GOP ... states can keep Obamacare

[Penelope]

Where does the money for Medicare Advantage and Medicare Supplement come from?

The government. That's where.

"Medicaid for all" is single payer.

Medicare Supplements are paid with private dollars only with insurer competition. No federal dollars.

Medicare Advantage is subsidized, yes. But the insurers still compete for the business and include preventive/diagnostic care so that small issues don't become large and expensive issues and other extras.
.

There are many Medicare Advantage plans out there, and one needs to pay the Part B premium and depending on the plan you buy you pay the premium for Medicare Advantage. Not subsidized

*sigh*

What is Single Payer? | Physicians for a National Health Program

Single-payer national health insurance, also known as “Medicare for all,” is a system in which a single public or quasi-public agency organizes health care financing, but the delivery of care remains largely in private hands.

The chart provided in your link proves my point.

"Single Payer Bill, H.R. 676" - Full Range of Benefits - Yes. Coverage for all medically necessary services."

That's not how the Medicare / Medicare Supplement / Medicare Advantage system works. Medicare covers only 80% of approved services. Plus it has co-pays and co-insurances, and NO out-of-pocket maximums.

That's where the free market Medicare Advantage and Medicare Supplement plans come in, to help fill or completely fill the LARGE gaps in Medicare AND provide out-of-pocket maximums, as well as other added benefits.

Single Payer is not what I'm proposing. I don't want Single Payer. I don't think you know the difference.
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Its not unusual for a person on Medicare to pay close to 400 or 500 a month with copays for prescriptions.

Just because you have premiums or a copay does not mean it isn't single payer.

Single payer means a single health insurance provider.

"Medicare for all" means a single health insurance provider. The US government.

One has to be 65 or disable and had to of worked so many quarters up to the disability to get Medicare. Also one needs to be disabled for 2 years to get Medicare. So one had best hope they have money saved or have a disability policy that they have income for 2 years because if they don't, they will have to spend down all their assets to the bare minimum to get SSI. But now if one has the ACA and even if one does not qualify for a subsidy its good to be on it, as one day, any day one can become disabled and then you go online and tell them and you can get expanded Medicare if the GOP in your state expanded it or a lower premium if say you can only work several hours a week.

Those are the facts, we do not have single payer, and going back to pre ACA standards, many will loose everything if they become disabled and even if they chose to return to work, one must be honest about work restrictions and chances are you will not get the job, or be able to get insurance at an affordable price.

Also from what I have been reading , employers under the GOP plans do not need to offer health insurance pay share.

 

[Flash]

States have always had the right to implement any kind of health care program they want.

When Trump and the Congress repeals that stupid ass Obamacare if some dumbass Libtard state like say California wants to have it then go for it. They are idiots but let them live with their stupidity.

 

[rightwinger]

What we have now in Obamacare is probably the worst legislation ever passed and obviously had zero thought out into. That's why insurance rates are skyrocketing and chocking the life out of the middle class. Anything is better than this garbage called Obamacare

Then why can't Republicans put their name on a plan if it is so easy to offer something better than Obamacare?

Exactly.

The GOP hasn't up to now because they are cowards. You can see they are in full panic mode right now.

"Oh fuck! We own healthcare now!"

They know that any Republican that proposes a healthcare plan will be crucified by the rightwing media

 

[bripat9643]

There is no such thing as Obamacare. It is page after page of fines and regulations sticking it to the hospitals and their patients. We can do much better. In fact we were doing much better before the obstruction.

uh huh, sure.

20 million people are having an insurance company pay for their medical bills now ... before, 20 million people were making taxpayers pay for their medical bills every time they went to a county hospital because they had NO insurance ..

RW logic is fucked up.

Those same taxpayers are still paying for the dead beats through higher premiums and higher deductibles.

 

[AntonToo]

Freedom is all about being allowed to be a moron.

But ObamaCare doesn't just force "morons" to buy insurance, it forces them to buy insurance at a higher cost than it should be. They are forced to subsidize high school dropouts.

What you just said is total nonsense.

Not a single dollar of your healthcare spending goes to pay for means based insurance subsidies. Funding for that comes from cuts in other spending and a few new taxes that mostly hit 250K+ income brakes.

Apparently you are completely oblivious as to why the individual mandate was the linchpin of Obamacare.

Everyone had to be forced into the pool to keep costs down for the "involuntarily uninsured".

The people forced to buy insurance are most certainly subsidizing the involuntarily uninsured by paying higher premiums, and one third of the involuntarily uninsured are high school dropouts.

please spare me, I've been participating in healthcare discussion long enough to know what the mandate is for.

