How do people survive on minimum wage?

[thereisnospoon]

"I can't see a single thing any of these people are doing that's worth a cent more than they're already getting paid."


A slogan? I'm fine with paying a low wage. Just dont expect people to work hard for it. You get what you pay for. If I am paid $8 an hour, I show up and do the very minimal. No more, no less. Thats what employers should expect.

You should learn the difference between a "slogan" and an observation.

Furthermore, "this is a crappy job, it doesn't pay enough, so it's not worth giving my best effort" is exactly the sort of lazy, shortsighted thinking that gets someone stuck with minimum wage at 45. I abso-fucking-lutely expect anyone who wants to get somewhere in life to have a better attitude and better work ethic, and THAT is not only what employers should expect, it's what they DO expect, and what they reward with continued employment.

If you've ever wondered why you have such a dead-end, shit career and why you're always the first person to be laid off when budget cuts come, look no further than this post. If I were your employer, I don't think it would take me more than a couple of weeks to figure out that my company could dispense with your nearly non-existent "services" and what you apparently consider the "high honor" of your unproductive presence.

You'll struggle to get these lefties to even acknowledge your points.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I am not arguing to pay people more to do less. I am arguing to pay minimum wage earners more to do the work there are currently doing. Someone who works at McDonalds is working hard, probably harder than yourself, at a job that most people would not wish to do. They do so because they lack skills, but it is still honorable work. Think about that next time you order a big mac.

You truly don't understand economics or business. Those people are getting paid exactly what they are worth. If they weren't, they wouldn't work that job. Why do you think a CEO doesn't get paid minimum wage? Because they won't do that job for that price. Why do you think engineers don't get paid minimum wage? Because they won't do that job for that price. The owners/board realize they have to pay a CEO six or seven figures - it's not that they want to pay that much.

The market will bear exactly what you are worth. It truly is that simple, and anyone who thinks otherwise doesn't have a clue.

Such a retarded mentality that absolutely overlooks many variables regarding why an employer pays what they do.

The way conservatives want it, is that American workers become price competitive with countries like china. Smash that minimum wage and let people earn what they are worth. 32 cents an hour.

The belief(that you have and trumpet) that CEO's have developed a worth which has exponentially grown over the years, is bullshit.

WHich variables might those be? Try specifics.
Now, answer the question..
Or is the question out of bounds?
Go ahead.
If you flame, the board will know you have no rebuttal save to lash out.
You see, you've set a trap for yourself.
If you react irrationally ,you lose the argument and you are finished.
In order to have any credibility, you must present a strong argument using facts, to support your claims.
Have at it.
Oh, do not post links to blogs or opinion pieces.
BTW you made one correct statement. "Earn what they are worth".

 

[Mac1958]

Furthermore, "this is a crappy job, it doesn't pay enough, so it's not worth giving my best effort" is exactly the sort of lazy, shortsighted thinking that gets someone stuck with minimum wage at 45. I abso-fucking-lutely expect anyone who wants to get somewhere in life to have a better attitude and better work ethic, and THAT is not only what employers should expect, it's what they DO expect, and what they reward with continued employment.

Bingo. Precisely.

Perhaps this should be taught in our schools instead of the current "you get a trophy just for showing up" bullshit.

.

 

[P@triot]

Such a retarded mentality that absolutely overlooks many variables regarding why an employer pays what they do.

The way conservatives want it, is that American workers become price competitive with countries like china. Smash that minimum wage and let people earn what they are worth. 32 cents an hour.

The belief(that you have and trumpet) that CEO's have developed a worth which has exponentially grown over the years, is bullshit.

Like I said, anyone who thinks otherwise doesn't have a clue. In your completely clueless rant that added no value at all, you failed to mention how those CEO's manage to obtain the salaries they have if it's not due to their worth on the open market? Do they grab a member of the board and hold him hostage? To they kidnap the owners children and hold them ransom? Do they have a global conspiracy which includes leaders of all nations?

Thank you for placing the envious, hateful, and most of all - ignorant - liberal ideology on full display for the world to see.

By the way - I'm a die hard conservative to my core, and I 100% support minimum wage (I don't support how it is handled by idiot liberals, but I do support it) and I'm 100% dead set against allowing jobs over seas that pay less than the minimum wage because it circumvents existing laws which is wrong (like Obamacare circumventing the Constitution). I support minimum wage because of the free market proven concept of supply & demand. So that pretty much blows your theory. See, the problem is, liberals are radicals. They are incapable of looking at an issues objectively and accepting where free market principles apply and where (on the rare occassion) they don't & require some level of intervention.

