Conservatism: Correcting the Ignorant

[Procrustes Stretched]

1. '"modern-day "conservatism" is much more concerned with the rights of global corporations than it is with individual liberties.'
I recognize this as the Liberal's pejorative description of conservatism, based on your hatred of capitalism.

a. As a result of an inordinate obsession with material equality, rather than equality before the law, the view of our (conservative) Founders, Liberals despise free market capitalism because it produces winners and loser.

b. Try to recognize that people not all the same; nor will results be.

2. "In fact, if left to their own devices, they would bury individual liberty under the rights of corporations totally."
Now, you've become irrational.

But it certainly burnished your Liberal credentials and validates the efficacy of government schooling.

Some are able to break free of the indoctrination....but you?

1. Amusing that you ended up all on your own equating corporatism with capitalism.
2. More amusing you chose to ignore the raging battle between corporations and individuals in society and went ad hominem

The very idea that American are indoctrinated in public schools is a fringe idea fed by the right

"Amusing that you ended up all on your own equating corporatism with capitalism."

Could you elucidate?

[youtube]NJnhwPcHoOQ[/youtube]

 

[PoliticalChic]

As long as you refuse to directly address the subject of your own thread, I will be happy to let the points I've made about the subject of your thread stand unchallenged,

and thus unrefuted.

You lose again.

So….who was the racist…Goldwater or LBJ?

LBJ opposed anti-lynching laws very early in his political career, when he was much more conservative. He opposed them on the grounds that states already had laws against murder.

Is that your case for LBJ being a racist?

My "case for LBJ being a racist" comes directly from the world's foremost expert on LBJ.
That would be his biographer, Robert Caro.


Prior to 1957, Johnson “had never supported civil rights legislation- any civil rights legislation. In the Senate and House alike, his record was an unbroken one of votes against every civil rights bill that had ever come to a vote: against voting rights bills; against bills that would have struck at job discrimination and at segregation in other areas of American life; even against bills that would have protected blacks from lynching.” Robert A. Caro, “Master of the Senate: The Years of Lyndon Johnson, vol.3,” p. xv .


Need more?
His policies, though, were more polemics than philanthropies. His racial attitudes are suggested by his biographer, Robert Dallek, who quotes him defending the Supreme Court appointment of the very well-known Thurgood Marshall, rather than a black judge less identified with the civil rights cause, by saying to a staff member, "Son, when I appoint a ****** to the court, I want everyone to know he's a ******."
http://query.nytimes.co/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CEED6163EF932A15754C0A967958260


Does that make clear the rationale for the 1964 Civil Rights Act?



Let's be clear here, Sloth....either you realize fully that the Democrat Party and LBJ was the party of slavery, and segregation for a full century after the Civil War....or, as I've described you before, you have an intellect the rival of garden tools.


I believe you fully recognize your vulnerability on this issue, and that is why you have attempted to slander Senator Goldwater.




Happiness will be seeing your picture on a milk carton.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. Amusing that you ended up all on your own equating corporatism with capitalism.
2. More amusing you chose to ignore the raging battle between corporations and individuals in society and went ad hominem

The very idea that American are indoctrinated in public schools is a fringe idea fed by the right

"Amusing that you ended up all on your own equating corporatism with capitalism."

Could you elucidate?

[youtube]NJnhwPcHoOQ[/youtube]

Thanks so much.
The book is sitting here in my library.


Possibly you misunderstood the question:


"Amusing that you ended up all on your own equating corporatism with capitalism."

Could you elucidate?

 

[PoliticalChic]

If you want to play that game, Reagan is Not Bowing...but look who is.

How the hell you know Reagan didn't? And what if he did? They bow to the queen also, Limbaugh Hair-Splitter.

No, they don't.


"There are many good reasons for this, starting with "We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal." It would seem that President Obama hasn't read or understood that document. It's hard to see if he's going in for a ring kiss, but perhaps that had already happened behind closed doors. In any case, it is especially heartening to see the President of the United States performing his kowtow to his betters, isn't it?"
Traditionally, American Presidents Do Not Bow Down to Kings @ AMERICAN DIGEST

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

part 1 very sad listening to how ignorant these three young people are

[youtube]EJAAxCbU8Ys[/youtube]

they remind me of the young turks on the left who after 2000 and 2004 thought all they had to do was sell their message better, reinvent liberalism when they weren't really liberals. these young people aren't truly conservative and they are all over the place with labels, names, and whatnot ....scatter brained ideas, yet focused on reacting. LOL

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

So….who was the racist…Goldwater or LBJ?

