The Bible does not leave man's point of view out of the picture. But when is comes to science, the Bible was far advanced from human points of view at that time - such as the earth being hung upon nothing (Job 26:7) which is in contrast with ancient beliefs such as being supported by elephants on a turtle. The Bible does not contain mythical statements like in the book of 1 Enoch in the Pseudepigrapha which purported to contain secrets of the Cosmos but is out of harmony with science.
Does God Exist?
- Thread starter Bruce Daniels
- Start date
The Bible does not leave man's point of view out of the picture. But when is comes to science, the Bible was far advanced from human points of view at that time - such as the earth being hung upon nothing (Job 26:7) which is in contrast with ancient beliefs such as being supported by elephants on a turtle. The Bible does not contain mythical statements like in the book of 1 Enoch in the Pseudepigrapha which purported to contain secrets of the Cosmos but is out of harmony with science.
Genesis 1
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.wol.jw.org
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
It's a mistake to suggest that there is anything scientifically accurate about Genesis. A common mistake of religionists is to presume their holy texts are science journals.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Thank you for inciting me to research further. 1 Samuel 2:8 is symbolic - for example God does not literally raise humble ones from the dust or ash heap - nor do they usually end up on thrones or sitting with princes. But you are correct that Psalms 104:5 is a good cross reference for a more literal application of 1 Samuel 2:8 (the latter part of the verse.)
From our Bible dictionary:
Foundation — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
wol.jw.org
"The Master Builder Jehovah, in answering Job out of the windstorm, compared the literal earth to a building. (Job 38:4-7) Though the earth hangs upon nothing, it has, as it were, durable foundations that will not be made to totter, for the unchangeable laws governing the universe hold it firmly in place, and God’s purpose toward the earth has remained unchanged. (Job 26:7; 38:33; Ps 104:5; Mal 3:6)"
In Biblical research, as in scientific research, all observations/verses are in harmony - but only when correctly interpreted. 1 Samuel 2:8 and Psalms are interpreted in Job 26:7 & 38:33.
Isaiah 40:22 is also accurate. Not only is earth a sphere (Hebrew chuwg in 3 dimensions) but also appears as a circle (2 dimensions) from any direction. And the universe is expanding like a stretching fine gauze - computer simulations confirm this - and astronomers even refer to its threads and filaments.
Bar Ilan University’s Professor Nathan Aviezer, author of the book In the Beginning, disagrees with you.It's a mistake to suggest that there is anything scientifically accurate about Genesis. A common mistake of religionists is to presume their holy texts are science journals.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
He told The Times of Israel, this discovery “isn’t going to make anyone who wasn’t a believer in God into one, or vice versa, but one thing the announcement does do is make it clear that the universe had a definite starting point — a creation — as described in the Book of Genesis,” said Aviezer. “To deny this now is to deny scientific fact.”
“Without addressing who or what caused it, the mechanics of the creation process in the Big Bang match the Genesis story perfectly. If I had to make up a theory to match the first passages in Genesis, the Big Bang theory would be it,” said Aviezer.
“It’s an example of Divine irony that it took atheistic scientists like [Nobel laureate Paul] Dirac and all the others to point out the truth of the Torah. At this point I think we can say that creation is a scientific fact.”
Could New Scientific Discovery Support Creation?
Nathan Aviezer - Wikipedia
It comes from the Pauli Exclusion principle and general relatvity. When a mass greater than the Chandrasekhar limit (2.765×1030 kg, the maximum mass of a white dwarf star) collapses, the gravitational force is sufficient to overcome the degeneracy pressure created by the Pauli exclusion principle and collapse fermionic particles into a common location. Bosons have no problem with colocation.
