How can there ever be peace here?

[JStone]

What happened 3000 years ago is totally irrelevant. As an example, 3000 years ago, there were no Jews in Florida. Should we boot them all out then?

No Shit Sherlock. Kinda why the Arabs don't have a claim on the land. Thanks for joining my side!

All I'm saying is whomever was wherever in that area should have been allowed to stay, you don't start a country by kicking a whole section of people off the land they owned at the time. Just saying.

IMA DUNCE



Eminent Historian Sir Martin Gilbert, Author of 10 Books on Middle East History

The Arab Invasion of the State of Israel 15 May 1948

On 15 May, 1948 six Arab armies, those of Egypt, Syria, Transjordan, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia and Iraq, invaded Israel. They advanced rapidly, threatening to destroy the one-day old State and drive its citizens into the sea. The Israelis resisted and after ten days were able to counter-attack

Between May 1948 and January 1949, the State of Israel fought to retain its independence against the combined forces of six Arab armies. Following the initial Arab invasion, the Israelis reopened the road to Jerusalem, won control of the Coastal Plain, secured the upper Galilee, and drove the Egyptians from the Negev.

But, the Israelis were themselves driven from the from the Jewish Quarter of the Old City of Jerusalem, whose synagogues were desecrated and whose Jewish houses were destroyed.

During Israel's struggle for independence between November 1947 and January 1949, more than 4,000 Jewish soldiers and 2,000 civilians were killed out of a total Jewish population of only 650,000. The figures for Arab dead were not disclosed by the Arab states.

The UN estimated that over 725,000 Arabs fled between April and December 1948. Many Arabs were encouraged to leave by their own political leaders who promised them that they would soon be able to return to their homes once Israel had been destroyed. But, over 150,000 Arabs either remained in Israel or returned to their homes in Israel during 1949.

In April 1949, at the UN Palestine Conciliation Commission at Lausanne, Israel offered to repatriate 100,000 Arab refugees within the framework of a general settlement. The Arab delegation rejected the offer. In 1950 the United Nations Relief and Works Agency [UNRWA] proposed resettling Arab refugees in Sinai, Jordan and Syria, but the Arab governments also rejected this proposal. In 1952, the UN Refugee Rehabilitation Fund offered the Arab states $200 million to find homes and jobs for the refugees. The Arab states used some of the money for relief work, but did not even apply for the greater part of the fund.

In 1949, some 150,000 Arabs remained in Israel. By 1956, their numbers had increased to 312,000 or 11% of the total populaiton. Less than 5,000 Arabs left Israel during this period. From 1959, Arabs could join the Israeli Trade Union Organization and on 1 December 1966 Israeli Military Government was abolished in all Arab areas. Since 1949, Arabs voted in all Israeli elections and sent their own members to the Israeli Parliament. Since May 1948, both Hebrew and Arabic have been the official languages of the State of Israel and three Arabic language daily newspapers have been in regular production. But throughout this period, the Arabs maintained separate communities and cultural life as did the 30,000 Bedouin who lived in the Negev and around Beersheba.

The majority of the Arabs who remained in Israel after May 19488 lived in the northernmost part ofj the State. Whereas the Arabs who fled from Israel in 1948 were for the most part confined to refugee camps by their fellow Arab hosts and deliberately cut off from the economic development of the States in which they lived, the Arabs of Israel continued to live unmolested in their original homes, gained materially from Israel's own material successes and received direct Israeli aid for irrigation, reclamation, mechanization and social welfare [including education, health and housing]

Palestinian terrorist groups, or fedayeen, began systematic raids into Israel from 1950. Toward the end of 1954, the Egyptian Government supervised the formal establishment of Palestinian terrorist groups in the Gaza strip and northeastern Sinai. Throughout 1955 an increasing number of raids were launched into Israel. From 1951 to 1958, Israeli vehicles were ambushed, farms attacked, fields boobytrapped and roads mined. Fedayeen from Gaza also infiltrated into Jordan and operated from there. Saudi Arabia, Syria and Lebanon each gave the Fedayeen support and refure. Local Jordanian-Palestinian Fedayeen were also active operating from the West Bank.
Amazon.com: Martin Gilbert'sThe Routledge Atlas of Jewish History (Routledge Historical Atlases) [Hardcover](2010): M., (Author) Gilbert: Books

Yale University Press...

