Hydroxychloroquine as treatment for COVID-19 shows no benefit and more deaths in VA study

[berg80]

Funny...from YOU!!! Trump. Trump. Trump. 24/7/365.

Good job. You get a cookie.

 

[gipper]

I’m more worried about what Gates, Soros, and the other billionaires are up to.

Spoken like an obedient cultist. When faced with a damning reality about your cult leader..........look the other way.

<sob>. But....but.....What about Soros?

Watch this you foolish dupes for the billionaires.

 

[RDD_1210]

Your lens for viewing the world is seriously distorted. You should fix that.

 

[jknowgood]

I’m more worried about what Gates, Soros, and the other billionaires are up to.

Spoken like an obedient cultist. When faced with a damning reality about your cult leader..........look the other way.

<sob>. But....but.....What about Soros?

You gonna get your chip?

 

[Olde Europe]

There was nothing wrong with Trump touting it as a potential cure.

The problem was Trump claiming it as salvation and pushing it as our solution to the problem. Most medical professionals took a wait and see attitude while Trump mocked them and sold a “What do we have to lose” philosophy

There was absolutely everything wrong with the Orange dunce touting that medication. It not only led to a shortage of supply for those who need the medication, it may well have entailed damage to Covid-19 patients for whom the drug isn't beneficial.

That said, the study Berg was touting doesn't tell us anything. It wasn't a controlled study, just looking back at a variety of cases. That is to say, if doctors used chloroquine predominantly on worse-off patients, with a double or triple rate of dying, it might have been beneficial even despite a higher death rate than the control group.

So, just as some laboratory result the Orange dunce was touting tells us nothing conclusive about chloroquine, so does that VA study. Except, it isn't a wonder cure. But, since it isn't an anti-viral drug specifically designed to kill off the coronavirus, we knew that before.

 

[JackOfNoTrades]

is Penicillin the wonder drug?

should it be banned?

I am allergic to it. If it is administered to me, I could get hurt, maybe even die.

If a Bad Orange Man were to say that PCN shows promise, and maybe even can help some people, does that mean that the Bad Orange Man wants ME to die???

The press is giddy about the VA study on HCQ. Which means that the left is really happy about it as well.

Image that. We have people that are excited the we don't have a wonder drug that can eradicate the Chines Virus.

There are people that are thrilled that to have a bullet against Trump, even if that means more people die or get hurt. And there are people getting hurt, folks with heart issues are showing signs of complications that they will deal with for the rest of their lives, even after they "recover"

Hydroxychloroquine IS STILL a valuable tool in the fight against this disease. If given early enough, it absolutely helps most people recover more quickly & even prevents some from progressing into the critical stage

Once someone gets to that critical stage, it does not help. We had already heard that. The VA patients were in that category.

It's sickening to see so many celibrate "bad news"; and they are wrong, This does not make Trump look bad, as much as they want it to. His "right to try" bill is a big step in the right direction towards bringing medical costs down & it demonstrates why those of us on the right are truly the ones that are "pro choice"

This is why there are approvals, clinical trials, research and data gathering...over a period of months, even years. So the "cure" isn't worse than the disease. The drug treatment showed initial signs of PROMISE in people already infected with the virus. Further treatment, research, observation, and data gathering has shown that hope may have been premature. Yes this drug has been around for decades...to treat malaria...in doses not even remotely approaching the amounts I've read that are needed to treat this virus. This is why you don't hang your hat on a miracle cure. Like it or not, that's exactly what Trump did. And it had nothing to do with concern with treating people who were infected. The purpose was to hock his magic bullet to the masses so he could justify opening things back up and get back to the only things he knows how to do well, his pep rallies, tweeting, and campaigning.

 

[berg80]

There was nothing wrong with Trump touting it as a potential cure.

The problem was Trump claiming it as salvation and pushing it as our solution to the problem. Most medical professionals took a wait and see attitude while Trump mocked them and sold a “What do we have to lose” philosophy

There was absolutely everything wrong with the Orange dunce touting that medication. It not only led to a shortage of supply for those who need the medication, it may well have entailed damage to Covid-19 patients for whom the drug isn't beneficial.

That said, the study Berg was touting doesn't tell us anything. It wasn't a controlled study, just looking back at a variety of cases. That is to say, if doctors used chloroquine predominantly on worse-off patients, with a double or triple rate of dying, it might have been beneficial even despite a higher death rate than the control group.

So, just as some laboratory result the Orange dunce was touting tells us nothing conclusive about chloroquine, so does that VA study. Except, it isn't a wonder cure. But, since it isn't an anti-viral drug specifically designed to kill of the coronavirus, we knew that before.

Widening access to experimental therapies that have not been fully evaluated is likely to have several unintended consequences. First, benefits to patients are unknown and may be negligible (as in the case of peramivir), in which case expanded access undermines physicians’ attempts to practice evidence-based medicine. Second, medications such as hydroxychloroquine have well-documented risks; subjecting patients to these risks would be unjustifiable in the absence of meaningful clinical benefit. Third, distributing unproven drugs under expanded access or EUAs may detract from the resources needed to carry out clinical trials, including the patient base and necessary funds. Since key outcome data are often not collected outside a trial, this redirection of resources will hamper our ability to quickly determine whether these drugs are truly safe and effective.

