Human Caused Global Warming

[SSDD]

Prove it... what is happening in the climate that is outside the boundaries of natural variation...and if nothing is outside of natural variation...how can you be sure humans are involved?

SSDD,
If your arguments are coming down to asking people to repeat themselves, you may as well just give up.

You have not answered the question....if the climate is within the bounds of natural variability....where is the human fingerprint?....how do you separate it from the natural noise?

You have made a claim that you have not substantiated...can you, or can you not substantiate it?

SSDD,
Refer to my last answer.

I did...it was a non answer...it shows that you don't know the difference between correlation and causation...it is a common characteristic among those who believe in the AGW hypothesis.

SSDD,
It was only a non answer to somebody who refuses to see.

Refuse to see what you haven't shown? I have seen what you have produced and it certainly doesn't constitute proof of anything. You clearly don't know the difference between correlation and causation. You seem to be terrified of CO2 levels going much above the present 400ppm because you fear warming but CO2 levels were above 1000ppm when the present ice age began...if CO2 causes catastrophic warming, how did an ice age begin....in fact, all of the ice ages of the past begin with CO2 levels over 1000ppm and in some cases with CO2 levels over 4000ppm? Do you think CO2 from human activity is somehow different than natural CO2?

 

[SSDD]

SSDD,
I'm going to skip most of what you said.

Of course you are...that is how zealots operate...when you can't answer, you ignore and hope that no one notices.

Then you really venture into insane land by claiming that it is better to be sorry than safe.

Can you prove that we will be sorry? If you can, then do it...if you can't, then you are no more than a crazy on the sidewalk with a sandwich sign saying that "The end is near"

Just like the DEVO song, "If you have a problem, you just have to whip it."

So according to you, if it is in a song, it must be true? I know some people who think like that...they live their lives by song lyrics...no matter what happens they have a song lyric...and they are, to the last one...sad losers. They prove beyond a doubt that living your life by song lyrics is not a good plan.

Even if something is only a perceived threat, it is ALWAYS a good idea to do something about it.

Really? Ever see a paranoid? They perceive all sorts of threats and act on them and it seldom works out for them...Was it a good idea to start the war in the middle east over the perceived threat of WMD in Iraq? I could go on with examples of taking disastrous action based on "perceived" threats for pages and pages. When you perceive a threat, the first thing you do is determine whether it is an actual threat...then you assess how much of a threat it is and then perform a gain loss assessment to determine whether taking action is better than not. Simply taking action based on perceived threats is one of the most stupid things you could possibly do. Chicken little took action based on a perceived threat...how did that work out for him?

Though of course, you claim that there is no problem.

I am not making any claim at all. I am saying that there is nothing going on in the climate that is outside of, or even getting close to the bounds of natural variation...I am saying that if humans are having an effect on the climate, it isn't distinguishable from natural climate variations. You are claiming imminent disaster that must be addressed and I am asking for you to substantiate your claims and you don't seem to be able to do it...you simply respond with more claims of imminent disaster. You claim that an increase of the present concentration 400ppm CO2 concentration is going to lead to disastrous warming but the ice age we are in began with atmospheric CO2 over 1000ppm. I am not making any claims at all...I am asking you what solid evidence of imminent disaster you base your claims of impending doom requiring immediate action upon.

Also, as I said to somebody, it isn't a good idea to wait until everything is known diwn to the finest, exact detail until a problem is recognized.

And I don't think that you should wait until every possible detail is known....but you should wait until you know whether a real threat exists and how serious that threat is. Consider the question..."how sensitive is the climate to a doubling of CO2? Don't you think that such a basic bit of knowledge would be useful in determining whether a threat exists and the level of that threat. Right now, the range of climate sensitivity to CO2 is somewhere between zero and 8 degrees for a doubling of CO2. Is that enough information to even determine whether a threat even exists...much less to determine a course of action based upon a perceived threat?

 

[SSDD]

jc456,
It appears I was able to make a graph appear that shows that right now, CO2 is leading the way. You should be able to click on one of the graphs to inlarge it. So what does that have to say about your assertion that CO2 always follows temperatures. Or that you're winning. Chew on that for a while!

CO2 is increasing but temperatures are not...do you really believe that the oceans ate the global warming? What sort of mechanism do you think is responsible for the heat suddenly shifting from the atmosphere to the oceans...how do square your belief that the oceans are eating the warming with the fact that there is no dramatic increase in the rate that the oceans are accumulating heat over the time that the heat supposedly started being eaten by the oceans...and if the oceans are eating the heat, why are we not seeing a sudden acceleration in sea level due to thermal expansion instead of the observed decrease in sea level increase?

