Creationists

[cbirch2]

No you are not getting it. If we did not have them there would be no life and life couldn't start without these condirions. There are no other planets we know of like this and that is the reason we see no life out there. You can say there so many planets how do you know ? Well as we know for now there is no life out there . There won't be either without the conditions of this planet. This is obvious evidence of a creator. To believe as your aide does I would have to try and stop reasoning from the evidence. If you missed it earlier I was asking where would amino acids come from the building blocks of life come from when the environment woe destroy them before they could become life. You add this up with the probability video I posted yesterday,not a very good chance for life developing without a designer.

kepler 22b - Google Search

Thats just the most earth like found so far. There are 708 other known exosolar planets, planets that are orbiting other stars.

But the idea needed to refute you is the anthropic principle. In short, your guilty of yet another logical fallacy.

Its like asking "why didnt life form on mars?" Well because thats impossible, given its current conditions.

Or "why did life form on earth and not another planet?" Thats like asking why your sitting in the room your in....because you are....If we had been born on, for example, kepler 22b, we would just call that our home planet, and have no knowledge of what we now call earth.

Theory does not trump facts sorry.

Lol now your just running away from arguments.

Ok, cool.

 

[cbirch2]

creationists are a bad joke, will be gone in a couple more generatons

Eh, theres still some young ones.

But your about right.

YWC, embrace your dying breed.

Lol actually, to him this is a good sign. Its a signal that has actually right, because his kind is being persecuted.

All religions have things like this built in, things that necessitate the survival of the religion.

All religions have some form of persecution in their mythology, so that any challenge to the religious order is perceived as fulfillment of prophecy.
And all religions tell their followers to continually reproduce, so as to boost their numbers. Its how the mormons, and before that the catholics, did it.

Its all just bullshiite

Don't think so, but you might want to prepare for the coming my friend.

Lol is it coming in your lifetime?

Do you believe jesus is coming back in your life time?

 

[cbirch2]

And do you not realize that claiming the early atmosphere had free oxygen is speculation as well right? The only difference is that my theory has evidence supporting it. Although i know creationists don't like evidence...

 

[Youwerecreated]

Eh, theres still some young ones.

But your about right.

YWC, embrace your dying breed.

Lol actually, to him this is a good sign. Its a signal that has actually right, because his kind is being persecuted.

All religions have things like this built in, things that necessitate the survival of the religion.

All religions have some form of persecution in their mythology, so that any challenge to the religious order is perceived as fulfillment of prophecy.
And all religions tell their followers to continually reproduce, so as to boost their numbers. Its how the mormons, and before that the catholics, did it.

Its all just bullshiite

One side will be dying for sure and that's what bothers me. There is no life but earth and the conditions of the earth is the reason there is life here. And these conditions would not allow life to start here without a creator.. believe as you must but you are clearly wrong on this.

Your like the cristians that used to tell us the world was flat, or that the earth was the center of the solar system, or that the sun was the center of the universe.

The components of life are the result of natural, and simple, chemical processes; and they exist anywhere that the conditions are right.

Since were on the topic of alien life, and all that.


Earth is just a chunk of rock, made round by gravity:

Orbiting around a cloud of hydrogen gas undergoing a perpetual thermonuclear reaction, again as a result of gravity:

Along with many other planets, in the form of a solar system:

And our star, and our solar system as a whole, is just one of many stars that we can see:

And all of the stars that we can see individually are stars within our own galaxy, the milky way, a collection of billions of stars:

(thats actually a different galaxy, because we can't take pictures of our own galaxy)

And even our galaxy, the milky way, is just one of many galaxies we see far away, and they even form clusters:

Why would you think that one tiny planet is special? It is one of billions of planets within our galaxy alone. And our galaxy is just one of billions of galaxies, each with around the same number of stars.

And god gave it all to us!

Why are you so dumb?

And I'm wrong about that??

Go ask some teenagers how they feel about creationism. Im right.

Because its the only one that contains life and can sustain life dummy. You should be able to reason that out for yourself,but no you couldn't do that either.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Wow.

You dont just get to dismiss evidence as imagination because you dont agree with it.

Im saying "deposits of this type of iron molecule can only exist if the earth once had a reducing atmosphere, and you cant explain it any other way."

And your saying, essentially, "pics or it didnt happen"

Wow.

Neither do you but you do because your mind is not open to the truth.