****************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Astronomy provides a spectacular demonstration of the effect of the Pauli principle, in the form of white dwarf and neutron stars. In both bodies, the atomic structure is disrupted by extreme pressure, but the stars are held in hydrostatic equilibrium by degeneracy pressure, also known as Fermi pressure. This exotic form of matter is known as degenerate matter. The immense gravitational force of a star's mass is normally held in equilibrium by thermal pressure caused by heat produced in thermonuclear fusion in the star's core. In white dwarfs, which do not undergo nuclear fusion, an opposing force to gravity is provided by electron degeneracy pressure. In neutron stars, subject to even stronger gravitational forces, electrons have merged with protons to form neutrons. Neutrons are capable of producing an even higher degeneracy pressure, neutron degeneracy pressure, albeit over a shorter range. This can stabilize neutron stars from further collapse, but at a smaller size and higher density than a white dwarf. Neutron stars are the most "rigid" objects known; their Young modulus (or more accurately, bulk modulus) is 20 orders of magnitude larger than that of diamond. However, even this enormous rigidity can be overcome by the gravitational field of a massive star or by the pressure of a supernova, leading to the formation of a black hole.[16]:286–287
16) Martin Bojowald (5 November 2012). The Universe: A View from Classical and Quantum Gravity. John Wiley & Sons. ISBN 978-3-527-66769-7.
Pauli exclusion principle - Wikipedia
Indeependent
Diamond Member
- Nov 19, 2013
- 73,633
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Wow! You just blew the Big Bang Theory right out of the water with that bitter little diatribe, didn't you?It's a mistake to suggest that there is anything scientifically accurate about Genesis. A common mistake of religionists is to presume their holy texts are science journals.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Indeependent
Diamond Member
- Nov 19, 2013
- 73,633
- 28,506
- 2,250
If you really know Hebrew word roots, that's a start.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Then you have to know why the Men of The Great Assembly who churned out the Septuagint turned words with 3 or more letters into one word as opposed to expounding the "whole" word as one word.
B'Rayshis, for instance does not mean "In The Beginning" in any way shape or form.
It means, "Within the essence of The Pristine."
They didn't want the Greeks to know that because the Greeks would never accept the fact that we are figments of The Pristine's Thought..
The Pristine's Thought? That requires a study of the S'fee-rote.
Borore...The Pristine Created
El-Low-Hihm...El (The Prinstine create The Power), Low (The Power's Possession of), Hihm (Multiplicity)
Just an example.
Most rabbi's are only now beginning to define the words in their lectures because the Holocaust generation is gone and wants the Real Deal, not the Fool The Greeks and Fool King James meaning.
Seems like you are trying hard to deny the account of creation to me.If you really know Hebrew word roots, that's a start.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Then you have to know why the Men of The Great Assembly who churned out the Septuagint turned words with 3 or more letters into one word as opposed to expounding the "whole" word as one word.
B'Rayshis, for instance does not mean "In The Beginning" in any way shape or form.
It means, "Within the essence of The Pristine."
They didn't want the Greeks to know that because the Greeks would never accept the fact that we are figments of The Pristine's Thought..
The Pristine's Thought? That requires a study of the S'fee-rote.
Borore...The Pristine Created
El-Low-Hihm...El (The Prinstine create The Power), Low (The Power's Possession of), Hihm (Multiplicity)
Just an example.
Most rabbi's are only now beginning to define the words in their lectures because the Holocaust generation is gone and wants the Real Deal, not the Fool The Greeks and Fool King James meaning.
Well, obviously thermodynamics are involved in Miller type experiments but using heat as the energy source instead of lightning/spark discharge. The chart on table 3-4 on page 27 gives the chemical reaction product proportions from experiments done by Harada and Fox using a simulated atmosphere of CH4 (methane), ammonia (NH3) and water (H2O) and heating to 950 degrees Centigrade using a quartz sand catalyst (and cooling quickly).
That temperature is VERY hot - hotter than any theorized early earth environment when life began on earth. This is just another example of different amino acids prefering different environments for synthesis. Table 3-4 only lists acidic amino acids, not basic (i.e. acid vs base/alkaline) amino acids.
The source of the chart:
From K. Harada and S. Fox, 1964. Nature 201, 335.
