from high school dropouts, idiots, racists and the like. Have a nice life.

Strange. You call me names. But you have yet to refute anything I said. I wonder who that makes the real idiot.

 

[Divine Wind]

That isn't telling me how. I said that whoever, probably like you, is a slave of the jews. The "proof" I gave didn't seem to be good enough for you. How few jews do you think there need to be in the U.S. to make anti-semitism a non-issue. 1/4 of 1%?

Maybe you shouldn't have dropped out of high school, eh?

 

[Divine Wind]

Strange. You call me names. But you have yet to refute anything I said. I wonder who that makes the real idiot.

Scroll up and read again.