LGBTs Get Backlash: North Carolinians Began Collecting Damages for NCAA Pulling Out: Oops!

[Pop23]

why don't the women count?

Funny, you are concerned for a tranny getting his ass kicked but you give a shit if a woman is raped. Nice!!

Indeed, the courts will be discussing your points.

Wouldn't it be a blast to actually debate this with the NCAA and see them defend their position in an open arena?

Good god they'd look the fool

Well if you consider that court is an open arena and they will HAVE to debate and defend their "points" there, your wish is going to come true.

If the judge doesn't allow the same shenanigans we've seen in the past, then ok.

I'd love a game of "one on one" though. It's only sporting!

 

[Montrovant]

I love how you want to ignore who the predators are and focus on lesbians....

You pointed it out moron.

You do realize that a large percentage of males that think they are actually women REMAIN SEXUALLY ATTRACTED TO WOMEN.

So YOU think having males, dressed like women AND SEXUALLY ATTRACTED TO WOMEN, allowed in shower rooms with our young daughters, while still packing a dick is............

NOT A PROBLEM?


Are you seriously that stupid?

Of course you are!

So if having a dick and being in a shower with people you are attracted to is a problem, do you advocate having gay males shower in the women's showers?

I don't actually agree with mixed gender showers, FYI.

You're deflection is noted.

So a problem exists, so to take care of the problem, we make it worse.

Nice job, when you dance with your unicorn, do you or it lead?

I'm not deflecting. I'm asking a question about your reasoning. You implied that someone with a dick being in a shower with a person they are attracted to is a problem. That would mean that having gays in a shower with other men or boys is a problem. I asked if you would be for having gays shower with women to avoid this problem.

I also pointed out that I do not advocate for mixed gender showers.

What, exactly, am I trying to deflect from?

wow are you uninformed. you must be democrat.

Uninformed about what, Pop's opinion? That's true, hence me asking the question. Since that's the only thing I was talking about, I get the feeling you are assuming I'm uninformed about something unrelated to my post. Either that or you quoted the wrong post.

I am not and have never been a democrat.

 

[Montrovant]

I'm not deflecting. I'm asking a question about your reasoning. You implied that someone with a dick being in a shower with a person they are attracted to is a problem. That would mean that having gays in a shower with other men or boys is a problem. I asked if you would be for having gays shower with women to avoid this problem.

I also pointed out that I do not advocate for mixed gender showers.

What, exactly, am I trying to deflect from?

I don't see a guy with a dick that is attracted to women, not being allowed in the restroom with females being much of a problem.

You don't advocate for tranny males sharing showers with females? Are you serious? By what legal standard could you possibly deny them access to showers and lockerrooms if you allow them in restrooms?

Here's a clue, if they are similarily situated enough to be allowed in restrooms, they must be allowed in all gender segregated facilities. You can't stop that.

I disagree. Bathrooms and showers are generally set up in different ways, particularly in regards to privacy. I could perhaps see an argument that a shower facility with stalls must legally allow mixed genders, but in a shower without privacy, it is a different situation than a bathroom.

I think the real question which should be answered, legally speaking, is whether any gender separation is warranted and why. If that is clearly answered, I think it will then answer all these other issues, or at least help.

That's not how our legal system works.

I could care less if anyone disagrees, You are disagreing with the 14th amendment, not me.

Any group judged to be "similarily situated" to another, must be granted access to everything that the other group has access to.

To argue against full access is to argue against same sex marriage and in favor of the North Carolina law that this whole thread is all about.

Are we not allowed to a right to security and privacy when vulnerable? If not, just remove your bathroom door in your home. I'm sure your guests will understand.

I am not disagreeing with the 14th amendment, whatever you say. I'm disagreeing with your argument that bathrooms and showers must be treated the same way. I am also arguing that the real issue here is the underlying question of whether any sort of gender separation is necessary or legally acceptable. I think once that issue is clarified it will answer many of the other questions which have led to these conflicts. If, for instance, the courts were to rule that separating bathrooms by gender is discriminatory and illegal, it would render all questions about transgender bathroom use pretty much moot. On the other hand, if the courts rule that separation by gender is legally acceptable because the possibility of being exposed to the genitalia of an opposite sex person is worth protecting against, it would mean that at least pre-op transgender people would not simply be allowed to go into the bathroom of their choice. While it may have been discussed in court rulings, I haven't seen any clarification on why gender separated bathrooms are or are not legally acceptable in the first place.

