How the Republican Government shutdown works

[Dad2three]

No one is clueless on that period of time. Bush was in charge, and was the commander-in-chief. The economy tanked and Iraq turned from a quagmire into a fiasco.

What does Iraq have to do with the economy? Are you agreeing with the other idiot who seems to think that Bush didn't pass TARP? Because if you are...then you are indeed CLUELESS!!!!!

What did Iraq's invasion and occupation have to do with the economy? You are kidding, aren't you? If not, please refrain from calling anyone clueless.

Are you making the claim that our invasion of Iraq caused the financial collapse? Because if you are...that's one of the more absurd statements I've ever seen on here, Wry!

Nope, pretty sure Wry understands Dubya cheering on the Banksters bubble AS Dubya gutted the FBI after warnings about creating a larger EPIDEMIC than Ronnie's S&L crisis was the cause. You know the GOP's "USUAL" , let markets hose US philosophy!

Bush was one of the few people in Washington warning about the real estate bubble being something we needed to worry about. If you'll recall...when he cautioned Congress about it...people like Todd and Frank pooh poohed his concern telling everyone that things were just fine the way that they were!

Fannie Mae responding to Bush’s aggressive push by committing $700 billion for low income and minority loans, a 66 percent increase in its previous pledge made in 2000.




The Administration and Republican Congress also passed the “American Dream Downpayment Act of 2003” to allow low income and minorities with blemished credit and no ability to come up with a downpayment to have the government cover their downpayment and closing costs. The Act gave 161.5 million dollars in taxpayer money to cover the downpayment and closing costs of minorities and low income individuals that would not be able to afford a downpayment and/or had “blemished credit.”

On December 16, 2003, President Bush signed into law the American Dream Downpayment Act of 2003, which will help approximately 40,000 families a year with their down payment and closing costs, and further strengthen America’s housing market. This legislation complements the President’s aggressive housing agenda announced in 2002 to dismantle the barriers to homeownership.

(From White House Press Release “American Dream Downpayment Act of 2003 – Expanding Homeownership Opportunities for All).

Bush also pushed and passed a “Zero-down Payment” initiative.


BUSH ADMINISTRATION ANNOUNCES NEW HUD “ZERO DOWN PAYMENT” MORTGAGE Initiative Aimed at Removing Major Barrier to Homeownership

LAS VEGAS – As part of President Bush’s ongoing effort to help American families achieve the dream of homeownership, Federal Housing Commissioner John C. Weicher today announced that HUD is proposing to offer a “zero down payment” mortgage, the most significant initiative by the Federal Housing Administration in over a decade. This action would help remove the greatest barrier facing first-time homebuyers – the lack of funds for a down payment on a mortgage.
Speaking at the National Association of Home Builders’ annual convention, Commissioner Weicher indicated that the proposal, part of HUD’s Fiscal Year 2005 budget request, would eliminate the statutory requirement of a minimum three percent down payment for FHA-insured single-family mortgages for first-time homebuyers.

“Offering FHA mortgages with no down payment will unlock the door to homeownership for hundreds of thousands of American families, particularly minorities,” said HUD’s Acting Secretary Alphonso Jackson. “President Bush has pledged to create 5.5 million new minority homeowners this decade, and this historic initiative will help meet this goal.”


Preliminary projections indicate that the new FHA mortgage product would generate about 150,000 homebuyers in the first year alone.
“This initiative would not only address a major hurdle to homeownership and allow many renters to afford their own home, it would help these families build wealth and become true stakeholders in their communities,” said Commissioner Weicher. “In addition, it would help spur the production of new housing in this country.”

The Administration, through HUD, further forced Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to offer riskier 3, 5, and 7 year arm loan products to low income and minorities.

BUSH ADMINISTRATION ANNOUNCES NEW ADJUSTABLE-RATE MORTGAGE PRODUCTS TO ENHANCE HOMEBUYING OPPORTUNITIES

40,000 More Families Expected To Benefit From New Offerings

WASHINGTON – The Department of Housing and Urban Development is proposing to enhance homebuying opportunities by expanding its offerings of adjustable-rate mortgage (ARM) products on FHA-insured mortgages. Potential homebuyers would be able to choose mortgages with periods of three, five, seven or ten years, depending on their needs, during which time the interest rate would be fixed. “By offering additional types of FHA-insured ARMs tailored to the financial conditions and desires of the borrowers, we are creating more homeownership opportunities,” said HUD Secretary Mel Martinez today in a speech to America’s Community Bankers. “We estimate that as many as 40,000 families a year will choose these new adjustable-rate mortgages as their way of financing their home purchase.”

(HUD Press Release).

