Iwo Jima- Uncommon Valor and wasted lives

[Oldguy]

There is no way that we would have defeated the Japanese by 1945 if we did not Island hop. Hell it took Mac Aurthur till late 44 to take the Philippines back.

We needed a base close enough to bomb Japan from and that was Tinian next to Saipan.

We did not have the modern equipment, doctrine or technology to go straight to Tinian and Saipan.

Further the naval Battles those island campaign caused gutted the Japanese Naval, Naval Air and Airforce. Another needed ingredient.

Some of you need to actually read the history of the Pacific War. Every Island we took was needed as a chain to allow us to take Tinian and Saipan. After that they were needed to protect the Bombers or in the case of Okinawa, give us a base close enough to invade Japan.

Even after 2 Atomic Bombs, the gutting of their industry, the inability to feed their people, the inability to provide fuel for winter fires, the Japanese Army REFUSED to surrender.

The ONLY reason Japan surrendered is that after the second Atomic Bomb the Emperor demanded a surrender. Even at that, the order from what they considered a "living God" the Army attempted a Coup to prevent the Emperor from surrendering.

And do not even start on the bullshit claim that the bombs were not needed. I have SOURCE documents to back up what I just said.

As for the Army in the Pacific, they were timid and half hearted up until Okinawa. Hell Mac Aurthur used the Australians for the tough jobs in his drive..

One Army General was relieved of Command at Makin ( Tarawa) for refusing to advance on an island abandoned by the Japanese. His timid and ineffective use of his troops tied up the back up forces for Tarawa.

MacArthur believed the Australians were not good troops and used them as little as possible, in fact, after Australian New Guinea was taken they were no longer used in the drive to Japan. The army and Marine Corps fought differently, as hated as MacArthur was his casualty rates were low and he did, perhaps because he had the room, avoid taking islands like Iwo and Tarawa. I think even Howlin Mad suggested Tarawa was an error. And the Palaus a total waste.

The intent of the central Pacific campaign was inadvertently revealed by Sec. of the Navy James Forrestal in 1945: "The raising of that flag on Suribachi means a MARINE CORPS for the next 500 years."

 

[there4eyeM]

Much if not all of war is waste. In the Pacific, many islands and pockets were left to 'dangle' as the noose tightened around Japan and the end became evident. On a macro scale, this eventually applied even to the home islands. There was in fact no need to invade Japan. The war was over and we only had to wait for them to realize it. That would have meant, however, seeing our Russian allies advance in the East. Contrary to what many seem to think, the government of the US at the time was opposed to Soviet expansion, so dropped the bombs to impress Joe Stalin about the seriousness of the US.

 

[editec]

There is no way that we would have defeated the Japanese by 1945 if we did not Island hop. Hell it took Mac Aurthur till late 44 to take the Philippines back.

We needed a base close enough to bomb Japan from and that was Tinian next to Saipan.

We did not have the modern equipment, doctrine or technology to go straight to Tinian and Saipan.

Further the naval Battles those island campaign caused gutted the Japanese Naval, Naval Air and Airforce. Another needed ingredient.

Some of you need to actually read the history of the Pacific War. Every Island we took was needed as a chain to allow us to take Tinian and Saipan. After that they were needed to protect the Bombers or in the case of Okinawa, give us a base close enough to invade Japan.

Even after 2 Atomic Bombs, the gutting of their industry, the inability to feed their people, the inability to provide fuel for winter fires, the Japanese Army REFUSED to surrender.

The ONLY reason Japan surrendered is that after the second Atomic Bomb the Emperor demanded a surrender. Even at that, the order from what they considered a "living God" the Army attempted a Coup to prevent the Emperor from surrendering.

And do not even start on the bullshit claim that the bombs were not needed. I have SOURCE documents to back up what I just said.

As for the Army in the Pacific, they were timid and half hearted up until Okinawa. Hell Mac Aurthur used the Australians for the tough jobs in his drive..

One Army General was relieved of Command at Makin ( Tarawa) for refusing to advance on an island abandoned by the Japanese. His timid and ineffective use of his troops tied up the back up forces for Tarawa.

Marine-written revisionist history, except for the part about the A-bombs and the attempted coup.

Not really.

It's a fairly accurate accessment of the campaign.

 

[Oldguy]

There is no way that we would have defeated the Japanese by 1945 if we did not Island hop. Hell it took Mac Aurthur till late 44 to take the Philippines back.