I think this conflict about transgender bathroom use must inevitably clarify and/or change both the legal system's and society's reasoning for gender separate bathrooms.

Are you a sock? Onyx?

If there is no outcry for a change the solution is not to change.

As for the 14th, make the argument that access can be limited. I'd love to hear it made without overturning the basic legal principles behind same sex marriage.

I have no problem with post ops using the restroom of their new gender. No dick, no problem in the woman's restroom. Gotta dick, adios.

It's really that simple.

Why on earth would you think I am a sock? You might notice I've been on this site quite a bit longer than you.

Make the argument that access to opposite gender bathrooms can be limited? Well, I don't actually know if it should be, but one might argue it is a question of privacy. That's complicated by bathrooms with only stalls, of course. Another argument might be one of safety; are sexual misconduct or rape more likely in a bathroom situation with mixed sexes?

I don't know if the arguments for bathroom separation will end up holding up in court. I don't consider the issue the same as same sex marriage, though.

Do you think that the opposite is true, that a woman who identifies as a man should not be allowed into the men's room because she doesn't have a penis?

 

[Montrovant]

I am also arguing that the real issue here is the underlying question of whether any sort of gender separation is necessary or legally acceptable

WTF? Where does the Constitution say we have to be gender blind? Even the ERA didn't say that.

And that government can force businesses what their bathroom policies are? Now that's totally not a power of the Federal government as it violates the fifth amendment and therefore by the 14th amendment government in general.

What crimes had businesses committed in Charlotte where their rights could be restricted? The fifth amendment says the Charlotte law overturned was unconstitutional. It's pathetic we don't recognize the right to property can be restricted just because we engage in business. That isn't in the Constitution

That's fine. This question will still remain for something like government facilities, though.

And I'm pretty sure you meant to say the right to property cannot be restricted just because we engage in business.

 

[kaz]

I am also arguing that the real issue here is the underlying question of whether any sort of gender separation is necessary or legally acceptable

WTF? Where does the Constitution say we have to be gender blind? Even the ERA didn't say that.

And that government can force businesses what their bathroom policies are? Now that's totally not a power of the Federal government as it violates the fifth amendment and therefore by the 14th amendment government in general.

What crimes had businesses committed in Charlotte where their rights could be restricted? The fifth amendment says the Charlotte law overturned was unconstitutional. It's pathetic we don't recognize the right to property can be restricted just because we engage in business. That isn't in the Constitution

That's fine. This question will still remain for something like government facilities, though.

And I'm pretty sure you meant to say the right to property cannot be restricted just because we engage in business.

Yes, I meant "cannot."

Government telling government what it can do isn't such a concern to me. To me, the ideal bill would have said:

1) Charlotte (or other local governments) cannot dictate to private citizens or businesses who can use their bathrooms or the terms they can use their bathrooms

2) For government schools targeted to minors (i.e., preschool through 12th grade), you use the bathroom of your sex organs

3) Other government buildings (including colleges and universities) can make their own choices

4) Anyone who opens their bathrooms without safeguards to crossover usage bears liability for sexual predators who utilize that ability to assault someone. Including governments.

My recommended solution to satisfy #3 is to have unisex bathrooms available and allow transgenders to either use the bathroom of their sex organs or the unisex bathrooms. But it's up to them as long as they take protection from sexual predators seriously.

However, in the end I support HB2 because 98% of what I care about are 1 and 2

 

[Pop23]

I don't see a guy with a dick that is attracted to women, not being allowed in the restroom with females being much of a problem.

You don't advocate for tranny males sharing showers with females? Are you serious? By what legal standard could you possibly deny them access to showers and lockerrooms if you allow them in restrooms?

Here's a clue, if they are similarily situated enough to be allowed in restrooms, they must be allowed in all gender segregated facilities. You can't stop that.

I disagree. Bathrooms and showers are generally set up in different ways, particularly in regards to privacy. I could perhaps see an argument that a shower facility with stalls must legally allow mixed genders, but in a shower without privacy, it is a different situation than a bathroom.

