Keeping guns from criminals - liberals, what is your plan?

[kaz]

High schoolers can afford pot.

First it was cars, now pot seems to be the equation.

Um...you didn't read the op, did you? Please go back and read it. Then go to the next part.

Pot is one of those rites of passage for kids. Many try; comparatively few relative to those who try continue use.

The point is, as I said in the op about ... pot ... not cars, they can't keep pot out of schools. Pot is illegal and high schoolers can get all they want. Guns aren't complicated technology and they are everywhere in and outside the country. If you can't keep illegal pot from kids, how are you going to keep guns from criminals? That's the question, always was.

 

[RKMBrown]

That said I have no problem with sales taxes being used to build and maintain insane asylums to keep the whacks off the street.

 

[kaz]

What is your end game? Communism, Facism?

A kind, authoritarian government who is benevolent and caring towards it's own people, has no border security, provides free birth control and abortions so people can screw their brains out and doesn't censor cuss words on TV.

Don't you want that too?

 

[RKMBrown]

We have a lot of indian reservations here; there are very few who are being over-run by smokers. You're telling stories.

We also need to stigmatize guns; they really don't make you safer. If they did, we would have almost zero gun deaths per year since we have a gazillion guns in this nation.

Does my machete make me safer than my shotgun? Should I use a pistol to kill a cougar when it attacks my dogs, or a pen knife?

If guns made us safer, we'd have fewer gun deaths in this nation since our citizens have, by far, more guns than any other society. Instead, we are among the leader in gun deaths in advanced societies.

So statistically, the machete makes you safer.

Our gun crime is a reflection of our democrat culture. Statistics about guns are all lies. They are lies because they ignore accidents, use of guns for defensive purposes, and suicides. They count all gun deaths in one pile. Guns are simply more efficient tools than say a knife. Though a knife will still work. Banning efficient tools is stupidity.

 

[kaz]

If guns made us safer, we'd have fewer gun deaths in this nation since our citizens have, by far, more guns than any other society. Instead, we are among the leader in gun deaths in advanced societies.

So statistically, the machete makes you safer.

How does a gun locked at home in your closet make you safer? What you are saying would be true if gun laws didn't prevent people from having them where they are needed.

How many people who got blown away in the Navy Yard had guns and knew perfectly well how to use them, but didn't have them because they weren't allowed to carry them?

 

[Steven_R]

It worked with cigarettes. It will work with guns.

Your liberties are safe. Nothing in the Constitution sets the price of the gun you're able to purchase. Remington does that.

Cigs give you cancer. Guns save your life. Cig taxes pushed purchases to the Indian Reservations and other black market sources. Cigs becoming unpopular reduced the number of people smoking them.

Yeah same thing.

Remington does not hold a monopoly. The reason guns are cheap is the fact that there is no monopoly. The price of guns is set by supply and demand.

We have a lot of indian reservations here; there are very few who are being over-run by smokers. You're telling stories.

We also need to stigmatize guns; they really don't make you safer. If they did, we would have almost zero gun deaths per year since we have a gazillion guns in this nation.

Can we stigmatize doctors while we're at it? For every gun death in the US there are three death's from doctor's mistakes and there are a lot fewer doctors than there are guns and gun owners.

 

[RKMBrown]

What is your end game? Communism, Facism?

A kind, authoritarian government who is benevolent and caring towards it's own people, has no border security, provides free birth control and abortions so people can screw their brains out and doesn't censor cuss words on TV.

Don't you want that too?

No. I would prefer a government that knows it's place as our employee, where the people live free under the rule of law, where border security meant we don't need security on the border, and where birth control was limited to condoms and the pill type control. As to cussing on TV, whatever. Let the people decide through supply and demand what they want to watch.

 

[Ernie S.]

Sure they do.

But it's not as if the illegal arms are immune from market forces.

That point works against you. Driving prices up just motivates the illegal gun trade. Because of ... wait for it ... market forces ...

So I suppose you've bought all of your weapons illegally then? Hey, if it's so much cheaper than Dick's Sporting Goods and the sales tax in your state...

How many illegal weapons DO YOU own?

.
I own many weapons, all of which I obtained legally. Some even have a paper trail.
None of them were obtained illegally because of that pesky 2nd Amendment.

 

[candycorn]

What is your end game? Communism, Facism?

A kind, authoritarian government

I'm overall pleased with out government. I reject all "isms" as a rule of thumb.

who is benevolent and caring towards it's own people,

Nothing wrong with that in my view.

has no border security,

No. Far from it. I like this model

I think there should be a channel from San Diego to Texas for shipping just inside this barrier just to make sure.

provides free birth control

Low-cost isn't free but I'd rather pay pennies for contraception than spend dollars for welfare/incarceration down the line. It's called common sense.

and abortions so people can screw their brains out

Pretty much the dumbest thing you've said and that is saying quite a bit.

and doesn't censor cuss words on TV.

No need to censor anything, anywhere. We've established that if you censor/restrict it; you can get it from your pot dealer.