Your claims simply do not hold up when compared with what we are observing?

 

[westwall]

AGW is a farce, there is zero real science to support this religion.

CO2 does NOT drive climate.

Pollution does NOT equal AGW..

Kosh,
Like it or not, CO2 IS a greenhouse gas. And as has been shown in many ways, it is causing global temperatures to generally rise. As far as particulate pollution goes, it may help keep temperatures from rising as fast by keeping some sunlight from reaching the ground. Maybe that's how some of you deniers can sleep at night. Because if things gat as bad as they probably will, all the government has to do is send a couple ground penetrating hydrogen bombs crashing into a couple places where super volcanos exist. But that isn't much of a solution.

GHG yes. Shown to be doing anything....anything at all? No. With a capital NO!

Really? Another get together coming up for the AGU. You will be there to tell all of those scientists how they are all wrong, and that GHGs don't do anything. Right? Come on now, I, and many like me watch the videos. Surely you won't miss this chance to show us all that we are wrong.

Or perhaps you would prefer to us the GSA as a forum. Just tell us when you will be speaking, we will surely not miss that.

But the reality is that you, and people like you, have nothing to present that would pass even minimal peer review. You would get your asses laughed out of either forum.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

'Ground penetrating hydrogen bombs'

Most supervolcano magma chambers are several miles underground. Deepest specially-designed ground penetrating bomb doesn't go deeper than about 100 meters. Deepest cavity vaporized out of solid earth from an underground nuclear detonation is less than about 1,000 meters.

Nuclear weapons optimally are airburst to maximize shockwave effects. Detonations on the ground reflect the majority of their energy up into the atmosphere. If you tried setting off a supervolcano like the one in Yellowstone with nuclear weapons, you'd move some earth and irradiate the vicinity, but you wouldn't get anywhere close to exposing the magma chamber so as to set it off.

 

[cultsmasher]

wildcard,
I said to bring up graphs. Not some article in Forbs.

I don't take orders.

You want graphs? Bring them up yourself, or have someone help you.

Make some attempt at backing-up the bullshit that YOU claim with some "undeniable real proof".

What's the matter, does that article from Forbes goes against the bullshit lies and misinformation about global warming that you faithfully believe in and accept without question?

wildcard,
It isn't that you don't take orders. You're just making up that it was an order to keep yourself from being proven wrong. But I have something else to tell you that you can take as fact. But I won't ask you to look it up if you don't believe me. I can guess where that would lead. But here is the fact. Each year all of the earths' volcanoes put out an estimated 200 MILLION tons of CO2 into the biosphere. Each year, the activities of humans results in the release of 26.8 BILLION tons. That's billion with a B. Also, depending on what you read, China alone starts up a new coal fired electric power plant either twice a week or once every ten days. Unfortunately is is more pleasing to stick your denier head in the sand. Just like those cartoon pictures of ostrichs doing.

You're just making up that it was an order to keep yourself from being proven wrong.

There is nothing truthful or factual about global warming to be proven wrong.

Everything about global warming is a lie!

wildcard,
You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true. If you look at how much CO2 has gone up since the beginning of the industrial revolution, even you can see where things are going.

You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true.

And you can continue to convince yourself that global warming is real, and that mankind is to blame, but it isn't going to make it true.

Wildcard,
Go up a little to the reply I gave jc456. Click on one of the graphs on my reply. Each year, all the volcanos on earth put out about 200 million tons of CO2. Each year, human activities put out 26.8 billion tons. Go up a little to the reply I gave jc456. Click on one of the graphs on my reply. Given what I said, tell me that what is happening now is just a coincidence.

 

[cultsmasher]

jc456,
Is this what things have come to? You making things up? I never said that I didn't know how to read graphs. I said I didn't know how to copy and past them to a reply for denier cultist like you to look at. Then you go on to talk about causal influence. Well duh! But the point is that most ovten in the past, CO2 followed temperatures. But these days, CO2 is leading the way. That can't be good.

sure, and some day maybe you could prove what you post. You have no evidence, none, nadda of any CO2 causing a climate or temperature change. As has been pointed out to you here, the past 18 year pause is an observed damning of your claim. While CO2 increased, temps stayed basically flat. So the cause is no where to be found. And as many on your side here have posted, at least you admit that CO2 follows temperature and to all of us is the only influence on the planet. So have a nice day and when you find that evidence you claim you have, that you don't, let us all know.

jc456,
First of all, it appears in the past that CO2 usually followed temperatures. But that isn't what is happening today. And as sure as the greenhouse effect is, Temperatures are sure to follow. Also, from what I heard, ocean temperatures have been rising more than atmospheric temperatures. Which apparently wasn't expected. But even warmer oceans isn't a good thing. Let me guess, you want me to dig up some graphs or find some scientific publication to quote. Well guess what. I have better things to do. Believe what you want. As you can tell from my avatar, I have more important cults to smash.