I think the real question which should be answered, legally speaking, is whether any gender separation is warranted and why. If that is clearly answered, I think it will then answer all these other issues, or at least help.

That's not how our legal system works.

I could care less if anyone disagrees, You are disagreing with the 14th amendment, not me.

Any group judged to be "similarily situated" to another, must be granted access to everything that the other group has access to.

To argue against full access is to argue against same sex marriage and in favor of the North Carolina law that this whole thread is all about.

Are we not allowed to a right to security and privacy when vulnerable? If not, just remove your bathroom door in your home. I'm sure your guests will understand.

I am not disagreeing with the 14th amendment, whatever you say. I'm disagreeing with your argument that bathrooms and showers must be treated the same way. I am also arguing that the real issue here is the underlying question of whether any sort of gender separation is necessary or legally acceptable. I think once that issue is clarified it will answer many of the other questions which have led to these conflicts. If, for instance, the courts were to rule that separating bathrooms by gender is discriminatory and illegal, it would render all questions about transgender bathroom use pretty much moot. On the other hand, if the courts rule that separation by gender is legally acceptable because the possibility of being exposed to the genitalia of an opposite sex person is worth protecting against, it would mean that at least pre-op transgender people would not simply be allowed to go into the bathroom of their choice. While it may have been discussed in court rulings, I haven't seen any clarification on why gender separated bathrooms are or are not legally acceptable in the first place.

I think this conflict about transgender bathroom use must inevitably clarify and/or change both the legal system's and society's reasoning for gender separate bathrooms.

Are you a sock? Onyx?

If there is no outcry for a change the solution is not to change.

As for the 14th, make the argument that access can be limited. I'd love to hear it made without overturning the basic legal principles behind same sex marriage.

I have no problem with post ops using the restroom of their new gender. No dick, no problem in the woman's restroom. Gotta dick, adios.

It's really that simple.

Why on earth would you think I am a sock? You might notice I've been on this site quite a bit longer than you.

Make the argument that access to opposite gender bathrooms can be limited? Well, I don't actually know if it should be, but one might argue it is a question of privacy. That's complicated by bathrooms with only stalls, of course. Another argument might be one of safety; are sexual misconduct or rape more likely in a bathroom situation with mixed sexes?

I don't know if the arguments for bathroom separation will end up holding up in court. I don't consider the issue the same as same sex marriage, though.

Do you think that the opposite is true, that a woman who identifies as a man should not be allowed into the men's room because she doesn't have a penis?

It's not a federal issue. That being said, the State has a right to protect the privacy and safety of its citizens and an even greater burdon to protect that of children.

But, if the REQUIREMENT is that trans individuals MUST be given access, based on the legal theory that a trans male is SIMILARILY SITUATED to a female, those rights do not stop at the bathroom door, they remain SIMILARILY SITUATED in life itself.

To argue againt that is to say, Blacks can drink at the water fountain that whites use, but they cannot use the white only restroom. That argument had failed many times at the federal court level.

 

[Silhouette]

Yep, showers, locker rooms, sports teams... etc.

 

[bodecea]

So all of you that are sure pro trans bathroom laws will open public restrooms up to sexual predators can point to where that is happening, right? Many cities in the US have had pro trans bathroom laws on the books for over a decade. Show us the increase in incidents.

Again, this is being said by someone who enjoys the right to shower with the sex she finds sexually attractive.

Do you not see how fucking stupid your opinion is?

Just another ENTITLED HOMOSEXUAl

You seem to thing...and I wonder why...we would be sexually attracted to strange women we don't know. Is that how it works with hetero male predators? No self-control?

 

[Pop23]

So all of you that are sure pro trans bathroom laws will open public restrooms up to sexual predators can point to where that is happening, right? Many cities in the US have had pro trans bathroom laws on the books for over a decade. Show us the increase in incidents.

Again, this is being said by someone who enjoys the right to shower with the sex she finds sexually attractive.

Do you not see how fucking stupid your opinion is?

Just another ENTITLED HOMOSEXUAl

You seem to thing...and I wonder why...we would be sexually attracted to strange women we don't know. Is that how it works with hetero male predators? No self-control?

