Gunny's Thread on Religion

[Coloradomtnman]

Thank you for a response.

Okay, so on which principles, if any, that you base your morality?

My morality is one of logic and rational reasoning. First, there's Maslow's Heirarchy of Needs: so, human beings need love, so we should love eachother. Killing one another is not loving one another, so don't do it. Hate is bad. And, to a certain extent, karma really does exist. For example, if I treat people poorly and without respect they're probably not going to treat me respectfully or with compassion, and if I feel negatively things will seem darker or less cheerful and bright. Or if I act negatively, there's a chance that my actions will have negative effects which could come back to me in some way. There's the Golden Rule, Kant's Moral Imperative, and, if you've never read anything about it you might get the wrong idea but, Secular Humanism. One can extrapolate morality from the following:

3 Basic Tenets of Human Secularism:
1. Humans have value and can solve human problems.
2. Science, free speech, democracy, rational thought, and freedom in the arts go together.
3. There is nothing supernatural.

And don't forget the Social Contract. As an atheist and an agnostic, life is given no universal meaning and so I must make meaning for it myself: which means that if I act in ways which do not conform to my morality I diminish or even nullify the meaning of my own existence - instead of fearing eternal damnation (which to me is not nearly as much incentive to act morally as immediate meaninglessness and this is not an external motivator but an internal one which is inherently more powerful).

That's a REALLY simplified and brief answer for such a broad subject.

 

[Setarcos]

You cannot be serious. It will never be disproved. "Disproven" is not a word. But that is irrelevant.

Verb: disprove (disproved,disproven) dis'proov

1. Prove to be false
"The physicist disproved his colleagues' theories"
- confute

Derived forms: disproved, disproven, disproves, disproving

See also: disprover

Type of: contradict, negate

Antonym: prove

disprove, disproved, disproven, disproves, disproving- WordWeb dictionary definition

Your reasoning is very flawed. You define something, and say it does not and cannot exist by your definition. That is fallacious. That is why it is impossible for you to apply your so called logic to this subject. That is why your reasoning is flawed.

That is the definition used by followed of the religion. Notice that not one came forth to claim otherwise.

 

[Setarcos]

What does it matter, what kind of rock it is? can he make a rock so large and massive that he cannot move it?

Face it, the Abrahamic deity is self-contradictory and impossible definition. Therefore it cannot and does not exist.

Bullshit. The Abrahamic deity is beyond the comprehension of man.

If it's beyond the comprehension of man, how did anyone comprehend it in order to write about it?

If man took that attitude, we wouldn't have fire, let alone the ability to manipulate atoms

 

[Setarcos]

My morality is one of logic and rational reasoning. First, there's Maslow's Heirarchy of Needs: so, human beings need love, so we should love eachother.

Should? Tio jump form shared desire for love to a prescription t love is logically fallacious.

Killing one another is not loving one another

Nor is it mutually exclusive with love. Your sentence means nothing

so don't do it.

Buy what authority do you give such moral commandments? What makes them valid at all?

Hate is bad.

Bad? By what standard?

One can extrapolate morality from the following:

3 Basic Tenets of Human Secularism:
1. Humans have value and can solve human problems.

Have value to whom

Does this philosophy apply only to those competent and able to"solve human problems"?

3. There is nothing supernatural.

You can prove this?

And don't forget the Social Contract.

Ethics are not equal to morals.

 

[AllieBaba]

What does it matter, what kind of rock it is? can he make a rock so large and massive that he cannot move it?

Face it, the Abrahamic deity is self-contradictory and impossible definition. Therefore it cannot and does not exist.

Bullshit. The Abrahamic deity is beyond the comprehension of man.

If it's beyond the comprehension of man, how did anyone comprehend it in order to write about it?

God helped them.

 

[Setarcos]

And you have evidence to support this claim?


Is god beyond his own comprehension? Is that why, even with his help, they contradict themselves and eachother constantly?

 

[Joe_Penalty]

You cannot be serious. It will never be disproved. "Disproven" is not a word. But that is irrelevant.

Verb: disprove (disproved,disproven) dis'proov

1. Prove to be false
"The physicist disproved his colleagues' theories"
- confute

Derived forms: disproved, disproven, disproves, disproving

See also: disprover

Type of: contradict, negate

Antonym: prove

disprove, disproved, disproven, disproves, disproving- WordWeb dictionary definition

Your reasoning is very flawed. You define something, and say it does not and cannot exist by your definition. That is fallacious. That is why it is impossible for you to apply your so called logic to this subject. That is why your reasoning is flawed.