LBJ opposed anti-lynching laws very early in his political career, when he was much more conservative. He opposed them on the grounds that states already had laws against murder.

Is that your case for LBJ being a racist?

My "case for LBJ being a racist" comes directly from the world's foremost expert on LBJ.
That would be his biographer, Robert Caro.

If you say so. All I know is if you judge a man by his actions and deeds you will better know his heart and mind

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Possibly you misunderstood the question:

"Amusing that you ended up all on your own equating corporatism with capitalism."

Could you elucidate?

Nope: somebody attacked corporatism and you defended capitalism

 

[PoliticalChic]

Possibly you misunderstood the question:

"Amusing that you ended up all on your own equating corporatism with capitalism."

Could you elucidate?

Nope: somebody attacked corporatism and you defended capitalism

So, you are retreating from the position, the claim, that I equated corporatism with capitalism.

Wise.


I was about to sign you up as goalie for the dart team.

 

[PoliticalChic]

LBJ opposed anti-lynching laws very early in his political career, when he was much more conservative. He opposed them on the grounds that states already had laws against murder.

Is that your case for LBJ being a racist?

My "case for LBJ being a racist" comes directly from the world's foremost expert on LBJ.
That would be his biographer, Robert Caro.

If you say so. All I know is if you judge a man by his actions and deeds you will better know his heart and mind

Exactly so.



1. So, the struggle ended: Thurgood Marshall had won his cases in the Supreme Court, Eisenhower used the military to enforce the victories, Nixon desegregated the schools and building trades, and Democrat “Bull” Connor was voted out of office by the people of Alabama. And, finally, even a majority of Democrats supported civil rights. Democrat segregationists were defeated.

2. This was the precise moment when liberals decided it was time to come out strongly against race discrimination!

3. Not having participated in the winning side of the battle, Democrats spent the next few decades pretending, and engaging in a ritualistic reenactment of the struggle. They wrote a modern day passion play, designating “racists,” “victims of racist violence,” and wrote themselves the best part: “saviors of black America!”

4. “In addition to lying in the history books, liberals lied on their personal resumes. Suddenly, every liberal remembered being beaten up by a 300-pound Southern sheriff during the civil rights movement. Among the ones who have been caught falsely gassing about their civil rights heroism are Bob Beckel, Carl Bernstein and Joseph Ellis. (Some days, it seems as if there are more liberals pretending to have been Freedom Riders than pretending to be Cherokees!)… You will never see anything so brave as a liberal fighting nonexistent enemies.”
Liberals Can't Break 200-Year Racism Habit - Ann Coulter - [page]

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

My "case for LBJ being a racist" comes directly from the world's foremost expert on LBJ.
That would be his biographer, Robert Caro.

If you say so. All I know is if you judge a man by his actions and deeds you will better know his heart and mind

2. This was the precise moment when liberals decided it was time to come out strongly against race discrimination!

were liberals in the GOP and DNC who supported civil rights.

Racists: Southern White Conservative Christians who had controlled the DNC since the early days of slave holders inventing the Republican Democratic Party. Northerners and Liberals split off and started the Republican party leaving the Southerners and conservatives the democratic party.

Through the years liberals and conservatives were welcome in each party, but wherever the Southern White Conservative Christian Segregationists went GOP or DNC, racist legislation went

 

[NYcarbineer]

So….who was the racist…Goldwater or LBJ?

LBJ opposed anti-lynching laws very early in his political career, when he was much more conservative. He opposed them on the grounds that states already had laws against murder.

Is that your case for LBJ being a racist?

My "case for LBJ being a racist" comes directly from the world's foremost expert on LBJ.
That would be his biographer, Robert Caro.


Prior to 1957, Johnson “had never supported civil rights legislation- any civil rights legislation. In the Senate and House alike, his record was an unbroken one of votes against every civil rights bill that had ever come to a vote: against voting rights bills; against bills that would have struck at job discrimination and at segregation in other areas of American life; even against bills that would have protected blacks from lynching.” Robert A. Caro, “Master of the Senate: The Years of Lyndon Johnson, vol.3,” p. xv .


