Just 51,000 people have enrolled in Federal Obamacare exchanges???

[Trajan]

If the Republicans had not shutdown the government, glitches in the Healthcare Insurance Exchange Websites which are stopping people from registering would be in headlines, but no the headlines are about damage the republican shutdown is going to the economy and the problems it's causing for people across the nation.

The Republican forced shutdown of government to defund Obamacare was an act of pure stupidity. In Sept, Fox News was reporting the support of the ACA had increased by 8 points. At the same time all of the polls were showing that the public was not supportive of a shutdown. So what did the Tea Party Republicans in the house do? They move ahead with a forced shutdown over defunding Obamacare. As a result Republicans now have the lowest approval rating ever. Now they turn to the Democrats, hat in hand asking for an out. During this whole process, Harry Reid and Obama were just watching the Republicans commit suicide, simply amazing.

what does that have to do with what we are discussing? did you cross post by accident?

 

[orBeMezaTtnoD]

If the Republicans had not shutdown the government, glitches in the Healthcare Insurance Exchange Websites which are stopping people from registering would be in headlines, but no the headlines are about damage the republican shutdown is going to the economy and the problems it's causing for people across the nation.

The Republican forced shutdown of government to defund Obamacare was an act of pure stupidity. In Sept, Fox News was reporting the support of the ACA had increased by 8 points. At the same time all of the polls were showing that the public was not supportive of a shutdown. So what did the Tea Party Republicans in the house do? They move ahead with a forced shutdown over defunding Obamacare. As a result Republicans now have the lowest approval rating ever. Now they turn to the Democrats, hat in hand asking for an out. During this whole process, Harry Reid and Obama were just watching the Republicans commit suicide, simply amazing.

When will you learn that no matter what the poll results the media (in this case the AP) will couch them to disparage the republicans and conservatives - if you researched these poll results you'd find that they are skewed (as usual) and magically appeared when Obama was going down for not acting on the funds for families of dead military - this is nothing more than the media providing cover for their Messiah.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

...and it happens again.
I have seen it so often. Reasonable people enter a thread with solid points...and the opposing view scatters like crickets.

 

[LoneLaugher]

...and it happens again.
I have seen it so often. Reasonable people enter a thread with solid points...and the opposing view scatters like crickets.

Your example is not complete.

Lets say the accident caused a collapsed lung, brain damage and left him on life support for 6 months? What then? D'oh!

Also........the fact that your governor is a dick and refused to expand Medicare is not an indictment of Obamacare. It is an indictment of your Governor.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

...and it happens again.
I have seen it so often. Reasonable people enter a thread with solid points...and the opposing view scatters like crickets.

Your example is not complete.

Lets say the accident caused a collapsed lung, brain damage and left him on life support for 6 months? What then? D'oh!

Also........the fact that your governor is a dick and refused to expand Medicare is not an indictment of Obamacare. It is an indictment of your Governor.

That would be Medicaid not Medicare, notwithstanding...so I see you are admitting to what we have been saying all along:
1) Affordable ACA for most who will be on the plan, the young, is not really insurance at all - it is a major medical plan like we said it was, not insurance.
2) ACA only works if the very people you need the most to have a successful exchange - would have to be subsidized..and that is just to get major medical only.
3) Major Medical plans have been around for years and years - at a lower cost than ACA - so, like we said, Obamacare raises cost for participants, not lowers it.

Everyone should give you rep points for getting past the partisan bickering and into the realities of ACA that we have been saying for months now.
Congratulations!

 

[LoneLaugher]

...and it happens again.
I have seen it so often. Reasonable people enter a thread with solid points...and the opposing view scatters like crickets.

Your example is not complete.

Lets say the accident caused a collapsed lung, brain damage and left him on life support for 6 months? What then? D'oh!

Also........the fact that your governor is a dick and refused to expand Medicare is not an indictment of Obamacare. It is an indictment of your Governor.

