FAIL- Electric Car Sales Plunge To 4 Year Lows

[WinterBorn]

Since I am hitting the Tesla charging stations, I wouldn't pay a dime for fuel.

No, but you'd be paying for electricity.

These "charging stations" won't be free, man. It costs money to charge one of these things.

No you won't. If you buy a new Tesla you get free charging at their Super Charging stations forever. That is guaranteed.

Bullshit. Unless they get gigantic subsidies, that can't last...it's just not a sustainable business model.

Sure it is. Now as their business grows and there are more of them on the road they will probably stop offering it free. But it is sustainable.

Most people will not use the charging stations on a regular basis. They will use them for longer trips and the like.

The cost to charge a Tesla is minimal. You can fully charge one in Atlanta for around $10 or $12. At the super charger that will take 75 to 90 minutes. Most people will take half a charge in 20 or 30 mins and keep going. So it costs $5 to $6 for Tesla. (less actually, since they can charge THEIR batteries at night when rates are low)

And if the range is the biggest obstacle to people buying a Tesla, these free charging stations can all but overcome that. This means a significant increase in sales. More than enough to pay for the electricity.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

A few years back, I had a lot of extra cash to play with and I was going to do a big block Cleveland 351 swap into a tiny 88 Ford ranger. The plan was after the swap to make it into a multi fuel, hydrogen boost vehicle with an adjustable distributor and the capacity to burn slow burning fuel like lamp oil, etc, and supliment it with about 4-5 percent hydrogen. I abandoned the project when I realized that you needed a much newer engine that could withstand exposure to the hydrogen. Cast iron\steel would be wrecked in a year.

My replacement project was going to be my own electric car, which is a fairly easy and relatively easy project save for the twenty car batteries that would have necessitated daily maintenance that would have sucked the fun factor right out.

 

[WinterBorn]

Have you ever heard of a battery that lasted forever?

That's why.

And yes, you have treated it like a Godsend. You haven't, in 43 pages of thread, said ONE NEGATIVE THING about the Tesla automobile. NOT A SINGLE THING. You have, however, defended every single negative thing said.

Every car on the road has major negatives about it, even Tesla. Far be it from you to admit it.

Really? Have you ever heard of an ICE that does not wear out? If the Tesla had a thousand mile range, it would be a far better automobile.

I have driven cars with over 350,000 miles on the original engine...and a truck with over 800,000. (The engine still ran perfectly when it was wrecked with 930,000.) Very, very, VERY few cars are scrapped due to engine failure!

And the entire battery tray can be replaced in a Tesla in less than 2 minutes. Electric motors have a lower failure rate than ICE motors. And there are fewer mechanical systems to fail.

 

[Jarlaxle]

My 1969 Chevy gets the same mileage as your new Ford. Eco fail.

And how many horses does your 1969 Chevy have? And by all means, what kind of car is it? Let's look it up. What is the 0-60 of your Chevy? Make? Model? Or is it a phantom car?

Ignorant morons love to say "My Geo Metro gets the same mileage as the new Fiesta." LOL Ok, and your Metro has a mind boggling 50 horsepower. The new Fiesta has 123 and 145ft lbs of torque. That is something the Metro surely didn't have. The new Focus ST has over 250 horsepower.

So while raw gas mileage hasn't gone up a whole lot, performance with that same mileage has gone through the roof.

It is a Malibu with a 307 bored 30 over and has around 300HP. And I don't give a shit how fast it goes from zero to sixty. Why are you in such a hurry? The point is modern cars still getting the same mileage is they did 30 years ago is a joke. And the fact you Millennials buy into the marketing BS just shows how stupid and gullible you are.

As I recall, the base hp for a 69 Chevy Malibu was about 200.

If you bored it over a bit, you could squeeze a little more out of it, but not much. It was not considered to be a very fast motor. You could beef it up with bigger valves and more compression. But most car guys would never have built a 307. Thier were better motors laying around that you could make fly.

