Creationists

[Youwerecreated]

Whatever reasonable discussion has previously existed in this thread has clearly gone the way of the dinosaur.....

Agreed.

 

[Hollie]

Hmm found this article.





CONCLUSION

Homology (or similarity) does not prove common ancestry. The entire genome of the tiny nematode (Caenorhabditis elegans) also has been sequenced as a tangential study to the human genome project. Of the 5,000 best-known human genes, 75% have matches in the worm (see “A Tiny Worm Challenges Evolution”). Does this mean that we are 75% identical to a nematode worm? Just because living creatures share some genes with humans does not mean there is a linear ancestry. Biologist John Randall admitted this when he wrote:

The older textbooks on evolution make much of the idea of homology, pointing out the obvious resemblances between the skeletons of the limbs of different animals. Thus the “pentadactyl” [five bone—BH/BT] limb pattern is found in the arm of a man, the wing of a bird, and flipper of a whale—and this is held to indicate their common origin. Now if these various structures were transmitted by the same gene couples, varied from time to time by mutations and acted upon by environmental selection, the theory would make good sense. Unfortunately this is not the case. Homologous organs are now known to be produced by totally different gene complexes in the different species. The concept of homology in terms of similar genes handed on from a common ancestor has broken down... (as quoted in Fix, 1984, p.189).

Yet textbooks and teachers still continue to proclaim that humans and chimps are 98% genetically identical. The evidence clearly demonstrates vast molecular differences—differences that can be attributed to the fact that humans, unlike animals, were created in the image and likeness of God (Genesis 1:26-27; see Lyons and Thompson, 2002a, 2002b). Elaine Morgan commented on this difference.

Considering the very close genetic relationship that has been established by comparison of biochemical properties of blood proteins, protein structure and DNA and immunological responses, the differences between a man and a chimpanzee are more astonishing than the resemblances. They include structural differences in the skeleton, the muscles, the skin, and the brain; differences in posture associated with a unique method of locomotion; differences in social organization; and finally the acquisition of speech and tool-using, together with the dramatic increase in intellectual ability which has led scientists to name their own species Homo sapiens sapiens—wise wise man. During the period when these remarkable evolutionary changes were taking place, other closely related ape-like species changed only very slowly, and with far less remarkable results. It is hard to resist the conclusion that something must have happened to the ancestors of Homo sapiens which did not happen to the ancestors of gorillas and chimpanzees (1989, pp. 17-18, emp. added).

Read the rest of the article.

Apologetics Press - Do Human and Chimpanzee DNA Indicate an Evolutionary Relationship?

NOT VALID NOT SCIENCE .....
What We Believe

The following principles of truth are accepted by those who actively participate in this work:

1.God exists, and man can know that God exists, by means of His manifold revelations, both in nature and through the inspired Word of God, the Holy Bible.
2.The entire material Universe was specially created by this almighty God in 6 days of approximately 24-hours each, as revealed in Genesis 1 and Exodus 20:11.
3.Both biblical and scientific evidence indicate a relatively young Earth, in contrast to evolutionary views of a multi-billion-year age for the Earth.
4.Both biblical and scientific evidence indicate that many of the Earth’s features must be viewed in light of a universal, catastrophic flood (i.e., the Noahic Flood as described in Genesis 6-8).
5.All compromising theories such as theistic evolution, progressive creationism, threshold evolution, the gap theory, the modified gap theory, the day-age theory, the non-world view, etc., are denied and opposed as patently false.
6.Christianity is the one true religion; Jesus Christ is the only divine Son of God, resurrected Lord, and Savior of all who lovingly obey Him.
7.The 66 books of the Bible are fully and verbally inspired of God; hence, they are inerrant and authoritative, and a complete guide for moral and religious conduct.
8.Salvation is by means of obedience to the Gospel system, involving faith in God and Christ, repentance from sin, confession of faith, and immersion in water for remission of past sins, coupled with a life of growing consecration and dedication.
9.Those enjoying salvation are members of the one true church, which is the body of Christ.


AND ABOVE ALL NOT OBJECTIVE....

I don't care how objective a person claims they are it's just simply not true we are all biased, it is human nature.

You're hoping to excuse the bias that requires the creationist crowd to force fit information to support a predefined conclusion.

The peer review requirement of science will subvert creationist bias. Creationism is not science. That is why creationism cannot meet the standard of the scientific method.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Hmm found this article.