That would be Medicaid not Medicare, notwithstanding...so I see you are admitting to what we have been saying all along:
1) Affordable ACA for most who will be on the plan, the young, is not really insurance at all - it is a major medical plan like we said it was, not insurance.
2) ACA only works if the very people you need the most to have a successful exchange - would have to be subsidized..and that is just to get major medical only.
3) Major Medical plans have been around for years and years - at a lower cost than ACA - so, like we said, Obamacare raises cost for participants, not lowers it.

Everyone should give you rep points for getting past the partisan bickering and into the realities of ACA that we have been saying for months now.
Congratulations!

You are still wrong.

The plans are far richer than your 'major medical' plans. The preventive care benefits alone make the additional premiums worth it for a young person.

You did not concede the point about the value of being insured in the event of a really bad accident. I wonder why?

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Your example is not complete.

Lets say the accident caused a collapsed lung, brain damage and left him on life support for 6 months? What then? D'oh!

Also........the fact that your governor is a dick and refused to expand Medicare is not an indictment of Obamacare. It is an indictment of your Governor.

That would be Medicaid not Medicare, notwithstanding...so I see you are admitting to what we have been saying all along:
1) Affordable ACA for most who will be on the plan, the young, is not really insurance at all - it is a major medical plan like we said it was, not insurance.
2) ACA only works if the very people you need the most to have a successful exchange - would have to be subsidized..and that is just to get major medical only.
3) Major Medical plans have been around for years and years - at a lower cost than ACA - so, like we said, Obamacare raises cost for participants, not lowers it.

Everyone should give you rep points for getting past the partisan bickering and into the realities of ACA that we have been saying for months now.
Congratulations!

You are still wrong.

The plans are far richer than your 'major medical' plans. The preventive care benefits alone make the additional premiums worth it for a young person.

You did not concede the point about the value of being insured in the event of a really bad accident. I wonder why?

And there you go again.....what preventative care? How many 25 year olds need a colonoscopy? Or a PSA? How many 25 year old girls need mammograms?
They DON'T NEED IT. And won't get it.
Also - are you being obtuse, or are you really having this much trouble comprehending?
I didn't concede the value of insurance if really bad injury or sickness?? Dude...what do you think Major Medical is?? That is my point...you will only get value from it IF you are seriously injured or...wait for it....MAJOR MEDICAL.

 

[Flopper]

Well over 100,000 people signed up in the first week. It will snowball from there. One is being willfully obtuse if one expected everything to work perfectly on Day One.

Hawaii is rebooting their exchange to restart on October 15.

I'm telling you, rumors of ObamaCare's demise are greatly exaggerated.

no reasonable person is talking demise G, but, we may hit a level of awfulness that really turns the tables, making it possible that it could be suspended wholesale, and no I don't mean now, I mean say next year.

some ifs-

- if the invincibles and healthy don't sign up in mass?

- if as it appears ( operative word being appears) that folks in the middle income brackets too, are paying more or even at par lose, their doctor, higher deductibles yada yada, dead plans....?

- if the sites don't deliver in full, if there is a constant drumbeat of dissatisfaction with the ability to sign up etc.....the danger is people tune out....even if they begin to work very well, the attention span of most Americans is low and they will just say fuck it, been there done that, thats a possibility.
No matter how many 'navigators' you add etc. the lower classes, who never had it, will most definitely benefit getting on and will go the extra mile, but the others, the ones they need to bankroll this?..... Will they?

- even if HHS says they have 10 million people signed up IN a plan etc., see points 1 and 2, they can frame it as a success in that respect but, that will not abrogate points 1 and 2.