Most of the 307s used a 2 speed power-glide tranny that used up a lot more fuel.

I would be going 60 mph and totally not notice I was in 1st gear!!!

300HP from a 307 wouldn't be all that hard. It's still a SB Chevy...I have seen 300HP 305's, and a 307 is actually a much better starting point. Swapping a TH700R4 (or TH-200-4R) trans into a Malibu is a weekend project.

I could force 375 out of it, but you have to build the living hell out of that puppy. Including new heads, big cam, four barrel carb, roller rockers, and a lot more. Why build a 307 though, when you can easily slap a 396 in that bad-boy?

*There is no real substitute for cubic inches.

There has been no reason to build a 396 in 35 years.

And there certainly IS a substitute for cubic inches!

 

[Jarlaxle]

Since I am hitting the Tesla charging stations, I wouldn't pay a dime for fuel.

No, but you'd be paying for electricity.

These "charging stations" won't be free, man. It costs money to charge one of these things.

No you won't. If you buy a new Tesla you get free charging at their Super Charging stations forever. That is guaranteed.

Bullshit. Unless they get gigantic subsidies, that can't last...it's just not a sustainable business model.

There currently are NO SUBSIDIES for electric cars. All of the tax breaks have expired. You are really closing your eyes to a cool new idea. Do I think they will last forever? No, but these technologies will eventually give rise to its eventual replacements.

reread my post. Comprehend it. Then, and ONLY then, respond to it. Thank you.

 

[WinterBorn]

Since I am hitting the Tesla charging stations, I wouldn't pay a dime for fuel.

No, but you'd be paying for electricity.

These "charging stations" won't be free, man. It costs money to charge one of these things.

No you won't. If you buy a new Tesla you get free charging at their Super Charging stations forever. That is guaranteed.

Bullshit. Unless they get gigantic subsidies, that can't last...it's just not a sustainable business model.

There currently are NO SUBSIDIES for electric cars. All of the tax breaks have expired. You are really closing your eyes to a cool new idea. Do I think they will last forever? No, but these technologies will eventually give rise to its eventual replacements.

Exactly. These are the first wave of the new EVs.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

The Fiesta is a $15000 car. It can go as fast, and twice as far as a vehicle costing 5 times as much needing special charging stations and hours to charge. That will NOT catch on with the general masses as the PATHETIC SALES NUMBERS have shown. The Fiesta engine has also won international engine of the year 3 years in a row. What has Tesla done?

The Fiesta is a totally revamp of the old car. In fact, the new generation Fiesta started out as a rally car in Europe. Because there were 5 other cars before it with the same name, to use your words, has no meaning in this conversation.

Quit making excuses and you still haven't said a single negative thing about the Tesla. What are you, a salesman for Tesla?

Oh yea, if EV's are so clean if they're charged by nuclear power plants, you do realize that less than 20% of Americas power is generated by nuclear energy? So that means that EV's are much more polluting than ICE cars because we simply don't have the infrastructure available to charge them in a non-polluting way.

U.S. Nuclear Power Plants - Nuclear Energy Institute

Why is it so important for you that I say something negative about Tesla? Who, by the way, won Car of the Year from at least 2 automotive magazines.

No, the Fiesta can't go as fast as the Tesla. And the fuel will almost always be far more expensive. It also requires oil changes, transmission service, coolant checks, ect ect ect.

You have spent more than 45 pages trying to demean and discredit the Tesla and other EVs. You have attacked them from every conceivable angle. You really do hate the idea of them, don't you? Why?

FOX news had a vicious hate campaign directly related to the bail-outs. It was an attempt mostly to discredit Obama's touting of the Volt when it was introduced. When two Volts caught fire after they were crashed, Republicans actually forced a recal! Too funny. I have never seen a car so hated for no discernable reason other than political poppycock.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

Since I am hitting the Tesla charging stations, I wouldn't pay a dime for fuel.

No, but you'd be paying for electricity.

These "charging stations" won't be free, man. It costs money to charge one of these things.