We needed a base close enough to bomb Japan from and that was Tinian next to Saipan.

We did not have the modern equipment, doctrine or technology to go straight to Tinian and Saipan.

Further the naval Battles those island campaign caused gutted the Japanese Naval, Naval Air and Airforce. Another needed ingredient.

Some of you need to actually read the history of the Pacific War. Every Island we took was needed as a chain to allow us to take Tinian and Saipan. After that they were needed to protect the Bombers or in the case of Okinawa, give us a base close enough to invade Japan.

Even after 2 Atomic Bombs, the gutting of their industry, the inability to feed their people, the inability to provide fuel for winter fires, the Japanese Army REFUSED to surrender.

The ONLY reason Japan surrendered is that after the second Atomic Bomb the Emperor demanded a surrender. Even at that, the order from what they considered a "living God" the Army attempted a Coup to prevent the Emperor from surrendering.

And do not even start on the bullshit claim that the bombs were not needed. I have SOURCE documents to back up what I just said.

As for the Army in the Pacific, they were timid and half hearted up until Okinawa. Hell Mac Aurthur used the Australians for the tough jobs in his drive..

One Army General was relieved of Command at Makin ( Tarawa) for refusing to advance on an island abandoned by the Japanese. His timid and ineffective use of his troops tied up the back up forces for Tarawa.

Marine-written revisionist history, except for the part about the A-bombs and the attempted coup.

Not really.

It's a fairly accurate accessment of the campaign.

Only if you accept the Marine's definition of "timid and ineffective" as meaning the Army didn't get enough of their own troops killed.

 

[JoeB131]

Don't they always?

No other outfit could take that island. It was literally Hell on Earth for both sides.

I seriously don't think it would have been taken that way today. Nobody would have the stomach for it.

You talk like that is a bad thing...

 

[regent]

Marine-written revisionist history, except for the part about the A-bombs and the attempted coup.

Not really.

It's a fairly accurate accessment of the campaign.

Only if you accept the Marine's definition of "timid and ineffective" as meaning the Army didn't get enough of their own troops killed.

The army used some National Guard divisions early in the Pacific and until some of the old poltical-Brass was weeded out, they were not as effective as some other army divisions. Some national guard generals excel with the garrison type political-military and others with the combat-military. Some had to be replaced. Wonder if that is still a factor today?

 

[whitehall]

A Marine working party raised the 2nd Flag on Suribachi and Joe Rosenthal snapped the greatest war photo in history. In a couple of days three of the Flag raisers would be killed in battle and a callus administration would pluck the other Marines off the Island with their survivors guilt and stress syndrome and parade them in front of an audience like trained monkeys to finance the freaking war. It is said that the dying president visibly gasped when he saw the list of Marine casualties.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Much if not all of war is waste. In the Pacific, many islands and pockets were left to 'dangle' as the noose tightened around Japan and the end became evident. On a macro scale, this eventually applied even to the home islands. There was in fact no need to invade Japan. The war was over and we only had to wait for them to realize it. That would have meant, however, seeing our Russian allies advance in the East. Contrary to what many seem to think, the government of the US at the time was opposed to Soviet expansion, so dropped the bombs to impress Joe Stalin about the seriousness of the US.

Not supported by the facts. There is zero evidence that ANYONE in the Government dropped the Bombs for any other reason then to force Japan to surrender.

As to surrender, the Army controlled the Government, the peace elements did not have the votes to carry the issue. And in fact with out the DIRECT intervention of the Emperor there would have been no peace. And he only intervened AFTER the second atomic attack. And even then the Army attempted a Coup to stop him.

Japan could not feed itself, could not provide fuel for heating for the coming winter and the Army REFUSED to surrender. Their position was that all they would accept was a cessation of hostilities with a return to the pre December 1941 Border, and nothing given up in China. They repeated that demand after BOTH Atomic bombs. That was their position even after we decimated their industry and population centers.

The simple fact is with out those atomic bombs the Emperor would not have intervened and we would have invaded a home Island around October. That would have resulted in MILLIONS of dead Japanese. Civilians mostly. The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. And Saipan and Okinawa proved most of them would have done it. We would have had around 100000 dead and about a million casualties as predicted by the Government.

 

[JoeB131]

Not supported by the facts. There is zero evidence that ANYONE in the Government dropped the Bombs for any other reason then to force Japan to surrender.