You said that "morons' are forced to pay more for their insurance to make up for for subsidies for the poor (which you characterize as those without secondary education).

It was false.

The good thing is now they are going to stop enforcing the mandate...

...well if crashing individual insurance market and leaving many millions of people without health insurance is your idea of a "good thing" then yes, it is great.

 

[Rustic]

Freedom is all about being allowed to be a moron.

But ObamaCare doesn't just force "morons" to buy insurance, it forces them to buy insurance at a higher cost than it should be. They are forced to subsidize high school dropouts.

What you just said is total nonsense.

Not a single dollar of your healthcare spending goes to pay for means based insurance subsidies. Funding for that comes from cuts in other spending and a few new taxes that mostly hit 250K+ income brakes.

Apparently you are completely oblivious as to why the individual mandate was the linchpin of Obamacare.

Everyone had to be forced into the pool to keep costs down for the "involuntarily uninsured".

The people forced to buy insurance are most certainly subsidizing the involuntarily uninsured by paying higher premiums, and one third of the involuntarily uninsured are high school dropouts.

please spare me, I've been participating in healthcare discussion long enough to know what the mandate is for.

You said that "morons' are forced to pay more for their insurance to make up for for subsidies for the poor (which you characterize as those without secondary education).

It was false.

The good thing is now they are going to stop enforcing the mandate...

...well if crashing individual insurance market and leaving many millions of people without health insurance is your idea of a "good thing" then yes, it is great.

No matter what they do they will never get a nationalized healthcare program working, it's impossible... so might as well crash it now.
Let the piece of shit die

 

[AntonToo]

What you just said is total nonsense.

Not a single dollar of your healthcare spending goes to pay for means based insurance subsidies. Funding for that comes from cuts in other spending and a few new taxes that mostly hit 250K+ income brakes.

Apparently you are completely oblivious as to why the individual mandate was the linchpin of Obamacare.

Everyone had to be forced into the pool to keep costs down for the "involuntarily uninsured".

The people forced to buy insurance are most certainly subsidizing the involuntarily uninsured by paying higher premiums, and one third of the involuntarily uninsured are high school dropouts.

please spare me, I've been participating in healthcare discussion long enough to know what the mandate is for.

You said that "morons' are forced to pay more for their insurance to make up for for subsidies for the poor (which you characterize as those without secondary education).

It was false.

The good thing is now they are going to stop enforcing the mandate...

...well if crashing individual insurance market and leaving many millions of people without health insurance is your idea of a "good thing" then yes, it is great.

No matter what they do they will never get a nationalized healthcare program working, it's impossible... so might as well crash it now.
Let the piece of shit die

What the fuck are you talking about? What "nationalized healthcare program"?

Are you maybe talking about Medicaid/Medicare that has been around for many decades and has very high support among Americans?

 

[Rustic]

Apparently you are completely oblivious as to why the individual mandate was the linchpin of Obamacare.

Everyone had to be forced into the pool to keep costs down for the "involuntarily uninsured".

The people forced to buy insurance are most certainly subsidizing the involuntarily uninsured by paying higher premiums, and one third of the involuntarily uninsured are high school dropouts.

please spare me, I've been participating in healthcare discussion long enough to know what the mandate is for.

You said that "morons' are forced to pay more for their insurance to make up for for subsidies for the poor (which you characterize as those without secondary education).

It was false.

The good thing is now they are going to stop enforcing the mandate...

...well if crashing individual insurance market and leaving many millions of people without health insurance is your idea of a "good thing" then yes, it is great.

No matter what they do they will never get a nationalized healthcare program working, it's impossible... so might as well crash it now.
Let the piece of shit die

What the fuck are you talking about? What "nationalized healthcare program"?

Are you maybe talking about Medicaid/Medicare that has been around for many decades and has very high support among Americans?

The very concept of healthcare for everybody is flawed to the core, human nature that will not allow it to be successful. Deadbeats will abuse it…

 

[LordBrownTrout]

There is no such thing as Obamacare. It is page after page of fines and regulations sticking it to the hospitals and their patients. We can do much better. In fact we were doing much better before the obstruction.

uh huh, sure.

20 million people are having an insurance company pay for their medical bills now ... before, 20 million people were making taxpayers pay for their medical bills every time they went to a county hospital because they had NO insurance ..

RW logic is fucked up.

You really have no clue do you. The premiums were raised exponentially on the taxpayer and deductibles increased.