- as to the 'demise', well, in the run up to 2014 midterms expect to see umpteen replays of Obama himself- "If you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor. Period. If you like your health care plan, you will be able to keep your health care plan. Period. No one will take it away. No matter what"........

or "I also have a plan that will save the average family $2500.00 on their premiums. My plan requires all employers to contribute towards health coverage for their employees or towards the cost of the public plan. Under my plan a typical family will save $2,500 each year. We will realize tremendous savings within the health care system from improving efficiency and quality and reducing wasted expenditures system-wide".

those are not right wing talking points, he, said it, many many times.....*shrugs*, long road to hoe......

You know you are making good points when no one answers your post.
Reasonable people have been saying all along that this will not work without millions..MILLIONS...of young people buying insurance to finance older/sick folks who will take way more out than pay in.
But if you are a young person, whose hours were cut recently because of said ACA mind you, why on earth would you take 25% of your income or more - and buy into a plan with a $5000 deductible?? What kind of idiot would do that?
This will never work for this reason. You would have to be a raving lunatic to buy a plan with a $5k deductible -- AND -- 40% copay!!!!!!
That is not insurance....that is a donation...or call it what it really is since it is forced - taxation.

I think you're missing some points. The purpose of the exchanges is to provide individual insurance for those not otherwise eligible for insurance coverage such as through their employer, Medicare, Medicaid, or VA. This is only 15% of the population. Most young people will get coverage either through their parents insurance up to age 26, or their employer. Single workers making less than $18,000 a year will be eligible Medicaid.

The cost of plans on the exchanges vary widely by state. In my state the lowest cost bronze plan is a $6,000 deductible but the yearly maximum out of pocket cost is only $6,350. With no government subsidy the premium is $147/mo. However, for a low income workers, the premium would be about $75 to $100/mo.

 

[Luissa]

Nearly two weeks ago, Obamacare opened for business, opening "exchanges" where people could sign up for it.

"Could" might be too nice a word. Participation is MANDATORY, with Federal law imposing stiff penalties if you don't sign up.

Now the numbers are starting to trickle out: Almost nobody is signing up, even with threats of penalties and IRS crackdowns hanging over their heads.

It looks like the grim facts are proving true, despite rosy media predictions: THE AMERICAN PEOPLE DON'T WANT OBAMACARE, AND NEVER DID.

How many of the nonexistent signups, are due to the huge problems and glitches in these "exchanges"?

OTOH, how many people took a look at the huge problems and glitches, and said, "Forget it, I'm not signing up for something that poorly run!"?

How many of the signups they DID get, are people who tried to sign up once, ran into glitches and crashes, and came back later to try again, start from scratch, and wound up signed up twice? Or three times? Or ten?

And how many never wanted to sign up for something that charges such high prices for the diminished service Obamacare offers, in the first place?

Almost as odd, is the fact that the signup numbers are such a "trickle". When asked how the signups are going, Federal officials keep saying they don't know, they don't have the information. Yet the employees of the exchanges, have all that info at their fingertips, and are telling reporters about it.

Do the top official have THAT poor communication with their own employees? Or are they simply afraid to admit the truth: That Obamacare is provinto be a huge flop? That even when threatened with penalties, people still don't want to sign up?

----------------------------------------------------

Oh My: Just 51,000 Americans Have Enrolled in Federal Obamacare Exchanges? - Guy Benson

Oh My: Just 51,000 Americans Have Enrolled in Federal Obamacare Exchanges?

Guy Benson | Oct 11, 2013

Remember, the Obama administration has been pretending that they don't have this data, which nobody believes. They've been sitting on it because it's super-embarrassing and underscores the magnitude of their failure and incompetence. Sadly for Sebelius & Co., the media has these things called "sources," and the UK Daily Mail gives the world its first glimpse of Obamacare's trainwreck-by-the-numbers. Wow:

Just 51,000 people completed Obamacare applications during the first week the Healthcare.gov website was online, according to two sources inside the Department of Health and Human Services who gave MailOnline an exclusive look at the earliest enrollment numbers.

The career civil servants, who process data inside the agency, confirmed independently that just 6,200 Americans applied for health insurance through the problem-plagued website on October 1, the day it first opened to the public.