As to surrender, the Army controlled the Government, the peace elements did not have the votes to carry the issue. And in fact with out the DIRECT intervention of the Emperor there would have been no peace. And he only intervened AFTER the second atomic attack. And even then the Army attempted a Coup to stop him.

Japan could not feed itself, could not provide fuel for heating for the coming winter and the Army REFUSED to surrender. Their position was that all they would accept was a cessation of hostilities with a return to the pre December 1941 Border, and nothing given up in China. They repeated that demand after BOTH Atomic bombs. That was their position even after we decimated their industry and population centers.

The simple fact is with out those atomic bombs the Emperor would not have intervened and we would have invaded a home Island around October. That would have resulted in MILLIONS of dead Japanese. Civilians mostly. The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. And Saipan and Okinawa proved most of them would have done it. We would have had around 100000 dead and about a million casualties as predicted by the Government.

I know that this is the LIE we tell ourselves, that the Bombs forced surrender so it was okay to use them.

Time to get real.

The Japanese were already putting out feelers for surrender, and the only real sticking point was the status of the Emperor. Most of the sensible people who knew Japanese Culture said this was fine, it would be impossible for us to maintain order in Japan without him, anyway.

Unfortunately, there was a whole lobby in Washington, led by General Groves, who just wanted to use this new toy.

The generals, particularly Ike and MacArthur, were totally against it.

in [July] 1945... Secretary of War Stimson, visiting my headquarters in Germany, informed me that our government was preparing to drop an atomic bomb on Japan. I was one of those who felt that there were a number of cogent reasons to question the wisdom of such an act. ...the Secretary, upon giving me the news of the successful bomb test in New Mexico, and of the plan for using it, asked for my reaction, apparently expecting a vigorous assent.

"During his recitation of the relevant facts, I had been conscious of a feeling of depression and so I voiced to him my grave misgivings, first on the basis of my belief that Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary, and secondly because I thought that our country should avoid shocking world opinion by the use of a weapon whose employment was, I thought, no longer mandatory as a measure to save American lives. It was my belief that Japan was, at that very moment, seeking some way to surrender with a minimum loss of 'face'. The Secretary was deeply perturbed by my attitude..."

-Dwight Eisenhower, Mandate For Change, pg. 380

Norman Cousins was a consultant to General MacArthur during the American occupation of Japan. Cousins writes of his conversations with MacArthur, "MacArthur's views about the decision to drop the atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were starkly different from what the general public supposed." He continues, "When I asked General MacArthur about the decision to drop the bomb, I was surprised to learn he had not even been consulted. What, I asked, would his advice have been? He replied that he saw no military justification for the dropping of the bomb. The war might have ended weeks earlier, he said, if the United States had agreed, as it later did anyway, to the retention of the institution of the emperor."

Norman Cousins, The Pathology of Power, pg. 65, 70-71.

Here's the reality. The atomic bombs didn't change Japan's mind. the USSR's entry into the Pacific War did. Prior to that, they had hopes that Stalin (with whom they had a non-aggression pact) could broker a peace deal that would leave Japan with some of their gains in Manchuria, Korea and Taiwan.

Once the battle hardened Red Army entered the war, and rolled up the Kwantung Army in Manchuria in less than week, Japan was faced with the real proposition that their country would be partitioned like Germany, the horror stories of what the Soviets were doing in their section of occuppied Germany fresh in everyone's mind.

 

[editec]

There is no way that we would have defeated the Japanese by 1945 if we did not Island hop. Hell it took Mac Aurthur till late 44 to take the Philippines back.

We needed a base close enough to bomb Japan from and that was Tinian next to Saipan.

We did not have the modern equipment, doctrine or technology to go straight to Tinian and Saipan.

Further the naval Battles those island campaign caused gutted the Japanese Naval, Naval Air and Airforce. Another needed ingredient.

Some of you need to actually read the history of the Pacific War. Every Island we took was needed as a chain to allow us to take Tinian and Saipan. After that they were needed to protect the Bombers or in the case of Okinawa, give us a base close enough to invade Japan.

Even after 2 Atomic Bombs, the gutting of their industry, the inability to feed their people, the inability to provide fuel for winter fires, the Japanese Army REFUSED to surrender.

The ONLY reason Japan surrendered is that after the second Atomic Bomb the Emperor demanded a surrender. Even at that, the order from what they considered a "living God" the Army attempted a Coup to prevent the Emperor from surrendering.