Finally, with drugs that are already marketed for other conditions, widespread off-label use can limit access for patients who need them for their established use. After Trump promoted hydroxychloroquine, prescribing of the drug increased rapidly, leading to substantial shortages affecting patients taking it for rheumatoid arthritis or lupus — indications for which it has been proven effective.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2009457?query=featured_coronavirus

 

[Penelope]

About 28% who were given hydroxychloroquine plus usual care died, versus 11% of those getting routine care alone. About 22% of those getting the drug plus azithromycin died, too, but the difference between that group and those receiving usual care was not considered large enough to rule out other factors that could have affected survival.
snip
Researchers did not track side effects but noted hints that hydroxychloroquine might have damaged other organs. The drug has long been known to have potentially serious side effects, including altering the heartbeat in a way that could lead to sudden death.

Hydroxychloroquine as treatment for COVID-19 shows no benefit and more deaths in VA study

President Trump has frequently touted the malaria drug as a potential breakthrough in the ongoing coronavirus fight.

www.marketwatch.com

------------------------------------------------

But its not peer reviewed. Facts are facts, tramp should of never recommended it for days and days endless times, he quit talking about it a few days ago, I wonder why??

If I get the virus, hydroxychloroquine is the first thing I'll ask for. Democrats want higher death counts so they can blame our great President. That's why they're against it.

No the Democrat's do not want a higher death toll, face the facts, and you can ask for it if your want, if you can find a Dr to administer to you!!

 

[JackOfNoTrades]

It's amazing how some people can disagree with everything Trump says. They never seem to get tired of being wrong. What they have is a mental disorder. TDS. If I ever got the virus, I'd take that stuff in a heart beat. So if you're one of those closed minded people who think there's a problem with hydroxychloroquine, just don't take it. Save it for the more essential people.

Sorry, I just had to laugh at the you'd take the stuff in a heart beat comment...cause that's exactly one of the big risks with giving doses of this drug that are necessary to treat this virus. Your heart may stop. Like I said, you don't want the cure to be worse than the disease. Best to wait until you get a lot more data before you make blanket proclamations.

 

[berg80]

Widening access to experimental therapies that have not been fully evaluated is likely to have several unintended consequences. First, benefits to patients are unknown and may be negligible (as in the case of peramivir), in which case expanded access undermines physicians’ attempts to practice evidence-based medicine. Second, medications such as hydroxychloroquine have well-documented risks; subjecting patients to these risks would be unjustifiable in the absence of meaningful clinical benefit. Third, distributing unproven drugs under expanded access or EUAs may detract from the resources needed to carry out clinical trials, including the patient base and necessary funds. Since key outcome data are often not collected outside a trial, this redirection of resources will hamper our ability to quickly determine whether these drugs are truly safe and effective.

Finally, with drugs that are already marketed for other conditions, widespread off-label use can limit access for patients who need them for their established use. After Trump promoted hydroxychloroquine, prescribing of the drug increased rapidly, leading to substantial shortages affecting patients taking it for rheumatoid arthritis or lupus — indications for which it has been proven effective.
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2009457?query=featured_coronavirus

 

[Maxdeath]

I still love the idea that anyone should overdose any drug and not expect problems. Take enough aspirin and you will have problems. You would think that doctors or whatever they want to call themselves would have that simple understanding at the very least.

 

[Olde Europe]

I should begin this thread by [...]

... checking whether other threads on the matter exist.

 

[Camp]

Studies using statistics, science, and scholarly stuff are anti tea bagger trumpoholic efforts to make Americans ignore the leader the red hat MAGA movement.

 

[JoeMoma]

I've been looking for a good deal on snake oil.

 

[Indeependent]

I should begin this thread by anticipating what lies Trumpette's will say about it. I can hear them now. "You are glad it didn't work." Just as they lie when saying, "you want the economy to crash." It's the kind of thing they do when their most Excellent, Infallible and Omnipotent Leader proves himself to be a modern day Elmer Gantry.

Trump-Boosted Malaria Drug Showed No Benefit In Study At Veterans Hospitals

Trump-Boosted Malaria Drug Showed No Benefit In Study At Veterans Hospitals

A malaria drug widely touted by President Donald Trump for treating the new coronavirus showed no benefit in a large analysis of its use in U.S. veterans hospitals. There were more deaths among those…

talkingpointsmemo.com

"A malaria drug widely touted by President Donald Trump for treating the new coronavirus showed no benefit in a large analysis of its use in U.S. veterans hospitals. There were more deaths among those given hydroxychloroquine versus standard care, researchers reported.

