Zone1 Do most Jews believe they killed Jesus?

[rosends]

Correct, but Christians argue that Daniel is a prophet.

The question is not exactly whether he is a prophet (that is, gifted with connection to the divine in that way) but whether what he received was formal prophecy. Prophecy in Judaism is a message (about the past, present or future) which the prophet is required to spread to the people. A "prophecy" not meant for anyone else is not a "nevu'ah".

Prophets and Prophecy - Judaism 101 (JewFAQ)

Discusses the meaning of the term 'prophet' and identifies the prophets of the Jewish scriptures.

www.jewfaq.org

 

[irosie91]

IIRC no haftarah selection is from Ketuvim (writings) -- all are from the Nevi'im (prophects).

yes----well that answers Suradie who designates Daniel part of Nevi'im

 

[Lisa558]

Except, Christians do not worship a mortal man. We worship the One God, whose Word, for a time, took on human nature, to teach and proclaim Good News.

That’s from the Christian perspective. From the Jewish perspective, you are worshipping a mortal man.

My point was to the antisemite, who keeps insisting that Jews are evil and will be punished for not agreeing with the Christian belief, that there are different beliefs according to different religions - and that demonizing an entire group of people because they don’t share your belief is…..shall we say….obnoxious.

 

[BreezeWood]

who demanded whose death?

Jesus is never addressed in Jewish services

Ever since then Jews have been lying to themselves and reinventing their religion.

the jews have never not lied, from the beginning chapters, their false claims and heavenly tablets ...

judaism is not a religion, theirs is nothing more than heredity idolatry - for world domination by monarchical rule. apartheid is their goal.

 

[theHawk]

As far as I know---the book of Daniel is considered VERY ARCANE ----and actually
is NOT USED as a "HAFTORAH" for that reason?----it cannot be considered EXPLANATORY
of a weekly Torah reading

Yet many copies of Daniel were found with the Dead Sea Scrolls.

 

[irosie91]

Yet many copies of Daniel were found with the Dead Sea Scrolls.

I don't know-----why do you bring it up---the dead sea scrolls are not
uhm THE BIBLE. The writings include lots of various STUFF

 

[BreezeWood]

oh----nor corroborating evidence----the WHOLE WORLD was unconscious of the mass
murder by crucifixion of TENS OF THOUSANDS OF PHARISEE JEWS by the Romans. gee----
how odd

no, jesus and those in the 1st century were persecuted for the specific 1st century events - liberation theology, self determination - they were turned on by both the jews and romans (christians) - for their beliefs - not as the others for their own self interests.

 

[rosends]

Yet many copies of Daniel were found with the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Finding something among scrolls doesn't mean much. The text of Daniel would have been canonical just in a different part of the overall organization. Additionally, there are texts among the DSS which are NOT part of the official canon of Jewish texts, and there are theories that the DSS served as a genizah for disposal of erroneous texts.

https://brill.com/previewpdf/book/edcoll/9789004214132/B9789004214132_018.xml

 

[Meriweather]

That’s from the Christian perspective. From the Jewish perspective, you are worshipping a mortal man.

It doesn't work well when someone of one faith or denomination tries to tell people of another faith or denomination what they "really" believe instead of listening to what they believe. In any case, God reaches out to everyone, wherever they are. God in our midst.

 

[irosie91]

no, jesus and those in the 1st century were persecuted for the specific 1st century events - liberation theology, self determination - they were turned on by both the jews and romans (christians) - for their beliefs - not as the others for their own self interests.

yeah ok----buy a cotton sheet----make a robe----sing a song and OPEN YOUR CULT

 

[BreezeWood]

I'm frankly amazed that this topic is worth 1300 + posts.

Seriously ?

sure you are ...

- the deserts, each stealthfully work for world domination - why give it a thought ... just crucify whoever is in their way.

* and when they turn on eachother, they cry like babies.

 

[Meriweather]

My point was to the antisemite, who keeps insisting that Jews are evil and will be punished for not agreeing with the Christian belief, that there are different beliefs according to different religions - and that demonizing an entire group of people because they don’t share your belief is…..shall we say….obnoxious.

Yes. As if anyone here today knows what is happening privately between God and any of His children. The other issue that bothers me with those who see things through modern Western culture is that Jews of Biblical times (including Jesus, John, and Paul) saw scripture and warnings as pertaining to the current life, not to the afterlife. God cares for all, now, not just some time in the future.

 

[Lisa558]

It doesn't work well when someone of one faith or denomination tries to tell people of another faith or denomination what they "really" believe instead of listening to what they believe. In any case, God reaches out to everyone, wherever they are. God in our midst.

I agree with that. But have you heard even one Jew insult Christians by saying they are going to hell, or that Gd is angry at them, for not believing the Jewish way? No, you haven’t, and that’s because we don’t believe that. We know we have a wonderful Gd who welcomes all good people to the World To Come, regardless of their belief (or not) in Jesus.

it is only (some) Christians who enjoy harassing and insulting Jews for their Jewish beliefs. It reminds me of a friend of my dad’s (May he RIP) who kept harping on him about his refusal to “accept” Jesus. My dad, always a mild man, would nicely respond that he is Jewish and believes differently, but the friend wouldn’t give up his onslaught. My dad finally said that he must stop coming into our house and criticizing our beliefs or he would no longer be welcome. The friend answered that he only does it because he loves my dad, to which my dad said “I wish you would love me a little less and respect me a little more.”

 

[BreezeWood]

- He must spread the knowledge of the G-d of Israel, uniting the entire world as one (Zechariah 14:9)

no such being exists, the motivations of dillusion and grandour for a few - not withstanding - and their monarchical madness.

 

[theHawk]

The third temple is a building, not a person. And there is no notion of "second chance" in the Judaic texts. What you are speaking of is Christianity.

I see, so your going to build a building that will last forever…okay.

 

[Meriweather]

I agree with that. But have you heard even one Jew insult Christians by saying they are going to hell, or that Gd is angry at them, for not believing the Jewish way? No, you haven’t, and that’s because we don’t believe that. We know we have a wonderful Gd who welcomes all good people to the World To Come, regardless of their belief (or not) in Jesus.

Catholic teaching is that we don't know who, if anyone, is in hell. Only God knows. The problem is languages change AND definitions of words in languages change. Add in cultural changes, and it behooves non-Jews to go back to the Noachide Laws when regarding people of other faiths and then proceeding very cautiously from there.

 

[Meriweather]

it is only (some) Christians who enjoy harassing and insulting Jews for their Jewish beliefs. It reminds me of a friend of my dad’s (May he RIP) who kept harping on him about his refusal to “accept” Jesus. My dad, always a mild man, would nicely respond that he is Jewish and believes differently, but the friend wouldn’t give up his onslaught. my dad finally said that he must stop coming into our house and criticizing our beliefs or he would no longer be welcome. The friend answered that he only does it because he loves my dad, to which my dad said “I wish you would love me a little less and respect me a little more.”

Good for your dad! A wonderful story.

 

[rosends]

I see, so your going to build a building that will last forever…okay.

Me? No. God, sure.

 

[BreezeWood]

He did build the third temple, the Church and his body through the New Covenant.

wrong, the c-bible is written by the crucifiers - only by bringing them to justice will the true path to the everlasting be made available through the triumph over evil.

their covenant, self determination, liberation theology was crucified w/ them ...

 

[theHawk]

Me? No. God, sure.

So God will come to Earth and build this temple?