And do not even start on the bullshit claim that the bombs were not needed. I have SOURCE documents to back up what I just said.

As for the Army in the Pacific, they were timid and half hearted up until Okinawa. Hell Mac Aurthur used the Australians for the tough jobs in his drive..

One Army General was relieved of Command at Makin ( Tarawa) for refusing to advance on an island abandoned by the Japanese. His timid and ineffective use of his troops tied up the back up forces for Tarawa.

Marine-written revisionist history, except for the part about the A-bombs and the attempted coup.

You think so?

What written above is not true?

You know that I am no fan of RTG, but in this case?

He's spot on.

 

[gipper]

Not supported by the facts. There is zero evidence that ANYONE in the Government dropped the Bombs for any other reason then to force Japan to surrender.

As to surrender, the Army controlled the Government, the peace elements did not have the votes to carry the issue. And in fact with out the DIRECT intervention of the Emperor there would have been no peace. And he only intervened AFTER the second atomic attack. And even then the Army attempted a Coup to stop him.

Japan could not feed itself, could not provide fuel for heating for the coming winter and the Army REFUSED to surrender. Their position was that all they would accept was a cessation of hostilities with a return to the pre December 1941 Border, and nothing given up in China. They repeated that demand after BOTH Atomic bombs. That was their position even after we decimated their industry and population centers.

The simple fact is with out those atomic bombs the Emperor would not have intervened and we would have invaded a home Island around October. That would have resulted in MILLIONS of dead Japanese. Civilians mostly. The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. And Saipan and Okinawa proved most of them would have done it. We would have had around 100000 dead and about a million casualties as predicted by the Government.

I know that this is the LIE we tell ourselves, that the Bombs forced surrender so it was okay to use them.

Time to get real.

The Japanese were already putting out feelers for surrender, and the only real sticking point was the status of the Emperor. Most of the sensible people who knew Japanese Culture said this was fine, it would be impossible for us to maintain order in Japan without him, anyway.

Unfortunately, there was a whole lobby in Washington, led by General Groves, who just wanted to use this new toy.

The generals, particularly Ike and MacArthur, were totally against it.

in [July] 1945... Secretary of War Stimson, visiting my headquarters in Germany, informed me that our government was preparing to drop an atomic bomb on Japan. I was one of those who felt that there were a number of cogent reasons to question the wisdom of such an act. ...the Secretary, upon giving me the news of the successful bomb test in New Mexico, and of the plan for using it, asked for my reaction, apparently expecting a vigorous assent.

"During his recitation of the relevant facts, I had been conscious of a feeling of depression and so I voiced to him my grave misgivings, first on the basis of my belief that Japan was already defeated and that dropping the bomb was completely unnecessary, and secondly because I thought that our country should avoid shocking world opinion by the use of a weapon whose employment was, I thought, no longer mandatory as a measure to save American lives. It was my belief that Japan was, at that very moment, seeking some way to surrender with a minimum loss of 'face'. The Secretary was deeply perturbed by my attitude..."

-Dwight Eisenhower, Mandate For Change, pg. 380

Norman Cousins was a consultant to General MacArthur during the American occupation of Japan. Cousins writes of his conversations with MacArthur, "MacArthur's views about the decision to drop the atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were starkly different from what the general public supposed." He continues, "When I asked General MacArthur about the decision to drop the bomb, I was surprised to learn he had not even been consulted. What, I asked, would his advice have been? He replied that he saw no military justification for the dropping of the bomb. The war might have ended weeks earlier, he said, if the United States had agreed, as it later did anyway, to the retention of the institution of the emperor."

Norman Cousins, The Pathology of Power, pg. 65, 70-71.

Here's the reality. The atomic bombs didn't change Japan's mind. the USSR's entry into the Pacific War did. Prior to that, they had hopes that Stalin (with whom they had a non-aggression pact) could broker a peace deal that would leave Japan with some of their gains in Manchuria, Korea and Taiwan.

Once the battle hardened Red Army entered the war, and rolled up the Kwantung Army in Manchuria in less than week, Japan was faced with the real proposition that their country would be partitioned like Germany, the horror stories of what the Soviets were doing in their section of occuppied Germany fresh in everyone's mind.

Yes...Japan had sought surrender terms as early as 1943, but thanks to that warmongering fool FDR for demanding unconditional surrender, thousands of unnecessary deaths on both sides were the consequence.