CONCLUSION

Homology (or similarity) does not prove common ancestry. The entire genome of the tiny nematode (Caenorhabditis elegans) also has been sequenced as a tangential study to the human genome project. Of the 5,000 best-known human genes, 75% have matches in the worm (see “A Tiny Worm Challenges Evolution”). Does this mean that we are 75% identical to a nematode worm? Just because living creatures share some genes with humans does not mean there is a linear ancestry. Biologist John Randall admitted this when he wrote:

The older textbooks on evolution make much of the idea of homology, pointing out the obvious resemblances between the skeletons of the limbs of different animals. Thus the “pentadactyl” [five bone—BH/BT] limb pattern is found in the arm of a man, the wing of a bird, and flipper of a whale—and this is held to indicate their common origin. Now if these various structures were transmitted by the same gene couples, varied from time to time by mutations and acted upon by environmental selection, the theory would make good sense. Unfortunately this is not the case. Homologous organs are now known to be produced by totally different gene complexes in the different species. The concept of homology in terms of similar genes handed on from a common ancestor has broken down... (as quoted in Fix, 1984, p.189).

Yet textbooks and teachers still continue to proclaim that humans and chimps are 98% genetically identical. The evidence clearly demonstrates vast molecular differences—differences that can be attributed to the fact that humans, unlike animals, were created in the image and likeness of God (Genesis 1:26-27; see Lyons and Thompson, 2002a, 2002b). Elaine Morgan commented on this difference.

Considering the very close genetic relationship that has been established by comparison of biochemical properties of blood proteins, protein structure and DNA and immunological responses, the differences between a man and a chimpanzee are more astonishing than the resemblances. They include structural differences in the skeleton, the muscles, the skin, and the brain; differences in posture associated with a unique method of locomotion; differences in social organization; and finally the acquisition of speech and tool-using, together with the dramatic increase in intellectual ability which has led scientists to name their own species Homo sapiens sapiens—wise wise man. During the period when these remarkable evolutionary changes were taking place, other closely related ape-like species changed only very slowly, and with far less remarkable results. It is hard to resist the conclusion that something must have happened to the ancestors of Homo sapiens which did not happen to the ancestors of gorillas and chimpanzees (1989, pp. 17-18, emp. added).

Read the rest of the article.

Apologetics Press - Do Human and Chimpanzee DNA Indicate an Evolutionary Relationship?

God definitely has a sense of humor. Use different genes to create the same types of structures. Do you ever get the feeling he is totally messing with these people?

I think he does and he gave it to all men. Certain times of the year in African can't recall the tree's name but the fruit rotts and falls off the tree. It firments and many different groups of animals come in and eat that fruit and makes them very drunk.

Wow I never laughed so hard in my life seeing giraffes and zebras staggering or chimps passing out with a female snuggled up with the male with her head on the males shoulder. I believe it was on the discovery channel but it is funny.

2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure the sound doctrine; but, having itching ears, will heap to themselves teachers after their own lusts;
2Ti 4:4 and will turn away their ears from the truth, and turn aside unto fables.

 

[Hollie]

Hmm found this article.





CONCLUSION

Homology (or similarity) does not prove common ancestry. The entire genome of the tiny nematode (Caenorhabditis elegans) also has been sequenced as a tangential study to the human genome project. Of the 5,000 best-known human genes, 75% have matches in the worm (see “A Tiny Worm Challenges Evolution”). Does this mean that we are 75% identical to a nematode worm? Just because living creatures share some genes with humans does not mean there is a linear ancestry. Biologist John Randall admitted this when he wrote:

The older textbooks on evolution make much of the idea of homology, pointing out the obvious resemblances between the skeletons of the limbs of different animals. Thus the “pentadactyl” [five bone—BH/BT] limb pattern is found in the arm of a man, the wing of a bird, and flipper of a whale—and this is held to indicate their common origin. Now if these various structures were transmitted by the same gene couples, varied from time to time by mutations and acted upon by environmental selection, the theory would make good sense. Unfortunately this is not the case. Homologous organs are now known to be produced by totally different gene complexes in the different species. The concept of homology in terms of similar genes handed on from a common ancestor has broken down... (as quoted in Fix, 1984, p.189).

Yet textbooks and teachers still continue to proclaim that humans and chimps are 98% genetically identical. The evidence clearly demonstrates vast molecular differences—differences that can be attributed to the fact that humans, unlike animals, were created in the image and likeness of God (Genesis 1:26-27; see Lyons and Thompson, 2002a, 2002b). Elaine Morgan commented on this difference.