The chart notes amino acids used in proteins; the highest proportions are Glycine and Alanine - similar to Miller's results. The top 8 by proportion are:
Glycine - 60.3%
Alanine - 18.0%
Glutamic acid - 4.8%
Aspartic acid - 3.4
Leucine - 2.4
Proline - 2.3
Valine - 2.3
Serine - 2.0
However, these results are disputed. Boynton & Lawless used the same environment and came up with totally different chemical reaction product proportions - see table 3-5 on page 28.
That chart if from:
From Lawless and Boynton, 1973. Nature 243, 450
They only found 3 amino acids used in proteins and the primary amino acid produced was beta-alanine (90% at 1060 degrees C) which is not found in proteins. Alanine, not beta-alanine is found in proteins. The chart also shows a distinct change in proporitions with lower hot temperature.
At 1060 C (with quartz sand catalyst) 90% was beta-alanine and only 1% for Alanine and Glycine. Aspartic acid was 3%.
At 980 C Glycine was the primary product - 59%, followed by 28% beta-alanine and 12% alanine.
At 930 C Glycine was 96% and Alanine was 4%.
Again, note how temperature changes the chemical reaction product proportions.
Thaxton et al report Fox's later conclusion that temperatures below 120 C are the most plausible for some amino acids - reference 20:
S.W. Fox, 1976. J. Mol. Evol. 8, 30.
Bottom line - as I posted repeatedly - some amino acids prefer hot, others cold, some acid others alkaline, some wet others dry. You can't have all these environments at the same place at the same time without an intelligent chemist.
That temperature is VERY hot - hotter than any theorized early earth environment when life began on earth. This is just another example of different amino acids prefering different environments for synthesis. Table 3-4 only lists acidic amino acids, not basic (i.e. acid vs base/alkaline) amino acids.
The source of the chart:
From K. Harada and S. Fox, 1964. Nature 201, 335.
The chart notes amino acids used in proteins; the highest proportions are Glycine and Alanine - similar to Miller's results. The top 8 by proportion are:
Glycine - 60.3%
Alanine - 18.0%
Glutamic acid - 4.8%
Aspartic acid - 3.4
Leucine - 2.4
Proline - 2.3
Valine - 2.3
Serine - 2.0
However, these results are disputed. Boynton & Lawless used the same environment and came up with totally different chemical reaction product proportions - see table 3-5 on page 28.
That chart if from:
From Lawless and Boynton, 1973. Nature 243, 450
They only found 3 amino acids used in proteins and the primary amino acid produced was beta-alanine (90% at 1060 degrees C) which is not found in proteins. Alanine, not beta-alanine is found in proteins. The chart also shows a distinct change in proporitions with lower hot temperature.
At 1060 C (with quartz sand catalyst) 90% was beta-alanine and only 1% for Alanine and Glycine. Aspartic acid was 3%.
At 980 C Glycine was the primary product - 59%, followed by 28% beta-alanine and 12% alanine.
At 930 C Glycine was 96% and Alanine was 4%.
Again, note how temperature changes the chemical reaction product proportions.
Thaxton et al report Fox's later conclusion that temperatures below 120 C are the most plausible for some amino acids - reference 20:
S.W. Fox, 1976. J. Mol. Evol. 8, 30.
Bottom line - as I posted repeatedly - some amino acids prefer hot, others cold, some acid others alkaline, some wet others dry. You can't have all these environments at the same place at the same time without an intelligent chemist.
Indeependent
Diamond Member
- Nov 19, 2013
- 73,633
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Be specific.Seems like you are trying hard to deny the account of creation to me.If you really know Hebrew word roots, that's a start.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Then you have to know why the Men of The Great Assembly who churned out the Septuagint turned words with 3 or more letters into one word as opposed to expounding the "whole" word as one word.
B'Rayshis, for instance does not mean "In The Beginning" in any way shape or form.
It means, "Within the essence of The Pristine."
They didn't want the Greeks to know that because the Greeks would never accept the fact that we are figments of The Pristine's Thought..
The Pristine's Thought? That requires a study of the S'fee-rote.
Borore...The Pristine Created
El-Low-Hihm...El (The Prinstine create The Power), Low (The Power's Possession of), Hihm (Multiplicity)
Just an example.