However this in no way denigrates the amazing fighting spirit and sacrifice of the American fighting man...those men who fell there are true American heroes. Though it is apparent today, as it was then, that Iwo Jima and Okinawa were completely unnecessary.

And Truman's dropping two a-bombs on women, children, and old men was one of the most heinous war crimes of all time. The Japanese were totally tapped out by August '45. Then Truman let Hirohito stay on the thrown anyway. WTF!!! Disgusting.

It is too bad Americans are told lies about the war in the Pacific...and so many have chosen to believe the lies. Lies promoted by the ever powerful State.

 

[there4eyeM]

Much if not all of war is waste. In the Pacific, many islands and pockets were left to 'dangle' as the noose tightened around Japan and the end became evident. On a macro scale, this eventually applied even to the home islands. There was in fact no need to invade Japan. The war was over and we only had to wait for them to realize it. That would have meant, however, seeing our Russian allies advance in the East. Contrary to what many seem to think, the government of the US at the time was opposed to Soviet expansion, so dropped the bombs to impress Joe Stalin about the seriousness of the US.

Not supported by the facts. There is zero evidence that ANYONE in the Government dropped the Bombs for any other reason then to force Japan to surrender.

As to surrender, the Army controlled the Government, the peace elements did not have the votes to carry the issue. And in fact with out the DIRECT intervention of the Emperor there would have been no peace. And he only intervened AFTER the second atomic attack. And even then the Army attempted a Coup to stop him.

Japan could not feed itself, could not provide fuel for heating for the coming winter and the Army REFUSED to surrender. Their position was that all they would accept was a cessation of hostilities with a return to the pre December 1941 Border, and nothing given up in China. They repeated that demand after BOTH Atomic bombs. That was their position even after we decimated their industry and population centers.

The simple fact is with out those atomic bombs the Emperor would not have intervened and we would have invaded a home Island around October. That would have resulted in MILLIONS of dead Japanese. Civilians mostly. The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. And Saipan and Okinawa proved most of them would have done it. We would have had around 100000 dead and about a million casualties as predicted by the Government.

The war-making ability of Japan was totally destroyed. They could no longer project power. Encircled, cut off, unable to produce or eat, the end would have come without the US bearing the onus of being the first to use the bomb.

As for evidence in the government; uh, so? Since when can we trust that as a source? Remember, Pearl Harbor was a 'surprise'.

 

[Unkotare]

The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. .

Don't be ridiculous. Old ladies and children - already starving to death - would not have stormed the beaches with bamboo. Don't be absurd. People were already fed up with the war before it had even gotten that bad. Some desperate people in the military may have written down their fantasies about what they wished would happen, but try to stay grounded in reality.

 

[regent]

The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. .

Don't be ridiculous. Old ladies and children - already starving to death - would not have stormed the beaches with bamboo. Don't be absurd. People were already fed up with the war before it had even gotten that bad. Some desperate people in the military may have written down their fantasies about what they wished would happen, but try to stay grounded in reality.

Too often people believe that all people are the same as their people, their culture. One of the things the American GI discovered early in the war, after they had been told the Japanese could not see too well, or design an airplane, was that most Japanese would rather die than surrender. Germans knew when to surrender as did the Americans but not the Japanese. One reason the huge casualty figures from some of those islands was simply the Japanese soldier fought to the end. The question then became, would the Japanese do the same when their home islands were invaded; it was believed they would and so a number of suggestions were put forth, not just the potential A bomb, but everything, including poison gas.
If the Japanese were tired of the war, so were many Americans The Germans had surrendered and many Americans looked on the war as being almost over. Those GI's being sent from Europe to the Pacific felt it was unfair as did much of the public. And the
American citizen, unlike his Japanese counterpart, had some say in the conduct of the war. America wanted the war to end.

 

[gipper]

The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. .

Don't be ridiculous. Old ladies and children - already starving to death - would not have stormed the beaches with bamboo. Don't be absurd. People were already fed up with the war before it had even gotten that bad. Some desperate people in the military may have written down their fantasies about what they wished would happen, but try to stay grounded in reality.