Need more?
His policies, though, were more polemics than philanthropies. His racial attitudes are suggested by his biographer, Robert Dallek, who quotes him defending the Supreme Court appointment of the very well-known Thurgood Marshall, rather than a black judge less identified with the civil rights cause, by saying to a staff member, "Son, when I appoint a ****** to the court, I want everyone to know he's a ******."
http://query.nytimes.co/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CEED6163EF932A15754C0A967958260


Does that make clear the rationale for the 1964 Civil Rights Act?



Let's be clear here, Sloth....either you realize fully that the Democrat Party and LBJ was the party of slavery, and segregation for a full century after the Civil War....or, as I've described you before, you have an intellect the rival of garden tools.


I believe you fully recognize your vulnerability on this issue, and that is why you have attempted to slander Senator Goldwater.




Happiness will be seeing your picture on a milk carton.

I never said anything about Goldwater other than the FACT that he fits the description of the original quote that is the subject of your thread.

If Lyndon Johnson is a racist for not supporting a federal law against lynching, then anyone who ever opposed federal hate crime legislation is a racist, agreed?

When are you going to tell us whether or not you agree with Goldwater's position on the civil rights act of 1964?

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

1. So, the struggle ended: Thurgood Marshall had won his cases in the Supreme Court, Eisenhower used the military to enforce the victories, Nixon desegregated the schools and building trades, and Democrat “Bull” Connor was voted out of office by the people of Alabama. And, finally, even a majority of Democrats supported civil rights. Democrat segregationists were defeated.

2. This was the precise moment when liberals decided it was time to come out strongly against race discrimination!

Epic Fail!

Democratic Republican Party splits: Liberals and Federalists and Northerners start GOP - Southerner Andrew Jackson ...states rights, pro slavery, beginning of Democratic party

see a trend? Liberal anti slavery versus Conservative pro slavery

Segregationists the children of pro slavery people, leave Democratic party into the welcoming open arms of GOP and the GOP Southern Strategy takes root.

Democratic-Republican Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

National Republican Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Civil Rights Act of 1964 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In 1960, Connor was elected Democratic National Committeeman for Alabama, soon after filing a lawsuit against The New York Times for $1.5 million, for what he said was insinuating that he had promoted racial hatred.
(Southern White Conservative Christian Democrat sues LIBERAL PRESS)
...

Because of the attack on the Freedom Riders, Project C, and Birmingham’s worsening reputation, voters had become dissatisfied with Connor. In November 1962, when the voters of Birmingham decided to switch to a Mayor-Council form of government, Connor sued to have the election thrown out. On May 11, 1963, Connor was ordered to vacate his office following the Alabama Supreme Court decision in favor of a Mayor-Council government, ending his 22-year run as the Commissioner of Public Safety.[13](Bull Connor was NOT voted out of office) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bull_Connor#Freedom_Riders_and_Project_C

Later career

On June 3, 1964, Connor resumed his place in government when he was elected to the post of Alabama Public Service Commission director (bigots and haters regroup and good ole boy back in Alabama government)

 

[NYcarbineer]

5. Conservatism proclaims that the only right and proper function of our government is to secure, promote, and protect the individual liberties of the citizen.

Really? Then why are the most important conservative planks in the Republican Party platform

1. one to take away all individual rights to an abortion, and

2. one to take away all individual rights to same sex marriage.

?

 

[KnobbyWalsh]

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Possibly you misunderstood the question:

"Amusing that you ended up all on your own equating corporatism with capitalism."

Could you elucidate?

Nope: somebody attacked corporatism and you defended capitalism

So, you are retreating from the position, the claim, that I equated corporatism with capitalism.

You attacked the attack on corporatism by interjecting capitalism into the debate. You countered attacked an attack on corporatism, by defending capitalism. You equated the two.

 

[PoliticalChic]

LBJ opposed anti-lynching laws very early in his political career, when he was much more conservative. He opposed them on the grounds that states already had laws against murder.

Is that your case for LBJ being a racist?

My "case for LBJ being a racist" comes directly from the world's foremost expert on LBJ.
That would be his biographer, Robert Caro.