Considering the very close genetic relationship that has been established by comparison of biochemical properties of blood proteins, protein structure and DNA and immunological responses, the differences between a man and a chimpanzee are more astonishing than the resemblances. They include structural differences in the skeleton, the muscles, the skin, and the brain; differences in posture associated with a unique method of locomotion; differences in social organization; and finally the acquisition of speech and tool-using, together with the dramatic increase in intellectual ability which has led scientists to name their own species Homo sapiens sapiens—wise wise man. During the period when these remarkable evolutionary changes were taking place, other closely related ape-like species changed only very slowly, and with far less remarkable results. It is hard to resist the conclusion that something must have happened to the ancestors of Homo sapiens which did not happen to the ancestors of gorillas and chimpanzees (1989, pp. 17-18, emp. added).

Read the rest of the article.

Apologetics Press - Do Human and Chimpanzee DNA Indicate an Evolutionary Relationship?

God definitely has a sense of humor. Use different genes to create the same types of structures. Do you ever get the feeling he is totally messing with these people?

I think he does and he gave it to all men. Certain times of the year in African can't recall the tree's name but the fruit rotts and falls off the tree. It firments and many different groups of animals come in and eat that fruit and makes them very drunk.

Wow I never laughed so hard in my life seeing giraffes and zebras staggering or chimps passing out with a female snuggled up with the male with her head on the males shoulder. I believe it was on the discovery channel but it is funny.

2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure the sound doctrine; but, having itching ears, will heap to themselves teachers after their own lusts;
2Ti 4:4 and will turn away their ears from the truth, and turn aside unto fables.

Some might think that the gods might get a chuckle out of that chromosome damage - birth defect thing. That seems cruel, not funny.

 

[Youwerecreated]

I thought we put your whole cut and paste accusation thing to rest a few posts back. I guess like most fundamentalist Darwinist, you think if you ignore it long enough, the truth will go away.

truth is subjective....and subjective to change.

Moral relativist!!! Next thing you will tell me is that child molestation is okay in certain circumstances. And why not? I mean, you and me baby ain't nothing but mammals so let's do it like they do on the discovery channel.

Here is definitive proof chimpanzees are our closest relative...

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xat1GVnl8-k]Bloodhound Gang - The Bad Touch - YouTube[/ame]

That seems like the popular theme for the past couple hundred years.

If people can't see the huge jump it took to throw humans in the same group as gorillas to me that is just a vivid imagination at work.

How can we have DNA similarity with many groups of animals but the DNA information is vastly different. If they can't see that they are truly proving the words at 2nd timothy .

 

[Youwerecreated]

ywc and his date ur vist:Virtual Tour | Creation Museum

If you saw my wife she is about as close as one can get to the beauty of faith hill not meaning to brag.

She liked intelligent but tough men,not only am I very good looking, but I also played football and tournament paintball.

Not for sissy theatre guys.

 

[Youwerecreated]

While that cartoon is a nice characterature, this is more what comes to my mind when I think of Hollie...

Oh boy I know it's not right to laugh but too late.

How unbelievably immature. Are you both in second grade? Grow up.

Just having a little fun.

 

[Hollie]

truth is subjective....and subjective to change.

Moral relativist!!! Next thing you will tell me is that child molestation is okay in certain circumstances. And why not? I mean, you and me baby ain't nothing but mammals so let's do it like they do on the discovery channel.

Here is definitive proof chimpanzees are our closest relative...

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xat1GVnl8-k]Bloodhound Gang - The Bad Touch - YouTube[/ame]

That seems like the popular theme for the past couple hundred years.

If people can't see the huge jump it took to throw humans in the same group as gorillas to me that is just a vivid imagination at work.

How can we have DNA similarity with many groups of animals but the DNA information is vastly different. If they can't see that they are truly the words at 2nd timothy correct.

If you believe the hacks at the ICR instead of the peer reviewed science, you will always have your foot in the bucket of fear and superstition.

 

[Hollie]

Oh boy I know it's not right to laugh but too late.

How unbelievably immature. Are you both in second grade? Grow up.

Just having a little fun.

Yeah - your gods' creations. That's some sense of humor you have there.

 

[Youwerecreated]

You've provided them.

The falsehoods and errors these buffoons have inflicted will, fortunately, not continue long after they have skulked away in disgrace.

Please expand on this line of reasoning.

The fundie line of reasoning begins and dead ends at "The gods did it".