First of all CO2 will always follow temperature, that is science. You sir still have not proved anything other than that. So, I don't believe you nor the links you constantly post, DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT? It doesn't matter how many times you post it the same reaction will be received....DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT? So tell me what else is there to discuss? WiNNiNG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jc456,
It appears I was able to make a graph appear that shows that right now, CO2 is leading the way. You should be able to click on one of the graphs to inlarge it. So what does that have to say about your assertion that CO2 always follows temperatures. Or that you're winning. Chew on that for a while!

This BULL SHIT AGAIN????

Billy_Bob,
I wonder how much denier money went to whoever made your graph. Even so, I still see a warming trend. Despite this, There are other graphs that show the opposite. But despite what your graph says, my graphs can beat up your graphs. Though I am new to this, you should be able to click on either graph to get a better view.

 

[cultsmasher]

wildcard,
You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true. If you look at how much CO2 has gone up since the beginning of the industrial revolution, even you can see where things are going.

You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true.

And you can continue to convince yourself that global warming is real, and that mankind is to blame, but it isn't going to make it true.

OK, asshole, present evidence for your position.

Hey dumbfuck, search the thread.

But we both know that whatever evidence is presented, YOU will automatically reject it. Why? Because it doesn't support the bullshit lies and misinformation of global warming that YOU and the other moronic warmists so faithfully believe in and accept without question.

Well, present us some evidence from credible sources. Not undegreed ex-TV weathermen, fake British Lords, and obese junkies on the radio.

All of the Scientific Societies of the world, all the National Academies of Science, and all of the major Universities have policy statements that say AGW is real, and a clear and present danger.

First we would have to see real science and real data from the alarmists... none of this fake modeled crap and made up tree ring proxies..

Billy_Bob,
It would seem that the kind of "proof" you deniers require doesn't exist.

 

[cultsmasher]

AGW is a farce, there is zero real science to support this religion.

CO2 does NOT drive climate.

Pollution does NOT equal AGW..

Kosh,
Like it or not, CO2 IS a greenhouse gas. And as has been shown in many ways, it is causing global temperatures to generally rise. As far as particulate pollution goes, it may help keep temperatures from rising as fast by keeping some sunlight from reaching the ground. Maybe that's how some of you deniers can sleep at night. Because if things gat as bad as they probably will, all the government has to do is send a couple ground penetrating hydrogen bombs crashing into a couple places where super volcanos exist. But that isn't much of a solution.

It has been shown in no way to make global temperatures rise. It has been hypothesized...it has been modeled and both the hypothesis and models have failed. CO2 does not drive the climate.

SSDD,
You can deny graphs like these all you want. But even you have to admit that it is likely that there is at least some "truthiness" to them.

 

[cultsmasher]

'Ground penetrating hydrogen bombs'

Most supervolcano magma chambers are several miles underground. Deepest specially-designed ground penetrating bomb doesn't go deeper than about 100 meters. Deepest cavity vaporized out of solid earth from an underground nuclear detonation is less than about 1,000 meters.

Nuclear weapons optimally are airburst to maximize shockwave effects. Detonations on the ground reflect the majority of their energy up into the atmosphere. If you tried setting off a supervolcano like the one in Yellowstone with nuclear weapons, you'd move some earth and irradiate the vicinity, but you wouldn't get anywhere close to exposing the magma chamber so as to set it off.

Delta4Embassy,
Not that any sane person would ever do it, but a hydrogen bomb even just 100 meters underground would still create quite a shockwave. Enough to shatter any layers of rock for miles. And maybe cause some of the magma to fizz. I have no doubt that it would work. Also, if that was their intent, I'm sure bomb makers could do something to make such a projectile go deeper. Such as if the jet carrying it released it wlile heading toward the ground at 1500 mph.

 

[cultsmasher]

SSDD,
If your arguments are coming down to asking people to repeat themselves, you may as well just give up.

You have not answered the question....if the climate is within the bounds of natural variability....where is the human fingerprint?....how do you separate it from the natural noise?

You have made a claim that you have not substantiated...can you, or can you not substantiate it?

SSDD,
Refer to my last answer.

I did...it was a non answer...it shows that you don't know the difference between correlation and causation...it is a common characteristic among those who believe in the AGW hypothesis.