WHOA BESSY, are you saying that you had to know someone personally to be sexually attracted to them????

That makes dating damn rough don't it?

Wow, you really think anyone buys your horse shit?

 

[Pop23]

Yep, showers, locker rooms, sports teams... etc.

I see bodie gave you a funny but forwards no argument?

Perplexing.

 

[Brambo]

And when a ball starts to roll...roll on it shall... (From: NCAA Boycotts NC Over Bathroom Law )

I guess conservatives are finding out their beloved free market can come back to bite them occasionally.

Or, conversely, if conservatives in North Carolina (the state, properly) had oral or written contracts with the NCAA for games being played there for NC's financial enjoyment, the court system will come back to bite the NCAA.

The NCAA cannot commit fiscal-terrorism against North Carolina because that states' sovereign and duly elected representatives of the People of NC are acting to protect women and girls from sexual harassment (being forced by "law" to undress in front of deranged men behind doors marked "women")

This will be taken to Law.

Fiscal terrorism is exactly what it is. It is a conspiracy by a group, using financial punishment as a club, to force women and girls to disrobe in front of men in their showers, locker rooms and bathrooms; whether or not they agree to.

*******

I'm going to guess that the NCAA has protected its right to change tournament venues in whatever legal paperwork may be involved here.

I'm going to guess those rights didn't include "as punishment for North Carolina protecting North Carolina's women and girls from sexual harassment in their showers and bathrooms."

This will be taken to Law, as I said.
***********

Ruh-roh! It's already starting!: This is not the only dude who will lose money if NCAA pulls out of NC:

The day after the announcement, athletic director at East Carolina University, Jeff Compher, spoke out about this decision, saying he is disappointed and that ECU Athletics has already invested close to $8,000 in preparation for the tournament...."Today, I haven't had a follow up question, but in a voicemail message from a representative from the NCAA, they did say they would help us defray any costs that we had incurred, so I hope to have some additional conversations with the NCAA in the next couple days just to see the extent to which they will help us in those costs," Compher says....He also says he's hopeful for a quick resolution and that the games are brought back in the future. ECU's athletic director responds to NCAA pulling games out of North Carolina

Aw heck. Just skip the voicemail conversations and have some lawyers pay them a personal visit to ask how much $$ they're willing to shell out to people in North Carolina already out a ton of cash via preparing for the various (golf, football, basketball...etc.) meets that had been scheduled.

Near as I can tell, you cannot renege on a contract, or fiscally punish individuals here and there because a state passed a law you don't like.

Protecting women against sexual harassment?

Fuck you.

For 230 years of North Carolina's history as a state, it has never had a Bathroom law to protect women against sexual harassment.

It was not an issue for 230 years.

It's not an issue now.

FUCK YOU.

 

[Silhouette]

Protecting women against sexual harassment?..Fuck you....For 230 years of North Carolina's history as a state, it has never had a Bathroom law to protect women against sexual harassment....It was not an issue for 230 years....It's not an issue now....FUCK YOU.

I can see your legal argument framed already, "Your honor, if you think women need protection from men in their communal shower area FUCK YOU."
Probably not going to get you very far with the USSC, but hey, knock yourself out.

 

[Seawytch]

So all of you that are sure pro trans bathroom laws will open public restrooms up to sexual predators can point to where that is happening, right? Many cities in the US have had pro trans bathroom laws on the books for over a decade. Show us the increase in incidents.

Again, this is being said by someone who enjoys the right to shower with the sex she finds sexually attractive.

Do you not see how fucking stupid your opinion is?

Just another ENTITLED HOMOSEXUAl

You seem to thing...and I wonder why...we would be sexually attracted to strange women we don't know. Is that how it works with hetero male predators? No self-control?

The weird thing he thinks is that people shower together in public places. The last time I had to disrobe and shower in front of a woman I wasn't sleeping with was boot camp.(and in boot camp you had so little time to shower, looking wasn't in the time budget )

 

[Silhouette]

The weird thing he thinks is that people shower together in public places. The last time I had to disrobe and shower in front of a woman I wasn't sleeping with was boot camp.(and in boot camp you had so little time to shower, looking wasn't in the time budget )

The "it's rare so why worry about it?" argument is going to fall flat on its face in court Seawytch. Everyone knows about locker rooms in schools, dorm rooms in college and communal shower areas in gyms and swimming pools. And of course once men get access to those areas, what keeps them off of women's sports teams?

