Zone1 It's quite easy to see why most people end up in Hell (as Jesus said)

[nomadic5]

Post #27 has been corrected. Dark Ed was intended to be the word Darkness.

so my guess was right!

I just don't trust myself to get anything right... One of my parents always sent me that message that I can't do anything "right." The problem was: that parent didn't seem to know much about what is (objectively) right either! Anyhow... a little rabbit trail there... Why am I talking about my parent(s)? It's late in the day and I haven't had any whiskey yet... LOL

Anyhow, I know what you mean about the light seeming like an oncoming train. You are one of the few here who seems to understand where I have been, minus the details that are of course different for everyone. like I said earlier to someone else, my life following Jesus is one long string of miserable experiences... and yet to be in Jesus is the only thing that makes life worth living.. I just wish everyone could be in His Presence as I have been (in the Church He founded). I don't know if He is still There in ALL the Catholic Churches.. It is scary to realize He may be only in some (the ones where he is truly appreciated)

 

[nomadic5]

Are you saying I don't believe him? If so, you are sadly mistaken. I delve into the meaning of the word(s) he used in the context he was using.

You don't believe Him when he says there is eternal punishment for those who do not care about His followers.. I mean, you seem to be claiming there is no eternal punishment for ANYTHING... Jesus disagrees

 

[Anathema]

Anyhow, I know what you mean about the light seeming like an oncoming train. You are one of the few here who seems to understand where I have been, minus the details that are of course different for everyone. like I said earlier to someone else, my life following Jesus is one long string of miserable experiences... and yet to be in Jesus is the only thing that makes life worth living.. I just wish everyone could be in His Presence as I have been (in the Church He founded). I don't know if He is still There in ALL the Catholic Churches

That’s where your experiences and mine differ. In mine the train runs me over, then backs up and does it again, and again, and again, ad nauseam. In my case it’s only once I moved away from the light thst things finally started to improve.

 

[hjmick]

It's quite easy to see why most people end up in Hell (as Jesus said)​

Excessive Masturbation

 

[hjmick]

I don't think young children lie.

Not a single day goes by that doesn't see young children lie.

 

[Meriweather]

You don't believe Him when he says there is eternal punishment for those who do not care about His followers.. I mean, you seem to be claiming there is no eternal punishment for ANYTHING... Jesus disagrees

Listen to what I actually say....not to what you think I seem to say.

'Eternal' in Biblical language paints a picture or literally, "Beyond the horizon." This translates better as what we cannot see or cannot know.

Here in modern Western culture, using the modern English definition for 'eternal' it is translated (more or less) as for all time or never ending.

As Jesus lived in Biblical times using Biblical languages, some thought should be given to the type of punishment he mentioned. You insist that Jesus meant for all time, but if we give thought to Biblical meanings, it is quite possible Jesus was saying something more in line with "unimaginable" punishment, a punishment beyond what we are capable of seeing.

You will be correct in saying I am not a Biblical translator by either training or by any stretch of the imagination. I have, however, long been fascinated by word etymology and changes in definitions. Our culture is not Biblical culture, we see through a modern lens--something impossible for them to have done. Therefore, I try to take a peek through their lens. You are welcome to say I perceive blindly. That may well be the case, but I will still find the different roots, etymologies, changing definitions to be fascinating.

 

[SweetSue92]

Get past "novus ordo" because it had nothing to do with my post. My post is based on reading the history, culture, and anthropology of Biblical times--what people knew and believed at that time.

So close. And yet so far.

For those reading:

What Meriweather preaches is dangerous, because it's close to the truth, yet not.

 

[Batcat]

Jesus is Truth Incarnate. We can believe every Word He said (which includes all that He has said via the Bible AND via His Church throughout the centuries, which may or may not be written down in black and white but is of course true just the same)

So Jesus said that most people end up in Hell (see Mt 7:14- and Lk 13:24 and other psgs)

And I can see why. Everywhere I look today there is nothing but selfishness, snarkyness, love of $$, lack of concern for others.. everyone going against what Jesus taught. He taught us to have charity for one another, but I don't see much charity these days.

And then there's all the perversity, sick stuff being taught in our schools. It's like our society despises children, their innocence. It's like everyone is in such a hurry to steal that innocence from them.. WHY?!