Most rabbi's are only now beginning to define the words in their lectures because the Holocaust generation is gone and wants the Real Deal, not the Fool The Greeks and Fool King James meaning.
I see a lot of wisdom in the Ari's tzim Tzum, not to mention the Nefesh Hachaim.
I am way past the pathetic English "translations".
Thank you for the
Thank you for the research ding!
Bar Ilan University’s Professor Nathan Aviezer, author of the book In the Beginning, disagrees with you.It's a mistake to suggest that there is anything scientifically accurate about Genesis. A common mistake of religionists is to presume their holy texts are science journals.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
He told The Times of Israel, this discovery “isn’t going to make anyone who wasn’t a believer in God into one, or vice versa, but one thing the announcement does do is make it clear that the universe had a definite starting point — a creation — as described in the Book of Genesis,” said Aviezer. “To deny this now is to deny scientific fact.”
“Without addressing who or what caused it, the mechanics of the creation process in the Big Bang match the Genesis story perfectly. If I had to make up a theory to match the first passages in Genesis, the Big Bang theory would be it,” said Aviezer.
“It’s an example of Divine irony that it took atheistic scientists like [Nobel laureate Paul] Dirac and all the others to point out the truth of the Torah. At this point I think we can say that creation is a scientific fact.”
Could New Scientific Discovery Support Creation?
Nathan Aviezer - Wikipedia
Thank you for the research ding!
EThank
Thank you for the research Crick! Clearly the mass of the star is crucial. I think our sun is supposed to go red giant to white dwarf - definitely not supernova let alone a neutron star or a black hole.
Just how drastic upcoming changes to our sun and heavens will be is hinted at in Hebrews 1:10-12 where perish = changed. I.e. when astronomers say our star will die, they really mean it will change drastically. And so will our galaxy when it merges with Andromeda and becomes Andromilk - or is it Milkmeda? Our galaxy will perish - but really it will simply die as to its present state - it actually will be changed - not go out of existence.
Of course, all of this ignores the fact that our Creator can change any of those outcomes. For example, a fine tuned merger of our sun with a brown dwarf c. 5 billion years from now (before entry into red giant phase) could return our sun to early main sequence. Who knows? A brown dwarf in Andromeda may already have a fine tuned trajectory and speed which could rejuvenate our sun in just that manner during the upcoming merger!
It comes from the Pauli Exclusion principle and general relatvity. When a mass greater than the Chandrasekhar limit (2.765×1030 kg, the maximum mass of a white dwarf star) collapses, the gravitational force is sufficient to overcome the degeneracy pressure created by the Pauli exclusion principle and collapse fermionic particles into a common location. Bosons have no problem with colocation.
****************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************
Astronomy provides a spectacular demonstration of the effect of the Pauli principle, in the form of white dwarf and neutron stars. In both bodies, the atomic structure is disrupted by extreme pressure, but the stars are held in hydrostatic equilibrium by degeneracy pressure, also known as Fermi pressure. This exotic form of matter is known as degenerate matter. The immense gravitational force of a star's mass is normally held in equilibrium by thermal pressure caused by heat produced in thermonuclear fusion in the star's core. In white dwarfs, which do not undergo nuclear fusion, an opposing force to gravity is provided by electron degeneracy pressure. In neutron stars, subject to even stronger gravitational forces, electrons have merged with protons to form neutrons. Neutrons are capable of producing an even higher degeneracy pressure, neutron degeneracy pressure, albeit over a shorter range. This can stabilize neutron stars from further collapse, but at a smaller size and higher density than a white dwarf. Neutron stars are the most "rigid" objects known; their Young modulus (or more accurately, bulk modulus) is 20 orders of magnitude larger than that of diamond. However, even this enormous rigidity can be overcome by the gravitational field of a massive star or by the pressure of a supernova, leading to the formation of a black hole.[16]:286–287
16) Martin Bojowald (5 November 2012). The Universe: A View from Classical and Quantum Gravity. John Wiley & Sons. ISBN 978-3-527-66769-7.