Bush and the Republican Congress forced Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to make zero-down loans and adjustable rate 3, 5, and 7 year arms available to the riskiest buyers. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were forced to effectively finance 103 percent of the mortgage (including closing costs).

The Administration often pointed to the huge increase in housing as one of its greatest successes.

[The Administration has] Helped Americans buy homes, expanding the homeownership rate to nearly 70 percent and the minority homeownership rate to over 51 percent nationwide. With approximately three million minorities owning a home for the first time, the Nation now has the highest minority homeownership rate in its history. Furthermore, the Administration is ahead of schedule in achieving the Presidential goal of adding 5.5 million new minority homeowners by 2010.

(From Bush Administration’s press release entitled “Expanding Home Ownership” under section entitled “Accomplishments”).



lol

 

[Dad2three]

Uhhhh, after the last government shutdown, the Republicans regained control of Congress and increased their control of state legislatures and governors' mansions in a historic landslide. So I guess shutting down the government and forcing Obama to agree to a semblance of fiscal sanity didn't hurt them too badly, hey?

Do you guys just live on Mars or something? Do you not read/view any rational, accurate news sources?

Simple explanations are for the simple people. Tell a lie often enough and simple people believe it to be true.

As a good liberal I'm always willing to educate those who confuse cause and effect:

Questionable Cause

How exactly does declaring "Questionable Cause" make what Mike posted a lie? Because you say that it is? Why do you think that the GOP accomplished a historic victory in 2010? What's your complex explanation of that? Barack Obama summed it up by saying "We got shellacked!" What would you like to add to that?

Stupid red staters voting against their own best interests, GOP gerrymandering and then recognize Dems received 20+ million more votes as minority in the Senate?

Oh, so the GOP crushed the Democrats in 2010 because voters were "stupid" in Red States? That's your complex explanation of why the Democrats suffered historic defeats both on the national level and locally in those midterms?

Don't understand gerrymandering is a state thing huh dummy? lol

But YES, the people ARE stupid in red states, I don't think there is much argument about that is there?

 

[Oldstyle]

You really ARE claiming that the Bush Administration approved Solyndra and didn't shelve it...aren't you? Wow...that's amazing. I mean really amazing! You're either terminally stupid...or shamelessly dishonest.

STICK With BS and ignore credible links Bubba, it's ALL you EVER have, opinions based on BS

Weekly Standard: Solyndra Debacle? Blame Bush

'By the time the Obama administration took office in late January 2009, the loan programs' staff had already established a goal of, and timeline for, issuing the company a conditional loan guarantee commitment in March 2009,' said Jonathan Silver, who heads the Energy loan program.


Weekly Standard: Solyndra Debacle? Blame Bush


May 2005: Just as a global silicon shortage begins driving up prices of solar photovoltaics [PV], Solyndra is founded to provide a cost-competitive alternative to silicon-based panels.

July 2005: The Bush Administration signs the Energy Policy Act of 2005 into law, creating the 1703 loan guarantee program.

February 2006 – October 2006: In February, Solyndra raises its first round of venture financing worth $10.6 million from CMEA Capital, Redpoint Ventures, and U.S. Venture Partners. In October, Argonaut Venture Capital, an investment arm of George Kaiser, invests $17 million into Solyndra. Madrone Capital Partners, an investment arm of the Walton family, invests $7 million. Those investments are part of a $78.2 million fund.

December 2006: Solyndra Applies for a Loan Guarantee under the 1703 program.

Late 2007: Loan guarantee program is funded. Solyndra was one of 16 clean-tech companies deemed ready to move forward in the due diligence process. The Bush Administration DOE moves forward to develop a conditional commitment.

October 2008: Then Solyndra CEO Chris Gronet touted reasons for building in Silicon Valley and noted that the “company’s second factory also will be built in Fremont, since a Department of Energy loan guarantee mandates a U.S. location.”

November 2008: Silicon prices remain very high on the spot market, making non-silicon based thin film technologies like Solyndra’s very attractive to investors. Solyndra also benefits from having very low installation costs. The company raises $144 million from ten different venture investors, including the Walton-family run Madrone Capital Partners. This brings total private investment to more than $450 million to date.

January 2009: In an effort to show it has done something to support renewable energy, the Bush Administration tries to take Solyndra before a DOE credit review committee before President Obama is inaugurated. The committee, consisting of career civil servants with financial expertise, remands the loan back to DOE “without prejudice” because it wasn’t ready for conditional commitment.

March 2009: The same credit committee approves the strengthened loan application. The deal passes on to DOE’s credit review board. Career staff (not political appointees) within the DOE issue a conditional commitment setting out terms for a guarantee.