Dude I'm just not going to be convinced by someone that continually shows they have no knowledge of anything intelligent, at all. As you'll see shortly....



No not really. See: Anaerobic Organisms



"The atmosphere keeps the oxygen in"

Please stop hypothesizing. You remind me of Newt Gingrich, the idea man! Yea, only if you accept retarded ideas....

Wtf does, the atmosphere keeps the oxygen in, even mean? If you want to get technical, gravity keeps the oxygen in.

The reason oxygen would not have existed in the early environment is because it readily reacts with the chemicals arounds it, like iron, and any in the atmosphere would have quickly been bound to other chemicals like iron. Eventually these chemicals become saturated with oxygen, because early anaerobic organisms were oxygenating the atmosphere by producing oxygen as a by product of their metabolism, and the excess oxygen then starts to accumulate in the atmosphere.

It has nothing to do with "the atmosphere keeping the oxygen in". Thats just a strange statement.



Lol it took intelligence to perform the experiment? Thats your argument?

So if those organic compounds came together by chance in a reducing environment, the same thing wouldn't happen? They only got that result because a person poured the chemicals together, essentially?

Can you not see the list of coincidences,,miracles,and all the chances needed for this universe, this planet, and the life we see that was needed for it to happen naturally. surely you can see the design and purpose i spoke of now.

I don't see any miracles because i understand how it works. You really think that a planet and a star are a miracle? They are the only possible outcome of gravity. There are 708 known planets outside of out solar system, orbiting other stars; and thousands more pending. Wow, whole lot of miracles.

We see stars being created, it happens just like we think. Its just gravity pulling a star together. Are we witnessing miracles?

Ill admit that gravity may be a result of god, but god did not create the sun as it is now; the sun formed like every other star we see. Anyone that thinks otherwise is a fucking idiot.

Some very good things come from science but theories built on wild imagination are not the good things that come from science,that comes from Ideologues and ones who spread these messages are Idelogues.

They aren't built on imagination you fool. Just because you can't follow deductive reasoning and don't understand chemistry, doesn't mean they're imaginary. I means your a thick skulled fool.

so are you suggesting life began with these organisms you really are way out there and don't have a clue about reality.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Now you been reduced to cherry picking from theories to make your arguments ? No my argument was amino acids ,you know the building blocks of life could not form in the environment that contained oxygen. How did you miss that,where were you educated ?

 

[Youwerecreated]

CCbirch you can lie to some but not someone that knows more then you foolish child.

 

[cbirch2]

One side will be dying for sure and that's what bothers me. There is no life but earth and the conditions of the earth is the reason there is life here. And these conditions would not allow life to start here without a creator.. believe as you must but you are clearly wrong on this.

Your like the cristians that used to tell us the world was flat, or that the earth was the center of the solar system, or that the sun was the center of the universe.

The components of life are the result of natural, and simple, chemical processes; and they exist anywhere that the conditions are right.

Since were on the topic of alien life, and all that.


Earth is just a chunk of rock, made round by gravity:

Orbiting around a cloud of hydrogen gas undergoing a perpetual thermonuclear reaction, again as a result of gravity:

Along with many other planets, in the form of a solar system:

And our star, and our solar system as a whole, is just one of many stars that we can see:

And all of the stars that we can see individually are stars within our own galaxy, the milky way, a collection of billions of stars:

(thats actually a different galaxy, because we can't take pictures of our own galaxy)

And even our galaxy, the milky way, is just one of many galaxies we see far away, and they even form clusters:

Why would you think that one tiny planet is special? It is one of billions of planets within our galaxy alone. And our galaxy is just one of billions of galaxies, each with around the same number of stars.

And god gave it all to us!

Why are you so dumb?

And I'm wrong about that??

Go ask some teenagers how they feel about creationism. Im right.

Because its the only one that contains life and can sustain life dummy. You should be able to reason that out for yourself,but no you couldn't do that either.

That claim is totally unsubstantiated.

In the middle ages the europeans thought the world was flat because no one was able to see otherwise. Your using the same argument again, theres that logical fallacy again.

So what do these other water covered worlds look like? Are there organic compounds in the oceans?

Your brain damaged.

 

[cbirch2]

Neither do you but you do because your mind is not open to the truth.

Dude I'm just not going to be convinced by someone that continually shows they have no knowledge of anything intelligent, at all. As you'll see shortly....