Pauli exclusion principle - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Thank you for the research Crick! Clearly the mass of the star is crucial. I think our sun is supposed to go red giant to white dwarf - definitely not supernova let alone a neutron star or a black hole.
Just how drastic upcoming changes to our sun and heavens will be is hinted at in Hebrews 1:10-12 where perish = changed. I.e. when astronomers say our star will die, they really mean it will change drastically. And so will our galaxy when it merges with Andromeda and becomes Andromilk - or is it Milkmeda? Our galaxy will perish - but really it will simply die as to its present state - it actually will be changed - not go out of existence.
Of course, all of this ignores the fact that our Creator can change any of those outcomes. For example, a fine tuned merger of our sun with a brown dwarf c. 5 billion years from now (before entry into red giant phase) could return our sun to early main sequence. Who knows? A brown dwarf in Andromeda may already have a fine tuned trajectory and speed which could rejuvenate our sun in just that manner during the upcoming merger!
It seems to me you have a chip on your shoulder that you love more than God.Be specific.Seems like you are trying hard to deny the account of creation to me.If you really know Hebrew word roots, that's a start.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Then you have to know why the Men of The Great Assembly who churned out the Septuagint turned words with 3 or more letters into one word as opposed to expounding the "whole" word as one word.
B'Rayshis, for instance does not mean "In The Beginning" in any way shape or form.
It means, "Within the essence of The Pristine."
They didn't want the Greeks to know that because the Greeks would never accept the fact that we are figments of The Pristine's Thought..
The Pristine's Thought? That requires a study of the S'fee-rote.
Borore...The Pristine Created
El-Low-Hihm...El (The Prinstine create The Power), Low (The Power's Possession of), Hihm (Multiplicity)
Just an example.
Most rabbi's are only now beginning to define the words in their lectures because the Holocaust generation is gone and wants the Real Deal, not the Fool The Greeks and Fool King James meaning.
I see a lot of wisdom in the Ari's tzim Tzum, not to mention the Nefesh Hachaim.
I am way past the pathetic English "translations".
Indeependent
Diamond Member
- Nov 19, 2013
- 73,633
- 28,506
- 2,250
I have zero clue as to what you are referencing in my posts.It seems to me you have a chip on your shoulder that you love more than God.Be specific.Seems like you are trying hard to deny the account of creation to me.If you really know Hebrew word roots, that's a start.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Then you have to know why the Men of The Great Assembly who churned out the Septuagint turned words with 3 or more letters into one word as opposed to expounding the "whole" word as one word.
B'Rayshis, for instance does not mean "In The Beginning" in any way shape or form.
It means, "Within the essence of The Pristine."
They didn't want the Greeks to know that because the Greeks would never accept the fact that we are figments of The Pristine's Thought..
The Pristine's Thought? That requires a study of the S'fee-rote.
Borore...The Pristine Created
El-Low-Hihm...El (The Prinstine create The Power), Low (The Power's Possession of), Hihm (Multiplicity)
Just an example.
Most rabbi's are only now beginning to define the words in their lectures because the Holocaust generation is gone and wants the Real Deal, not the Fool The Greeks and Fool King James meaning.
I see a lot of wisdom in the Ari's tzim Tzum, not to mention the Nefesh Hachaim.
I am way past the pathetic English "translations".
If you have something to state, Be specific.
All I can conjure is that you can't stand the fact that my Hebrew is far superior to yours and I can interpret a verse far more accurately than yourself.
Y
Yes, we need to get at the root of the matter so we don't get stumped! (puns intended)
Words can change meaning and also most words in Hebrew, Greek and English have multiple definitions. The definition is determined by the context. So, for example, Hebrew chiyl and the same root as Hebrew chuwg/circle/sphere - and the literal definition of chiyl is similar to chuwg. But in Proverbs 8:24,25 it may simply describe God's whirling in a circular or spiral motion when having the pains of parturition/childbirth at giving birth to his firstborn (Gr. prototokos) only-begotten (Gr. monogenes = only born) Son?