Sir Martin Gilbert is the author of more than eighty books, including the six-volume authorized biography of Winston Churchill, the twin histories First World War and Second World War, Israel: A History, The Holocaust, A History of the Twentieth Century in three volumes, and nine pioneering historical atlases, including Atlas of Jewish History and Atlas of the Arab-Israeli Conflict. In 1995, he was knighted for services to British history and international relations, and in 2009 he was appointed to the British Government’s Iraq War Inquiry. He lives in London.

In Ishmael's House - Gilbert, Martin - Yale University Press

 

[MJB12741]

Good point. Tell it to the Arab countries who made their Palestinians refugees from their homelands.

What happened 3000 years ago is totally irrelevant. As an example, 3000 years ago, there were no Jews in Florida. Should we boot them all out then?

No Shit Sherlock. Kinda why the Arabs don't have a claim on the land. Thanks for joining my side!

All I'm saying is whomever was wherever in that area should have been allowed to stay, you don't start a country by kicking a whole section of people off the land they owned at the time. Just saying.

 

[ima]

Good point. Tell it to the Arab countries who made their Palestinians refugees from their homelands.

No Shit Sherlock. Kinda why the Arabs don't have a claim on the land. Thanks for joining my side!

All I'm saying is whomever was wherever in that area should have been allowed to stay, you don't start a country by kicking a whole section of people off the land they owned at the time. Just saying.

So basically your point is that the arabs in gaza were all airlifted there from other arab countries? And none were indigenous to the area?

 

[Lipush]

Good point. Tell it to the Arab countries who made their Palestinians refugees from their homelands.

All I'm saying is whomever was wherever in that area should have been allowed to stay, you don't start a country by kicking a whole section of people off the land they owned at the time. Just saying.

So basically your point is that the arabs in gaza were all airlifted there from other arab countries? And none were indigenous to the area?

Were did all those Arabs who became "Palestinians" came from? Arab countries, of course

 

[ima]

Good point. Tell it to the Arab countries who made their Palestinians refugees from their homelands.

So basically your point is that the arabs in gaza were all airlifted there from other arab countries? And none were indigenous to the area?

Were did all those Arabs who became "Palestinians" came from? Arab countries, of course

So you actually believe that NO arabs were pushed off their land in what is now Israel? NONE?

 

[Hossfly]

So basically your point is that the arabs in gaza were all airlifted there from other arab countries? And none were indigenous to the area?

Were did all those Arabs who became "Palestinians" came from? Arab countries, of course

So you actually believe that NO arabs were pushed off their land in what is now Israel? NONE?

Depends on the nature of the crimes they committed. That has to be taken into account.

 

[ima]

Were did all those Arabs who became "Palestinians" came from? Arab countries, of course

So you actually believe that NO arabs were pushed off their land in what is now Israel? NONE?

Depends on the nature of the crimes they committed. That has to be taken into account.

Ok, so according to you, if you commit a crime you lose your house and land. Hmmm... Is Israel a democracy or a dictatorship?

 

[MJB12741]

HUH??? "Their land"? WHEN did Israel become "their land"?

So basically your point is that the arabs in gaza were all airlifted there from other arab countries? And none were indigenous to the area?

Were did all those Arabs who became "Palestinians" came from? Arab countries, of course

So you actually believe that NO arabs were pushed off their land in what is now Israel? NONE?

 

[ima]

HUH??? "Their land"? WHEN did Israel become "their land"?

Were did all those Arabs who became "Palestinians" came from? Arab countries, of course

So you actually believe that NO arabs were pushed off their land in what is now Israel? NONE?

The people owned house, olive orchards... no? Or are you trying to say that they were all squatters on Jewish land or something like that?

 

[Hossfly]

HUH??? "Their land"? WHEN did Israel become "their land"?