 

[P@triot]

A low-skilled worker is low-paid because there are so many people who can do the simple tasks that the low-skilled worker does

Honestly in my experience most low wage workers are low wage because they don't care. They don't care about their employer, their customers or themselves. They make the same stupid mistakes over and over and over. It's very frustrating. And paying them more does not make them care more. They are their own worst enemies.

People are poor because they SUCK at life. It's just a fact. Some get hooked on drugs (because they were too stupid to stay away - they SUCK at life). Some lie, cheat, and steal (they SUCK at life). But most of them are just flat out lazy. I've known those that have dropped out of high school, and one of them cries to this day that he wanted to go to college but "never had the chance" Sorry, not only is education through high school FREE, it's freaking mandatory. But liberals would rather skip classes, party like rock stars, drop out of school to get high, and then demand that others owe them a high standard of living.

People are living of off welfare or earning minimum wage for life because they can't get out of their own way. They don't make the right decisions and most importantly, they make no effort at all to better themselves.

 

[Mac1958]

.

As shocking as it may be for some, you don't get to keep your job just because you got it in the first place. You don't get raises just for showing up. You don't get promoted for just doing the minimum.

Well, not unless you're in a union, but that's for a different thread.


.

 

[P@triot]

.

As shocking as it may be for some, you don't get to keep your job just because you got it in the first place. You don't get raises just for showing up. You don't get promoted for just doing the minimum.

Well, not unless you're in a union, but that's for a different thread.

As we all know, if there is one thing a liberal is adverse to - it's giving an effort. Well, unless of course it's raping their own liberal women at Occupy Wall Street protests. Then suddenly they are willing to struggle to the end...

 

[P@triot]

Such a retarded mentality that absolutely overlooks many variables regarding why an employer pays what they do.

The way conservatives want it, is that American workers become price competitive with countries like china. Smash that minimum wage and let people earn what they are worth. 32 cents an hour.

The belief(that you have and trumpet) that CEO's have developed a worth which has exponentially grown over the years, is bullshit.

By the way - there is a very simple solution for every single last minimum wage worker out there who feels they are not getting paid what they are worth. They can quit their job, start their own business, and ride off into the sunset as billionaires (but that would require effort, now wouldn't it - so much easier to take the liberal path of mooching of off others and constantly demanding more and more from them).

And I'll save you from embarassing yourself with the tired excuse of money - Seve Jobs started Apple out of his garage with $0 and he died a billionaire entrepreneur. He did not go to college (save for a semester or two over the span of several years) and he was of average intelligence. What he was however, was extremely driven. He would work 18 hour days most of the time. You're all out of excuses lazy liberals.

 

[thanatos144]

This thread has turned in to a ignorant against more ignorant.....In today's economy more and more people are working low wages cause thats what is out there all of you can thank Obama for this....Let me tell you guys something the moment I find a better job I am taking it but right now I work the Job I have. Thats what real men do. They work any job to feed their kids. They dont ask for handout from the government enslaving them and their kids. THAT DOES NOT MEAN WE ALL SUCK AT LIFE. You can take that ignorant bigotry and shove straight up your ignorant ass.

I dont need governments help but I sure as hell refuse to be disrespected by a bunch or assholes who mistakenly think that's what conservative means! All of you conservatives looking down on hard working men and women who make low wage should be ashamed of yourselves. They are at least working! Look down at the welfare queens all you want cause scum is scum but because someone has to flip burgers or scrub toilets to feed their family does not mean they are lazy or stupid.....You want to see true leeches on society?

That's the true leeches and those idiots went to college.

 

[Mac1958]

This thread has turned in to a ignorant against more ignorant.....In today's economy more and more people are working low wages cause thats what is out there all of you can thank Obama for this....Let me tell you guys something the moment I find a better job I am taking it but right now I work the Job I have. Thats what real men do. They work any job to feed their kids. They dont ask for handout from the government enslaving them and their kids. THAT DOES NOT MEAN WE ALL SUCK AT LIFE. You can take that ignorant bigotry and shove straight up your ignorant ass.

I dont need governments help but I sure as hell refuse to be disrespected by a bunch or assholes who mistakenly think that's what conservative means! All of you conservatives looking down on hard working men and women who make low wage should be ashamed of yourselves. They are at least working! Look down at the welfare queens all you want cause scum is scum but because someone has to flip burgers or scrub toilets to feed their family does not mean they are lazy or stupid.....

You're clearly missing the point.