Or KJV may be correct and chiyl may simply mean "brought forth" - but I doubt it. Jehovah sometimes uses words that have multiple definitions for a reason - different reasons in each example.
As I am into science, I have found the Bible in the original Hebrew (and Greek) will have words with definitions that invite scientific research to see which definitions apply. An obvious example is the discoveries of galaxies which do actually literally whirl in a circular of spiral motion.
Note Strong's Hebrew dictionary definition of chiyl which is translated "brought forth as with labor pains) in NW ref at Proverbs 8:24,25 -
H2342
חִיל חוּל
chûl chı̂yl
khool, kheel
A primitive root; properly to twist or whirl (in a circular or spiral manner), that is, (specifically) to dance, to writhe in pain (especially of parturition) or fear; ...
If you really know Hebrew word roots, that's a start.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Then you have to know why the Men of The Great Assembly who churned out the Septuagint turned words with 3 or more letters into one word as opposed to expounding the "whole" word as one word.
B'Rayshis, for instance does not mean "In The Beginning" in any way shape or form.
It means, "Within the essence of The Pristine."
They didn't want the Greeks to know that because the Greeks would never accept the fact that we are figments of The Pristine's Thought..
The Pristine's Thought? That requires a study of the S'fee-rote.
Borore...The Pristine Created
El-Low-Hihm...El (The Prinstine create The Power), Low (The Power's Possession of), Hihm (Multiplicity)
Just an example.
Most rabbi's are only now beginning to define the words in their lectures because the Holocaust generation is gone and wants the Real Deal, not the Fool The Greeks and Fool King James meaning.
Yes, we need to get at the root of the matter so we don't get stumped! (puns intended)
Words can change meaning and also most words in Hebrew, Greek and English have multiple definitions. The definition is determined by the context. So, for example, Hebrew chiyl and the same root as Hebrew chuwg/circle/sphere - and the literal definition of chiyl is similar to chuwg. But in Proverbs 8:24,25 it may simply describe God's whirling in a circular or spiral motion when having the pains of parturition/childbirth at giving birth to his firstborn (Gr. prototokos) only-begotten (Gr. monogenes = only born) Son?
Or KJV may be correct and chiyl may simply mean "brought forth" - but I doubt it. Jehovah sometimes uses words that have multiple definitions for a reason - different reasons in each example.
As I am into science, I have found the Bible in the original Hebrew (and Greek) will have words with definitions that invite scientific research to see which definitions apply. An obvious example is the discoveries of galaxies which do actually literally whirl in a circular of spiral motion.
Note Strong's Hebrew dictionary definition of chiyl which is translated "brought forth as with labor pains) in NW ref at Proverbs 8:24,25 -
H2342
חִיל חוּל
chûl chı̂yl
khool, kheel
A primitive root; properly to twist or whirl (in a circular or spiral manner), that is, (specifically) to dance, to writhe in pain (especially of parturition) or fear; ...
OK, when I get tired my sense of humor is peaked - so an example of multiple definitions of words.
I love dates - also fig - ures - especially tree ripened.
I asked a sister I wanted to marry - will you have a date with me? As she knew we were trying to be just friends - she looked at me perplexed. Then I offered her a date and had one myself - yum!
As for dating - I think some scientists are way off on their dates!
Pleasant dreams you all!
I love dates - also fig - ures - especially tree ripened.
I asked a sister I wanted to marry - will you have a date with me? As she knew we were trying to be just friends - she looked at me perplexed. Then I offered her a date and had one myself - yum!
As for dating - I think some scientists are way off on their dates!
Pleasant dreams you all!
Indeependent
Diamond Member
- Nov 19, 2013
- 73,633
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- 2,250
Everything you read in English was doctored to keep the Greeks and Romans away.Y
If you really know Hebrew word roots, that's a start.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
Then you have to know why the Men of The Great Assembly who churned out the Septuagint turned words with 3 or more letters into one word as opposed to expounding the "whole" word as one word.
B'Rayshis, for instance does not mean "In The Beginning" in any way shape or form.
It means, "Within the essence of The Pristine."