Well, I think we know why.. "People loved darkness rather than the light..."

etc

The Gospel Truth About How to Get to Heaven

If you believe you can get to heaven by being a good person, you'll be shocked at what the Bible says. We unmask the biggest misconception in Christianity.

www.learnreligions.com

snip

How to Get To Heaven God's Way​

Because people can never be good enough to get to heaven, God provided a way, through justification, for them to be credited with the righteousness of Jesus Christ:


“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." (John 3:16, NIV)


Getting to heaven is not a matter of keeping the Commandments, because no one can. Neither is it a matter of being ethical, going to church, saying a certain number of prayers, making pilgrimages, or attaining levels of enlightenment. Those things may represent goodness by religious standards, but Jesus reveals what matters to him and his Father:


"In reply Jesus declared, 'I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.’” (John 3:3, NIV)


"Jesus answered, 'I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.'" (John 14:6, NIV)


Receiving salvation through Christ is a simple step-by-step process that has nothing to do with works or goodness. Eternal life in heaven comes through God's grace, a gift. It is gained through faith in Jesus, not performance.


The Bible is the final authority on heaven, and its truth is crystal clear:


"That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved." (Romans 10:9,

 

[Anathema]

How to Get To Heaven God's Way

What about those of us who didn’t want to go to “Heaven”

 

[Meriweather]

What Meriweather preaches is dangerous, because it's close to the truth, yet not.

But...I am not "preaching" anything. There is nothing "dangerous" in presenting etymologies (original definitions) of words. Saying our Biblical ancestors portrayed eternity like something unseen over the horizon is about as dangerous as a kitten. To note they compared punishment as being brought down so one has to look up/ascend is a beautiful way to describe the ultimate purpose of a punishment.

Ask yourself: Is it the person who is presenting word etymologies the one who is "preaching"? Or, could it be those who tell of hellfire and damnation to all who do not believe as they do who are the ones who are "preaching"?

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

You are creating reality and Christ in your own sinful human image.

Jesus said there is eternal punishment. If you don't believe HIM, then... I really have nothing more to say to you. So many people rationalize away the CLEAR words Jesus spoke. If you are one, I'm sorry to break this bad news but if you continue to do that, you yourself will end up in (again..) what Jesus called Eternal punishment. And if I did not warn you about it, I would end up there also

Mt 25:31

Cackling From the Clouds

Why do you get a thrill out of imagining others burning in hell?

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

You will be correct in saying I am not a Biblical translator by either training or by any stretch of the imagination. I have, however, long been fascinated by word etymology and changes in definitions. Our culture is not Biblical culture, we see through a modern lens--something impossible for them to have done. Therefore, I try to take a peek through their lens. You are welcome to say I perceive blindly. That may well be the case, but I will still find the different roots, etymologies, changing definitions to be fascinating.

Etymological Detective


Do you make anything out of the similarity between Yahweh and the way the Romans pronounced Jove ("Yo way)? Deeper than that, it's two words meaning "go."

So my interpretation is that not only were they the same description of an Omnipotent Being, but they both meant "Run for Your Lives" as a reaction to a prehistoric Mongol invader who drove the Indo-Europeans out of the Caucasus Mountains, including those who became the Jews.

 

[Batcat]

What about those of us who didn’t want to go to “Heaven”

That is your choice and you have the freedom to choose. You can always change your mind before you die.

 

[Anathema]

That is your choice and you have the freedom to choose. You can always change your mind before you die

I grew up in a devoutly a Lutheran (LCMS) family. My life experiences have pushed me away from the Abrahamic God, in all His forms. Especially his New Testament form.

 

[Meriweather]

Do you make anything out of the similarity between Yahweh and the way the Romans pronounced Jove ("Yo way)? Deeper than that, it's two words meaning "go."

So my interpretation is that not only were they the same description of an Omnipotent Being, but they both meant "Run for Your Lives" as a reaction to a prehistoric Mongol invader who drove the Indo-Europeans out of the Caucasus Mountains, including those who became the Jews.