That is the definition used by followed of the religion. Notice that not one came forth to claim otherwise.

The first part is irrelevant, like I said. But the use of the term disproven makes no sense, because it is the negation of a completed task (lexical semantics). Something can be proven, but can something be disproven? It should be "not proven." (IRRELEVANT)

Not one came forth to claim otherwise makes no difference, you know that.

Wisdom and understanding is very important. Unfortunately everyone does not possess such. The overwhelming majority of people are surface dwellers.

What do you think about my poem analogy?

Have you ever believed in God?

 

[Setarcos]

Are you ever going to attempt to refute or rebut anything I've said, or are you simply going to keep playing childish games?

Your religion was disproven and you have not even attempted to refute the arguments made.

 

[Joe_Penalty]

Thank you for a response.

Okay, so on which principles, if any, that you base your morality?

My morality is one of logic and rational reasoning. First, there's Maslow's Heirarchy of Needs: so, human beings need love, so we should love eachother. Killing one another is not loving one another, so don't do it. Hate is bad. And, to a certain extent, karma really does exist. For example, if I treat people poorly and without respect they're probably not going to treat me respectfully or with compassion, and if I feel negatively things will seem darker or less cheerful and bright. Or if I act negatively, there's a chance that my actions will have negative effects which could come back to me in some way. There's the Golden Rule, Kant's Moral Imperative, and, if you've never read anything about it you might get the wrong idea but, Secular Humanism. One can extrapolate morality from the following:

3 Basic Tenets of Human Secularism:
1. Humans have value and can solve human problems.
2. Science, free speech, democracy, rational thought, and freedom in the arts go together.
3. There is nothing supernatural.

And don't forget the Social Contract. As an atheist and an agnostic, life is given no universal meaning and so I must make meaning for it myself: which means that if I act in ways which do not conform to my morality I diminish or even nullify the meaning of my own existence - instead of fearing eternal damnation (which to me is not nearly as much incentive to act morally as immediate meaninglessness and this is not an external motivator but an internal one which is inherently more powerful).

That's a REALLY simplified and brief answer for such a broad subject.

Thank you.

That sounds divine to me.

From my understanding of the revealed word of God, God is in all his creations. Also, from my understanding, God is love. This is the basis of the ten commandments. It is up to the person (free will) to acknowledge this or not.

You are right, Karma does exist. If you plant an apple seed, then that seed will bring forth an apple tree. If a person is righteous, then their life is peaceful. If a person is wicked, then their life is destructive. A negative action yields a negative return. A positive action yields a positive return. Even thoughts! But I am sure you are already aware of this.

The use of terms like "eternal damnation" are only metaphoric and or allegoric. That is why I say through wisdom and understanding can the truth be revealed.

I take issue with number three on the basic tenets, because I know prophets. That is part of the reason I took issue with many of my colleagues in philosophy.

If you fully understand AND believe number three to be true, then I would like to challenge it. Please provide a premise and or premises for number three.

"There is nothing supernatural."

 

[Joe_Penalty]

Are you ever going to attempt to refute or rebut anything I've said, or are you simply going to keep playing childish games?

Your religion was disproven and you have not even attempted to refute the arguments made.

Oh and thank you for your time.

Childish games?

What about proven to be false? That will sound much better.

Your argument is invalid. Based on your definition of God and your inadequate inferential claim. That is not a good reason to conclude God cannot and does not exist. (Simple)

I believe you are a reasonable arguer, just this argument shows that you lack wisdom and most of all understanding.

Will you answer the question, have you ever believed in God?

By the way, who said what was my religion?

 

[Setarcos]

From my understanding of the revealed word of God, God is in all his creations. Also, from my understanding, God is love.

if A=B, then B=A

If God = Love, then Love= God

Love:

Noun

* S: (n) love (a strong positive emotion of regard and affection) "his love for his work"; "children need a lot of love"
* S: (n) love, passion (any object of warm affection or devotion) "the theater was her first love"; "he has a passion for cock fighting";
* S: (n) beloved, dear, dearest, honey, love (a beloved person; used as terms of endearment)
* S: (n) love, sexual love, erotic love (a deep feeling of sexual desire and attraction) "their love left them indifferent to their surroundings"; "she was his first love"
* S: (n) love (a score of zero in tennis or squash) "it was 40 love"
* S: (n) sexual love, lovemaking, making love, love, love life (sexual activities (often including sexual intercourse) between two people) "his lovemaking disgusted her"; "he hadn't had any love in months"; "he has a very complicated love life"