June 2009: As more silicon production facilities come online while demand for PV wavers due to the economic slowdown, silicon prices start to drop. Meanwhile, the Chinese begin rapidly scaling domestic manufacturing and set a path toward dramatic, unforeseen cost reductions in PV. Between June of 2009 and August of 2011, PV prices drop more than 50%.

September 2009: Solyndra raises an additional $219 million. Shortly after, the DOE closes a $535 million loan guarantee after six months of due diligence. This is the first loan guarantee issued under the 1705 program. From application to closing, the process took three years – not the 41 days that is sometimes reported. OMB did raise some concerns in August not about the loan itself but how the loan should be “scored.” OMB testified Wednesday that they were comfortable with the final scoring.

January – June 2010: As the price of conventional silicon-based PV continues to fall due to low silicon prices and a glut of solar modules, investors and analysts start questioning Solyndra’s ability to compete in the marketplace. Despite pulling its IPO (as dozens of companies did in 2010), Solyndra raises an additional $175 million from investors.

November 2010: Solyndra closes an older manufacturing facility and concentrates operations at Fab 2, the plant funded by the $535 million loan guarantee. The Fab 2 plant is completed that same month — on time and on budget — employing around 3,000 construction workers during the build-out, just as the DOE projected.

February 2011: Due to a liquidity crisis, investors provide $75 million to help restructure the loan guarantee. The DOE rightly assumed it was better to give Solyndra a fighting chance rather than liquidate the company – which was a going concern – for market value, which would have guaranteed significant losses.

March 2011: Republican Representatives complain that DOE funds are not being spent quickly enough.

Exclusive Timeline: Bush Administration Advanced Solyndra Loan Guarantee for Two Years, Media Blow the Story

"Republicans pushed back hard against this version of events, unearthing internal Energy Department emails that indicate the panel evaluating the loans had made the unanimous decision to shelve Solyndra's application two weeks before Obama took office." If the first consideration of Solyndra came during the presidency of George W. Bush, that means that the application for the loan guarantee came after the Energy Policy Act of 2005 was passed. Clearly, this type of loan guarantee program was not a Bush Depratment of Energy (DOE) priority. The fact that Solyndra submitted a loan application does not mean the Bush White House or DOE approved the program or did more than accept the application and shuffle the paperwork a bit. And the DOE emails mentioned above appear to confirm that is all that happened."

That's from the article that you cited you idiot! I know that liberals like you would like to MAKE Solyndra a Bush thing but it's not! The Bush Administration shelved Solyndra's application for a loan because they correctly determined that the numbers didn't work! The Obama Administration decided that they did. Gee, think all those contributions to the Obama election campaign paid off?

 

[Oldstyle]

Uhhhh, after the last government shutdown, the Republicans regained control of Congress and increased their control of state legislatures and governors' mansions in a historic landslide. So I guess shutting down the government and forcing Obama to agree to a semblance of fiscal sanity didn't hurt them too badly, hey?

Do you guys just live on Mars or something? Do you not read/view any rational, accurate news sources?

Simple explanations are for the simple people. Tell a lie often enough and simple people believe it to be true.

As a good liberal I'm always willing to educate those who confuse cause and effect:

Questionable Cause

How exactly does declaring "Questionable Cause" make what Mike posted a lie? Because you say that it is? Why do you think that the GOP accomplished a historic victory in 2010? What's your complex explanation of that? Barack Obama summed it up by saying "We got shellacked!" What would you like to add to that?

Stupid red staters voting against their own best interests, GOP gerrymandering and then recognize Dems received 20+ million more votes as minority in the Senate?

Oh, so the GOP crushed the Democrats in 2010 because voters were "stupid" in Red States? That's your complex explanation of why the Democrats suffered historic defeats both on the national level and locally in those midterms?

Don't understand gerrymandering is a state thing huh dummy? lol

But YES, the people ARE stupid in red states, I don't think there is much argument about that is there?

You can't Gerrymander until you CONTROL the State! Duh?

 

[Dad2three]

Solyndra! You jerks make a big deal over a small mistake. Cheney's belief that Iraq would greet us a liberators costs over 4,500 Americans their lives, and untold Billions of Dollars.

Let's talk about how much Cheney steered to Halliburton, shall we?

If Solyndra were the only "small mistake" that was made then you might have a point but it wasn't...there were numerous "green" companies that got big money from the Obama Administration only to go belly up. They ended up costing jobs...not creating them.

Nice job at trying to divert the discussion from Obama to a Vice President who's been out of office for almost eight years now. Cheney and Haliburton? That's the best you've got?