So you actually believe that NO arabs were pushed off their land in what is now Israel? NONE?

The people owned house, olive orchards... no? Or are you trying to say that they were all squatters on Jewish land or something like that?

You betcha they're squatters.

 

[MJB12741]

YES, they are squatters on Israel's land. If you don't believe that please tell us when did Israel's ancient land become this "Palestinian land" that you & your ilk claim Israel is stealing?

HUH??? "Their land"? WHEN did Israel become "their land"?

So you actually believe that NO arabs were pushed off their land in what is now Israel? NONE?

The people owned house, olive orchards... no? Or are you trying to say that they were all squatters on Jewish land or something like that?

 

[ima]

YES, they are squatters on Israel's land. If you don't believe that please tell us when did Israel's ancient land become this "Palestinian land" that you & your ilk claim Israel is stealing?

HUH??? "Their land"? WHEN did Israel become "their land"?

The people owned house, olive orchards... no? Or are you trying to say that they were all squatters on Jewish land or something like that?

So since it's always been Israel's land, maybe you're the guy to see about a map of Israel from 1915.

Also, what was the purpose of dispossessing all these people of their houses and land, to create an ethnically pure country? Dunno, but I seem to remember the Germans already tried that.

 

[JStone]

YES, they are squatters on Israel's land. If you don't believe that please tell us when did Israel's ancient land become this "Palestinian land" that you & your ilk claim Israel is stealing?

The people owned house, olive orchards... no? Or are you trying to say that they were all squatters on Jewish land or something like that?

So since it's always been Israel's land, maybe you're the guy to see about a map of Israel from 1915.

Also, what was the purpose of dispossessing all these people of their houses and land, to create an ethnically pure country? Dunno, but I seem to remember the Germans already tried that.

Go back to egypt and saudi arabia where you worthless sacks of shit came from!

Palesteenian Hamas Minister of the Interior Fathi Hammad, Al-Hekma TV [Egypt]: "Half of the Palestiniains are Egyptians and the other half are Saudis"

Brothers, there are 1.8 million of us in Gaza. Allah be praised, we all have Arab roots and every Palestinian in Gaza and throughout Palestine can prove his Arab roots--whether from Saudi Arabia, from Yemen, or anywhere.

Personally, half my family is Egyptian. We are all like that.

More than 30 families in the Gaza Strip are called Al-Masri [Egyptian]

Brothers, half of the Palestiniains are Egyptians and the other half are Saudis

Who are the Palestinians? we have many families called Al-Masri, whose roots are Egyptian. Egyptian! They may be from Alexandria, from Cairo, from Dumietta, from the North, from aswan, from Upper Egypt. We are Egyptians. we are Arabs. We are Muslims
Hamas Minister of the Interior and of National Security Fathi Hammad Slams Egypt over Fuel Shortage in Gaza Strip, and Says: "Half of the Palestinians Are Egyptians and the Other Half Are Saudis"

Winston Churchill, Secretary of "Palestine" During British Mandate to House of Commons, Parliamentary Debates, 23 May 1939

So far from being persecuted, the Arabs have crowded into the country and multiplied till their population has increased more than even all world Jewry could lift up the Jewish population.
Churchill and the Jews | Martin Gilbert | Macmillan

 

[Wolverine1984]

YES, they are squatters on Israel's land. If you don't believe that please tell us when did Israel's ancient land become this "Palestinian land" that you & your ilk claim Israel is stealing?

The people owned house, olive orchards... no? Or are you trying to say that they were all squatters on Jewish land or something like that?

So since it's always been Israel's land, maybe you're the guy to see about a map of Israel from 1915.

Also, what was the purpose of dispossessing all these people of their houses and land, to create an ethnically pure country? Dunno, but I seem to remember the Germans already tried that.

I don't know if you noticed, but Israel isn't an ethnically "clean" country. About 20% of Israel's population are Arabs.But as always you do not disappoint and clearly don't let the facts confused you.