There are people working low-wage jobs because they have to, and they're going to do everything they can to improve their situation. They will see to it that their situation is temporary. Then there are people who are working low-wage jobs because they're not willing to do what it takes to improve their situation, people who expect raises and promotions just for showing up.

Apples & oranges.

.

 

[Foxfyre]

I agree that looking down on those working for minimum wage is wrong headed. I certainly have taken my share of minimum wage jobs and I think I should be applauded for doing so, and not diminished or demeaned in any way.

There is also nothing wrong with those who CHOOSE to stay in minimum wage jobs because they just enjoy the work or they really don't want any more pressure or complications in their lives. I've done that too.

The ones, however, who complain about minimum wage while admitting they resent it so much they don't put out any more effort than they absolutely have to in order to keep from being fired, SHOULD be sneered at. Such people are complaining about the very situation they put themselves in and are doing their damndest to be sure nothing is ever better for them.

The person working a minimum wage job who shows up for work on time, properly attired with good personal hygiene, and who does their crappy job as well as it can be done and also demonstrates a positive attitude, a pleasant demeanor, and an eagerness to impress and to learn, is not likely to stay in a minimum wage for long. He or she will be given raises or be moved into a better paying position, or will have opportunity to go to a different company when something better comes open. He or she will likely get the new job because he or she will likely receive excellent references from his former employer.

People increase their opportunities and better their circumstances not by just being born, but by making themselves valuable where they are.

A mentality that the world owes us something just because we live, or looking to government or some other benefactor to give us something jjust because we live is what has gotten us into most of the messes we are in. Realizing that our labor, our skills, our abilities, our talents, our work ethic, our creativity, our instincts, and our experience are all valuable commodities to sell is how the free market works.

And in a free country, it is the tried and true way for the lowliest among us to be able to prosper greatly. And somewhere in there are likely to be some work performed at minimum wage.

 

[barry1960]

Such a retarded mentality that absolutely overlooks many variables regarding why an employer pays what they do.

The way conservatives want it, is that American workers become price competitive with countries like china. Smash that minimum wage and let people earn what they are worth. 32 cents an hour.

The belief(that you have and trumpet) that CEO's have developed a worth which has exponentially grown over the years, is bullshit.

By the way - there is a very simple solution for every single last minimum wage worker out there who feels they are not getting paid what they are worth. They can quit their job, start their own business, and ride off into the sunset as billionaires (but that would require effort, now wouldn't it - so much easier to take the liberal path of mooching of off others and constantly demanding more and more from them).

And I'll save you from embarassing yourself with the tired excuse of money - Seve Jobs started Apple out of his garage with $0 and he died a billionaire entrepreneur. He did not go to college (save for a semester or two over the span of several years) and he was of average intelligence. What he was however, was extremely driven. He would work 18 hour days most of the time. You're all out of excuses lazy liberals.

A simple solution is to quit a minimum wage job and start their own business? Do you really think a minimum wage earner would have start up captal?

BTW not everyone is Steve Jobs or would have his opportunity.Then again, you really don't know what your talking about do you? Characterizing all liberals as lazy is an over-generalization, made by someone who is lazy in their thinking.

 

[Foxfyre]

Such a retarded mentality that absolutely overlooks many variables regarding why an employer pays what they do.

The way conservatives want it, is that American workers become price competitive with countries like china. Smash that minimum wage and let people earn what they are worth. 32 cents an hour.

The belief(that you have and trumpet) that CEO's have developed a worth which has exponentially grown over the years, is bullshit.

By the way - there is a very simple solution for every single last minimum wage worker out there who feels they are not getting paid what they are worth. They can quit their job, start their own business, and ride off into the sunset as billionaires (but that would require effort, now wouldn't it - so much easier to take the liberal path of mooching of off others and constantly demanding more and more from them).

And I'll save you from embarassing yourself with the tired excuse of money - Seve Jobs started Apple out of his garage with $0 and he died a billionaire entrepreneur. He did not go to college (save for a semester or two over the span of several years) and he was of average intelligence. What he was however, was extremely driven. He would work 18 hour days most of the time. You're all out of excuses lazy liberals.

A simple solution is to quit a minimum wage job and start their own business? Do you really think a minimum wage earner would have start up captal?

BTW not everyone is Steve Jobs or would have his opportunity.Then again, you really don't know what your talking about do you? Characterizing all liberals as lazy is an over-generalization, made by someone who is lazy in their thinking.