Yes Dummy, the GOP's 2005 ENERGY POLICY that Dubya signed onto, AND CREATED A $10 BILLION RESERVE TO GET "GREEN ENERGY, CREATED TENS OF THOUSANDS OF JOBS, MOST UNDER OBAMA AND EVEN WITH SOLYNDRA, MADE MONEY FOR HE TREASURY, LOL

Now you're claiming that Solyndra made money for the Treasury? You're a complete moron, Dad! Seriously!

Yes Bubba, your cherry picking what people are saying make you look like special Ed, you have 2 accounts Bubba?


Yep, the GOP's/Dubya's 2005 energy bill, which included Solyndra, made the Gov't money, despite the GOP, setting aside $10 billion for losses!

How much money did the US make off of the Solyndra loan that was approved by the Obama Administration?

I think the green energy loan program created under Dubya/GOP 2005 Congress was like $40 million profit, despite setting aside $10 billion for losses Bubs, look I found a success the CONservatives can pointtto next time!!

 

[Dad2three]

Its strange....the Republicans control Congress now and the only tool they have in their toolbox is the threat of shutting down government

Then they are outraged when services are not available.
"What do you mean the park is closed?"

I would actually think that in a DEMOCACY that whoever has control of the legislative branch should have control of the government. That isn't true of other forms of government but I suspect that beneath this socialist attitude is a desire for those other forms of government.

Sigh, you do realize that our government was set up so that NOBODY would have too much control over the government and that was done deliberately by the Founding Fathers? We've got a Legislative Branch, a Judicial Branch and an Executive Branch so that one person or small group of people can't force their views on the rest of the country because the three branches provide checks and balances. Of course if you have a President who decides to side step Congress and conduct business through Executive Orders then that starts to become a problem.

lol

It's not the number of EO that you should be looking at, Sparky...but what each of them DID! Vast numbers of the ones you've cited were nothing more than slight changes to governmental policy made by a sitting President without having to go through Congress which is what EOs were designed to do. Barack Obama has not used EO's in that way at all however...he's used them to circumvent the wishes of Congress and the American people and push a liberal agenda that the American people didn't want.

More opinions based on BS. Shocking

 

[Dad2three]

You really ARE claiming that the Bush Administration approved Solyndra and didn't shelve it...aren't you? Wow...that's amazing. I mean really amazing! You're either terminally stupid...or shamelessly dishonest.

STICK With BS and ignore credible links Bubba, it's ALL you EVER have, opinions based on BS

Weekly Standard: Solyndra Debacle? Blame Bush

'By the time the Obama administration took office in late January 2009, the loan programs' staff had already established a goal of, and timeline for, issuing the company a conditional loan guarantee commitment in March 2009,' said Jonathan Silver, who heads the Energy loan program.


Weekly Standard: Solyndra Debacle? Blame Bush


May 2005: Just as a global silicon shortage begins driving up prices of solar photovoltaics [PV], Solyndra is founded to provide a cost-competitive alternative to silicon-based panels.

July 2005: The Bush Administration signs the Energy Policy Act of 2005 into law, creating the 1703 loan guarantee program.

February 2006 – October 2006: In February, Solyndra raises its first round of venture financing worth $10.6 million from CMEA Capital, Redpoint Ventures, and U.S. Venture Partners. In October, Argonaut Venture Capital, an investment arm of George Kaiser, invests $17 million into Solyndra. Madrone Capital Partners, an investment arm of the Walton family, invests $7 million. Those investments are part of a $78.2 million fund.

December 2006: Solyndra Applies for a Loan Guarantee under the 1703 program.

Late 2007: Loan guarantee program is funded. Solyndra was one of 16 clean-tech companies deemed ready to move forward in the due diligence process. The Bush Administration DOE moves forward to develop a conditional commitment.

October 2008: Then Solyndra CEO Chris Gronet touted reasons for building in Silicon Valley and noted that the “company’s second factory also will be built in Fremont, since a Department of Energy loan guarantee mandates a U.S. location.”

November 2008: Silicon prices remain very high on the spot market, making non-silicon based thin film technologies like Solyndra’s very attractive to investors. Solyndra also benefits from having very low installation costs. The company raises $144 million from ten different venture investors, including the Walton-family run Madrone Capital Partners. This brings total private investment to more than $450 million to date.

January 2009: In an effort to show it has done something to support renewable energy, the Bush Administration tries to take Solyndra before a DOE credit review committee before President Obama is inaugurated. The committee, consisting of career civil servants with financial expertise, remands the loan back to DOE “without prejudice” because it wasn’t ready for conditional commitment.

March 2009: The same credit committee approves the strengthened loan application. The deal passes on to DOE’s credit review board. Career staff (not political appointees) within the DOE issue a conditional commitment setting out terms for a guarantee.