You're talking about people dispersing and dislocating however the dislocating and discussing was done during a war. Those people who talk about the ones with houses and lands and territories for fighting with a single minded purpose and that purpose was to kill the Jews. Therefore fighting to (in their own words) "drive the Jews into the sea".

I don't know if you understand anything about tactics or warfare, however it seems really basic to me that if you control a territory it would be extremely wise to dislocate the people that want to kill you who currently reside in this territory.

I don't know why you so fixed about them map thing? There is no map of sovereign Israel in 1915. However there is also no map of sovereign Palestine in 1915.
Actually there is no map of sovereign Palestine from anytime in history, this is due the fact that a sovereign Palestine never existed. No amount of maps or lack there of would disprove this fact.

 

[ima]

YES, they are squatters on Israel's land. If you don't believe that please tell us when did Israel's ancient land become this "Palestinian land" that you & your ilk claim Israel is stealing?

So since it's always been Israel's land, maybe you're the guy to see about a map of Israel from 1915.

Also, what was the purpose of dispossessing all these people of their houses and land, to create an ethnically pure country? Dunno, but I seem to remember the Germans already tried that.

I don't know if you noticed, but Israel isn't an ethnically "clean" country. About 20% of Israel's population are Arabs.But as always you do not disappoint and clearly don't let the facts confused you.

You're talking about people dispersing and dislocating however the dislocating and discussing was done during a war. Those people who talk about the ones with houses and lands and territories for fighting with a single minded purpose and that purpose was to kill the Jews. Therefore fighting to (in their own words) "drive the Jews into the sea".

I don't know if you understand anything about tactics or warfare, however it seems really basic to me that if you control a territory it would be extremely wise to dislocate the people that want to kill you who currently reside in this territory.

I don't know why you so fixed about them map thing? There is no map of sovereign Israel in 1915. However there is also no map of sovereign Palestine in 1915.
Actually there is no map of sovereign Palestine from anytime in history, this is due the fact that a sovereign Palestine never existed. No amount of maps or lack there of would disprove this fact.

So basically, what happens in war is war, too bad? Then why are the (mostly) Jews getting all their paintings back that were taken from them during WWII?

As for the map, I never claimed that palestine has existed for 3000 years like some people here claim about Israel.

 

[JStone]

So since it's always been Israel's land, maybe you're the guy to see about a map of Israel from 1915.

Also, what was the purpose of dispossessing all these people of their houses and land, to create an ethnically pure country? Dunno, but I seem to remember the Germans already tried that.

I don't know if you noticed, but Israel isn't an ethnically "clean" country. About 20% of Israel's population are Arabs.But as always you do not disappoint and clearly don't let the facts confused you.

You're talking about people dispersing and dislocating however the dislocating and discussing was done during a war. Those people who talk about the ones with houses and lands and territories for fighting with a single minded purpose and that purpose was to kill the Jews. Therefore fighting to (in their own words) "drive the Jews into the sea".

I don't know if you understand anything about tactics or warfare, however it seems really basic to me that if you control a territory it would be extremely wise to dislocate the people that want to kill you who currently reside in this territory.

I don't know why you so fixed about them map thing? There is no map of sovereign Israel in 1915. However there is also no map of sovereign Palestine in 1915.
Actually there is no map of sovereign Palestine from anytime in history, this is due the fact that a sovereign Palestine never existed. No amount of maps or lack there of would disprove this fact.

So basically, what happens in war is war, too bad? Then why are the (mostly) Jews getting all their paintings back that were taken from them during WWII?

As for the map, I never claimed that palestine has existed for 3000 years like some people here claim about Israel.

You worthless arab sacks of shit must leave Jewish Israel and return to egypt and saudi arabia where you came from.

Palesteenian Hamas Minister of the Interior Fathi Hammad, Al-Hekma TV [Egypt]: "Half of the Palestiniains are Egyptians and the other half are Saudis"

Brothers, there are 1.8 million of us in Gaza. Allah be praised, we all have Arab roots and every Palestinian in Gaza and throughout Palestine can prove his Arab roots--whether from Saudi Arabia, from Yemen, or anywhere.

Personally, half my family is Egyptian. We are all like that.