Prior to 1957, Johnson “had never supported civil rights legislation- any civil rights legislation. In the Senate and House alike, his record was an unbroken one of votes against every civil rights bill that had ever come to a vote: against voting rights bills; against bills that would have struck at job discrimination and at segregation in other areas of American life; even against bills that would have protected blacks from lynching.” Robert A. Caro, “Master of the Senate: The Years of Lyndon Johnson, vol.3,” p. xv .


Need more?
His policies, though, were more polemics than philanthropies. His racial attitudes are suggested by his biographer, Robert Dallek, who quotes him defending the Supreme Court appointment of the very well-known Thurgood Marshall, rather than a black judge less identified with the civil rights cause, by saying to a staff member, "Son, when I appoint a ****** to the court, I want everyone to know he's a ******."
http://query.nytimes.co/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CEED6163EF932A15754C0A967958260


Does that make clear the rationale for the 1964 Civil Rights Act?



Let's be clear here, Sloth....either you realize fully that the Democrat Party and LBJ was the party of slavery, and segregation for a full century after the Civil War....or, as I've described you before, you have an intellect the rival of garden tools.


I believe you fully recognize your vulnerability on this issue, and that is why you have attempted to slander Senator Goldwater.




Happiness will be seeing your picture on a milk carton.

I never said anything about Goldwater other than the FACT that he fits the description of the original quote that is the subject of your thread.

If Lyndon Johnson is a racist for not supporting a federal law against lynching, then anyone who ever opposed federal hate crime legislation is a racist, agreed?

When are you going to tell us whether or not you agree with Goldwater's position on the civil rights act of 1964?

Good to see you scooting off with your tail between your legs, and no longer suggesting some imaginary link between Goldwater and a desire for segregation.

So...we agree that LBJ was the racist and the same for 100 years of Democrats?



I understand your desire to recoup some saving of face.....but this is just as absurd:
"If Lyndon Johnson is a racist for not supporting a federal law against lynching, then anyone who ever opposed federal hate crime legislation is a racist, agreed?"


I am opposed to thought crime legislation.
Only a Liberal would support such, and base it on what a criminal was supposedly thinking.
Next...restrictions on free speech?


In your collective role as the 'white-warriors-against-racism,' I suggest you endorse what a former mayor of NYC countered with: simply make any crime committed by a member of one race against a member of another race a hate-crime.
Far more objective.

You'll support that, won't you?

 

[NYcarbineer]

My "case for LBJ being a racist" comes directly from the world's foremost expert on LBJ.
That would be his biographer, Robert Caro.

If you say so. All I know is if you judge a man by his actions and deeds you will better know his heart and mind

Exactly so.



1. So, the struggle ended: Thurgood Marshall had won his cases in the Supreme Court, Eisenhower used the military to enforce the victories, Nixon desegregated the schools and building trades, and Democrat “Bull” Connor was voted out of office by the people of Alabama. And, finally, even a majority of Democrats supported civil rights. Democrat segregationists were defeated.

2. This was the precise moment when liberals decided it was time to come out strongly against race discrimination!

3. Not having participated in the winning side of the battle, Democrats spent the next few decades pretending, and engaging in a ritualistic reenactment of the struggle. They wrote a modern day passion play, designating “racists,” “victims of racist violence,” and wrote themselves the best part: “saviors of black America!”

4. “In addition to lying in the history books, liberals lied on their personal resumes. Suddenly, every liberal remembered being beaten up by a 300-pound Southern sheriff during the civil rights movement. Among the ones who have been caught falsely gassing about their civil rights heroism are Bob Beckel, Carl Bernstein and Joseph Ellis. (Some days, it seems as if there are more liberals pretending to have been Freedom Riders than pretending to be Cherokees!)… You will never see anything so brave as a liberal fighting nonexistent enemies.”
Liberals Can't Break 200-Year Racism Habit - Ann Coulter - [page]

Wrong. The movement of the conservative Southern wing of the Democratic party out of the Democratic party was begun when Truman integrated the armed forces. Truman began the movement of the Democratic party to the forefront of civil rights causes and effectively began to bring to an end the liberal/conservative northern/southern Democratic party coalition.

The so-called 'solid South' began to break up.

