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NFBW wrote: please confirm with precise language that what you are saying is that all predominantly black Christian churches in America are not Christian because they vote overwhelmingly four democratic party candidates I believe abortion should be legal. Does that mean none of these bkack left leaning Americans can be saved like you are? 22FEB09-POST#1098Any church that is fine with abortion is not a Christian church,
The pope is in full agreement with all official Catholic positions which are all conservative.Someone better tell the Pope...oh wait he is one.
Trolling pretty hard, aren't you?When did God personally anoint you?
I don't know what the official positions of all black churches are on abortion or gay marriage. But I can say that any churches that support those two things are not Christian.NFBW wrote: please confirm with precise language that what you are saying is that all predominantly black Christian churches in America are not Christian because they vote overwhelmingly four democratic party candidates I believe abortion should be legal. Does that mean none of these bkack left leaning Americans can be saved like you are? 22FEB09-POST#1098
Going to put me on ignore nowThe pope is in full agreement with all official Catholic positions which are all conservative.
Trolling pretty hard, aren't you?
I'll converse with you again if you can refrain from the namecalling.
Yes really. Those countries did not fail for lack of religious government. In fact, North Korea is probably th emost religious government and country on the planet. . Don't waste your time. But the most successful, developed nations in the world have definitely succeeded in part because of it.HAHAHAH!!! Really? Look at Communist shitholes like China, N. Korea, Venezuela, and the old USSR & Eastern Block/Warsaw Pact countries. There's your "secular" government for ya, frigging Communist!
Why did you support the war in Afghanistan?NFBW wrote: What you say means nothing. You are not God. You must be confused that believing in a god makes you a god and your word goes. I supported George W. Bush going into Afghanistan like 90% of Americans did including most of the religious left. We should’ve stayed focused there and never gone into Iraq. We never should have abandoned Afghanistan of military resources the way that GW Bush did. The black churches opposed the US invasion of Iraq and they are a key part of the religious left. If you don’t think black churches are Christians with different political views than yours, just put the big red letter R on your forehead, Thats about as racist as it gets. Think about what you’re saying. You’re saying that Pope John Paul II could only oppose the war because he hates Bush. the religious left and the black church opposed the war in Iraq same as the pope. And they are the ones that should have a say. Do you believe all black churches who vote Democrat are immoral people incapable of Christian living? 22FEB09-POST#1092
It was a misguided mistake leaving the One True Church, The RCC.The Protestant Reformation was a triumph over the Vatican and her Idolotry.
one CANNOT be a practicing Catholic while being a leftwinger.
Ummm.....aren't we conversing now?
Not answering the post where you were checkmated in your hypocrisy #1107? lol.NFBW wrote: Sure they can. It’s called voting for the lesser of two evils. Republican candidates can easily be seen as more are evil than Democrat candidates as a whole in the eyes of the pro-life Catholic who well formed conscience for evil treatment of viable innocent human beings. Bush a Republican started a needless war that killed hundreds of thousands which was enough evil to last for generations of voters.
Have you ever paid attention to
Forming Consciences for Faithful Citizenship - Part I - The U.S. Bishops’ Reflection on Catholic Teaching and Political Life
Forming Consciences for Faithful Citizenship - Part I - The U.S. Bishops’ Reflection on Catholic Teaching and Political Life
First|Prev|Next|Last Introduction Our redemption has a social dimension because "God, in Christ, redeems not only the individual person, but also . . ...www.usccb.org
Relevant Excerpts:35. There may be times when a Catholic who rejects a candidate's unacceptable position even on policies promoting an intrinsically evil act may reasonably decide to vote for that candidate for other morally grave reasons. Voting in this way would be permissible only for truly grave moral reasons, not to advance narrow interests or partisan preferences or to ignore a fundamental moral evil.36. When all candidates hold a position that promotes an intrinsically evil act, the conscientious voter faces a dilemma. The voter may decide to take the extraordinary step of not voting for any candidate or, after careful deliberation, may decide to vote for the candidate deemed less likely to advance such a morally flawed position and more likely to pursue other authentic human goods.37. In making these decisions, it is essential for Catholics to be guided by a well-formed conscience that recognizes that all issues do not carry the same moral weight and that the moral obligation to oppose policies promoting intrinsically evil acts has a special claim on our consciences and our actions. These decisions should take into account a candidate's commitments, character, integrity, and ability to influence a given issue. In the end, this is a decision to be made by each Catholic guided by a conscience formed by Catholic moral teaching.