You're done. Stick a fork in your cult. They went too far this time. They should've quietly backed away from the "T" component because ....they're patently and transparently crazy from even the most generous of perspectives.

 

[Pop23]

So all of you that are sure pro trans bathroom laws will open public restrooms up to sexual predators can point to where that is happening, right? Many cities in the US have had pro trans bathroom laws on the books for over a decade. Show us the increase in incidents.

Again, this is being said by someone who enjoys the right to shower with the sex she finds sexually attractive.

Do you not see how fucking stupid your opinion is?

Just another ENTITLED HOMOSEXUAl

You seem to thing...and I wonder why...we would be sexually attracted to strange women we don't know. Is that how it works with hetero male predators? No self-control?

The weird thing he thinks is that people shower together in public places. The last time I had to disrobe and shower in front of a woman I wasn't sleeping with was boot camp.(and in boot camp you had so little time to shower, looking wasn't in the time budget )

Every town has public shower facilities. Unless you live as a hermit in some wacky wilderness, your town has a public pool.

Another dodge by the boards dodging dyke.

I see you never refuted my claim? Is there a reason?

Of course there is. Limiting transgenders to only restrooms screws with the law making same sex marriage legal.

Deflect away witch, you got nothing to add!

 

[Seawytch]

So all of you that are sure pro trans bathroom laws will open public restrooms up to sexual predators can point to where that is happening, right? Many cities in the US have had pro trans bathroom laws on the books for over a decade. Show us the increase in incidents.

Again, this is being said by someone who enjoys the right to shower with the sex she finds sexually attractive.

Do you not see how fucking stupid your opinion is?

Just another ENTITLED HOMOSEXUAl

You seem to thing...and I wonder why...we would be sexually attracted to strange women we don't know. Is that how it works with hetero male predators? No self-control?

The weird thing he thinks is that people shower together in public places. The last time I had to disrobe and shower in front of a woman I wasn't sleeping with was boot camp.(and in boot camp you had so little time to shower, looking wasn't in the time budget )

Every town has public shower facilities. Unless you live as a hermit in some wacky wilderness, your town has a public pool.

Another dodge by the boards dodging dyke.

I see you never refuted my claim? Is there a reason?

Of course there is. Limiting transgenders to only restrooms screws with the law making same sex marriage legal.

Deflect away witch, you got nothing to add!

Nobody is forced to use them. Simple solution...

 

[rightwinger]

And when a ball starts to roll...roll on it shall... (From: NCAA Boycotts NC Over Bathroom Law )

I guess conservatives are finding out their beloved free market can come back to bite them occasionally.

Or, conversely, if conservatives in North Carolina (the state, properly) had oral or written contracts with the NCAA for games being played there for NC's financial enjoyment, the court system will come back to bite the NCAA.

The NCAA cannot commit fiscal-terrorism against North Carolina because that states' sovereign and duly elected representatives of the People of NC are acting to protect women and girls from sexual harassment (being forced by "law" to undress in front of deranged men behind doors marked "women")

This will be taken to Law.

Fiscal terrorism is exactly what it is. It is a conspiracy by a group, using financial punishment as a club, to force women and girls to disrobe in front of men in their showers, locker rooms and bathrooms; whether or not they agree to.

*******

I'm going to guess that the NCAA has protected its right to change tournament venues in whatever legal paperwork may be involved here.

I'm going to guess those rights didn't include "as punishment for North Carolina protecting North Carolina's women and girls from sexual harassment in their showers and bathrooms."

This will be taken to Law, as I said.
***********

Ruh-roh! It's already starting!: This is not the only dude who will lose money if NCAA pulls out of NC:

The day after the announcement, athletic director at East Carolina University, Jeff Compher, spoke out about this decision, saying he is disappointed and that ECU Athletics has already invested close to $8,000 in preparation for the tournament...."Today, I haven't had a follow up question, but in a voicemail message from a representative from the NCAA, they did say they would help us defray any costs that we had incurred, so I hope to have some additional conversations with the NCAA in the next couple days just to see the extent to which they will help us in those costs," Compher says....He also says he's hopeful for a quick resolution and that the games are brought back in the future. ECU's athletic director responds to NCAA pulling games out of North Carolina

Aw heck. Just skip the voicemail conversations and have some lawyers pay them a personal visit to ask how much $$ they're willing to shell out to people in North Carolina already out a ton of cash via preparing for the various (golf, football, basketball...etc.) meets that had been scheduled.

