Do you support abolishing the Federal Dept of Education?

[francoHFW]

States Rights is code for morons and bigots holding up progress.

 

[Firehorse]

You never answered these two questions

why I should care about the rest of the world education systems

why you think biology and science can not coexist with religion

(personal attacks will be ignored ... If you can't deal with the topic, then go to a different topic)

 

[DontBeStupid]

The best thing they could do is get outta the way and let the soverign States handle it thier own unique way as determined by thier citizens.

Yeah! That's right! Get out of the way so States can teach kids about how sun spots are warming the planet and that our 6,000 year old Earth was made in 6 days by God.

Wahoo Freedom!

Nice deflection and typical of a moron.

What deflection? You want the Feds out of the way so states can decide for themselves. Well, Kansas has been trying for years now to teach Intelligent Design in Science classes as the theory of how life began. Are you trying to suggest that if States had free reign they wouldn't try something like that?

 

[DontBeStupid]

But they can make things better than they are. If they choose to live in ignorance, we have a constitution that gives them that right.

No. We have a Constitution that ensures that right. They have the right by nature.

Semantically speaker you are correct. We are born with the right. Our constitution recognizes and guarantees it, which is a fact I am pretty sure isn't being taught much in schools these days and that maybe half the members of USMB don't grasp or understand. We need to get the federal government out of education.

But again, you're doing what so many others here are doing. You're pointing out a short coming in our education system and then just blaming the Federal Government without ever showing HOW the Feds are responsible for the short coming.

You're scapegoating, nothing more.

 

[Firehorse]

If Kansas decides to teach it, then that's what they decide. If I have a problem with it, I will remove my child ... If they have been "trying for years" that suggests that maybe it isn't going so well? Why isn't it going so well? Too many families moving across the river to other states?

 

[eflatminor]

States Rights is code for morons and bigots holding up progress.

And "progress", what is that code for? "We know what's best for others" or "Let's spend more of what we don't have"?

Checking in on progress...as of today, you owe $131,579. Look's like you've progressed the next generation right into the poor house. Thanks a lot.

 

[bripat9643]

States Rights is code for morons and bigots holding up progress.

That's what every enemy of the Constitution says.

 

[bripat9643]

You want the Feds out of the way so states can decide for themselves. Well, Kansas has been trying for years now to teach Intelligent Design in Science classes as the theory of how life began. Are you trying to suggest that if States had free reign they wouldn't try something like that?

Any Kansans who object can move to Nebraska.

 

[Firehorse]

Giving up on answering my posts dontbestupid? Found that spell checking is not an effective way to handle those with oppinions other then your own?

 

[DontBeStupid]

You want the Feds out of the way so states can decide for themselves. Well, Kansas has been trying for years now to teach Intelligent Design in Science classes as the theory of how life began. Are you trying to suggest that if States had free reign they wouldn't try something like that?

Any Kansans who object can move to Nebraska.

And the ones that can't move? What about them?

Oh wait, they're poor, so you don't care about them.

 

[Firehorse]

You was doing so good ... I'm sorry. Try to live life and learn to have your own oppinions

 

[DontBeStupid]

You was doing so good ... I'm sorry. Try to live life and learn to have your own oppinions

Oh, are you talking to me? Hard to tell from your posts.

 

[Oddball]

You want the Feds out of the way so states can decide for themselves. Well, Kansas has been trying for years now to teach Intelligent Design in Science classes as the theory of how life began. Are you trying to suggest that if States had free reign they wouldn't try something like that?

Any Kansans who object can move to Nebraska.

And the ones that can't move? What about them?

Oh wait, they're poor, so you don't care about them.

They can home school.

Oh wait, liberoidals don't believe that anyone but NEA/AFT union minions are capable of teaching the chilluns.

 

[flacaltenn]

Hey Wait DontBeStupid::

B4 you go.. You never answered my question here. http://www.usmessageboard.com/4185403-post190.html..

I want to know if you were seriously abandoning the leftist talking points or just yanking my chain..

You support National testing and parental choice to pull their kids out of failing schools? So NCLB was just fine in principle for you? Could be the 1st time we could agree on something.. But I doubt it..

 

[Foxfyre]

No. We have a Constitution that ensures that right. They have the right by nature.