Neither HHS nor the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services would comment on the record about the numbers. Enroll America, the president's organization of health care 'navigators' who are charged with helping Americans sign up, didn't reply to a request for information about its level of success so far. The White House also did not respond to emails seeking comment.

But several administration officials have claimed this month that they didn't have access to the kinds of raw figures MailOnline obtained from the people who work for them. And the anemic totals suggest a far lower level of interest in coverage through the Affordable Care Act than the Obama administration has hoped to see.

A devastating paragraph. First of all 51,000 people out of the entire combined populations of 36 states is microscopic. It's a rounding error. It's as if a sold-out Yankee Stadium signed up -- and nobody else. In a nation of 300 million.

Questions: Of the lucky 51,000, how many aren't actually signed up, thanks to another related snag? And how many are duplicates?

The British paper also smacks down the White House's obvious lie that they aren't aware of these numbers. The figures were provided to the press by people who report to the very officials who say they don't have access to them.

At the state level, potential enrollees' experiences have varied, though not even the uber-prepared state of Maryland has met with much success. In Iowa, home to a hybrid state/federal exchange, five people have signed up. In Hawaii, which runs its own exchange, zero people have obtained coverage.

The Mail article suggests that public interest in Obamacare is unsustainably low, given the enrollment levels required to keep the program afloat. I think that's a premature conclusion. How many people have tried to sign on and failed due to all the glitches and crashes?

It's weird they have number when most insurance companies aren't releasing numbers until the end of the month.
From the article it sounds like they got their numbers from Jim Bob's cousin who works in the mail room.
Numbers may be down, but I your article lacks a lot of credibility.

 

[LoneLaugher]

That would be Medicaid not Medicare, notwithstanding...so I see you are admitting to what we have been saying all along:
1) Affordable ACA for most who will be on the plan, the young, is not really insurance at all - it is a major medical plan like we said it was, not insurance.
2) ACA only works if the very people you need the most to have a successful exchange - would have to be subsidized..and that is just to get major medical only.
3) Major Medical plans have been around for years and years - at a lower cost than ACA - so, like we said, Obamacare raises cost for participants, not lowers it.

Everyone should give you rep points for getting past the partisan bickering and into the realities of ACA that we have been saying for months now.
Congratulations!

You are still wrong.

The plans are far richer than your 'major medical' plans. The preventive care benefits alone make the additional premiums worth it for a young person.

You did not concede the point about the value of being insured in the event of a really bad accident. I wonder why?

And there you go again.....what preventative care? How many 25 year olds need a colonoscopy? Or a PSA? How many 25 year old girls need mammograms?
They DON'T NEED IT. And won't get it.
Also - are you being obtuse, or are you really having this much trouble comprehending?
I didn't concede the value of insurance if really bad injury or sickness?? Dude...what do you think Major Medical is?? That is my point...you will only get value from it IF you are seriously injured or...wait for it....MAJOR MEDICAL.

And dude! If we do not make young people buy it, they won't. That is why the ACA is good for young people. It helps them do the smart thing. It gives them a little push toward being personally responsible. It also makes sure that they don't get ripped off by some fucking insurance company.

Until we have single payer.....this is the way we are going to try and cut our fucking health costs in this country. And we need everyone in the game if we are going to do it. Young, healthy people need to suck it up and play team ball.

Duh!

 

[iamwhatiseem]

I think you're missing some points. The purpose of the exchanges is to provide individual insurance for those not otherwise eligible for insurance coverage such as through their employer, Medicare, Medicaid, or VA. This is only 15% of the population. Most young people will get coverage either through their parents insurance up to age 26, or their employer. Single workers making less than $18,000 a year will be eligible Medicaid.