Barry Goldwater voted against the Civil Rights Act in '64, ran for president in '64, and won, for example,

80% of the vote in Mississippi, one of the most racist states in country. If Goldwater wasn't himself a racist,

he sure had lots of racist friends after 1964.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Nope: somebody attacked corporatism and you defended capitalism

So, you are retreating from the position, the claim, that I equated corporatism with capitalism.

You attacked the attack on corporatism by interjecting capitalism into the debate. You countered attacked an attack on corporatism, by defending capitalism. You equated the two.

There was no such attack.

He attacked corporations.

Need me to explain the dif?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Conservatism: Correcting the Ignorant

You had a fellow rightist recently exhibit his ignorance by posting that the US Constitution applies only to US citizens. “Period.”

Clearly conservatives are in no position to ‘correct’ anyone about anything.

 

[PoliticalChic]

If you say so. All I know is if you judge a man by his actions and deeds you will better know his heart and mind

Exactly so.



1. So, the struggle ended: Thurgood Marshall had won his cases in the Supreme Court, Eisenhower used the military to enforce the victories, Nixon desegregated the schools and building trades, and Democrat “Bull” Connor was voted out of office by the people of Alabama. And, finally, even a majority of Democrats supported civil rights. Democrat segregationists were defeated.

2. This was the precise moment when liberals decided it was time to come out strongly against race discrimination!

3. Not having participated in the winning side of the battle, Democrats spent the next few decades pretending, and engaging in a ritualistic reenactment of the struggle. They wrote a modern day passion play, designating “racists,” “victims of racist violence,” and wrote themselves the best part: “saviors of black America!”

4. “In addition to lying in the history books, liberals lied on their personal resumes. Suddenly, every liberal remembered being beaten up by a 300-pound Southern sheriff during the civil rights movement. Among the ones who have been caught falsely gassing about their civil rights heroism are Bob Beckel, Carl Bernstein and Joseph Ellis. (Some days, it seems as if there are more liberals pretending to have been Freedom Riders than pretending to be Cherokees!)… You will never see anything so brave as a liberal fighting nonexistent enemies.”
Liberals Can't Break 200-Year Racism Habit - Ann Coulter - [page]

Wrong. The movement of the conservative Southern wing of the Democratic party out of the Democratic party was begun when Truman integrated the armed forces. Truman began the movement of the Democratic party to the forefront of civil rights causes and effectively began to bring to an end the liberal/conservative northern/southern Democratic party coalition.

The so-called 'solid South' began to break up.

Barry Goldwater voted against the Civil Rights Act in '64, ran for president in '64, and won, for example,

80% of the vote in Mississippi, one of the most racist states in country. If Goldwater wasn't himself a racist,

he sure had lots of racist friends after 1964.

1. First of all, the Democrats didn’t pass the Civil Rights Bill of 1964. That bill, along with every civil rights bill for the preceding century, was supported by substantially more Republicans than Democrats.

2. Second, the South kept voting for Democrats for decades after that 1964 act. And, btw, Democrats continued to win a plurality of votes in southern congressional elections for the next 30 years…right up to 1994. "GOP Poised to Reap Redistricting Rewards" by Michael Barone on Creators.com - A Syndicate Of Talent


a. Between ’48 and ’88, Republicans never won a majority of the Dixiecrat states, outside of two 49-state landslides. Any loses in the South are directly attributable to their championing abortion, gays in the military, Christian-bashing, springing criminals, attacks on guns, dovish foreign policy, ‘save the whales/kill the humans environmentalism….certainly not race!


b. Rather than the Republicans winning the Dixiecrat vote, the Dixiecrats simply died out. By contrast, Democrats kept winning the alleged “segregationist” states into the ‘90’s. If states were voting for Goldwater out of racism, what of Carter’s 1976 sweep of all the Goldwater states?



3. "Three years after Brown, President Eisenhower won passage of his landmark Civil Rights Act of 1957. Republican Senator Everett Dirksen authored and introduced the 1960 Civil Rights Act, and saw it through to passage. Republicans supported the 1964 Civil Rights Act and the 1965 Voting Rights Act overwhelmingly, and by much higher percentages in both House and Senate than the Democrats. Indeed, the 1964 Civil Rights Act became law only after overcoming a Democrat filibuster."
Everything I Know Is Wrong: History of the Republican Party