Yes, they're dishonest for requiring a prior committment to Christian apologetis and then requires that all evidence (belief in a 6,000 year old planet and, well, you know the rest of that nonsense).

The Flat Earth Academy / Harun Yahya / fundie creationists are largely fossilized remnants of 17th century fear and superstition.

That is a pretty sound conclusion when you consider the alternative that a natural, unintelligent,undirected process was the reason for all life, and all that it created kept improving and improving.

 

[Youwerecreated]

NOT VALID NOT SCIENCE .....
What We Believe

The following principles of truth are accepted by those who actively participate in this work:

1.God exists, and man can know that God exists, by means of His manifold revelations, both in nature and through the inspired Word of God, the Holy Bible.
2.The entire material Universe was specially created by this almighty God in 6 days of approximately 24-hours each, as revealed in Genesis 1 and Exodus 20:11.
3.Both biblical and scientific evidence indicate a relatively young Earth, in contrast to evolutionary views of a multi-billion-year age for the Earth.
4.Both biblical and scientific evidence indicate that many of the Earth’s features must be viewed in light of a universal, catastrophic flood (i.e., the Noahic Flood as described in Genesis 6-8).
5.All compromising theories such as theistic evolution, progressive creationism, threshold evolution, the gap theory, the modified gap theory, the day-age theory, the non-world view, etc., are denied and opposed as patently false.
6.Christianity is the one true religion; Jesus Christ is the only divine Son of God, resurrected Lord, and Savior of all who lovingly obey Him.
7.The 66 books of the Bible are fully and verbally inspired of God; hence, they are inerrant and authoritative, and a complete guide for moral and religious conduct.
8.Salvation is by means of obedience to the Gospel system, involving faith in God and Christ, repentance from sin, confession of faith, and immersion in water for remission of past sins, coupled with a life of growing consecration and dedication.
9.Those enjoying salvation are members of the one true church, which is the body of Christ.


AND ABOVE ALL NOT OBJECTIVE....

I don't care how objective a person claims they are it's just simply not true we are all biased, it is human nature.

You're hoping to excuse the bias that requires the creationist crowd to force fit information to support a predefined conclusion.

The peer review requirement of science will subvert creationist bias. Creationism is not science. That is why creationism cannot meet the standard of the scientific method.

No I wish we could be objective and remove all bias but it's not possible so we are down to which theory makes the most sense.

 

[Youwerecreated]

How unbelievably immature. Are you both in second grade? Grow up.

I will, right after I get your response on the Meyer Darwin comments.

I don't know what you're talking about, and It definitely wouldn't make a difference. You have no case. Evolution is a fact. It is demonstrable. NOTHING ABOUT RELIGION is demonstrable. Not one single thing. There is zero evidence for God, yet you act like you actually have a case. It is fucking laughable. Go away.

Like I said before, that term "fact" gets thrown around so much from your side it's like part of your proof for your theory. If you say it is a fact enough people will start believing it.

 

[Youwerecreated]

God definitely has a sense of humor. Use different genes to create the same types of structures. Do you ever get the feeling he is totally messing with these people?

I think he does and he gave it to all men. Certain times of the year in African can't recall the tree's name but the fruit rotts and falls off the tree. It firments and many different groups of animals come in and eat that fruit and makes them very drunk.

Wow I never laughed so hard in my life seeing giraffes and zebras staggering or chimps passing out with a female snuggled up with the male with her head on the males shoulder. I believe it was on the discovery channel but it is funny.

2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure the sound doctrine; but, having itching ears, will heap to themselves teachers after their own lusts;
2Ti 4:4 and will turn away their ears from the truth, and turn aside unto fables.

Some might think that the gods might get a chuckle out of that chromosome damage - birth defect thing. That seems cruel, not funny.

Explain ?

 

[Hollie]

Please expand on this line of reasoning.

The fundie line of reasoning begins and dead ends at "The gods did it".

Yes, they're dishonest for requiring a prior committment to Christian apologetis and then requires that all evidence (belief in a 6,000 year old planet and, well, you know the rest of that nonsense).

The Flat Earth Academy / Harun Yahya / fundie creationists are largely fossilized remnants of 17th century fear and superstition.

That is a pretty sound conclusion when you consider the alternative that a natural, unintelligent,undirected process was the reason for all life, and all that it created kept improving and improving.

That's a thoroughly fraudulent conclusion. Not all life was fit for survival, thus not all life kept improving.