No you won't. If you buy a new Tesla you get free charging at their Super Charging stations forever. That is guaranteed.

Bullshit. Unless they get gigantic subsidies, that can't last...it's just not a sustainable business model.

There currently are NO SUBSIDIES for electric cars. All of the tax breaks have expired. You are really closing your eyes to a cool new idea. Do I think they will last forever? No, but these technologies will eventually give rise to its eventual replacements.

reread my post. Comprehend it. Then, and ONLY then, respond to it. Thank you.

Am I being a dickhead to You? Then don't be one to me. You could not be anymore wrong about your stupid, partisan driven, position that you are repeating like a good solider in order to discredit what you view as a "liberal technology".

Seriously, get your head out of your ass.

Charging a Volt is incredibly cheap -- a "fill-up" is less than 2 dollars. Stations would be stupid to charge for that, anyone charging will spend cash on other stuff. Its marketing genius.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

And how many horses does your 1969 Chevy have? And by all means, what kind of car is it? Let's look it up. What is the 0-60 of your Chevy? Make? Model? Or is it a phantom car?

Ignorant morons love to say "My Geo Metro gets the same mileage as the new Fiesta." LOL Ok, and your Metro has a mind boggling 50 horsepower. The new Fiesta has 123 and 145ft lbs of torque. That is something the Metro surely didn't have. The new Focus ST has over 250 horsepower.

So while raw gas mileage hasn't gone up a whole lot, performance with that same mileage has gone through the roof.

It is a Malibu with a 307 bored 30 over and has around 300HP. And I don't give a shit how fast it goes from zero to sixty. Why are you in such a hurry? The point is modern cars still getting the same mileage is they did 30 years ago is a joke. And the fact you Millennials buy into the marketing BS just shows how stupid and gullible you are.

As I recall, the base hp for a 69 Chevy Malibu was about 200.

If you bored it over a bit, you could squeeze a little more out of it, but not much. It was not considered to be a very fast motor. You could beef it up with bigger valves and more compression. But most car guys would never have built a 307. Thier were better motors laying around that you could make fly.

Most of the 307s used a 2 speed power-glide tranny that used up a lot more fuel.

I would be going 60 mph and totally not notice I was in 1st gear!!!

300HP from a 307 wouldn't be all that hard. It's still a SB Chevy...I have seen 300HP 305's, and a 307 is actually a much better starting point. Swapping a TH700R4 (or TH-200-4R) trans into a Malibu is a weekend project.

I could force 375 out of it, but you have to build the living hell out of that puppy. Including new heads, big cam, four barrel carb, roller rockers, and a lot more. Why build a 307 though, when you can easily slap a 396 in that bad-boy?

*There is no real substitute for cubic inches.

There has been no reason to build a 396 in 35 years.

And there certainly IS a substitute for cubic inches!

You don't really sound very knowledgeable about anything you are talking about.

396 Big Block Chevy Stroker Build - Car Craft Magazine

Plus, you just seem to be argumentative for No real reason.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

The same way wifi will be free to everyone, so will electricity. Republicans Will do their very best to mess that up for everybody, but 85 year olds can't keep electing shills for big oil forever.

 

[EverCurious]

Our 96' Subaru engine went 500,000 miles, the clutch blew out on it and we gave it to a local mechanic buddy for his kid - two or three years later and it's still going strong last I heard. Only down side with Subaru engines is one of them came out with a shitty seal, 205i if I remember right, so pretty much you are guaranteed to have to replace the head gasket on them; but once you do that they're awesome for 500k plus.

Chevy did well until like the 90's or so as well. I've got an all original single-owner 1968 stepside with a flipped odometer sitting next to my husbands shop that we picked up a couple years ago; engines fine, transmission's just dead (3 on the tree.) My first two trucks too, a 1980 V6 and a 1969 v8 shortblock both had flipped odometer's as well. The 69' engine died to a big bull moose in like 93 or 94', but the 80' lasted me a good 8 years before I decided I wanted a more kid friendly car and sold it.