 

[MAGA]

Universal health care is the worst idea any government ever had. I live in the U.K. In the early 2000's and what he'd daily on the news of the complaints of long lines and waiting to long to see a doctor. They passed a law that required a person in an ambulance to be seen in 30 min once they arrived at the hospital. They circumvented this law by having the ambulance continue circulating the block until they where ready to see them. If you don't believe me than just look at how bad of shape are VA is and you honestly want this for everyone?

 

[rightwinger]

Quite frankly, I think that if Congress doesn't pass a replacement/alternative to O-care before they vote to repeal it, there won't be a replacement/alternative that gets passed.

Republicans are more concerned with removing Obama's name than passing a healthcare plan

 

[jc456]

There is no such thing as Obamacare. It is page after page of fines and regulations sticking it to the hospitals and their patients. We can do much better. In fact we were doing much better before the obstruction.

uh huh, sure.

20 million people are having an insurance company pay for their medical bills now ... before, 20 million people were making taxpayers pay for their medical bills every time they went to a county hospital because they had NO insurance ..

RW logic is fucked up.

Your fairy tale would be find if it were not that....a fairy tale. 20 million are paying to guard against the big one.

And they pay a lot.

Their deductibles are often over 6,000 so the insurance company is often paying NOTHING.

that is our deductible

jc, what was it prior to Obamacare? Mine went from 500 to 5,000.

There is no such thing as Obamacare. It is page after page of fines and regulations sticking it to the hospitals and their patients. We can do much better. In fact we were doing much better before the obstruction.

uh huh, sure.

20 million people are having an insurance company pay for their medical bills now ... before, 20 million people were making taxpayers pay for their medical bills every time they went to a county hospital because they had NO insurance ..

RW logic is fucked up.

Your fairy tale would be find if it were not that....a fairy tale. 20 million are paying to guard against the big one.

And they pay a lot.

Their deductibles are often over 6,000 so the insurance company is often paying NOTHING.

that is our deductible

Are you on a bronze plan?

I'm on the plan that says you will pay 6000

 

[jc456]

Quite frankly, I think that if Congress doesn't pass a replacement/alternative to O-care before they vote to repeal it, there won't be a replacement/alternative that gets passed.

Republicans are more concerned with removing Obama's name than passing a healthcare plan

It was removed it's now ACA

 

[Kosh]

repealing healthcare is already meeting opposition ..

GOP senators: Give states the option of keeping ObamaCare

when (and if ) it comes time to vote on repealing the ACA it will only take a few more like-minded Republicans to cross the aisle and vote with the dems to stop Trump dead in his tracks.

Wow! The government allows others to make up their minds!

Perfect example of why you never vote far left!

 

[jc456]

If you like your Obamacare, you can keep your Obamacare

GOP senators outline first Obamacare replacement plan

States are given the option that if healthcare exchanges are working and the people like them, they can keep them

Otherwise, the can set up Health Savings Plans to help pay for insurane

or....do nothing and let em die


My guess is Republicans will hate it more than the Democrats do

Hell, I don't give a shit if people want to keep Obama care to themselves - that should be choice, but it's fucked up forcing anybody into Obamacare it's Obviously something they will never use…

Nobody is forced into Obamacare
They always had the option of a private policy

it was called a mandate. go read about it.

Mandate to get yourself a policy
You have a CHOICE of which policy and whether public or private

Only a moron goes through life without health insurance

Freedom is all about being allowed to be a moron.

But ObamaCare doesn't just force "morons" to buy insurance, it forces them to buy insurance at a higher cost than it should be. They are forced to subsidize high school dropouts.

Apparently it is okay to be a moron who drops out of high school, but it is not okay to be well off enough to pay for health expenses out of one's own pocket.

We have shit completely backwards.

That they don't want! Funny shit eh?

 

[Kosh]

Hell, I don't give a shit if people want to keep Obama care to themselves - that should be choice, but it's fucked up forcing anybody into Obamacare it's Obviously something they will never use…

Nobody is forced into Obamacare
They always had the option of a private policy

it was called a mandate. go read about it.

Mandate to get yourself a policy
You have a CHOICE of which policy and whether public or private

Only a moron goes through life without health insurance

Freedom is all about being allowed to be a moron.

But ObamaCare doesn't just force "morons" to buy insurance, it forces them to buy insurance at a higher cost than it should be. They are forced to subsidize high school dropouts.

Apparently it is okay to be a moron who drops out of high school, but it is not okay to be well off enough to pay for health expenses out of one's own pocket.

We have shit completely backwards.

That they don't want! Funny shit eh?

Yes but you are quoting someone that supported Obamacare!

 

[WillReadmore]

The Democrats should have done the right thing the FIRST damn time and extended the Medicare / Medicare Supplement / Medicare Advantage system to all. An excellent, already-functioning blend of public funding and dynamic private competition.