The nationwide study was not a rigorous experiment. But with 368 patients, it’s the largest look so far of hydroxychloroquine with or without the antibiotic azithromycin for COVID-19, which has killed more than 171,000 people as of Tuesday.

The study was posted on an online site for researchers and has been submitted to the New England Journal of Medicine, but has not been reviewed by other scientists. Grants from the National Institutes of Health and the University of Virginia paid for the work.

Researchers did not track side effects, but noted hints that hydroxychloroquine might have damaged other organs. The drug has long been known to have potentially serious side effects, including altering the heartbeat in a way that could lead to sudden death.

Earlier this month, scientists in Brazil stopped part of a hydroxychloroquine study after heart rhythm problems developed in one-quarter of people given the higher of two doses being tested."
............................................................................................................................................
We critics of Trump said at the outset the issue was there was no scientific evidence on which to promote the drug's efficacy in treating the virus. That concern has turned out to be correct. However, there was evidence it could be harmful.

Ultimately, the questions are these. Will the Conman-in-Chief be held responsible by Trumptards for recklessly pushing the use of this drug before it was shown to be effective? Will they acknowledge it was wrong for him to have done so? The answer............have popes covered up for child molesters.

Except for the many people I know who were given the medication and recovered.

 

[Lesh]

So much for the "Trump Pills"...

What a surprise

 

[bluzman61]

It's amazing how some people can disagree with everything Trump says. They never seem to get tired of being wrong. What they have is a mental disorder. TDS. If I ever got the virus, I'd take that stuff in a heart beat. So if you're one of those closed minded people who think there's a problem with hydroxychloroquine, just don't take it. Save it for the more essential people.

Yep. If our president said oxygen was vital to your survival. MANY dim liberal lunatics, including some that post on here. would hold their breath until they expired. Yes, they ARE that stupid.

 

[colfax_m]

I should begin this thread by anticipating what lies Trumpette's will say about it. I can hear them now. "You are glad it didn't work." Just as they lie when saying, "you want the economy to crash." It's the kind of thing they do when their most Excellent, Infallible and Omnipotent Leader proves himself to be a modern day Elmer Gantry.

Trump-Boosted Malaria Drug Showed No Benefit In Study At Veterans Hospitals

Trump-Boosted Malaria Drug Showed No Benefit In Study At Veterans Hospitals

A malaria drug widely touted by President Donald Trump for treating the new coronavirus showed no benefit in a large analysis of its use in U.S. veterans hospitals. There were more deaths among those…

talkingpointsmemo.com

"A malaria drug widely touted by President Donald Trump for treating the new coronavirus showed no benefit in a large analysis of its use in U.S. veterans hospitals. There were more deaths among those given hydroxychloroquine versus standard care, researchers reported.

The nationwide study was not a rigorous experiment. But with 368 patients, it’s the largest look so far of hydroxychloroquine with or without the antibiotic azithromycin for COVID-19, which has killed more than 171,000 people as of Tuesday.

The study was posted on an online site for researchers and has been submitted to the New England Journal of Medicine, but has not been reviewed by other scientists. Grants from the National Institutes of Health and the University of Virginia paid for the work.

Researchers did not track side effects, but noted hints that hydroxychloroquine might have damaged other organs. The drug has long been known to have potentially serious side effects, including altering the heartbeat in a way that could lead to sudden death.

Earlier this month, scientists in Brazil stopped part of a hydroxychloroquine study after heart rhythm problems developed in one-quarter of people given the higher of two doses being tested."
............................................................................................................................................
We critics of Trump said at the outset the issue was there was no scientific evidence on which to promote the drug's efficacy in treating the virus. That concern has turned out to be correct. However, there was evidence it could be harmful.

Ultimately, the questions are these. Will the Conman-in-Chief be held responsible by Trumptards for recklessly pushing the use of this drug before it was shown to be effective? Will they acknowledge it was wrong for him to have done so? The answer............have popes covered up for child molesters.

Except for the many people I know who were given the medication and recovered.

Don’t the vast majority of people recover without any medication?

 

[rightwinger]

I’m more worried about what Gates, Soros, and the other billionaires are up to.

Spoken like an obedient cultist. When faced with a damning reality about your cult leader..........look the other way.

<sob>. But....but.....What about Soros?

Funny...from YOU!!! Trump. Trump. Trump. 24/7/365.

Trump is the POTUS

He is accountable for what he says and what he does. So far, he has been less than the perfect that he claims

But he does have good ratings on his briefings

 

[bluzman61]

It's amazing how some people can disagree with everything Trump says. They never seem to get tired of being wrong. What they have is a mental disorder. TDS. If I ever got the virus, I'd take that stuff in a heart beat. So if you're one of those closed minded people who think there's a problem with hydroxychloroquine, just don't take it. Save it for the more essential people.

Yep. If our president said oxygen was vital to your survival. MANY dim liberal lunatics, including some that post on here. would hold their breath until they expired. Yes, they ARE that stupid.

Hey, you holding your breath there, playtime? Get started, I believe you're past your expiration date.......