 

[Jarlaxle]

It is a Malibu with a 307 bored 30 over and has around 300HP. And I don't give a shit how fast it goes from zero to sixty. Why are you in such a hurry? The point is modern cars still getting the same mileage is they did 30 years ago is a joke. And the fact you Millennials buy into the marketing BS just shows how stupid and gullible you are.

As I recall, the base hp for a 69 Chevy Malibu was about 200.

If you bored it over a bit, you could squeeze a little more out of it, but not much. It was not considered to be a very fast motor. You could beef it up with bigger valves and more compression. But most car guys would never have built a 307. Thier were better motors laying around that you could make fly.

Most of the 307s used a 2 speed power-glide tranny that used up a lot more fuel.

I would be going 60 mph and totally not notice I was in 1st gear!!!

300HP from a 307 wouldn't be all that hard. It's still a SB Chevy...I have seen 300HP 305's, and a 307 is actually a much better starting point. Swapping a TH700R4 (or TH-200-4R) trans into a Malibu is a weekend project.

I could force 375 out of it, but you have to build the living hell out of that puppy. Including new heads, big cam, four barrel carb, roller rockers, and a lot more. Why build a 307 though, when you can easily slap a 396 in that bad-boy?

*There is no real substitute for cubic inches.

There has been no reason to build a 396 in 35 years.

And there certainly IS a substitute for cubic inches!

You don't really sound very knowledgeable about anything you are talking about.

396 Big Block Chevy Stroker Build - Car Craft Magazine

Plus, you just seem to be argumentative for No real reason.

I didn't say that nobody built them...I said that today, there is no real REASON to do so. You can build a larger engine (which will make more power) for less money.

 

[airplanemechanic]

That's what people just don't realize. You can't compare prices today of energy with any kind of reliable numbers. You can't look at the cost of electricity in todays numbers and assume everything else remains the same. That's ignorant.

Add 25 million electrics and that means electricity demands on an already struggling old power grid go through the roof. The cost of electricity would also go sky high. Reduce the number of ICE cars on the road and the demand for gas would go way down. That would bring prices way down. The problem people don't understand is that EV cars could effect the cost to homeowners who don't even own them. Higher electricity prices would cost everyone more, even if they don't own an electric vehicle. This would mean a lot of pissed off people.

So the more EV automobiles that are out there, the less desirable they would be. The sales numbers, thus far, have been so dismal that they really haven't affected anything.

 

[WinterBorn]

That's what people just don't realize. You can't compare prices today of energy with any kind of reliable numbers. You can't look at the cost of electricity in todays numbers and assume everything else remains the same. That's ignorant.

Add 25 million electrics and that means electricity demands on an already struggling old power grid go through the roof. The cost of electricity would also go sky high. Reduce the number of ICE cars on the road and the demand for gas would go way down. That would bring prices way down. The problem people don't understand is that EV cars could effect the cost to homeowners who don't even own them. Higher electricity prices would cost everyone more, even if they don't own an electric vehicle. This would mean a lot of pissed off people.

So the more EV automobiles that are out there, the less desirable they would be. The sales numbers, thus far, have been so dismal that they really haven't affected anything.

The grid needs more generating capacity. That is a given. As the need grows greater, as it will even without EVs, this becomes more and more apparent. And the capacity to generate electricity is virtually boundless. Something that cannot be said for oil. Assuming we can continue to burn oil at ever greater rates, without having problems with supply or after effects is foolish.

One thing you CAN look at, as far as energy prices, and that is the fluctuations. Oil, and therefore gas, prices fluctuate far more than electricity.

 

[Politico]

There has been no reason to build a 396 in 35 years.

And there certainly IS a substitute for cubic inches!

Whether there is a reason is irrelevant.

 

[skookerasbil]

update.............sales still sucking.

 

[WinterBorn]

update.............sales still sucking.

If being 55% above teh previous years sales is "sucking", I think Tesla is happy to suck.