June 2009: As more silicon production facilities come online while demand for PV wavers due to the economic slowdown, silicon prices start to drop. Meanwhile, the Chinese begin rapidly scaling domestic manufacturing and set a path toward dramatic, unforeseen cost reductions in PV. Between June of 2009 and August of 2011, PV prices drop more than 50%.

September 2009: Solyndra raises an additional $219 million. Shortly after, the DOE closes a $535 million loan guarantee after six months of due diligence. This is the first loan guarantee issued under the 1705 program. From application to closing, the process took three years – not the 41 days that is sometimes reported. OMB did raise some concerns in August not about the loan itself but how the loan should be “scored.” OMB testified Wednesday that they were comfortable with the final scoring.

January – June 2010: As the price of conventional silicon-based PV continues to fall due to low silicon prices and a glut of solar modules, investors and analysts start questioning Solyndra’s ability to compete in the marketplace. Despite pulling its IPO (as dozens of companies did in 2010), Solyndra raises an additional $175 million from investors.

November 2010: Solyndra closes an older manufacturing facility and concentrates operations at Fab 2, the plant funded by the $535 million loan guarantee. The Fab 2 plant is completed that same month — on time and on budget — employing around 3,000 construction workers during the build-out, just as the DOE projected.

February 2011: Due to a liquidity crisis, investors provide $75 million to help restructure the loan guarantee. The DOE rightly assumed it was better to give Solyndra a fighting chance rather than liquidate the company – which was a going concern – for market value, which would have guaranteed significant losses.

March 2011: Republican Representatives complain that DOE funds are not being spent quickly enough.

Exclusive Timeline: Bush Administration Advanced Solyndra Loan Guarantee for Two Years, Media Blow the Story

"Republicans pushed back hard against this version of events, unearthing internal Energy Department emails that indicate the panel evaluating the loans had made the unanimous decision to shelve Solyndra's application two weeks before Obama took office." If the first consideration of Solyndra came during the presidency of George W. Bush, that means that the application for the loan guarantee came after the Energy Policy Act of 2005 was passed. Clearly, this type of loan guarantee program was not a Bush Depratment of Energy (DOE) priority. The fact that Solyndra submitted a loan application does not mean the Bush White House or DOE approved the program or did more than accept the application and shuffle the paperwork a bit. And the DOE emails mentioned above appear to confirm that is all that happened."

That's from the article that you cited you idiot! I know that liberals like you would like to MAKE Solyndra a Bush thing but it's not! The Bush Administration shelved Solyndra's application for a loan because they correctly determined that the numbers didn't work! The Obama Administration decided that they did. Gee, think all those contributions to the Obama election campaign paid off?

SAME ARTICLE BUBS:


The Energy Department's top lending officer told Congress that the Solyndra loan application was not only filed during President Bush's term, but it surged towards completion before Obama took office in January 2009.

'By the time the Obama administration took office in late January 2009, the loan programs' staff had already established a goal of, and timeline for, issuing the company a conditional loan guarantee commitment in March 2009,' said Jonathan Silver, who heads the Energy loan program.

 

[Wry Catcher]

No one is clueless on that period of time. Bush was in charge, and was the commander-in-chief. The economy tanked and Iraq turned from a quagmire into a fiasco.

What does Iraq have to do with the economy? Are you agreeing with the other idiot who seems to think that Bush didn't pass TARP? Because if you are...then you are indeed CLUELESS!!!!!

What did Iraq's invasion and occupation have to do with the economy? You are kidding, aren't you? If not, please refrain from calling anyone clueless.

Are you making the claim that our invasion of Iraq caused the financial collapse? Because if you are...that's one of the more absurd statements I've ever seen on here, Wry!

Nope, pretty sure Wry understands Dubya cheering on the Banksters bubble AS Dubya gutted the FBI after warnings about creating a larger EPIDEMIC than Ronnie's S&L crisis was the cause. You know the GOP's "USUAL" , let markets hose US philosophy!

Bush was one of the few people in Washington warning about the real estate bubble being something we needed to worry about. If you'll recall...when he cautioned Congress about it...people like Todd and Frank pooh poohed his concern telling everyone that things were just fine the way that they were!

Point that finger if it makes you feel good. Bush had no problem sending his team out to push for a war of choice. Why didn't he send them out when he became concerned about the housing bubble?

I suggest you read Paulson's book, On the Brink; you can probably find it at a used book store for around .50 cents. He spent a year writing it, keep in mind Paulson came to his job in the Bush Administration from Goldman Sachs, the ultimate insider.