Near as I can tell, you cannot renege on a contract, or fiscally punish individuals here and there because a state passed a law you don't like.

$8000.00?


Okay, here's $4000.00, now fuck off.

Silhouette is right

$8000 bucks will bring the NCAA to its knees. That will teach them a lesson about not hating gays

 

[Pop23]

So all of you that are sure pro trans bathroom laws will open public restrooms up to sexual predators can point to where that is happening, right? Many cities in the US have had pro trans bathroom laws on the books for over a decade. Show us the increase in incidents.

Again, this is being said by someone who enjoys the right to shower with the sex she finds sexually attractive.

Do you not see how fucking stupid your opinion is?

Just another ENTITLED HOMOSEXUAl

You seem to thing...and I wonder why...we would be sexually attracted to strange women we don't know. Is that how it works with hetero male predators? No self-control?

The weird thing he thinks is that people shower together in public places. The last time I had to disrobe and shower in front of a woman I wasn't sleeping with was boot camp.(and in boot camp you had so little time to shower, looking wasn't in the time budget )

Every town has public shower facilities. Unless you live as a hermit in some wacky wilderness, your town has a public pool.

Another dodge by the boards dodging dyke.

I see you never refuted my claim? Is there a reason?

Of course there is. Limiting transgenders to only restrooms screws with the law making same sex marriage legal.

Deflect away witch, you got nothing to add!

Nobody is forced to use them. Simple solution...

Wow, who knew you were a bigot?

No black was forced to use the white only bathroom? No gay woman was forced to marry?

Damn, your true colors are coming out Wytch!

 

[Seawytch]

Again, this is being said by someone who enjoys the right to shower with the sex she finds sexually attractive.

Do you not see how fucking stupid your opinion is?

Just another ENTITLED HOMOSEXUAl

You seem to thing...and I wonder why...we would be sexually attracted to strange women we don't know. Is that how it works with hetero male predators? No self-control?

The weird thing he thinks is that people shower together in public places. The last time I had to disrobe and shower in front of a woman I wasn't sleeping with was boot camp.(and in boot camp you had so little time to shower, looking wasn't in the time budget )

Every town has public shower facilities. Unless you live as a hermit in some wacky wilderness, your town has a public pool.

Another dodge by the boards dodging dyke.

I see you never refuted my claim? Is there a reason?

Of course there is. Limiting transgenders to only restrooms screws with the law making same sex marriage legal.

Deflect away witch, you got nothing to add!

Nobody is forced to use them. Simple solution...

Wow, who knew you were a bigot?

No black was forced to use the white only bathroom? No gay woman was forced to marry?

Damn, your true colors are coming out Wytch!

Who, besides trans people, are being told they cannot use a changing room?

 

[Pop23]

You seem to thing...and I wonder why...we would be sexually attracted to strange women we don't know. Is that how it works with hetero male predators? No self-control?

The weird thing he thinks is that people shower together in public places. The last time I had to disrobe and shower in front of a woman I wasn't sleeping with was boot camp.(and in boot camp you had so little time to shower, looking wasn't in the time budget )

Every town has public shower facilities. Unless you live as a hermit in some wacky wilderness, your town has a public pool.

Another dodge by the boards dodging dyke.

I see you never refuted my claim? Is there a reason?

Of course there is. Limiting transgenders to only restrooms screws with the law making same sex marriage legal.

Deflect away witch, you got nothing to add!

Nobody is forced to use them. Simple solution...

Wow, who knew you were a bigot?

No black was forced to use the white only bathroom? No gay woman was forced to marry?

Damn, your true colors are coming out Wytch!

Who, besides trans people, are being told they cannot use a changing room?

The people who don't want to share them with members of the opposite sex.

Think about how very weird that is.