No not really. See: Anaerobic Organisms



"The atmosphere keeps the oxygen in"

Please stop hypothesizing. You remind me of Newt Gingrich, the idea man! Yea, only if you accept retarded ideas....

Wtf does, the atmosphere keeps the oxygen in, even mean? If you want to get technical, gravity keeps the oxygen in.

The reason oxygen would not have existed in the early environment is because it readily reacts with the chemicals arounds it, like iron, and any in the atmosphere would have quickly been bound to other chemicals like iron. Eventually these chemicals become saturated with oxygen, because early anaerobic organisms were oxygenating the atmosphere by producing oxygen as a by product of their metabolism, and the excess oxygen then starts to accumulate in the atmosphere.

It has nothing to do with "the atmosphere keeping the oxygen in". Thats just a strange statement.



Lol it took intelligence to perform the experiment? Thats your argument?

So if those organic compounds came together by chance in a reducing environment, the same thing wouldn't happen? They only got that result because a person poured the chemicals together, essentially?



I don't see any miracles because i understand how it works. You really think that a planet and a star are a miracle? They are the only possible outcome of gravity. There are 708 known planets outside of out solar system, orbiting other stars; and thousands more pending. Wow, whole lot of miracles.

We see stars being created, it happens just like we think. Its just gravity pulling a star together. Are we witnessing miracles?

Ill admit that gravity may be a result of god, but god did not create the sun as it is now; the sun formed like every other star we see. Anyone that thinks otherwise is a fucking idiot.

Some very good things come from science but theories built on wild imagination are not the good things that come from science,that comes from Ideologues and ones who spread these messages are Idelogues.

They aren't built on imagination you fool. Just because you can't follow deductive reasoning and don't understand chemistry, doesn't mean they're imaginary. I means your a thick skulled fool.

so are you suggesting life began with these organisms you really are way out there and don't have a clue about reality.

Yea i am actually.

How many times do i have to tell you, laughing off the arguments does nothing but make me respect you less and less.

Its like a husband who wont accept that his wife is cheating on him. You can ignore all the signs but that doesnt mean its not happening.

 

[cbirch2]

Now you been reduced to cherry picking from theories to make your arguments ? No my argument was amino acids ,you know the building blocks of life could not form in the environment that contained oxygen. How did you miss that,where were you educated ?

What are you talking about?

Didnt we already have this discussion. Free oxygen did not exist in the early atmosphere. We have evidence to prove it.

Now plug your ears and cry, im sure thats about why your response will be.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Cbirch do you understand that there are over 100 amino acids that your side admits that they can't form naturally how do you explain that ? You really are just using smoke and mirrors and deliberately being misleading with your responses either that or you do not understand what you are talking about. No oxygen ,you are a funny guy and so are anyone else that suggests such nonsense. There are no explosions and no fire without oxygen.

 

[cbirch2]

CCbirch you can lie to some but not someone that knows more then you foolish child.

Someone that knows more than me? Lol. Thats awesome.

Ive had to explain everything to you. The structure of an atom, the types of organic molecules, examples of genetic mutations, the evolutionary trees of organisms, transitional fossils, how information is encoded in the genome, what nucleotides are, etc, etc, etc....And you havent explained one thing to me. In fact all ive done is correct your ignorance.

How the hell can you possibly think you know more than i do?

You have not provided one piece of evidence. In fact you havent once shown you even have an understanding of chemistry or biology. Not once. Everything you say about genetics and chemistry is just blatant ignorance. Its not even based on text book knowledge, its obvious that you read these creationist websites and form your understanding of science upon those. Its sad

A respectable creationist is one who first understands the science and then rejects it. You've accepted the creationist viewpoint and then set out to disprove the science. And in doing so you've managed to learn a very wrong notion of just about every science.

 

[cbirch2]

Cbirch do you understand that there are over 100 amino acids can't form naturally how do you explain that?

Again, please understand how things work. Theres about 20 amino acids that form naturally, yep.

The idea is that a whole bunch are coded for by sequences of nucleic acids, which do form naturally. Not all amino acids may be able to form naturally, but the blueprints that code for them do.

You really are just using smoke and mirrors and deliberately being misleading with your responses either that or you do not understand what you are talking about.

Nope im not being misleading. Your being an idiot.

 

[cbirch2]

I just want to make sure you realize the logical fallacy of your "life only exists on earth" argument.

We cannot observe any other planet close enough to come to that conclusion.