SSDD,
It was only a non answer to somebody who refuses to see.

Refuse to see what you haven't shown? I have seen what you have produced and it certainly doesn't constitute proof of anything. You clearly don't know the difference between correlation and causation. You seem to be terrified of CO2 levels going much above the present 400ppm because you fear warming but CO2 levels were above 1000ppm when the present ice age began...if CO2 causes catastrophic warming, how did an ice age begin....in fact, all of the ice ages of the past begin with CO2 levels over 1000ppm and in some cases with CO2 levels over 4000ppm? Do you think CO2 from human activity is somehow different than natural CO2?

SSDD,
You are picking the hell out of some nits. Maybe you can tell me where CO2 levels were at when the entire earth froze over. But none of that matters. What matters is the effects of what humans are now doing is having. And if greed or being able to multiply like bacteria are worth it.

 

[Wyld Kard]

I don't take orders.

You want graphs? Bring them up yourself, or have someone help you.

Make some attempt at backing-up the bullshit that YOU claim with some "undeniable real proof".

What's the matter, does that article from Forbes goes against the bullshit lies and misinformation about global warming that you faithfully believe in and accept without question?

wildcard,
It isn't that you don't take orders. You're just making up that it was an order to keep yourself from being proven wrong. But I have something else to tell you that you can take as fact. But I won't ask you to look it up if you don't believe me. I can guess where that would lead. But here is the fact. Each year all of the earths' volcanoes put out an estimated 200 MILLION tons of CO2 into the biosphere. Each year, the activities of humans results in the release of 26.8 BILLION tons. That's billion with a B. Also, depending on what you read, China alone starts up a new coal fired electric power plant either twice a week or once every ten days. Unfortunately is is more pleasing to stick your denier head in the sand. Just like those cartoon pictures of ostrichs doing.

You're just making up that it was an order to keep yourself from being proven wrong.

There is nothing truthful or factual about global warming to be proven wrong.

Everything about global warming is a lie!

wildcard,
You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true. If you look at how much CO2 has gone up since the beginning of the industrial revolution, even you can see where things are going.

You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true.

And you can continue to convince yourself that global warming is real, and that mankind is to blame, but it isn't going to make it true.

Wildcard,
Go up a little to the reply I gave jc456. Click on one of the graphs on my reply. Each year, all the volcanos on earth put out about 200 million tons of CO2. Each year, human activities put out 26.8 billion tons. Go up a little to the reply I gave jc456. Click on one of the graphs on my reply. Given what I said, tell me that what is happening now is just a coincidence.

I'm not interested in the lies and misinformation about global warming that you are trying to convince others of that it is real.

 

[cultsmasher]

wildcard,
It isn't that you don't take orders. You're just making up that it was an order to keep yourself from being proven wrong. But I have something else to tell you that you can take as fact. But I won't ask you to look it up if you don't believe me. I can guess where that would lead. But here is the fact. Each year all of the earths' volcanoes put out an estimated 200 MILLION tons of CO2 into the biosphere. Each year, the activities of humans results in the release of 26.8 BILLION tons. That's billion with a B. Also, depending on what you read, China alone starts up a new coal fired electric power plant either twice a week or once every ten days. Unfortunately is is more pleasing to stick your denier head in the sand. Just like those cartoon pictures of ostrichs doing.

You're just making up that it was an order to keep yourself from being proven wrong.

There is nothing truthful or factual about global warming to be proven wrong.

Everything about global warming is a lie!

wildcard,
You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true. If you look at how much CO2 has gone up since the beginning of the industrial revolution, even you can see where things are going.

You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true.

And you can continue to convince yourself that global warming is real, and that mankind is to blame, but it isn't going to make it true.

Wildcard,
Go up a little to the reply I gave jc456. Click on one of the graphs on my reply. Each year, all the volcanos on earth put out about 200 million tons of CO2. Each year, human activities put out 26.8 billion tons. Go up a little to the reply I gave jc456. Click on one of the graphs on my reply. Given what I said, tell me that what is happening now is just a coincidence.

I'm not interested in the lies and misinformation about global warming that you are trying to convince others of that it is real.

Wildcard,
You call these graphs lies and misinformation. But they hold more weight than the blanlet denials that you come up with.

 

[Wyld Kard]

There is nothing truthful or factual about global warming to be proven wrong.

Everything about global warming is a lie!

wildcard,
You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true. If you look at how much CO2 has gone up since the beginning of the industrial revolution, even you can see where things are going.

You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true.

And you can continue to convince yourself that global warming is real, and that mankind is to blame, but it isn't going to make it true.