Too often people believe that all people are the same as their people, their culture. One of the things the American GI discovered early in the war, after they had been told the Japanese could not see too well, or design an airplane, was that most Japanese would rather die than surrender. Germans knew when to surrender as did the Americans but not the Japanese. One reason the huge casualty figures from some of those islands was simply the Japanese soldier fought to the end. The question then became, would the Japanese do the same when their home islands were invaded; it was believed they would and so a number of suggestions were put forth, not just the potential A bomb, but everything, including poison gas.
If the Japanese were tired of the war, so were many Americans The Germans had surrendered and many Americans looked on the war as being almost over. Those GI's being sent from Europe to the Pacific felt it was unfair as did much of the public. And the
American citizen, unlike his Japanese counterpart, had some say in the conduct of the war. America wanted the war to end.

The war in the Pacific could have ended well before August '45, had we not demanded unconditional surrender. The only reason thousands of Japanese and Americans died in the Pacific war, was because of FDR's absurd unconditional surrender requirement.

And plus, keep in mind that FDR PUSHED Japan to war by his ridiculous demands and refusal to negotiate terms prior to Pearl Harbor. He set it all up.

In my view, the war in the Pacific should never have happened had we had real leadership in our government and White House, rather than deceitful fools.

But the deceit continues unabated today with the fools that now occupy Congress and the WH.

 

[JoeB131]

Yes...Japan had sought surrender terms as early as 1943, but thanks to that warmongering fool FDR for demanding unconditional surrender, thousands of unnecessary deaths on both sides were the consequence.

Get real dude. No American President could have demanded anything LESS than unconditional surrender from Japan after Pearl Harbor.

A poll taken after the bombings showed that 22% wanted to drop as many bombs as we had on Japan before it had a chance to surrender. And that was in 1945, when the war was a lot less popular than it was in 1943.

There was also the bigger consideration that because less than unconditional surrender happened in World War I, Hitler was able to claim Germany's army was "Stabbed in the back" by politicians who sold them out. We didn't want some future Japanese or German politician pulling that shit.

All that said, the use of Atomic Bombs did not end the war. Soviet intervention did.

 

[Redbone]

The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. .

Don't be ridiculous. Old ladies and children - already starving to death - would not have stormed the beaches with bamboo. Don't be absurd. People were already fed up with the war before it had even gotten that bad. Some desperate people in the military may have written down their fantasies about what they wished would happen, but try to stay grounded in reality.

Coulda, shoulda and history revision abounds from those that view World War Two as a movie. Here is hint people, it was real, it was WAR. All this pansy based armchair quarterbacking complete with the benefit of hindsight just proves some would like nothing more than to discredit that generation and how they came together and sacrificed to pull off the greatest war victory ever known to mankind.

Boys and girls, America did not start World War Two but the fact that we damn well finished it successfully irks the hell out of some. Too bad.

 

[regent]

Unconditional surrender, used early in our history by Grant, was not unheard of before WWII. FDR's goal was to prevent the Axis from rebuilding as it had done after WWI and with the emergence of Hitler. In this regard unconditonal surrender seems to have worked, look at Germany, Italy and Japan today.
Secondly, the emperor was spared, secret negotiations were taking place and Truman spelled out what unconditional surrender meant to the Japan. In fact, America needed the emperor, it was the emporer that called it quits and helped in the occupation.
Germany had surrendered and can you imagine the Republican glee if FDR had said, "They all gotta surrender unconditionally except Japan cause they got an emperor."
The surrender policy, rightly or wrongly, was to rebuild the axis in such a manner that in twenty years or so we would not be fighting the same enemies again.
In any case, many in Japan would still have wanted to fight on to the end because it was part of their culture.

 

[Unkotare]

The Army defense plan included a command for all able bodied Japanese civilians to arm themselves with bamboo spears and mass assault any landing area. .

Don't be ridiculous. Old ladies and children - already starving to death - would not have stormed the beaches with bamboo. Don't be absurd. People were already fed up with the war before it had even gotten that bad. Some desperate people in the military may have written down their fantasies about what they wished would happen, but try to stay grounded in reality.

Coulda, shoulda and history revision abounds from those that view World War Two as a movie...

What revision?

 

[Redbone]

Don't be ridiculous. Old ladies and children - already starving to death - would not have stormed the beaches with bamboo. Don't be absurd. People were already fed up with the war before it had even gotten that bad. Some desperate people in the military may have written down their fantasies about what they wished would happen, but try to stay grounded in reality.

Coulda, shoulda and history revision abounds from those that view World War Two as a movie...

What revision?

Try reading a few history books dated before the 60's. You shall learn.. . You may not like it but you'll learn...