My weakness in etymology is that I decided to overlook pronunciation because I could never seem to get my mouth, lips, throat around words in most languages. As far as the etymology of Jove (sans pronunciation) is that is seems to tie into shining, bright, sky, specifically, Jupiter. Their word for deity also roots in shining and bright.
As far as the root for Yahweh...Jews insist it is a tetra-gram, merely four letters whose pronunciation is lost. I haven't seen a thread where Jews discuss or pay much attention to Moses' strong connections to Midian and his Midianite wife and father-in-law. It has been suggested that one God of this region was known as what we would translate as "The Impassioned One" who wanted His followers to worship only Him and no other. "The Impassioned One" of course had roots in 'love' and apparently the spelling of this name looks quite similar to the Hebrew YHWH.

While I can see a tie between Greek and Roman Gods, I do not see a clear tie between Greek/Roman Gods and Israelite/Middle Eastern Gods. I do see that possible tie between the belief in a God that arose in ancient Arabia in what became known as Midian, with the One God of the Israelites.

With Abraham came the belief there is only one God to worship. From the Midianites came the idea an individual should worship one God only. In places, Exodus seems to present both ideas--by a man who had ties to both the Hebrews and the Midianites.

But, as I said, I have never seen a thread where Jews discussed this, and I do not know what possible answer they might have to it.

 

[Leo123]

It's quite easy to see why most people end up in Hell (as Jesus said)​

Excessive Masturbation

Naw, this is what we were told

 

[nomadic5]

That’s where your experiences and mine differ. In mine the train runs me over, then backs up and does it again, and again, and again, ad nauseam. In my case it’s only once I moved away from the light thst things finally started to improve.

well, I don't know why you say that my experiences differ from yours in this way. I don't know all your sufferings but I disagree anyway.

And if you go away from Jesus, things will go smoothly but likely only because the devil already has you. Jesus never said the pathway was easy. He said just the opposite.

It would be nice to have more details on what your being in the "light" was like and etc... but I am sure of this, that following Jesus is NOT easy and He never said it would be. The thing is, humans live for this world.. they don't know how to live for a world they have never seen, and yet, what choice do we have? Living for this world alone brings misery also.. and there is no Heaven at the end of that road. In fact, Jesus tells us about "eternal punishment" (mt 25:31)

 

[nomadic5]

I grew up in a devoutly a Lutheran (LCMS) family. My life experiences have pushed me away from the Abrahamic God, in all His forms. Especially his New Testament form.

The (truly) Catholic way is as difficult as it gets, and yet such things as the rosary WORK. Being in the Real Presence of Christ in His Church works.. which is not to say that my life is a bowl of pit-less cherries, sunshine and kittens. But this life and all its difficulties passes away. Are we true to Christ until the end? that is all that matters. The devil and his cohorts makes it difficult, makes you think it is impossible to stay true.. but he is a liar and the Father of all Lies (not to mention he is a murderer.. wants to steal your soul for eternity)

 

[nomadic5]

Cackling From the Clouds

Why do you get a thrill out of imagining others burning in hell?

projection

classic case

 

[nomadic5]

The Gospel Truth About How to Get to Heaven

If you believe you can get to heaven by being a good person, you'll be shocked at what the Bible says. We unmask the biggest misconception in Christianity.

www.learnreligions.com

snip

How to Get To Heaven God's Way​

Because people can never be good enough to get to heaven, God provided a way, through justification, for them to be credited with the righteousness of Jesus Christ:


“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." (John 3:16, NIV)


Getting to heaven is not a matter of keeping the Commandments, because no one can. Neither is it a matter of being ethical, going to church, saying a certain number of prayers, making pilgrimages, or attaining levels of enlightenment. Those things may represent goodness by religious standards, but Jesus reveals what matters to him and his Father:


"In reply Jesus declared, 'I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.’” (John 3:3, NIV)


"Jesus answered, 'I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.'" (John 14:6, NIV)


Receiving salvation through Christ is a simple step-by-step process that has nothing to do with works or goodness. Eternal life in heaven comes through God's grace, a gift. It is gained through faith in Jesus, not performance.


The Bible is the final authority on heaven, and its truth is crystal clear:


"That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved." (Romans 10:9,

you should address this to someone who doesn't already know this.