Don't you want that too?

I guess we're done.

 

[candycorn]

That point works against you. Driving prices up just motivates the illegal gun trade. Because of ... wait for it ... market forces ...

So I suppose you've bought all of your weapons illegally then? Hey, if it's so much cheaper than Dick's Sporting Goods and the sales tax in your state...

How many illegal weapons DO YOU own?

.
I own many weapons, all of which I obtained legally. Some even have a paper trail.
None of them were obtained illegally because of that pesky 2nd Amendment.

Apparently your'e a fool.

You could have bought them from Louie and his black market behind Wal*Mart cheaper. They have every gun you want, no sales tax....

 

[Ernie S.]

So I suppose you've bought all of your weapons illegally then? Hey, if it's so much cheaper than Dick's Sporting Goods and the sales tax in your state...

How many illegal weapons DO YOU own?

I'm not asking you to give up your source but really; the black market sounds great. You can avoid sales taxes so it makes me wonder why Dick's is sold out of weapons....everyone should be at this black market...right?

If illegal arms are so prevealant; why are gun manufacturers running 3 shifts and "can't keep up"?

Retard. It's legal to manufacture and buy guns. The question was what if guns were made illegal to manufacture and sell in the states. Then most of us would gladly tell the feds to shove it just as we did during prohibition and just as we are doing now regarding weed.

I'd be buying a load of steel. I am fully capable of making guns. I have built several prototypes in the past.
I am not all that unique. I suppose there are a million people in the states able to make a gun and maybe 100,000 with the resources to start small scale production.

 

[candycorn]

What is your end game? Communism, Facism?

A kind, authoritarian government who is benevolent and caring towards it's own people, has no border security, provides free birth control and abortions so people can screw their brains out and doesn't censor cuss words on TV.

Don't you want that too?

No. I would prefer a government that knows it's place as our employee, where the people live free under the rule of law, where border security meant we don't need security on the border, and where birth control was limited to condoms and the pill type control. As to cussing on TV, whatever. Let the people decide through supply and demand what they want to watch.

I think he ws trying to take a shot at me...

 

[candycorn]

Cigs give you cancer. Guns save your life. Cig taxes pushed purchases to the Indian Reservations and other black market sources. Cigs becoming unpopular reduced the number of people smoking them.

Yeah same thing.

Remington does not hold a monopoly. The reason guns are cheap is the fact that there is no monopoly. The price of guns is set by supply and demand.

We have a lot of indian reservations here; there are very few who are being over-run by smokers. You're telling stories.

We also need to stigmatize guns; they really don't make you safer. If they did, we would have almost zero gun deaths per year since we have a gazillion guns in this nation.

Can we stigmatize doctors while we're at it? For every gun death in the US there are three death's from doctor's mistakes and there are a lot fewer doctors than there are guns and gun owners.

Do you have a source for that statistic?

One of the many good things about the ACA (as I understand it) is that the preventative healthcare emphasis will assist doctors in being able to track your health through decades of doctor visits. High blood pressure, for example, is damaging to your kidneys. If she/he can see that you've had hypertension since you were a kid, when you show up with a renal issue, the leading candidate won't be bladder cancer or liver issues....likely the hypertension they will be made aware of by reviewing your file.

I would like to have some sort of scoring system for Dr's. You can recite your favorite pitcher's ERA but do you know how many patients of your doctor improved their overall health after a year under their care?

Good idea.

 

[RKMBrown]

A kind, authoritarian government who is benevolent and caring towards it's own people, has no border security, provides free birth control and abortions so people can screw their brains out and doesn't censor cuss words on TV.

Don't you want that too?

No. I would prefer a government that knows it's place as our employee, where the people live free under the rule of law, where border security meant we don't need security on the border, and where birth control was limited to condoms and the pill type control. As to cussing on TV, whatever. Let the people decide through supply and demand what they want to watch.

I think he ws trying to take a shot at me...

Yeah the sarcasm was not lost on me.. I just wanted to reply to the parts where libertarians want more freedom than even the right wants.

 

[candycorn]

So I suppose you've bought all of your weapons illegally then? Hey, if it's so much cheaper than Dick's Sporting Goods and the sales tax in your state...

How many illegal weapons DO YOU own?

I'm not asking you to give up your source but really; the black market sounds great. You can avoid sales taxes so it makes me wonder why Dick's is sold out of weapons....everyone should be at this black market...right?

If illegal arms are so prevealant; why are gun manufacturers running 3 shifts and "can't keep up"?

Retard. It's legal to manufacture and buy guns. The question was what if guns were made illegal to manufacture and sell in the states. Then most of us would gladly tell the feds to shove it just as we did during prohibition and just as we are doing now regarding weed.

Of course you're putting words in my mouth.

Never once have I said I want to prohibit guns.

Debate all you wish but stop lying about my position.

 

[RKMBrown]

I'm not asking you to give up your source but really; the black market sounds great. You can avoid sales taxes so it makes me wonder why Dick's is sold out of weapons....everyone should be at this black market...right?

