Joe Biden/Sarah Palin Debate Conversation Thread

[Stoner]

He wasn't pretending. He lost his wife and year old daughter in a car wreck. Do you have any idea how that feels?

Bad acting. He wasn't remotely close to crying. It was a lame attempt to connect to middle-America. He wanted everyone to see he's human and not some rich, out-of-touch politician.

Didn't work.

 

[dilloduck]

He wasn't pretending. He lost his wife and year old daughter in a car wreck. Do you have any idea how that feels?

Sorta like Hiilary when she was behind in the polls ?

 

[eots]

no the wtc was not a hologram..but it did fall into its own footprint at free fall speed..with relatively small fires and was completely excluded from the 911 commission report...and it strikes me and other intelligent people as very odd..that such random uneven fire..and structural damage.. could create such a controlled collapse only on one side of wtc 7 was damaged..which is all the more reason the building would fall unevenly...yet it came down in a controlled manner at free fall speed........but that's another story

 

[DiveCon]

Bad acting. He wasn't remotely close to crying. It was a lame attempt to connect to middle-America. He wanted everyone to see he's human and not some rich, out-of-touch politician.

Didn't work.

Sorta like Hiilary when she was behind in the polls ?

meh, losing a wife and child like that, i give him the benefit of any doubt on that one

 

[del]

...and it strikes me and other intelligent people as very odd..

 

[dilloduck]

meh, losing a wife and child like that, i give him the benefit of any doubt on that one

Personally? of course but this is politics !! blood and guts --stay out of the kitchen type stuff !!!

 

[DiveCon]

Personally? of course but this is politics !! blood and guts --stay out of the kitchen type stuff !!!

not when recalling an event like that
cut the man some slack on such a personal event

 

[Chris]

Bad acting. He wasn't remotely close to crying. It was a lame attempt to connect to middle-America. He wanted everyone to see he's human and not some rich, out-of-touch politician.

Didn't work.

Biden rides the train back to Delaware every night.

How many Senators ride public transportation to and from work every day?

 

[jreeves]

Biden rides the train back to Delaware every night.

How many Senators ride public transportation to and from work every day?

How many Senators have the worst record in wasting tax money...Biden

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLe3_1a_KUs]YouTube - Biden Has Worst Possible Rating For Wasteful Spending[/ame]

 

[Modbert]

meh, losing a wife and child like that, i give him the benefit of any doubt on that one

And he was also talking about his son who is being deployed to Iraq today/tomorrow.

 

[DiveCon]

And he was also talking about his son who is being deployed to Iraq today/tomorrow.

that whole thing isnt an issue with me
its about the same as the BS attacks against Palin

 

[Luissa]

I watched the debate with a friend who knows nothing about what is going on and politics and had heard neither really speak before. Her comment was Palin was hard to follow about after three seconds and Biden answered directly.
It was very clear Biden knew what he was talking about Foreign relations especially israel and Palin had no clue. And to suggest the VP isn't really apart of the executive branch, give me a break! Well I guess when you have a journalism degree you don't know much about constitutional law!

 

[N4mddissent]

Biden did not grow up wealthy. And I cannot imagine, absolutely cannot imagine, what sort of mark it would leave if my daughter was killed. He lost a wife and daughter and almost his sons. He was elected to the Senate for the first time in Nov. 1972. His wife and daughter were killed and his sons severely injured in Dec. 1972, just weeks after he won the election and a few days before Christmas. He initially decided to resign his newly won seat, but the Senate Majority leader came and asked him to reconsider. He kept the seat but refused to leave his sons' bedside in the hospital where both were in critical condition. He was sworn in at their bedside. He takes the train to Washington, because after his sons recovered and he was a single Dad, he insisted on being there for them and so for 26 years, he rode the train home (4 hours round trip) every single night rather than stay in Washington so he could be there, tuck them in, read stories, etc... As a divorced dad who is a single dad half the time, I can tell you that dedication of that caliber is not always easy, but nothing compares to the eyes of your child when they have been waiting to see you and you're there. No, I don't think he's faking at all. He loves his kids.