Therefore,
God:
Noun

* S: (n) love (a strong positive emotion of regard and affection) "his love for his work"; "children need a lot of love"
* S: (n) love, passion (any object of warm affection or devotion) "the theater was her first love"; "he has a passion for cock fighting";
* S: (n) beloved, dear, dearest, honey, love (a beloved person; used as terms of endearment)
* S: (n) love, sexual love, erotic love (a deep feeling of sexual desire and attraction) "their love left them indifferent to their surroundings"; "she was his first love"
* S: (n) love (a score of zero in tennis or squash) "it was 40 love"
* S: (n) sexual love, lovemaking, making love, love, love life (sexual activities (often including sexual intercourse) between two people) "his lovemaking disgusted her"; "he hadn't had any love in months"; "he has a very complicated love life"

So you're saying that feelings of affection inspired men to genocide?

This is the basis of the ten commandments. It is up to the person (free will) to acknowledge this or not.

 

[Setarcos]

Again, it is not my definition. It is the definition forwarded by members of a set of debunked religions.

 

[Joe_Penalty]

From my understanding of the revealed word of God, God is in all his creations. Also, from my understanding, God is love.

if A=B, then B=A

If God = Love, then Love= God

Love:

Noun

* S: (n) love (a strong positive emotion of regard and affection) "his love for his work"; "children need a lot of love"
* S: (n) love, passion (any object of warm affection or devotion) "the theater was her first love"; "he has a passion for cock fighting";
* S: (n) beloved, dear, dearest, honey, love (a beloved person; used as terms of endearment)
* S: (n) love, sexual love, erotic love (a deep feeling of sexual desire and attraction) "their love left them indifferent to their surroundings"; "she was his first love"
* S: (n) love (a score of zero in tennis or squash) "it was 40 love"
* S: (n) sexual love, lovemaking, making love, love, love life (sexual activities (often including sexual intercourse) between two people) "his lovemaking disgusted her"; "he hadn't had any love in months"; "he has a very complicated love life"


Therefore,
God:
Noun

* S: (n) love (a strong positive emotion of regard and affection) "his love for his work"; "children need a lot of love"
* S: (n) love, passion (any object of warm affection or devotion) "the theater was her first love"; "he has a passion for cock fighting";
* S: (n) beloved, dear, dearest, honey, love (a beloved person; used as terms of endearment)
* S: (n) love, sexual love, erotic love (a deep feeling of sexual desire and attraction) "their love left them indifferent to their surroundings"; "she was his first love"
* S: (n) love (a score of zero in tennis or squash) "it was 40 love"
* S: (n) sexual love, lovemaking, making love, love, love life (sexual activities (often including sexual intercourse) between two people) "his lovemaking disgusted her"; "he hadn't had any love in months"; "he has a very complicated love life"

So you're saying that feelings of affection inspired men to genocide?

This is the basis of the ten commandments. It is up to the person (free will) to acknowledge this or not.

If you want to look at it (argument form) that way. Seemingly, you really like to quote other people.

Free will is you can either accept or reject whatever you want to.

You have to know what was before you can know what is. So, why were the people killed?

Have you ever believed in God?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Want to know if there is a God? Serve others with love and care for their needs.

 

[Setarcos]

You have to know what was before you can know what is. So, why were the people killed?

False. Do you know that you are? Do you know all tat was before you were?

Your assertion falls apart.

 

[Joe_Penalty]

You have to know what was before you can know what is. So, why were the people killed?

False. Do you know that you are? Do you know all tat was before you were?

Your assertion falls apart.

That is why I am asking you to tell me why the people were killed?

Have you ever believed in God?

 

[Joe_Penalty]

It is illogical to conclude that a statement is false without asking for premises first.
That is one of the first concepts taught in argument analysis.
You can assess that the conclusion is PROBABLY false, but that is not for certain.
Asking for premises reveals the authors inferential claim and reasons for concluding such.
Assessing without that information, the reader comes across as biased or stupid.
But people already know this, I suppose.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Want to know if there is a God? Serve others with love and care for their needs.

Love this answer.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Have you ever believed in God?

Sorry for the delay.

No, I have never believed in God.

Do you believe in human goodness?

 

[Modbert]

Do you believe in human goodness?

Human goodness has nothing to do with God though. God was one mean motherfucker in the bible. If you fucked with him, he'd smite your ass before you could say what the fuck.