 

[Dad2three]

Simple explanations are for the simple people. Tell a lie often enough and simple people believe it to be true.

As a good liberal I'm always willing to educate those who confuse cause and effect:

Questionable Cause

How exactly does declaring "Questionable Cause" make what Mike posted a lie? Because you say that it is? Why do you think that the GOP accomplished a historic victory in 2010? What's your complex explanation of that? Barack Obama summed it up by saying "We got shellacked!" What would you like to add to that?

Stupid red staters voting against their own best interests, GOP gerrymandering and then recognize Dems received 20+ million more votes as minority in the Senate?

Oh, so the GOP crushed the Democrats in 2010 because voters were "stupid" in Red States? That's your complex explanation of why the Democrats suffered historic defeats both on the national level and locally in those midterms?

Don't understand gerrymandering is a state thing huh dummy? lol

But YES, the people ARE stupid in red states, I don't think there is much argument about that is there?

You can't Gerrymander until you CONTROL the State! Duh?

You asked, they GREATLY grew their gerrymandered districts dumbass!
You asked, they GREATLY grew their gerrymandered districts dumbass!

 

[Wry Catcher]

Simple explanations are for the simple people. Tell a lie often enough and simple people believe it to be true.

As a good liberal I'm always willing to educate those who confuse cause and effect:

Questionable Cause

How exactly does declaring "Questionable Cause" make what Mike posted a lie? Because you say that it is? Why do you think that the GOP accomplished a historic victory in 2010? What's your complex explanation of that? Barack Obama summed it up by saying "We got shellacked!" What would you like to add to that?

Stupid red staters voting against their own best interests, GOP gerrymandering and then recognize Dems received 20+ million more votes as minority in the Senate?

Oh, so the GOP crushed the Democrats in 2010 because voters were "stupid" in Red States? That's your complex explanation of why the Democrats suffered historic defeats both on the national level and locally in those midterms?

Don't understand gerrymandering is a state thing huh dummy? lol

But YES, the people ARE stupid in red states, I don't think there is much argument about that is there?

You can't Gerrymander until you CONTROL the State! Duh?

The People control the state! As we've seen here:

Supreme Court strikes blow against gerrymandering

The way districts should be formed.

 

[Oldstyle]

Uhhhh, after the last government shutdown, the Republicans regained control of Congress and increased their control of state legislatures and governors' mansions in a historic landslide. So I guess shutting down the government and forcing Obama to agree to a semblance of fiscal sanity didn't hurt them too badly, hey?

Do you guys just live on Mars or something? Do you not read/view any rational, accurate news sources?

Simple explanations are for the simple people. Tell a lie often enough and simple people believe it to be true.

As a good liberal I'm always willing to educate those who confuse cause and effect:

Questionable Cause

How exactly does declaring "Questionable Cause" make what Mike posted a lie? Because you say that it is? Why do you think that the GOP accomplished a historic victory in 2010? What's your complex explanation of that? Barack Obama summed it up by saying "We got shellacked!" What would you like to add to that?

Stupid red staters voting against their own best interests, GOP gerrymandering and then recognize Dems received 20+ million more votes as minority in the Senate?

Oh, so the GOP crushed the Democrats in 2010 because voters were "stupid" in Red States? That's your complex explanation of why the Democrats suffered historic defeats both on the national level and locally in those midterms?

Don't understand gerrymandering is a state thing huh dummy? lol

But YES, the people ARE stupid in red states, I don't think there is much argument about that is there?

What does Iraq have to do with the economy? Are you agreeing with the other idiot who seems to think that Bush didn't pass TARP? Because if you are...then you are indeed CLUELESS!!!!!

What did Iraq's invasion and occupation have to do with the economy? You are kidding, aren't you? If not, please refrain from calling anyone clueless.

Are you making the claim that our invasion of Iraq caused the financial collapse? Because if you are...that's one of the more absurd statements I've ever seen on here, Wry!

Nope, pretty sure Wry understands Dubya cheering on the Banksters bubble AS Dubya gutted the FBI after warnings about creating a larger EPIDEMIC than Ronnie's S&L crisis was the cause. You know the GOP's "USUAL" , let markets hose US philosophy!

Bush was one of the few people in Washington warning about the real estate bubble being something we needed to worry about. If you'll recall...when he cautioned Congress about it...people like Todd and Frank pooh poohed his concern telling everyone that things were just fine the way that they were!

Point that finger if it makes you feel good. Bush had no problem sending his team out to push for a war of choice. Why didn't he send them out when he became concerned about the housing bubble?

I suggest you read Paulson's book, On the Brink; you can probably find it at a used book store for around .50 cents. He spent a year writing it, keep in mind Paulson came to his job in the Bush Administration from Goldman Sachs, the ultimate insider.