Now we're going to end up with some kind of Frankenstein's fucking monster.

Thanks, "leaders".
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You're right, but even that would have pissed off a lot of people, who like me don't have to pay out much out of pocket for routine preventative exams and very rarely actually meet my deductible. I'd have to pay for medicare supplemenets, or face a real danger that me or mine would get something serious.

I'm not sure there was a good answer. In some ways, I think the dems original Obamacare that forced ALL states to expand Medicaid or lose all Medicaid dollars, was the right way to go, but the fine for not having HC should have been low, with more of the funding stream coming from the top 1%. They had 60 and they could have passed it.

Well, Medicare Advantage plans are closer to the PPO/HMO model, with some co-pays and deductibles, but have VERY low monthly premiums, from $0 to around $75. Medicare Supplements have higher premiums but cover pretty much EVERYTHING. And I'd be all for premium support where needed.

Right now we have seven (7) different delivery/payment systems: Group, individual, Medicare, Medicaid, VA, Worker's Comp and indigent care. That's fucking MADNESS. And worse, they don't communicate directly with each other. The inefficiencies are as bad as you'd imagine.

I think the answers are out there, but everyone is too busy screaming at each other.
.

You do realize that Medicare funding comes from payroll tax line item that would explode if everyone had to get covered suddenly?

It is right now 15% of total federal budget, or about 500 billion a year, extending it will at very least double that to 1 Trillion a year.

Democrats will actually go along with that, but for Republicans this will be a total nonstarter and actually a lot closer to single payer than ACA ever will be.

Heath care costs are not linear. Over 80% of the average person's lifetime health care costs are incurred after age 65. Also, these plans are personal and portable, meaning American businesses would be able to take a massive cost & administrative cost monkey off their backs. We might need to drop Medicare co-insurance from 80% to 70% or 75%, we'd have to look at tort reform and reducing defensive medicine, but I'd sure rather start from that point and tweak from there than deal with this mess.

But you're right, the Republicans right now couldn't vote for this if they want to be re-elected, and certainly fundraising and being re-elected are a politician's top priority. But this would be far better than the seven-headed beast of a "system" that we have now.
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repealing healthcare is already meeting opposition ..

GOP senators: Give states the option of keeping ObamaCare

when (and if ) it comes time to vote on repealing the ACA it will only take a few more like-minded Republicans to cross the aisle and vote with the dems to stop Trump dead in his tracks.

It has been weakened so much by the GOP propaganda, that its very weak now.
It like Right to Work, you do not need to join the union, unions loose money and dies.

Expect slave labor soon, why the wealthy like Trump do not pay taxes, so they need the middle class to.

And the middle class who can do factory jobs will just be happy having food, clothes and a roof over their head, while the rich laugh all the way to the hedge funds. Keep the poor happy and paying taxes, we are their food.

Viruses need a host and the working poor are it.

This is not a village and we are not all in this together… That's the way it should be. By the way unions are just like communism fucking government forcing people into shit they don't want to. Unions deserve to die if they want to force people into them...

At some point, some smart people are going to notice that the majority of Americans believe the government has a duty to ensure all Americans are covered.

And, that other countries pay less by achieving that.


But, it's a whole lot of fun dealing with insurane companies that take a percent off the top every time some drug company decides to jack you.

 

[Penelope]

Mandate to get yourself a policy
You have a CHOICE of which policy and whether public or privately

You don't really get the concept of freedom at all, do you?

No I have lots of laws to follow, don't you. For instance we have to pay state, Fed and Local income tax.

Yeah. You probably won't really get why freedom is important until it's gone.

What kind of freedom are you in need of? Robbing a convenience store or bank, speeding , not paying taxes, not having auto insurance, not paying your property tax, being able to shoot everyone you see, able to beat your woman,

I might be able to answer you better if you describe what freedoms your missing.

 

[Penelope]

There is no such thing as Obamacare. It is page after page of fines and regulations sticking it to the hospitals and their patients. We can do much better. In fact we were doing much better before the obstruction.

uh huh, sure.

20 million people are having an insurance company pay for their medical bills now ... before, 20 million people were making taxpayers pay for their medical bills every time they went to a county hospital because they had NO insurance ..

RW logic is fucked up.

You really have no clue do you. The premiums were raised exponentially on the taxpayer and deductibles increased.

And what kind of insurance do you have, if your employer raised your cost share talk to him.

 

[Penelope]

Price is getting confirmed now, he said 20 million people do not have health insurance, DUH his state did not expand Medicaid.