Starting your own business and laziness are two separate topics, but for sure self employment is not for the lazy or the clueless. But yes, many many businesses have been started by people with very little in capital. Just yesterday I was visiting with a young woman who had just opened her first commercial location to sell cupcakes. She started out teaching herself how to flavor and decorate custom cupcakes in her own kitchen in her spare time. She gradually gained a reputation by making these for friends and relatives and then getting paid for some special orders until she had developed a booming business that she could do and still be a full time mom and housewife. Now that her kids are teenager and more independent, she is ready to go full time commercial.

It can be done with anybody with the ability to see and fill a need and the courage to take the risk.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Such a retarded mentality that absolutely overlooks many variables regarding why an employer pays what they do.

The way conservatives want it, is that American workers become price competitive with countries like china. Smash that minimum wage and let people earn what they are worth. 32 cents an hour.

The belief(that you have and trumpet) that CEO's have developed a worth which has exponentially grown over the years, is bullshit.

By the way - there is a very simple solution for every single last minimum wage worker out there who feels they are not getting paid what they are worth. They can quit their job, start their own business, and ride off into the sunset as billionaires (but that would require effort, now wouldn't it - so much easier to take the liberal path of mooching of off others and constantly demanding more and more from them).

And I'll save you from embarassing yourself with the tired excuse of money - Seve Jobs started Apple out of his garage with $0 and he died a billionaire entrepreneur. He did not go to college (save for a semester or two over the span of several years) and he was of average intelligence. What he was however, was extremely driven. He would work 18 hour days most of the time. You're all out of excuses lazy liberals.

A simple solution is to quit a minimum wage job and start their own business? Do you really think a minimum wage earner would have start up captal?

BTW not everyone is Steve Jobs or would have his opportunity.Then again, you really don't know what your talking about do you? Characterizing all liberals as lazy is an over-generalization, made by someone who is lazy in their thinking.

Steve Jobs had talent and balls. He used that talent and chutzpa to develop a multi-billion dollar business.
Many businesses successful or otherwise were started by people with very little capital. They were financed based on their ideas, desire and potential.
There are NO excuses. Only those with a defeatist attitude will never have the chance to succeed because they do not want to try.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Most minimum wage jobs fall into one of two categories:

1. An entry level wage that pays a person to train and learn how to be productive so that they are able to produce a profit for the employer, or. . . .

2. A wage to do simple tasks that anybody can do with no training or education at all. (Construction clean up crews fall into this category for instance. The carpenters or painters or electricians or plumbers could do such tasks and do if they have no 'helpers', but the master craftsmen can be more productive if they don't have to also do the work that anybody with no skills or education can do.)

Make the wage too high to afford to train people, and businesses become much more reluctant to hire unskilled people and train them so more people are locked out of the job market. Make the wage too high and the low end jobs for unskilled construction workers go away for the most part.

Yes, and if you get someone who is reliable and works hard at either they don't make minimum wage for long. Trust me, when someone even starts out looking like a keeper we start raising their wages to make them happy right away. Which is another reason that most minimum wagers suck, the ones who stay there for more than a brief time are only the ones who suck.

Isn't it funny how the Democrats, the party of diversity, think that every worker is identical? None are better or worse than the others it's just which ones get lucky or unlucky getting a good employer or a greedy one?

Frankly, any worker who goes to their job just caring will figure out a way to make more than minimum wage very quickly.

Absolutely. When the minimum wage employee isn't producing at least the minimum wage plus a reasonable profit for me within a reasonable amount of time, I suggest that employee will be happier working someplace else. But the minimum wage employee who learns the job and does it well plus gives some extra effort to make himself or herself even more valuable, that person isn't going to stay at minimum wage. I'm going to pay as much as it takes to keep him/her very happy to stay with me, provided he or she is earning that wage plus a reasonable profit for me.

Not to mention you're going to give him more responsibilities, because he's proven that you CAN give him more, which is also going to increase his value to your business and merit more pay for him.

In McDonald's terms, that MW cashier just became shift leader, and is supervising all of the slacker MW cashiers who started with him, but didn't think the pay merited more than a half-assed effort.

 

[Cecilie1200]

"I can't see a single thing any of these people are doing that's worth a cent more than they're already getting paid."


A slogan? I'm fine with paying a low wage. Just dont expect people to work hard for it. You get what you pay for. If I am paid $8 an hour, I show up and do the very minimal. No more, no less. Thats what employers should expect.

You should learn the difference between a "slogan" and an observation.