They didn't want the Greeks to know that because the Greeks would never accept the fact that we are figments of The Pristine's Thought..
The Pristine's Thought? That requires a study of the S'fee-rote.
Borore...The Pristine Created
El-Low-Hihm...El (The Prinstine create The Power), Low (The Power's Possession of), Hihm (Multiplicity)
Just an example.
Most rabbi's are only now beginning to define the words in their lectures because the Holocaust generation is gone and wants the Real Deal, not the Fool The Greeks and Fool King James meaning.
Yes, we need to get at the root of the matter so we don't get stumped! (puns intended)
Words can change meaning and also most words in Hebrew, Greek and English have multiple definitions. The definition is determined by the context. So, for example, Hebrew chiyl and the same root as Hebrew chuwg/circle/sphere - and the literal definition of chiyl is similar to chuwg. But in Proverbs 8:24,25 it may simply describe God's whirling in a circular or spiral motion when having the pains of parturition/childbirth at giving birth to his firstborn (Gr. prototokos) only-begotten (Gr. monogenes = only born) Son?
Or KJV may be correct and chiyl may simply mean "brought forth" - but I doubt it. Jehovah sometimes uses words that have multiple definitions for a reason - different reasons in each example.
As I am into science, I have found the Bible in the original Hebrew (and Greek) will have words with definitions that invite scientific research to see which definitions apply. An obvious example is the discoveries of galaxies which do actually literally whirl in a circular of spiral motion.
Note Strong's Hebrew dictionary definition of chiyl which is translated "brought forth as with labor pains) in NW ref at Proverbs 8:24,25 -
H2342
חִיל חוּל
chûl chı̂yl
khool, kheel
A primitive root; properly to twist or whirl (in a circular or spiral manner), that is, (specifically) to dance, to writhe in pain (especially of parturition) or fear; ...
You are doing well to investigate the roots.
I'm on Torah Anytime almost all day where the real meanings are used.
It's not simple because the meaning of a few words often result in an hour class or multiple hour classes.
BreezeWood
VIP Member
- Oct 26, 2011
- 17,276
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Bar Ilan University’s Professor Nathan Aviezer, author of the book In the Beginning, disagrees with you.It's a mistake to suggest that there is anything scientifically accurate about Genesis. A common mistake of religionists is to presume their holy texts are science journals.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
He told The Times of Israel, this discovery “isn’t going to make anyone who wasn’t a believer in God into one, or vice versa, but one thing the announcement does do is make it clear that the universe had a definite starting point — a creation — as described in the Book of Genesis,” said Aviezer. “To deny this now is to deny scientific fact.”
“Without addressing who or what caused it, the mechanics of the creation process in the Big Bang match the Genesis story perfectly. If I had to make up a theory to match the first passages in Genesis, the Big Bang theory would be it,” said Aviezer.
“It’s an example of Divine irony that it took atheistic scientists like [Nobel laureate Paul] Dirac and all the others to point out the truth of the Torah. At this point I think we can say that creation is a scientific fact.”
Could New Scientific Discovery Support Creation?
Nathan Aviezer - Wikipedia
.
.
the jew the christian and jehova witness - who's kidding who.
primordial Earth ...
10 billion years after "the beginning" - other than the book of forgeries, where's the water -
what water, howabout it newtonian ... is it "holy water".
doesn't take a whole lot to make some people happy or slightly intoxicated, the coincidental in depth research by - bing.
Last edited:
Indeependent
Diamond Member
- Nov 19, 2013
- 73,633
- 28,506
- 2,250
The Big Bang could not have eventually produced H2O?Bar Ilan University’s Professor Nathan Aviezer, author of the book In the Beginning, disagrees with you.It's a mistake to suggest that there is anything scientifically accurate about Genesis. A common mistake of religionists is to presume their holy texts are science journals.Genesis 1
The document is there...it's called the verses.Tanach was kidnapped and raped by the early self-hating Jews.
Say what???
Job 26:7 is really remarkable because most people believed earth was supported by something while the verse says Earth is hung upon nothing in empty space.