 

[DiveCon]

I watched the debate with a friend who knows nothing about what is going on and politics and had heard neither really speak before. Her comment was Palin was hard to follow about after three seconds and Biden answered directly.
It was very clear Biden knew what he was talking about Foreign relations especially israel and Palin had no clue. And to suggest the VP isn't really apart of the executive branch, give me a break! Well I guess when you have a journalism degree you don't know much about constitutional law!

the VP is part of both
the VP functions as President of the senate

 

[N4mddissent]

And to suggest the VP isn't really apart of the executive branch, give me a break! Well I guess when you have a journalism degree you don't know much about constitutional law!

Yeah, Palin did say she agreed with Cheney's interpretation, but to be honest, I don't think she really understood that whole separation of powers, constitutional conflict that's been ongoing throughout the Bush years. She looked like she was treading water a bit there and took a shot. The issue is Cheney has enunciated the idea that he is not subject to certain limits and restrictions because the V.P. presides over the Senate which makes him part of the Legislative Branch. This is obviously ridiculous. Even he knows its bullshit, because when faced with subpoenas or investigations, he's quick to use "executive privilege". Palin agreeing with him could be a sign of more Constitutional subversion, but I really just don't think she knew.

 

[DiveCon]

Yeah, Palin did say she agreed with Cheney's interpretation, but to be honest, I don't think she really understood that whole separation of powers, constitutional conflict that's been ongoing throughout the Bush years. She looked like she was treading water a bit there and took a shot. The issue is Cheney has enunciated the idea that he is not subject to certain limits and restrictions because the V.P. presides over the Senate which makes him part of the Legislative Branch. This is obviously ridiculous. Even he knows its bullshit, because when faced with subpoenas or investigations, he's quick to use "executive privilege". Palin agreeing with him could be a sign of more Constitutional subversion, but I really just don't think she knew.

its not bullshit, its FACT
the VP is part of BOTH

http://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/common/briefing/Vice_President.htm

notice the address?

 

[N4mddissent]

the VP is part of both
the VP functions as President of the senate

No, the VP is part of the executive branch. That's why his duties are listed in Article 1. The whole separation of powers thing falls apart if the powers aren't separate. He has 1 duty even associated with the senate and that's to vote to break a tie. If it's not a tie, he doesn't even get to vote. It's obvious the founders need some way to resolve issues that are a tie in the senate since with 2 senators from every state, you would always have an even number. They chose to let the VP do it. But if they had wanted him to be in the legislative branch, they would not have listed this duty under Article 1 which outlines the executive branch. Cheney is attacking the nation more successfully than any terrorists when he tries to undermine the principles of the Constitution.

 

[Chris]

McCain should have selected Tina Fey.........she's smarter.

 

[DiveCon]

No, the VP is part of the executive branch. That's why his duties are listed in Article 1. The whole separation of powers thing falls apart if the powers aren't separate. He has 1 duty even associated with the senate and that's to vote to break a tie. If it's not a tie, he doesn't even get to vote. It's obvious the founders need some way to resolve issues that are a tie in the senate since with 2 senators from every state, you would always have an even number. They chose to let the VP do it. But if they had wanted him to be in the legislative branch, they would not have listed this duty under Article 1 which outlines the executive branch. Cheney is attacking the nation more successfully than any terrorists when he tries to undermine the principles of the Constitution.

did you bother to read the link?

 

[N4mddissent]

When I typed my response the link wasn't up yet, but since then I have read it. It was obvious they created the position before they even gave him the duty to preside over the Senate. And when they created the position, they placed it in the executive branch. Otherwise there would not have been complaints even then that it seemed to violate the separation of powers. Why would it violate it if they intended it to be in the legislative branch. They finally decided to do allow him that duty because basically the V.P. job would have been pointless and unnecessary without that duty.

But having a duty that involves the legislative branch does not make you part of the legislative branch. The duty of presidential impeachment falls upon the congress. That doesn't make congress part of the executive branch. I think the clearest way to understand is to ask these simple questions. Can the V.P. introduce legislation as a Senator? No. Can he even vote on legislation if it's not a tie vote? No. Can he even serve as president of the senate if the head of the executive branch is being impeached? No.

But if you are absolutely determined to interpret all of this as the V.P. being part of the legislative branch, then you need to prove to me that he is in the executive branch. It can be argued whether the founding fathers intended it to be part of the executive branch or legislative branch (though I think it's foolish), but it is straining one's integrity to deny that the founding fathers did not intend to have separation of powers.