Furthermore, "this is a crappy job, it doesn't pay enough, so it's not worth giving my best effort" is exactly the sort of lazy, shortsighted thinking that gets someone stuck with minimum wage at 45. I abso-fucking-lutely expect anyone who wants to get somewhere in life to have a better attitude and better work ethic, and THAT is not only what employers should expect, it's what they DO expect, and what they reward with continued employment.

If you've ever wondered why you have such a dead-end, shit career and why you're always the first person to be laid off when budget cuts come, look no further than this post. If I were your employer, I don't think it would take me more than a couple of weeks to figure out that my company could dispense with your nearly non-existent "services" and what you apparently consider the "high honor" of your unproductive presence.

You'll struggle to get these lefties to even acknowledge your points.

Not really trying to get them to acknowledge anything. That would smack of trying to teach them, which in turn brings to mind the phrase "pearls before swine". I operate more along the lines of bludgeoning them with facts until they run away, whimpering. If they choose to learn something, they're welcome to it, but I'm not going to fash myself trying to make them learn.

 

[jack113]

Yes, and if you get someone who is reliable and works hard at either they don't make minimum wage for long. Trust me, when someone even starts out looking like a keeper we start raising their wages to make them happy right away. Which is another reason that most minimum wagers suck, the ones who stay there for more than a brief time are only the ones who suck.

Isn't it funny how the Democrats, the party of diversity, think that every worker is identical? None are better or worse than the others it's just which ones get lucky or unlucky getting a good employer or a greedy one?

Frankly, any worker who goes to their job just caring will figure out a way to make more than minimum wage very quickly.

Absolutely. When the minimum wage employee isn't producing at least the minimum wage plus a reasonable profit for me within a reasonable amount of time, I suggest that employee will be happier working someplace else. But the minimum wage employee who learns the job and does it well plus gives some extra effort to make himself or herself even more valuable, that person isn't going to stay at minimum wage. I'm going to pay as much as it takes to keep him/her very happy to stay with me, provided he or she is earning that wage plus a reasonable profit for me.

Not to mention you're going to give him more responsibilities, because he's proven that you CAN give him more, which is also going to increase his value to your business and merit more pay for him.

In McDonald's terms, that MW cashier just became shift leader, and is supervising all of the slacker MW cashiers who started with him, but didn't think the pay merited more than a half-assed effort.

Minimum wage is not capable of supporting a family or even a single person without the safety nets that cost us so much money. The only solution is to stop supporting fascism and get back to supporting the public that owns the country.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Absolutely. When the minimum wage employee isn't producing at least the minimum wage plus a reasonable profit for me within a reasonable amount of time, I suggest that employee will be happier working someplace else. But the minimum wage employee who learns the job and does it well plus gives some extra effort to make himself or herself even more valuable, that person isn't going to stay at minimum wage. I'm going to pay as much as it takes to keep him/her very happy to stay with me, provided he or she is earning that wage plus a reasonable profit for me.

Not to mention you're going to give him more responsibilities, because he's proven that you CAN give him more, which is also going to increase his value to your business and merit more pay for him.

In McDonald's terms, that MW cashier just became shift leader, and is supervising all of the slacker MW cashiers who started with him, but didn't think the pay merited more than a half-assed effort.

Minimum wage is not capable of supporting a family or even a single person without the safety nets that cost us so much money. The only solution is to stop supporting fascism and get back to supporting the public that owns the country.

Would you mind telling us what the hell this vague bullshit is supposed to even MEAN? "Fascism"? "Supporting the public"? Specify, please.

By the way, OF COURSE minimum wage is not capable of supporting a family, or even a single independent person. Who the hell ever told you it was SUPPOSED to?

 

[thereisnospoon]

Absolutely. When the minimum wage employee isn't producing at least the minimum wage plus a reasonable profit for me within a reasonable amount of time, I suggest that employee will be happier working someplace else. But the minimum wage employee who learns the job and does it well plus gives some extra effort to make himself or herself even more valuable, that person isn't going to stay at minimum wage. I'm going to pay as much as it takes to keep him/her very happy to stay with me, provided he or she is earning that wage plus a reasonable profit for me.

Not to mention you're going to give him more responsibilities, because he's proven that you CAN give him more, which is also going to increase his value to your business and merit more pay for him.

In McDonald's terms, that MW cashier just became shift leader, and is supervising all of the slacker MW cashiers who started with him, but didn't think the pay merited more than a half-assed effort.

Minimum wage is not capable of supporting a family or even a single person without the safety nets that cost us so much money. The only solution is to stop supporting fascism and get back to supporting the public that owns the country.

Minimum wage is NOT supposed to do any of those things.
Holy shit. The density of some people is magnificent!

 

[Barb]