The cost of plans on the exchanges vary widely by state. In my state the lowest cost bronze plan is a $6,000 deductible but the yearly maximum out of pocket cost is only $6,350. With no government subsidy the premium is $147/mo. However, for a low income workers, the premium would be about $75 to $100/mo.

I am not missing any points. I think you are.
Again, what young adult would pay out $3297 a year for a plan where they would have to at least rack up $5-$6,000 in bills to get any benefit whatsoever, and after that only get 60% paid? Who would do that? That is no better than the Walmart plans that you guys railed on and on about.
On top of that, again, you guys keep concentrating on the premiums. The real pertinent topic is HEALTHCARE bills paid. For the low income person who is barely-barely getting buy - first $100 a month is real money to them, but most importantly, unless they have something seriously wrong with them - they WILL STILL GET NO BENEFITS.

 

[LoneLaugher]

The purpose of insurance is not to derive benefit each premium period. To think it is is a weird position.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

The purpose of insurance is not to derive benefit each premium period. To think it is is a weird position.

Nobody is saying it is, again you are reaching high and over your head to try to come up with an argument, when I believe way back in your mind...deep in their - you know I am right.
This country very much needs REAL healthcare reform. We didn't get that. Or anything really close to it.
1) Tort reform....nothing.
2) Cost far and above the rate of inflation....nothing.
3) A fix for awful faux coverage plans for low income...not only nothing done, but actually now forces them to buy into such plans.
4) Fraud and waste in Medicare........nothing.
5) Fraud and waste in Medicaid.....expanded it.

There were a few good things about ACA, existing conditions one of them...but there ia mainly a whoooole lot of bad.

 

[SFC Ollie]

I'm just wondering how the left will blame Obamacare on the right when the young Democrats realize how much money they don't have in their pockets anymore.....
Carry on.........

 

[iamwhatiseem]

I'm just wondering how the left will blame Obamacare on the right when the young Democrats realize how much money they don't have in their pockets anymore.....
Carry on.........

They already are Ollie. In a thread earlier today the comment was made "well if it wasn't for the Republican policies that lead to the economic collapse..."
Never fear, if one party is in the wrong - they will always find a way to blame it on the other.

 

[SFC Ollie]

I'm just wondering how the left will blame Obamacare on the right when the young Democrats realize how much money they don't have in their pockets anymore.....
Carry on.........

They already are Ollie. In a thread earlier today the comment was made "well if it wasn't for the Republican policies that lead to the economic collapse..."
Never fear, if one party is in the wrong - they will always find a way to blame it on the other.

Even though for 2 years they had controlled both houses of congress....But don't remind them of that little fact....

 

[PixieStix]

Why isn't the the left screaming about their right to privacy?

They used that mantra when it was about killing innocents babies.

 

[PixieStix]

Anyone with any balls would refuse to pay any penalty.

I'm guessing they'd be too stupid to know the words 'garnish' and 'lien.'

AKA, steal

 

[SFC Ollie]

Why isn't the the left screaming about their right to privacy?

They used that mantra when it was about killing innocents babies.

And the founder of McAffee systems says that Obamacare is a hackers Wet Dream....

 

[PixieStix]

More math for you guys...that you will ignore.

28 year old male.
Insurance Premiums.............$3297
Deductible............................$5000
Copay..................................40%
He is injured in a car wreck that required $10,000 in care.
Of that he had to pay $5000 to meet the deductible.
He also, of course, paid $3297 for his "insurance".
Of the $5000 left owed to the hospital, he has to pay $2,000 for the copay.
Sooo...Obamacare pays $3000...of which they received $3297 in premiums...so they are $297 ahead.
The 28 year old paid $7000 to the hospital, plus $3297 in "insurance"
Net result...even with $10k in medical costs - he lost money, he would have been better off without Obamacare.
And to note...you can check it out if you like - please do...in my state, a single 28 year old making $8 per hour part time gets no tax credits for Obamacare, nor qualifies for subsidies.

Which is what the left is willfully ignoring