I point out that Bush was one of the few voices in Washington warning about the dangers of a housing bubble and you respond that he should have pushed harder on it? What recommendation would you give to Barney Frank?

 

[Oldstyle]

How exactly does declaring "Questionable Cause" make what Mike posted a lie? Because you say that it is? Why do you think that the GOP accomplished a historic victory in 2010? What's your complex explanation of that? Barack Obama summed it up by saying "We got shellacked!" What would you like to add to that?

Stupid red staters voting against their own best interests, GOP gerrymandering and then recognize Dems received 20+ million more votes as minority in the Senate?

Oh, so the GOP crushed the Democrats in 2010 because voters were "stupid" in Red States? That's your complex explanation of why the Democrats suffered historic defeats both on the national level and locally in those midterms?

Don't understand gerrymandering is a state thing huh dummy? lol

But YES, the people ARE stupid in red states, I don't think there is much argument about that is there?

You can't Gerrymander until you CONTROL the State! Duh?

The People control the state! As we've seen here:

Supreme Court strikes blow against gerrymandering

The way districts should be formed.

You can't claim that a Party won an election because of Gerrymandering when you need to control States in order to Gerrymander in the first place. You've put the cart in front of the horse.

 

[Vandalshandle]

You guys misunderstand. We love it when you shut down the government. Every time you do, there is a serious backlash against the republicans. It is almost like we somehow engineered it ourselves, to your disadvantage!

Go for it, dudes!

Be careful what you wish for, Vandal...each time the government closes down it seem to affect the country less and less. At some point the people might realize that they don't NEED all that government...OMG...the horror!

That is called "anarchy". Do a Google on that, and see where it leads.

Smaller government does not equal "anarchy"...an over-reaching government equals "tyranny".

And in case you hadn't noticed the bigger our government gets the more our streets seem to be filled with anarchy.

No, I have not noticed that at all. Presumably, our government is much larger than it was in 1968, and in that year, there were race riots everywhere,assassinations, and hard hats fighting anti-war demonstrators in the streets. In fact, in my home city of Atlanta, a huge part of the city did not leave their homes during MLK's funeral, because we were afraid that there would be armed insurrection.

 

[Oldstyle]

If Solyndra were the only "small mistake" that was made then you might have a point but it wasn't...there were numerous "green" companies that got big money from the Obama Administration only to go belly up. They ended up costing jobs...not creating them.

Nice job at trying to divert the discussion from Obama to a Vice President who's been out of office for almost eight years now. Cheney and Haliburton? That's the best you've got?

Yes Dummy, the GOP's 2005 ENERGY POLICY that Dubya signed onto, AND CREATED A $10 BILLION RESERVE TO GET "GREEN ENERGY, CREATED TENS OF THOUSANDS OF JOBS, MOST UNDER OBAMA AND EVEN WITH SOLYNDRA, MADE MONEY FOR HE TREASURY, LOL

Now you're claiming that Solyndra made money for the Treasury? You're a complete moron, Dad! Seriously!

Yes Bubba, your cherry picking what people are saying make you look like special Ed, you have 2 accounts Bubba?


Yep, the GOP's/Dubya's 2005 energy bill, which included Solyndra, made the Gov't money, despite the GOP, setting aside $10 billion for losses!

How much money did the US make off of the Solyndra loan that was approved by the Obama Administration?

I think the green energy loan program created under Dubya/GOP 2005 Congress was like $40 million profit, despite setting aside $10 billion for losses Bubs, look I found a success the CONservatives can pointtto next time!!

You keep avoiding answering my question...
How much money did the Federal Government lose on the Solyndra loan approval?

How many other so called "green" companies that the Obama Administration touted as the engine that was going to create jobs also went belly up costing jobs as well as millions in tax payer monies?

 

[Oldstyle]

You guys misunderstand. We love it when you shut down the government. Every time you do, there is a serious backlash against the republicans. It is almost like we somehow engineered it ourselves, to your disadvantage!

Go for it, dudes!

Be careful what you wish for, Vandal...each time the government closes down it seem to affect the country less and less. At some point the people might realize that they don't NEED all that government...OMG...the horror!

That is called "anarchy". Do a Google on that, and see where it leads.

Smaller government does not equal "anarchy"...an over-reaching government equals "tyranny".

And in case you hadn't noticed the bigger our government gets the more our streets seem to be filled with anarchy.

No, I have not noticed that at all. Presumably, our government is much larger than it was in 1968, and in that year, there were race riots everywhere,assassinations, and hard hats fighting anti-war demonstrators in the streets. In fact, in my home city of Atlanta, a huge part of the city did not leave their homes during MLK's funeral, because we were afraid that there would be armed insurrection.