Wildcard,
Go up a little to the reply I gave jc456. Click on one of the graphs on my reply. Each year, all the volcanos on earth put out about 200 million tons of CO2. Each year, human activities put out 26.8 billion tons. Go up a little to the reply I gave jc456. Click on one of the graphs on my reply. Given what I said, tell me that what is happening now is just a coincidence.

I'm not interested in the lies and misinformation about global warming that you are trying to convince others of that it is real.

Wildcard,
You call these graphs lies and misinformation. But they hold more weight than the blanlet denials that you come up with.

You call these graphs lies and misinformation.

Yes I do.

But they hold more weight than the blanlet denials that you come up with.

Of course you believe that, after all you were gullible enough to be sold on the lies and misinformation of global warming.

 

[Wyld Kard]

 

[Wyld Kard]

 

[Billy_Bob]

sure, and some day maybe you could prove what you post. You have no evidence, none, nadda of any CO2 causing a climate or temperature change. As has been pointed out to you here, the past 18 year pause is an observed damning of your claim. While CO2 increased, temps stayed basically flat. So the cause is no where to be found. And as many on your side here have posted, at least you admit that CO2 follows temperature and to all of us is the only influence on the planet. So have a nice day and when you find that evidence you claim you have, that you don't, let us all know.

jc456,
First of all, it appears in the past that CO2 usually followed temperatures. But that isn't what is happening today. And as sure as the greenhouse effect is, Temperatures are sure to follow. Also, from what I heard, ocean temperatures have been rising more than atmospheric temperatures. Which apparently wasn't expected. But even warmer oceans isn't a good thing. Let me guess, you want me to dig up some graphs or find some scientific publication to quote. Well guess what. I have better things to do. Believe what you want. As you can tell from my avatar, I have more important cults to smash.

First of all CO2 will always follow temperature, that is science. You sir still have not proved anything other than that. So, I don't believe you nor the links you constantly post, DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT? It doesn't matter how many times you post it the same reaction will be received....DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT? So tell me what else is there to discuss? WiNNiNG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jc456,
It appears I was able to make a graph appear that shows that right now, CO2 is leading the way. You should be able to click on one of the graphs to inlarge it. So what does that have to say about your assertion that CO2 always follows temperatures. Or that you're winning. Chew on that for a while!

This BULL SHIT AGAIN????

Billy_Bob,
I wonder how much denier money went to whoever made your graph. Even so, I still see a warming trend. Despite this, There are other graphs that show the opposite. But despite what your graph says, my graphs can beat up your graphs. Though I am new to this, you should be able to click on either graph to get a better view.

Too Funny... You Plot CO2 as if it is a direct correlation ( and you had to do some mighty fun tricks to get it to plot that way too).

IF CO2 is LOG functioning how does it magically plot equal to temperature when temperature is NOT LOG FUNCTIONING. your graphs are a lie! If you simply use basic science your whole premise is blown out the door...

 

[Billy_Bob]

We are at the top portion of the 60 year warm side of the solar output. We will now continue to cool for about 30-50 years until we again reach the bottom of the cooling cycle. We have been out of all modeled predictions for over 14 years. 126 models updated just 10 years ago are now failed. And its 100%..

 

[Billy_Bob]

First we would have to see real science and real data from the alarmists... none of this fake modeled crap and made up tree ring proxies..

Billy_Bob,
It would seem that the kind of "proof" you deniers require doesn't exist.

A legend in your own mind... nothing more... You are a marxist, communist who is using lie and deceit to get the control over everyone you desire. I have posted real facts and all you have posted is "modeled" non-facts...

 

[Crick]

wildcard,
You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true. If you look at how much CO2 has gone up since the beginning of the industrial revolution, even you can see where things are going.

You can tell yourself that all you want. But it isn't going to make it true.

And you can continue to convince yourself that global warming is real, and that mankind is to blame, but it isn't going to make it true.

OK, asshole, present evidence for your position.

Hey dumbfuck, search the thread.

But we both know that whatever evidence is presented, YOU will automatically reject it. Why? Because it doesn't support the bullshit lies and misinformation of global warming that YOU and the other moronic warmists so faithfully believe in and accept without question.

Well, present us some evidence from credible sources. Not undegreed ex-TV weathermen, fake British Lords, and obese junkies on the radio.

All of the Scientific Societies of the world, all the National Academies of Science, and all of the major Universities have policy statements that say AGW is real, and a clear and present danger.

First we would have to see real science and real data from the alarmists... none of this fake modeled crap and made up tree ring proxies..

You prefer the thermometer proxies?