An example is the beliefs about Atlas (not Rand McNally's) - that Earth rested on the shoulders of Atlas:
The Bible—A Reliable Source of Truth — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"About 3,500 years ago, the Bible stated that the earth is suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) This differed greatly from the myths that described the earth as floating on water or being carried by a giant tortoise. Some 1,100 years after the book of Job was written, people continued to believe that the earth could not just hang in midair; it had to have something to rest upon. Only three hundred years ago, in 1687, Isaac Newton published his work on gravity and explained that the earth is held in orbit by an invisible force. This scientific milestone confirmed what the Bible had stated more than 3,000 years earlier!"
How Science Affects Your Life — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
This is an authorized Web site of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It is a research tool for publications in various languages produced by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
"How the earth is suspended
The Bible describes the earth as suspended “upon nothing.” (Job 26:7) There is no mention of our planet resting on the shoulders of a giant or on the backs of elephants that stand on a turtle, as some popular myths of ancient times had it. Rather, the Bible leaves the door open to scientific discovery. In time, Nicolaus Copernicus and Johannes Kepler described how the planets move around the sun driven by an invisible force. Isaac Newton later showed how gravitation governs the movement of all objects in space."
Ummmm, lets be honest, here. The Bible is not 3,500 years old. Job is a part of Hebrew scripture, the Tanakh, which was stolen by Christianity and made a part of the Christian Bible.
The Bible contains 66 books (depending on how they are counted) with different writers and different dates of writing spanning about 1600 years. The book of Job is one of the oldest books of the Bible - written by Moses about the same time as the written Torah/Pentateuch about 1513 BCE.
Why do you say the Hebrew Scriptures were stolen by Christianity? Jesus was a Jew and the only Bible he quoted was the Hebrew Scriptures - he did not steal the Hebrew Scriptures!
Take a year or two to read the Torah and this will be obvious.
But you won't.
See my thread on Genesis - we are going pretty slow. When I joined our ministry school in 1958 we were on the book of Job. We have read and studied the entire Bible in our assigned Bible reading many times since then - this time we are actually going quite slowly.
Btw - no one ever graduates that school - we just keep learning!
Can you document what you are referring to?
Tanach is impossible to read without going to the yeshiva called Gemara.
The English translations are purposefully horrendous...
No Jew from the moment of the completion of the Septuagint could read it and believe for a second that it was faithful because each verse can be read in an overwhelming number of ways and the Genesis 1:1 is completely wrong.
The closet you will get is from the Pritzger Edition Zohar available from Amazon.
When I first read it many years ago I thought I got ripped off.
Then I started learning Hebrew and realized the Artscroll is sort of a joke...to much catering to the King James Crowd.
Genesis 1:1 is accurate scientifically - the universe had a beginning contrary to what Aristotle taught and many believed for centuries.
You don't need any other book to read the Hebrew Scriptures in Hebrew, or in any good Hebrew-English interlinear.
He told The Times of Israel, this discovery “isn’t going to make anyone who wasn’t a believer in God into one, or vice versa, but one thing the announcement does do is make it clear that the universe had a definite starting point — a creation — as described in the Book of Genesis,” said Aviezer. “To deny this now is to deny scientific fact.”
“Without addressing who or what caused it, the mechanics of the creation process in the Big Bang match the Genesis story perfectly. If I had to make up a theory to match the first passages in Genesis, the Big Bang theory would be it,” said Aviezer.
“It’s an example of Divine irony that it took atheistic scientists like [Nobel laureate Paul] Dirac and all the others to point out the truth of the Torah. At this point I think we can say that creation is a scientific fact.”
Could New Scientific Discovery Support Creation?
Nathan Aviezer - Wikipedia
.
the jew the christian and jehova witness - who's kidding who.
primordial Earth ...
View attachment 333006
10 billion years after "the beginning" - other than the book of forgeries, where's the water -
what water, howabout it newtonian ... is it "holy water".
.Thank you for the research ding! .
doesn't take a whole lot to make some people happy or slightly intoxicated, the coincidental in depth research by - bing.
Are you retarded?
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