More than 30 families in the Gaza Strip are called Al-Masri [Egyptian]

Brothers, half of the Palestiniains are Egyptians and the other half are Saudis

Who are the Palestinians? we have many families called Al-Masri, whose roots are Egyptian. Egyptian! They may be from Alexandria, from Cairo, from Dumietta, from the North, from aswan, from Upper Egypt. We are Egyptians. we are Arabs. We are Muslims
Hamas Minister of the Interior and of National Security Fathi Hammad Slams Egypt over Fuel Shortage in Gaza Strip, and Says: "Half of the Palestinians Are Egyptians and the Other Half Are Saudis"

Winston Churchill, Secretary of "Palestine" During British Mandate to House of Commons, Parliamentary Debates, 23 May 1939

So far from being persecuted, the Arabs have crowded into the country and multiplied till their population has increased more than even all world Jewry could lift up the Jewish population.
Churchill and the Jews | Martin Gilbert | Macmillan

 

[Billo_Really]

You worthless arab sacks of shit must leave Jewish Israel and return to egypt and saudi arabia where you came from.

The same thing can be said for zionists.

Not one country on the planet recognizes Israels right to that land and it's been that way for the last 50 years. Think about that. The whole world disagrees with your position, so what does that make you? A lunatic completely detached from reality.

 

[JStone]

You worthless arab sacks of shit must leave Jewish Israel and return to egypt and saudi arabia where you came from.

The same thing can be said for zionists.

Not one country on the planet recognizes Israels right to that land and it's been that way for the last 50 years. Think about that. The whole world disagrees with your position, so what does that make you? A lunatic completely detached from reality.

Jews have prior possession of Israel dating back 3000 years and have never relinquished sovereignty. Moreover, no other indigenous nation except the Jewish nation has ever been established in Israel for 3 millenia.

Basic property law: First in time, first in right.

Your history and law lessons for the day, gratis

 

[Wolverine1984]

You worthless arab sacks of shit must leave Jewish Israel and return to egypt and saudi arabia where you came from.

The same thing can be said for zionists.

Not one country on the planet recognizes Israels right to that land and it's been that way for the last 50 years. Think about that. The whole world disagrees with your position, so what does that make you? A lunatic completely detached from reality.

I would like to see you prove that.
Where do you get your information? And how do you know what all countries in the world have to say about it?

 

[Wolverine1984]

So since it's always been Israel's land, maybe you're the guy to see about a map of Israel from 1915.

Also, what was the purpose of dispossessing all these people of their houses and land, to create an ethnically pure country? Dunno, but I seem to remember the Germans already tried that.

I don't know if you noticed, but Israel isn't an ethnically "clean" country. About 20% of Israel's population are Arabs.But as always you do not disappoint and clearly don't let the facts confused you.

You're talking about people dispersing and dislocating however the dislocating and discussing was done during a war. Those people who talk about the ones with houses and lands and territories for fighting with a single minded purpose and that purpose was to kill the Jews. Therefore fighting to (in their own words) "drive the Jews into the sea".

I don't know if you understand anything about tactics or warfare, however it seems really basic to me that if you control a territory it would be extremely wise to dislocate the people that want to kill you who currently reside in this territory.

I don't know why you so fixed about them map thing? There is no map of sovereign Israel in 1915. However there is also no map of sovereign Palestine in 1915.
Actually there is no map of sovereign Palestine from anytime in history, this is due the fact that a sovereign Palestine never existed. No amount of maps or lack there of would disprove this fact.

So basically, what happens in war is war, too bad? Then why are the (mostly) Jews getting all their paintings back that were taken from them during WWII?

As for the map, I never claimed that palestine has existed for 3000 years like some people here claim about Israel.

No one has claimed that Israel exists for 3000 years continuously. Israel has existed 3000 years ago.

One very clear distinction about the Jews during World War II is that the Jews were not fighting the Germans. The Jews did not try to drive the Germans out.

The Germans and Russians were fighting each other, you think that the Germans got Back the property Russians looted when they conquered Berlin?