The riots following the assassination of Martin Luther King were a specific reaction to the death of an icon. The anarchy that we have in our streets now is the direct result of a cradle to the grave sense of entitlement that our big government nation now demands. If Big Brother doesn't give me free stuff...I'm going to take to the streets and riot. That's the essential message of Occupy Wall Streeters.

 

[LogikAndReazon]

"War of Choice".....

Giggles

 

[Vandalshandle]

You guys misunderstand. We love it when you shut down the government. Every time you do, there is a serious backlash against the republicans. It is almost like we somehow engineered it ourselves, to your disadvantage!

Go for it, dudes!

Be careful what you wish for, Vandal...each time the government closes down it seem to affect the country less and less. At some point the people might realize that they don't NEED all that government...OMG...the horror!

That is called "anarchy". Do a Google on that, and see where it leads.

Smaller government does not equal "anarchy"...an over-reaching government equals "tyranny".

And in case you hadn't noticed the bigger our government gets the more our streets seem to be filled with anarchy.

No, I have not noticed that at all. Presumably, our government is much larger than it was in 1968, and in that year, there were race riots everywhere,assassinations, and hard hats fighting anti-war demonstrators in the streets. In fact, in my home city of Atlanta, a huge part of the city did not leave their homes during MLK's funeral, because we were afraid that there would be armed insurrection.

The riots following the assassination of Martin Luther King were a specific reaction to the death of an icon. The anarchy that we have in our streets now is the direct result of a cradle to the grave sense of entitlement that our big government nation now demands. If Big Brother doesn't give me free stuff...I'm going to take to the streets and riot. That's the essential message of Occupy Wall Streeters.

Whatever, old.... it is all so hopeless, isn't it? {sigh}

 

[bravoactual]

Bush warned about the housing bubble? Was that before or after the mortage backed securities debacle?

It was the shrub's ecomonic policies that led to market collapse in 2008.

Over 1.5 Million Americans lost their jobs under the shrub in 2008.

Millions of Americans lost their homes under the shrub in 2008.

Trillions of dollars of debt were created by the shrub.

Billions of dollars borrowed from Communist China by the shrub to finance the interest on the ever growing National Debt under the shrub.

Trillions of dollars in the deficit under the shrub.

President Obama has cut the deficit in half.

Obama says he has cut national deficit in half.

The Republicans were lemming following bush43 off the cliff when they had the majority (2001 - 2007). Republicans supported every continuing resloution regarding the budget for the War(s) in Afghanistan and Iraq.

When it came time to slash the budget for the Veteran's Administration, man oh man did they love it. It was the Democrats who fought to restore the V.A.Budget which was opposed by the RePubliCons. The RePugs love to Men and Women off to fight in War, but the only RePugs love more is Fucking them over when they come home.

Keep lying to yourself RePugs, it is the only thing left for you to do.

 

[Oldstyle]

So let me see if I understand how this works...when the GOP refuses to allow Barry to spend all the money he wanted to spend...triggering a budget fight and a subsequent sequester taking place which automatically cut the budget...something that Obama has constantly railed against...when all THAT happens...Barry gets credit for cutting the deficit?

But I'm lying to myself? Interesting take on things!

 

[Oldstyle]

Be careful what you wish for, Vandal...each time the government closes down it seem to affect the country less and less. At some point the people might realize that they don't NEED all that government...OMG...the horror!

That is called "anarchy". Do a Google on that, and see where it leads.

Smaller government does not equal "anarchy"...an over-reaching government equals "tyranny".

And in case you hadn't noticed the bigger our government gets the more our streets seem to be filled with anarchy.

No, I have not noticed that at all. Presumably, our government is much larger than it was in 1968, and in that year, there were race riots everywhere,assassinations, and hard hats fighting anti-war demonstrators in the streets. In fact, in my home city of Atlanta, a huge part of the city did not leave their homes during MLK's funeral, because we were afraid that there would be armed insurrection.

The riots following the assassination of Martin Luther King were a specific reaction to the death of an icon. The anarchy that we have in our streets now is the direct result of a cradle to the grave sense of entitlement that our big government nation now demands. If Big Brother doesn't give me free stuff...I'm going to take to the streets and riot. That's the essential message of Occupy Wall Streeters.

Whatever, old.... it is all so hopeless, isn't it? {sigh}

"Whatever"? That's your reply?
It's not hopeless but it's approaching that point rather quickly. We've reached a tipping point where more people are taking out then are putting in...I know that you liberals hate math when we're talking about "people" but some things aren't really that hard to grasp.