Unfortunately, you know nothing of even the most basic principles of biology and the life sciences. It's a shame that ignorance and fraud is seen as a virtue by the fundie / Christian apologetic cult.

 

[Hollie]

I think he does and he gave it to all men. Certain times of the year in African can't recall the tree's name but the fruit rotts and falls off the tree. It firments and many different groups of animals come in and eat that fruit and makes them very drunk.

Wow I never laughed so hard in my life seeing giraffes and zebras staggering or chimps passing out with a female snuggled up with the male with her head on the males shoulder. I believe it was on the discovery channel but it is funny.

2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure the sound doctrine; but, having itching ears, will heap to themselves teachers after their own lusts;
2Ti 4:4 and will turn away their ears from the truth, and turn aside unto fables.

Some might think that the gods might get a chuckle out of that chromosome damage - birth defect thing. That seems cruel, not funny.

Explain ?

The gods did it.

If you feel better about yourself for ridiculing those with health problems, I'm happy for you.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Moral relativist!!! Next thing you will tell me is that child molestation is okay in certain circumstances. And why not? I mean, you and me baby ain't nothing but mammals so let's do it like they do on the discovery channel.

Here is definitive proof chimpanzees are our closest relative...

Bloodhound Gang - The Bad Touch - YouTube

That seems like the popular theme for the past couple hundred years.

If people can't see the huge jump it took to throw humans in the same group as gorillas to me that is just a vivid imagination at work.

How can we have DNA similarity with many groups of animals but the DNA information is vastly different. If they can't see that they are truly the words at 2nd timothy correct.

If you believe the hacks at the ICR instead of the peer reviewed science, you will always have your foot in the bucket of fear and superstition.

Man knows very little about nature that is a fact.

 

[Youwerecreated]

The fundie line of reasoning begins and dead ends at "The gods did it".

Yes, they're dishonest for requiring a prior committment to Christian apologetis and then requires that all evidence (belief in a 6,000 year old planet and, well, you know the rest of that nonsense).

The Flat Earth Academy / Harun Yahya / fundie creationists are largely fossilized remnants of 17th century fear and superstition.

That is a pretty sound conclusion when you consider the alternative that a natural, unintelligent,undirected process was the reason for all life, and all that it created kept improving and improving.

That's a thoroughly fraudulent conclusion. Not all life was fit for survival, thus not all life kept improving.

Unfortunately, you know nothing of even the most basic principles of biology and the life sciences. It's a shame that ignorance and fraud is seen as a virtue by the fundie / Christian apologetic cult.

That is true animals did go extinct but could it have been due to man not being good stewards of the earth ? The buffalo was one that almost went extinct due to over hunting.

How many species were wiped out due to natural disasters ?

How bout drought was that one of the reasons for many extinctions ?

 

[Hollie]

That seems like the popular theme for the past couple hundred years.

If people can't see the huge jump it took to throw humans in the same group as gorillas to me that is just a vivid imagination at work.

How can we have DNA similarity with many groups of animals but the DNA information is vastly different. If they can't see that they are truly the words at 2nd timothy correct.

If you believe the hacks at the ICR instead of the peer reviewed science, you will always have your foot in the bucket of fear and superstition.

Man knows very little about nature that is a fact.

Embrace your ignorance and your maintenance of same.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Some might think that the gods might get a chuckle out of that chromosome damage - birth defect thing. That seems cruel, not funny.

Explain ?

The gods did it.

If you feel better about yourself for ridiculing those with health problems, I'm happy for you.

I don't believe in gods I believe in the one and only true God, the Almighty creator.

 

[Youwerecreated]

The fundie line of reasoning begins and dead ends at "The gods did it".

Yes, they're dishonest for requiring a prior committment to Christian apologetis and then requires that all evidence (belief in a 6,000 year old planet and, well, you know the rest of that nonsense).

The Flat Earth Academy / Harun Yahya / fundie creationists are largely fossilized remnants of 17th century fear and superstition.

That is a pretty sound conclusion when you consider the alternative that a natural, unintelligent,undirected process was the reason for all life, and all that it created kept improving and improving.

That's a thoroughly fraudulent conclusion. Not all life was fit for survival, thus not all life kept improving.

Unfortunately, you know nothing of even the most basic principles of biology and the life sciences. It's a shame that ignorance and fraud is seen as a virtue by the fundie / Christian apologetic cult.

Why do you avoid my biological questions then make this assertion ?