If illegal arms are so prevealant; why are gun manufacturers running 3 shifts and "can't keep up"?

Retard. It's legal to manufacture and buy guns. The question was what if guns were made illegal to manufacture and sell in the states. Then most of us would gladly tell the feds to shove it just as we did during prohibition and just as we are doing now regarding weed.

I'd be buying a load of steel. I am fully capable of making guns. I have built several prototypes in the past.
I am not all that unique. I suppose there are a million people in the states able to make a gun and maybe 100,000 with the resources to start small scale production.

How much does it cost to make a Molotov cocktail? 30cents?

 

[Ernie S.]

But you can go to this "black market" and buy them cheaper; right?

The point was that if you drive up the price of guns, THEN they will be cheaper on the black market. Criminals won't have a problem getting them. The whole point of this is that your policies make it harder and harder for people to defend themselves without keeping guns out of the hands of criminals. Seriously, after all this discussion, you don't get that?

You're assuming supply will remain the same as it is today. It won't. The price lowers demand and thus lowers supply

In fact, you'll likely see the price escalation keep guns out of the hands of the criminals and the youth.

Why?

If something costs 1 week's pay, it's pretty easy to get it.
If something costs 3 week's pay, it's harder to get; agreed?

So the unemployed (a lot of criminals don't have a day job; nor do kids like Kleibold, Harris, and that A-Hole who shot up Sandy Hook, Va Tech, Gabby Giffords etc (I can't list all of the recent perps and their financial conditions but suffice to say that many are not hob nobbing with Bill Gates) won't be able to afford the weaponry they seek.

It will take quite a while but we really need to do something.

And someone like me will start producing guns at a cost of 1.5 weeks pay and supply all the guns the private sector wants. Think Prohibition.

 

[RKMBrown]

I'm not asking you to give up your source but really; the black market sounds great. You can avoid sales taxes so it makes me wonder why Dick's is sold out of weapons....everyone should be at this black market...right?

If illegal arms are so prevealant; why are gun manufacturers running 3 shifts and "can't keep up"?

Retard. It's legal to manufacture and buy guns. The question was what if guns were made illegal to manufacture and sell in the states. Then most of us would gladly tell the feds to shove it just as we did during prohibition and just as we are doing now regarding weed.

Of course you're putting words in my mouth.

Never once have I said I want to prohibit guns.

Debate all you wish but stop lying about my position.

Where did I say you did? Where did I put words in your mouth? How about you cite me when you are lying about what I said?

 

[RKMBrown]

The point was that if you drive up the price of guns, THEN they will be cheaper on the black market. Criminals won't have a problem getting them. The whole point of this is that your policies make it harder and harder for people to defend themselves without keeping guns out of the hands of criminals. Seriously, after all this discussion, you don't get that?

You're assuming supply will remain the same as it is today. It won't. The price lowers demand and thus lowers supply

In fact, you'll likely see the price escalation keep guns out of the hands of the criminals and the youth.

Why?

If something costs 1 week's pay, it's pretty easy to get it.
If something costs 3 week's pay, it's harder to get; agreed?

So the unemployed (a lot of criminals don't have a day job; nor do kids like Kleibold, Harris, and that A-Hole who shot up Sandy Hook, Va Tech, Gabby Giffords etc (I can't list all of the recent perps and their financial conditions but suffice to say that many are not hob nobbing with Bill Gates) won't be able to afford the weaponry they seek.

It will take quite a while but we really need to do something.

And someone like me will start producing guns at a cost of 1.5 weeks pay and supply all the guns the private sector wants. Think Prohibition.

You sell the guns, I'll sell bows, tools to make cocktails, tools to make air powered projectile weapons, etc. Drones and other projectile firing weapons are gonna change things real soon now. Guns will go the way of the dodo bird.

 

[Ernie S.]

You're assuming supply will remain the same as it is today. It won't. The price lowers demand and thus lowers supply

In fact, you'll likely see the price escalation keep guns out of the hands of the criminals and the youth.

Why?

If something costs 1 week's pay, it's pretty easy to get it.
If something costs 3 week's pay, it's harder to get; agreed?

So the unemployed (a lot of criminals don't have a day job; nor do kids like Kleibold, Harris, and that A-Hole who shot up Sandy Hook, Va Tech, Gabby Giffords etc (I can't list all of the recent perps and their financial conditions but suffice to say that many are not hob nobbing with Bill Gates) won't be able to afford the weaponry they seek.

It will take quite a while but we really need to do something.

ROFL typical authoritarian thinks they can force demand to decrease by screwing people over. ROFL

I have tons of guns. Make it illegal I'd love to make some good money off my inventory.

What we need to do is put people like you, who take our liberties away, in jail.

It worked with cigarettes. It will work with guns.

Your liberties are safe. Nothing in the Constitution sets the price of the gun you're able to purchase. Remington does that.

What part of "the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed" is so fucking hard to understand?