A practicing Catholic can be pro-choice and allow other people to choose abortion while he remains personally opposed to the practice and chooses a candidate if Jesse evil. Why
Proof of that is almost half of Catholics vote Democrat and they take communion and guess what Mashmont the Vatican takes their offerings don’t they?
Catholic Democrats, even those who are pro-life, believe that there are morally grave reasons to vote for a pro-choice Democrat over a Republican who wants to criminalize abortion.
In "Forming Consciences for Faithful Citizenship," the U.S. bishops explicitly say:
- "As Catholics we are not single-issue voters." (#42)
- A voter "should take into account a candidate's commitments, character, integrity, and ability to influence a given issue. In the end, this is a decision to be made by each Catholic guided by a conscience formed by Catholic moral teaching." (#37)
- "A Catholic who rejects a candidate's unacceptable position [on abortion] may decide to vote for that candidate for other morally grave reasons." (#35)
My opinion is that your conscience Mashmont is not well formed yet.
22FEB09-POST#
Never mind, troll.Ummm.....aren't we conversing now?
Never mind, troll.
Trolls just can't help themselves, I guess. You try to be nice, but.....
That's hilarious. The entire thread is a troll.Never mind, troll.
Trolls just can't help themselves, I guess.
Why did you support the war in Afghanistan?
Checkmate. lol.
www.catholicnewsagency.com
Nibert and other Huntington students staged a walkout during their homeroom period Wednesday to protest the assembly. More than 100 students left their classrooms chanting, “Separate the church and state" and, “My faith, my choice.”
School security turned away reporters who tried to cover the demonstration.
Said the iggied troll.That's hilarious. The entire thread is a troll.
Why is it time right now?Ladies and gentlemen, it’s time to formally declare America a Christian nation.
Saint John Paul did not endorse the Afghanistan war. It's a lie to say he did.The Pope and I are batting 1000 on matters of war and peace. You, not so much Mashmont, If the Pope’s for war -I’m good. When he is for no war - I’m good.
Pope John Paul II "Ambassador Nicholson, this was an attack, not just on the United States, but on all of humanity. We must stop these people who kill in the name of God."
Then the Pope said something very profound and very revealing of his acute grasp of international terrorism. He said, "Ambassador Nicholson, this was an attack, not just on the United States, but on all of humanity.” And, then he added, “We must stop these people who kill in the name of God."
The Pope's words about the attackers of America on 9/11, and our need, indeed our moral obligation "to do something" was invaluable to the U.S. in assembling a "Coalition of the Willing," as President Bush called it. It was the Pope's instant and keen grasp of the situation – the Afghanistan-based launching of these terrorist attacks -- that compelled him to lend his moral influence to his friend and ally, the United States.The Pope and 9/11
Pope John Paul II, although a man of the Church, was possessed with an uncommon sense for the dynamics of globalism and the complexities of peoples and cultures.
He knew exactly what he was saying and the effect it would have on the other countries who were trying to decide whether or not to join us as military partners in Afghanistan against Al Qaeda and its collaborators. The Pope didn't pause, hesitate or equivocate when he communicated through me to our President and the leaders of like-minded countries to push back against those stateless terrorists who tried to align themselves under the protective wall of Afghanistan's sovereignty.
Pope John Paul II grew up under the repressive regimes of both the Nazis and the Communists. He knew well the effects on freedom and dignity that those with an ideological agenda and matching military resources could wreak on innocent people.
22FEB09-POST#1114
www.catholicarena.com
Saint John Paul did not endorse the Afghanistan war. It's a lie to say he did.
So why would you support a war against a country that did not attack the US,
2. As I said, the left did not oppose the Iraq War on moral grounds; they couldn't care less about morality. They just hated Bush and opposed everything he did.
The invasion of Iraq was insanely stupid for anyone who knows the middle east or the oil business.Atheists do start most wars. That's a fact.
And although I no longer support the Iraq invasion, I understand the logic behind it. George W. Bush knew history and saw how Hitler, the brutal atheist dictator took tens of millions of innocent lives during his murderous regime. Had someone taken out Hitler in the 1930s before he became really powerful, they could have prevented those deaths. Bush saw the pre-emptive strike against Saddam the same way. Our intelligence had reported Saddam was developing WMD, Saddam had threatened to annihilate the US, and Bush was going to stop it before it happened.
But whatever a noble goal that was, I now realize that you cannot kill thousands pre-emptively over something that might happen. I agree with St. John Paul on this. But the leftwing atheists opposed the war for reasons not nearly as noble. They hated George Bush and everything he did. They also hated America and protected Islamic terrorists over American liberty. So their goal was to oppose Bush and nothing else. They didn't give a damn about people dying.
