Man Cannot Be Suitably Moral or Good without God. Here's why:

[rightnow909]

so Meriweather

Where is your response to #250?

 

[Mashmont]

Valid point. The coercive heaven and hell doctrine of Christianity and the threats of burning flesh, eternal damnation and eternal pain are a powerful motivational force especially when you can impose those scare tactics on children. What better way for a ruling class seeking to coerce conformance from their minions.

Shoot. Leftists won't even let them be born. That'll show 'em.

 

[Mashmont]

Sure it does. It teaches the only way to be with G-d when you perish is to believe Christ is G-d and the son of G-d and that died for our sins and was resurrected. That's a Christian thing. What other faiths believe that?

So you've moved from the RCC to the 'Christian Church'. Neat sleight of hand.

 

[SweetSue92]

I am saying they are not rejecting the Gospel Jesus proclaimed, but an addition made by some Christians.

I am saying non-Christians are rejecting Christians--who are not Jesus--telling them they are going to hell because they do not claim Christ as personal Lord and Savior.

There are much better, more accurate, more truthful ways to proclaim the Gospel.

According to you who do not even believe the Bible.

Heretical.

 

[Meriweather]

What is wrong with preaching?

Just for starters.

I didn't say anything was wrong with it. I said I don't try to preach--it is not my intent.

 

[Hollie]

Shoot. Leftists won't even let them be born. That'll show 'em.

Shoot. When they are born, religioners teach them such self hate and self loathing.

Is that where your hate derives? Were you saddled as a child with the corrosive and destructive idea that you were born base and evil and carried original sin?

 

[Meriweather]

Sure it does. It teaches the only way to be with G-d when you perish is to believe Christ is G-d and the son of G-d and that died for our sins and was resurrected. That's a Christian thing. What other faiths believe that?

Not exactly. Those interested may wish to read Paragraphs 836-848 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church. It is about three pages in length.

 

[Faun]

So you've moved from the RCC to the 'Christian Church'. Neat sleight of hand.

Why not since they both believe what I said.

 

[SweetSue92]

I didn't say anything was wrong with it. I said I don't try to preach--it is not my intent.

But that is what you do here. Preach a false gospel. Not that Scripture will have any effect, as you have determined that you are a better source than the Word of God:

This is what the LORD Almighty says: “Do not listen to what the prophets are prophesying to you; they fill you with false hopes. They speak visions from their own minds, not from the mouth of the LORD.--Jer 23:16

I am done. Go ahead and fill unbelievers' minds with falsehoods. That is on you.

 

[rightnow909]

The most moral and loving people I know are those who are truly Catholic

so that tells u something about... extra ecclesia nulla salus

possibly being true

(you know... IF you were to be objective and all that... which a lot of posters here are NOT)

 

[skye]

okay. But if God is real and true it would be important to know about Him rather than just believe things. Right?

Right.

First believe in Him and then know Him....it comes naturally.

That's what I think at least.

 

[Meriweather]

Where is your response to #250?

I have been clear about my position which hasn't changed. I believe God meets each of us where we are and draws us closer to Him. I believe the Church was correct in acknowledging God's everlasting Covenants with others--and--its own limitations.

As the Catholic Catechism also insists, recognizing the above is absolutely no reason not to proceed full steam ahead with proclaiming Christ and the Gospel. That is the Church's assignment, and the Church is all of us who are the Body of Christ.

The Catholic Church teaches, ultimately, our purpose is to be the the universality for all to share in the communion between the Father and the Son in their Spirit of love. (Paragraph 850 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church.)

 

[skye]

huh?

When you commit a mortal sin, you are not in Christ, who is the only way to Heaven.. If you repent and vow not to sin again, then you are on the right track and if you persevere, you can make it... but all sin does damage to the soul (and body and mind...) and the damage needs to be dealt with or just as OP said... can't be accepted into Heaven where, as Revelation says

no unclean thing will enter 21:27?

I can only believe what my heart tells me is the right thing to believe.

But I respect what you choose to believe yourself.

 

[Meriweather]

But that is what you do here. Preach a false gospel. Not that Scripture will have any effect, as you have determined that you are a better source than the Word of God:

This is what the LORD Almighty says: “Do not listen to what the prophets are prophesying to you; they fill you with false hopes. They speak visions from their own minds, not from the mouth of the LORD.--Jer 23:16

I am done. Go ahead and fill unbelievers' minds with falsehoods. That is on you.

Sue, I have been quite clear on what Christ said and what he did not say.

I am not preaching, I am not prophesying. I am not even saying what it means. I stand by what I noted from the Bible because anyone who wants to take the time will agree that when it comes to what Christ said (and to whom) I was precise. I did not elaborate beyond that.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

The most moral and loving people I know are those who are truly Catholic

Nah. You like to make things up because they sound nice.

 

[rightnow909]

I can only believe what my heart tells me is the right thing to believe.

But I respect what you choose to believe yourself.

as the Word says

"The heart is perverse above all and desperately wicked. Who can know it?" Jeremiah 17:9, I believe

the answer being God alone

we cannot trust our hearts... we give into our passions a lot of the time and then regret doing so later...

I love the Catholic Church so much because I know what it could have saved me from (I had a helluva life at one time...).

for one, it kept me out of potentially horrible relationships.... I've been celibate for a long time.. couldn't have done that w/o the Church, I am sure

I speak of the OLD Church

the new one is not all bad but there are some serious problems.........

 

[skye]

as the Word says

"The heart is perverse above all and desperately wicked. Who can know it?" Jeremiah 17:9, I believe

the answer being God alone

we cannot trust our hearts... we give into our passions a lot of the time and then regret doing so later...

I love the Catholic Church so much because I know what it could have saved me from (I had a helluva life at one time...).

for one, it kept me out of potentially horrible relationships.... I've been celibate for a long time.. couldn't have done that w/o the Church, I am sure

I speak of the OLD Church

the new one is not all bad but there are some serious problems.........

Yes rightnow909......we all have our beliefs.

I respect yours and you won't change mine.

 

[rightnow909]

I have been clear about my position which hasn't changed. I believe God meets each of us where we are and draws us closer to Him. I believe the Church was correct in acknowledging God's everlasting Covenants with others--and--its own limitations.

As the Catholic Catechism also insists, recognizing the above is absolutely no reason not to proceed full steam ahead with proclaiming Christ and the Gospel. That is the Church's assignment, and the Church is all of us who are the Body of Christ.

The Catholic Church teaches, ultimately, our purpose is to be the the universality for all to share in the communion between the Father and the Son in their Spirit of love. (Paragraph 850 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church.)

so you don't believe that outside the Church there is (at least virtually) no salvation?

well, that means that the Church was wrong once... or the Church is wrong now... which is it?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

so you don't believe that outside the Church there is (at least virtually) no salvation?

well, that means that the Church was wrong once... or the Church is wrong now... which is it?

Oh, don't worry. They can be wrong both times.

 

[Mashmont]

Why not since they both believe what I said.

RCC doesn't. That's my church. I know.