Semantically speaker you are correct. We are born with the right. Our constitution recognizes and guarantees it, which is a fact I am pretty sure isn't being taught much in schools these days and that maybe half the members of USMB don't grasp or understand. We need to get the federal government out of education.

But again, you're doing what so many others here are doing. You're pointing out a short coming in our education system and then just blaming the Federal Government without ever showing HOW the Feds are responsible for the short coming.

You're scapegoating, nothing more.

The Federal government is a big part of the problem by siphoning off large chunks of taxes presumable for education, absorbing up to two thirds of that in the federal bureaucracy, and then doling it back out to the states and schools contingent on them conforming and obeying federal standards, regulations, and policy. This is nothing short of legalized extortion to force local education to bend to the federal will.

The feds however attempt to micromanage everything from whether there should be soft drinks in the cafeteria, how many vegetables have to be served in the school lunches, and dozens of other issues ranging from teacher certification to curriculum. Some are mandates. Some are strongly 'suggested' with the 'suggestion' that funding could be involved. It is just wrong.

I don't subscribe to all points of the Constitution Party, but their platform declaration re education comes pretty close to my personal views:

Since the Constitution grants the Federal Government no authority over Education, the 10th Amendment applies:
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
All teaching is related to basic assumptions about God and man. Education as a whole, therefore, cannot be separated from religious faith. The law of our Creator assigns the authority and responsibility of educating children to their parents. Education should be free from all federal government subsidies, including vouchers, tax incentives, and loans, except with respect to veterans.

Because the federal government has absolutely no jurisdiction concerning the education of our children, the United States Department of Education should be abolished; all federal legislation related to education should be repealed. No federal laws subsidizing or regulating the education of children should be enacted. Under no circumstances should the federal government be involved in national teacher certification, educational curricula, textbook selection, learning standards, comprehensive sex education, psychological and psychiatric research testing programs, and personnel.

Because control over education is now being relegated to departments other than the Department of Education, we clarify that no federal agency, department, board, or other entity may exercise jurisdiction over any aspect of children's upbringing. Education, training, and discipline of children are properly placed in the domain of their parents.

We support the unimpeded right of parents to provide for the education of their children in the manner they deem best, including home, private or religious. We oppose all legislation from any level of government that would interfere with or restrict that liberty. We support equitable tax relief for families whose children do not attend government schools.

So that parents need not defy the law by refusing to send their children to schools of which they disapprove, compulsory attendance laws should be repealed
Constitution Party Platform

Even a statist would have to see why the federal government having control of education, most especially subject matter, and curriculum content, is a bad idea. Think of the worst President you can think of. And then imagine that he has the power to support or reject the curriculum in your child's school. That would have been one of the Founder's worst fears and is at the heart of Constitutional intent to ensure the liberties we are intended to have.

 

[Firehorse]

My questions were a direct responce to your quotes, or are you having trouble remembering your position on this topic?

(my phone is crappy when using the "quote funchion" it formats quite badly)

 

[DontBeStupid]

Any Kansans who object can move to Nebraska.

And the ones that can't move? What about them?

Oh wait, they're poor, so you don't care about them.

They can home school.

Your compassion knows no ends.

 

[Firehorse]

Home schooled children almost always rank higher in math and science then their public or private school counterparts ... Of course your depth of knowledge on the subject would suggest that you knew this and are simply ignoring the facts

 

[DontBeStupid]

Hey Wait DontBeStupid::

B4 you go.. You never answered my question here. http://www.usmessageboard.com/4185403-post190.html..

I want to know if you were seriously abandoning the leftist talking points or just yanking my chain..

You support National testing and parental choice to pull their kids out of failing schools? So NCLB was just fine in principle for you? Could be the 1st time we could agree on something.. But I doubt it..

Sorry about that.

Yes, I actually agree with NCLB in theory. But like many things Bush and his GOP buddies did, I disagree with how they went about it. It basically became a scheme whereby parents could use tax dollars to go to private schools, many of them religious schools. Couple that with their underfunding of the program, and it was doomed from the start.

And even though I am in favour of testing as a benchmark, I'm not as naive as Bush to think that one test will work for every kid in the country. That just simply ignores our diversity.

 

[francoHFW]

TY, morons and bigots