So the only factual conclusion to come to at this point is that we dont know if life exists elsewhere. To say it doesnt is wishful thinking, just like when europeans thought the earth was flat.

But what we can say is that planets are very common, and that planets within a stars habitable zone are common as well.

You can claim life is special, but you cannot claim the earth is special. And in my mind if earth isnt special, that would seem to indicate life isnt special either. But others may not see it that way.

 

[skipper]

Ill admit that gravity may be a result of god, but god did not create the sun as it is now; the sun formed like every other star we see. Anyone that thinks otherwise is a fucking idiot.

Just trying to follow along. So god may have created gravity? Is this the result of a lack of scientific knowledge? Not taking sides here. Just an interesting on-looker.

 

[daws101]

Who is your God naturalism ?

why would I need a god when none exists, except in the minds of those who invented it.

You mean the same way they invented the idea that all living organisms are related

once more it is not an invention it's a valid conclusion based on on evidence ,unlike yours.

 

[daws101]

Just pointing out what an educated fool believes.

so ignorance is bliss then?

Apparently so if you believe life was not directed by someone and believe in chance.

chance is fact and operates in real time..
so it is unnecessary to believe be·lieve verb \bə-ˈlēv\
be·lievedbe·liev·ing
Definition of BELIEVE
intransitive verb
1a : to have a firm religious faith)in it.
there is no proof of a "someone"

 

[daws101]

So you like mathematics.

Mathematics Disprove Evolution? The probability of spontaneous generation (creation vs. evolution) - YouTube

fine example of a false premise!

Explain the false false premise ?

A false premise is an incorrect proposition that forms the basis of a logical syllogism. Since the premise (proposition, or assumption) is not correct, the conclusion drawn may be in error

 

[daws101]

You like to put words in peoples mouths.

The components of most systems on earth remain on earth. In this sense, the earth is a closed system.

lol life isnt

Does Entropy Contradict Evolution?

by Henry Morris, Ph.D. *

The popular syndicated columnist, Sydney Harris, recently commented on the evolution/entropy conflict as follows:


There is a factor called "entropy" in physics, indicating that the whole universe of matter is running down, and ultimately will reduce itself to uniform chaos. This follows from the Second Law of Thermodynamics, which seems about as basic and unquestionable to modern scientific minds as any truth can be. At the same time that this is happening on the physical level of existence, something quite different seems to be happening on the biological level: structure and species are becoming more complex, more sophisticated, more organized, with higher degrees of performance and consciousness.1

As Harris points out, the law of increasing entropy is a universal law of decreasing complexity, whereas evolution is supposed to be a universal law of increasing complexity. Creationists have been pointing out this serious contradiction for years, and it is encouraging that at least some evolutionists (such as Harris) are beginning to be aware of it.

How can the forces of biological development and the forces of physical degeneration be operating at cross purposes? It would take, of course, a far greater mind than mine even to attempt to penetrate this riddle. I can only pose the question - because it seems to me the question most worth asking and working upon with all our intellectual and scientific resources.2


Rest of article here you need to see this contradiction.

Does Entropy Contradict Evolution?

biased...invalid source....conjecture not fact .

 

[Youwerecreated]

I just want to make sure you realize the logical fallacy of your "life only exists on earth" argument.

We cannot observe any other planet close enough to come to that conclusion.

So the only factual conclusion to come to at this point is that we dont know if life exists elsewhere. To say it doesnt is wishful thinking, just like when europeans thought the earth was flat.

But what we can say is that planets are very common, and that planets within a stars habitable zone are common as well.

You can claim life is special, but you cannot claim the earth is special. And in my mind if earth isnt special, that would seem to indicate life isnt special either. But others may not see it that way.

You don't realize you don't have an argument until life is found somewhere other then our planet. What you don't realize is the only evidence you presented was from the miller and urwy experiment. That is only based in truth if there was no free oxygen. You font even realize there would have been no big bang without oxygen. It is laughable that you believe you taught me what an atom was and about mutations. Wake up dreamer the point is if mutations cause change we know most change from mutations result in q loss of information and in harming the organism. You are are blatantly lying to suggest otherwise. Do you remember me presenting the argument as to why beneficial mutations do not accumulate in the gene pool like you claim. It's a lie and its been shown how rare these beneficial mutations are and I can point to over 4,500 genetic disorders and disease that is the result of mutations. So please stop lying. So where were you educated again and what degree do you hold ? I was forthcoming about my background.